What about Command skills. Some ideas. Vol 1

[Ehecatl.9172]

22 hours ago, anduriell.6280 said:

I am  personally against giving the pet any kind shadow steps unless from their own skills (like the cheeta or smokescale)  thus i even removed the teleport from search and rescue.

This is because balance purpouses again, it would feel unfair if the ranger could teleport around the pet by using commands, avoiding all the damage or setting up the pet on their targets location not giving time to any counterplay. 

 

Given other classes can teleport their entire bodies around I just don't see how the pet having a player-commanded teleport would be unfair. It isn't functionally different from dropping a ground targeted spell on the area. The counter-play would be to use your own teleport to escape the pet or just kite it with slows and dodges. Needing to use your own resources to counter the ranger's resources is fair play.

 

It isn't like our pets don't all have telegraphs on their strongest skills. Nobody is in danger of getting burst down before they can react.

 

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thus i even removed the teleport from search and rescue.

 

Given I actually use Search and Rescue as part of my main build to pull my friends' bodies out of AoEs all the time this would pretty much ruin the utility for me.

 

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About Guard command. Revealing a target is a very powerful mechanic as it does not only allow you to attack that target but any friendly that may be with you. Think stealth is another profession main mechanic, As such Gard is fine with just the reveal.

 

I suppose so. It just makes this a skill I'd never use outside of PVP and makes it mostly wasted in certain match-ups. Especially when you have Sic 'Em that counters stealth while also providing other benefits in case you get attacked by someone that isn't playing thief, mesmer, or engineer.

 

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Pathing is not remotely perfect but to mitigate that  pet could receive working close gaps. If the close gaps works with the same internal mechanics as the tiger's Furious_Pounce pets should not have much trouble sticking to the target. But that topic would be better treated in the propper thread about the pets rework.

Potentially, but I am leery of giving all the responsibility of overcoming pathing issues to the AI. Maybe I'm just too used to pet skills being janky and not working right all the time.

[Lazze.9870]

10 hours ago, Ehecatl.9172 said:

Given I actually use Search and Rescue as part of my main build to pull my friends' bodies out of AoEs all the time this would pretty much ruin the utility for me.

 

That's pretty niche. I mean, I'm assuming this is just regular PvE?

 

In typical Anet clunkiness fashion they have given rangers three utilities with revival skills, and none of them is as effective as a some of the singular skills on other classes, and as an added result, our revive trait is also among the least effective in teamfights (where they matter the most).

 

I'm fine with the druid revive on the elite glyph. With some QoL adjustment, the spirit one could be really good. SnR has been pretty trash ever since the nerf to the range (and ofc, they did the double whammy by nerfing its cooldown too).

 

Signet of Mercy on Guardian is a game changer in competetive modes. Necro's revive trait is a potential game changer as well. Mesmer's Illusion of Life is busted in WvW. Using SnR on your bar outside of PvE (where any revive trait/skill is "useful") isn't anymore. It used to be when you could immediately port someone properly far away from the enemy instead of channeling a lengthy revive skill, but that's in the past. The revive trait obviously doesn't benefit from the porting either and can also overlap with SnR itself and thus be completely useless.

 

A bit of streamlining where SnR was axed for something different, our revive trait dropped a healing spring and gave the skill a revive % on each pulse, and our two remaining revive skills were updated a bit? That's the kind of QoL changes ranger needs. Not giant overhauls like command changes. The only overall change commands should have is to be reverted back to shouts (hell, the statement they made about the SnR nerf was to normalize the range to match the range of other shout skills (which was just an excuse for deleting it in PvP, but oh well)).

Edited August 26, 2021 by Lazze.9870

[Ehecatl.9172]

9 hours ago, Lazze.9870 said:

 

That's pretty niche. I mean, I'm assuming this is just regular PvE?

 

In typical Anet clunkiness fashion they have given rangers three utilities with revival skills, and none of them is as effective as a some of the singular skills on other classes, and as an added result, our revive trait is also among the least effective in teamfights (where they matter the most).

 

Generally yah. They aren't the strongest players so my main running around build is made to support them and our party. I realize any build can do Open World so it doesn't matter from a balance perspective but pulling peoples' bodies out of AoE death zones or away from the big boss is a huge part of the utility of Search and Rescue and part of what makes it one of my favorite ranger skills. Removing the teleport wouldn't make it better, it'd just be a harsh nerf on an already overnerfed skill.

 

That said I don't disagree that we have too many skills that get people off the ground. Personally I'd rather change the spirit if we had to. It doesn't live long enough to be out entire fights from my experience and a lot of the time it is dead and on cooldown when someone does go down. For a skill that requires surviving long enough for its ability to come into play I'd rather its active skill be something like dropping a Healing Spring effect or something that can be immediately useful, but that is just me.

