AldKai.9712

I love when new players are toxic like this, and you cannot even help them. Just before the EU servers went down, I used the time a losing unranked match gave me to explain to a newbie why hugging the trebucet on kylo is a bad idea. He started out defensive and hostile, he ended up saying that he understands my points and won't do it again. Guess what, if he turned chat off and treated everyone as an unhelpful NPC, he'd still be going treb and wondering why his team always loses on that map.Want to learn PvP? Get rid of this attitude first. What an entitled, dismissive and toxic comment, and exemplifying the very problem he was describing.

Blocks: Haha yeah oh whoops it doesn't negate any damage when you've been already hit by condition attacks, and oh when you're done blocking there's heaps more! Completely negates power on the other hand.Evades: Funnily enough, when you are on fire, you cannot evade the flames already on you, or evade the blood back into your body when you're bleeding. You can, however, completely evade power attacks that need to hit you several times to do damage.Legit big brain moment here. You also can't negate power damage you've already got hit by. Invulnerability: Oh man it's too bad not everyone is playing a Guardian or a Weaver huh? Oh wait. Since I actually play PvP, I can tell that half the players do now. Other professions, like core thief, quit. Invulnerability that also protects against Power btw. Cleanses: And now for the cheap cheap price of 30s cooldown and one of your utility slots you can remove immediately an entire stack of conditions* until it is reapplied full force one second later by the dragonhunter's fire pulse for 30k damage.I have like 5-6 traits and skills used just for condition cleansing. Death breakdown takes downed state into account where you can't cleanse, but let me guess, you didn't even know that did you?No it does not. Compare any warrior greatsword death breakdown to a condi build and you see the difference. I don't even play mirage, I play core mesmer.Don't worry, it's just as bad, and I called it. Rune of Resistance and Rune of Revenant helps a lot.Yes I'm sure -10% condition damage in lieue of what little power output I need to be slightly more relevant will help alleviate the damage that is enough to kill me three times already. It's just an option.While nothing else is an option, and that's your idea of 'good' game design? Legit big brain moment here. You also can't negate power damage you've already got hit by.Except that it is negated instantly by your defense value, defense boons and generally being fucking worthless damage wise. I have like 5-6 traits and skills used just for condition cleansing.That's nice that your class of choice can afford to do that (or even has these skills). Mine doesn't, which makes it not meta. Oh but I wish I was running the invincible ten clones cleanse on stealth supertanky dude in light armour like you do sometimes.

More bad opinions from Vallun. I guess CMC's opinions are bad as well, because when I asked him about it on the dev livestream he showed almost the same opinion as me. https://clips.twitch.tv/EnticingBombasticBunnyPeoplesChamp You can watch the clip yourself and see Ah yes one of the devs that made PvP into the hellscape that it is agreed with you about how hey guys the current cancer condi meta totally takes skill. It's totally worth the recourse to authority. I wonder how many AAA MMO games you have helped design or balance or maintain...ha yes...none I have never served in any government position either but that doesn't mean I'm unqualified to vote. I bet you never produced any wine in your life but doesn't that mean you should not be allowed to drink any? I can vote..and hope for the best and I can drink wine..but I won't be able to really discern a good one from a great one as I lack the practical experience to do so, do you get my point? @Arheundel.6451 said: More bad opinions from Vallun. I guess CMC's opinions are bad as well, because when I asked him about it on the dev livestream he showed almost the same opinion as me. https://clips.twitch.tv/EnticingBombasticBunnyPeoplesChamp You can watch the clip yourself and see Ah yes one of the devs that made PvP into the hellscape that it is agreed with you about how hey guys the current cancer condi meta totally takes skill. It's totally worth the recourse to authority. I wonder how many AAA MMO games you have helped design or balance or maintain...ha yes...none I have never served in any government position either but that doesn't mean I'm unqualified to vote. I bet you never produced any wine in your life but doesn't that mean you should not be allowed to drink any? I can vote..and hope for the best and I can drink wine..but I won't be able to really discern a good one from a great one as I lack the practical experience to do so, do you get my point?That by your own logic you are completely unqualified to judge my comments because you lack the practical experience of being me. Got it. Let's break this down shall we: 'I have never played PvP in the last month and will persist to claim that not every player in Gold+ is running condi damage for a certain reason' It is literally out there, if you bothered to open your game and play above Bronze. 90% of your death screen recaps will consist of 50k+ condition damage, you know, because if you fought someone with a power build, you'd be able to counter it and actually win. *we decline any and all responsibility for when our cleanses remove the 2s Vulnerability 1 stack instead of the 10s Fire 14

lol funny lol except that the only thieves that didn't quit PvP are condi ones. So if anything I'm the one that goes against the flow.