 

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A bit of streamlining where SnR was axed for something different, our revive trait dropped a healing spring and gave the skill a revive % on each pulse, and our two remaining revive skills were updated a bit? That's the kind of QoL changes ranger needs. Not giant overhauls like command changes. The only overall change commands should have is to be reverted back to shouts (hell, the statement they made about the SnR nerf was to normalize the range to match the range of other shout skills (which was just an excuse for deleting it in PvP, but oh well)).

 

I don't disagree with this. A lot of the ranger's tools could work really well if they were just adjusted a little bit in the right direction. Changing our shouts to commands made no sense thematically and didn't really change them mechanically beyond a straight nerf due to losing synergy with certain runes.

 

Changing them into command should have come with more significant mechanical changes but it really didn't. They don't even "command" your pet. You just... Shout at your pet to trigger buffs.

[Lazze.9870]

13 hours ago, Ehecatl.9172 said:

That said I don't disagree that we have too many skills that get people off the ground. Personally I'd rather change the spirit if we had to. It doesn't live long enough to be out entire fights from my experience and a lot of the time it is dead and on cooldown when someone does go down. For a skill that requires surviving long enough for its ability to come into play I'd rather its active skill be something like dropping a Healing Spring effect or something that can be immediately useful, but that is just me.

 

The problem with the spirit imo is the cast times, less so its functionality. The health drain is also a tad too much.

 

Either way, I think the revive trait should be changed even if SnR stays as it is. Basically, running SnR on your bar means the trait is dead because it overlaps and goes on cooldown. I don't think any other class has that isse with their revive trait. I also just generally think dropping a Healing Spring is much more thematically fitting for Nature Magic than using a shout..er.. command.

Edited August 27, 2021 by Lazze.9870

[Ehecatl.9172]

11 hours ago, Lazze.9870 said:

 

The problem with the spirit imo is the cast times, less so its functionality. The health drain is also a tad too much.

 

Either way, I think the revive trait should be changed even if SnR stays as it is. Basically, running SnR on your bar means the trait is dead because it overlaps and goes on cooldown. I don't think any other class has that isse with their revive trait. I also just generally think dropping a Healing Spring is much more thematically fitting for Nature Magic than using a shout..er.. command.

 

I agree. The spirit's cast time means you can't drop it in an emergency to bring your allies back up all at once. Health degeneration is also pointless since they aren't really that tanky to begin with. I'd absolutely love it if spirits were good enough support options to take 1-2 of them on my bar for the utility because I love their flavor. Unfortunately they just aren't very good outside very specific content.

 

Does the trait make the utility go on cooldown? I just jumped into the game and tested this. I was able to activate the trait on one downed ally and then still cast it to pull a second downed ally to me to start reviving directly after.

[Lazze.9870]

30 minutes ago, Ehecatl.9172 said:

Does the trait make the utility go on cooldown? I just jumped into the game and tested this. I was able to activate the trait on one downed ally and then still cast it to pull a second downed ally to me to start reviving directly after.

 

No, the other way around. Using the skill and then pressing F to revive them will put the trait on cooldown. If you let the pet do it all by itself it won't, but most of the time you'd probably want to help it out. Which means you basically just add some additional aoe regen, as opposed to most other revive traits which would stack with whatever skill is being used (like casting Well of Blood and then reviving, procing the trait for a second well).

 

Using SnR, then casting a lesser healing spring via the trait to help sustain and add some additional rez pulses would be so much better. Ranger used to have a trait that proced a healing spring on self-down, shame they didn't move that to the revive trait instead.

Edited August 27, 2021 by Lazze.9870

[Ehecatl.9172]

7 hours ago, Lazze.9870 said:

 

No, the other way around. Using the skill and then pressing F to revive them will put the trait on cooldown. If you let the pet do it all by itself it won't, but most of the time you'd probably want to help it out. Which means you basically just add some additional aoe regen, as opposed to most other revive traits which would stack with whatever skill is being used (like casting Well of Blood and then reviving, procing the trait for a second well).

 

Using SnR, then casting a lesser healing spring via the trait to help sustain and add some additional rez pulses would be so much better. Ranger used to have a trait that proced a healing spring on self-down, shame they didn't move that to the revive trait instead.

 

Ahhh, I see. Because it basically uses a non-stacking buff twice. I gotcha.

 

An easy fix to that would just be to make it so the trait doesn't trigger if the pet is already reviving someone.

 

Though if it had to be changed dropping a Healing Spring wouldn't be a bad choice either.