More bad opinions from Vallun. I guess CMC's opinions are bad as well, because when I asked him about it on the dev livestream he showed almost the same opinion as me. https://clips.twitch.tv/EnticingBombasticBunnyPeoplesChamp You can watch the clip yourself and see Ah yes one of the devs that made PvP into the hellscape that it is agreed with you about how hey guys the current cancer condi meta totally takes skill. It's totally worth the recourse to authority. I wonder how many AAA MMO games you have helped design or balance or maintain...ha yes...noneI have never served in any government position either but that doesn't mean I'm unqualified to vote. I bet you never produced any wine in your life but doesn't that mean you should not be allowed to drink any?

More bad opinions from Vallun. I guess CMC's opinions are bad as well, because when I asked him about it on the dev livestream he showed almost the same opinion as me. https://clips.twitch.tv/EnticingBombasticBunnyPeoplesChamp You can watch the clip yourself and seeAh yes one of the devs that made PvP into the hellscape that it is agreed with you about how hey guys the current cancer condi meta totally takes skill. It's totally worth the recourse to authority. EDIT: I bet you didn't even know that Endure Pain has no effect on condition damage. In fact nothing does. Every single defense in the game affects power, which requires three different stats to be effective. Only one single countermeasure exists for condition damage, and it's an active, costly one, aka cleanse. Power got nerfed while condi has not and any mesmer can do 22k damage from prone position and the average standing damage of most burn-focused classes is 54k over 8 seconds (and they say Power is burst-based...). That's why you're playing condi thief, and that's why, incidentally, you're defending it despite the blatant discrepancy with how unviable any build with power damage is at the moment. But you're hurting more than thief with this. That's also why I don't let streamers and other professional socialites think for me.

Utter shit and extremely toxic. Don't touch with a ten foot pole. Devs don't know what balance is.

More bad opinions from Vallun.

You can never tell with the current meta.

'PP/ Shortbow' has to be the funniest joke I've heard this month.

I just took 22k confusion damage to a downed mesmer. I'm sorry I tried using my skills Anet. I won't do it again.

I can't help but notice you are talking about Daredevil every time like this is the only thief that ever exists. It is not. It's the only thief people are running, however. But on that same note let me tell you that I eat these meta slaves with shortbows for breakfast and dinner. They are useless. They are bad. It doesn't matter how far they run because running is all they can ever do, but I can do killing. They suck. I'm not sorry to call them out. All they ever did was copy-paste the full mobility shortbow build from metabattle, never got into a fight, and only ever cap points. They die in every fight because they never learnt to actually fight.Their build is meant for the GW2 equivalent of fetching people drinks. It's useless in a fight.Their shortbow sucks balls in a fight. It will lose to P/P any day, because P/P actually does damage and has a daze, for what it's worth.They run Daredevil and not core thief because Daredevil is the only Thief spec with any sort of sustain, which comes in a package of obnoxious permadodges and passive defenses. The moment they encounter a player with a build that won't take their shit they fall flat on their face. Theirs has no flexibility whatsoever, mine can be adapted to several situations at the very least.

Ahem. So, I stealth in combat, a lot, in fact that's half my playstyle. The thing is that I will still die because stealth attacks are ridiculously impotent while I still take damage from all sources and can get revealed by half the classes. All it lets me do is reposition, cast basilisk venom and avoid being shot directly at for a small duration of time.

Not enough to keep it up for 15 seconds. Dash rans out after 3 dashes, and you dont regain one for 10 seconds. Heartseeker-wise, you run out of initiative after 7 heartseekers, at 6 seconds. Then you heartseeker once every 3 seconds. So total distance traveled is an average of 900/1.5 seconds for the first 6 seconds, then 2.25*400 + 0.75 *450 every 3 seconds, for lets say 9 seconds. Total distance: 3600 + 3712 = 7312. In 16 seconds. Comparision: Holo has a consistent 1.25*400 + 0.75*600 every 2 seconds, for a total of 8 times. Thats 7600. Faster, Im afraid. Oh and any more travel time makes the distance worse. Oh and it gets even worse, because Holo has other movement skills and tools they can use, like Radiant Arc. And Quickness which benefits you. The distance widens. And thats just Holo, which isnt exactly high on the mobility list. Nope, on no map is that the case. I will also let you in on a little dark secret of sPvP. Its called "inclines". Have you ever tried moving from mid to far on Legacy using dashes, vs using shortbow? Its so much slower. Good luck. And that argument is wrong, see above. Congratulations, you failed to answer the question. As such, we will now procceed with eliminating the contradiction. Well, Sindrener not using in-combat stealth is easily verified. It is true. So, only one assumption remains. "In-combat stealth is good and high tier thieves use it". Since its the only one left, it has to be wrong. Ergo, in-combat stealth is bad and high tier thieves (such as Sindrener) do not use it. Proof through contradiction. Q.E.D. Nice, thats finished then. Please do not ever try to say that its good, you have already been proven wrong. Also you really dont understand what "retract a statement" means, do you? I already said that that statement is wrong, if it pleases you. Its not really important, after all. I can already prove you wrong through the contradiction, and the question you refuse to answer. You dont need 15 sec to cover 2 bases , you need 6Your initial argument is that Thiefs needshortbow , which i have shown you they don't . Doing 2 Infritrators arrows ,12 resources , for 1800 range , while 3x Hertsseker+Dash can cover 2700 distance + cost 6resources . (if you arelockedin those animation and restorre resouces) I saw people use stealth on the tournamentsYour initial argument that people dont use steal , is not validCould you show me thread or video where Tokier+ Sind , said to the new thieves that they shouldn't use stealth , please ?Go play core thief record footage or get off the thread.

I think a fair amount of participants here don't play thief, don't know thief, let alone play PvP. I would offer to stream my gameplay so you can actually see what a PvP match looks like but based on the amount of people I have to block each game I'm afraid that it would just result in me being harassed. So show me you got balls, make a core thief, go fight in a ranked match, and show us that 'thief is fine'.

they could start by banning you, one toxic person at a time.Ironically you go about calling everyone toxic ;p Literally all you do here is troll, just like on the other thread, it's trolling and personal attacks and provocations. You have nothing intelligent to add and you're not even a thief player, you're a mesmer main, ie one of the most bs classes in this game. Don't try to pretend you're here for any other reason than talking down people and getting attention, and I'm not biting that bait.

Just had another game. I noticed Maul hits me for half my 16k health (so around 8k). I also noticed swoop can carry the ranger at shadowstep distance. Isn't Swoop the ranger equivalent of Heartseeker? Cool. I guess I'm rerolling a ranger?

Just got insulted by not one but two teammates because I the core Thief won't go duel a Weaver for the point while they sit on their ass mid not trying to help. This is the community you created. This is the community you are. It's a community that is heinous, toxic, selfish and completely disconnected from the reality of things. I've mentionned before how only thief gets insulted in every single game no matter what they are doing; the same people in game insulting you for not committing suicide on a hopeless fight are the same people that come here to troll your profession forum, demand more nerfs to your class and tell you that you only exist for blowjobs and running away from fights. When will the devs respond publicly to this?

Yes, a l2p issue. Sure. Your post is literally full of stupid assumptions. As I mentionned already (but you didn't read that) I am, shocker shocker,a thief that does NOT use your kitten shortbow. No sir! And my shadowstep is on CD because I used it to reach close fast. But I bet you're some master thief, just LAUGHING your kitten off at players that can't even run after you! They just took your points and they're laughing at you back, but hey, at least you can come here and calling others noobs for not playing with your copy-paste metabattle shortbow build. Just l2p! 1) If you had shortbow and they sent 3 people to your close, you could have zipped out of there and snowball rest of the map..then gone back and reclaimed your close2) Playing a thief without shortbow in PvP..it's like playing an ele with staff or a ranger without GS...don't blame the game for your lack of wisdow, every class must be played to its strength..not some lore background3) If you don't to play +1 decapper/burst then play something that suits your style You are literally a troll. Play thief, don't talk to me until you do. He is right, you know. If I see two or more enemies approaching cap I am standing on I am noping out of there with my short bow like there is no tomorrow. While I am noping out I try to +1 my team on mid or where ever it is needed. Then I come back to from where I was chased out and it is usually unguarded. If there is only one I am more often then not able to hold my ground with the help of my fellow thieves (guild of thieves). Exactly and that's where thiefs strengths lie. Other classes cant just leave relatively safely like thief when being approached by to other opponents and are usually 1v2 while trying to escape and destroyed lol.This would be the best play even if thorf had a better burst potential.I think what find is the issue is if thief as a decapper/+1 burst class if ur +1ing with ur teammate and with both attacking the opponent it still takes a long time to down that opponent that should ring some bells toward either the sustain of the opponents or the burst potential of the class +1ing.Not saying thief needs a burst buff just that something needs to be looked at if those scenarios are occurring frequently. @Psycoprophet.8107 said: Yes, a l2p issue. Sure. Your post is literally full of stupid assumptions. As I mentionned already (but you didn't read that) I am, shocker shocker,a thief that does NOT use your kitten shortbow. No sir! And my shadowstep is on CD because I used it to reach close fast. But I bet you're some master thief, just LAUGHING your kitten off at players that can't even run after you! They just took your points and they're laughing at you back, but hey, at least you can come here and calling others noobs for not playing with your copy-paste metabattle shortbow build. Just l2p! 1) If you had shortbow and they sent 3 people to your close, you could have zipped out of there and snowball rest of the map..then gone back and reclaimed your close2) Playing a thief without shortbow in PvP..it's like playing an ele with staff or a ranger without GS...don't blame the game for your lack of wisdow, every class must be played to its strength..not some lore background3) If you don't to play +1 decapper/burst then play something that suits your style You are literally a troll. Play thief, don't talk to me until you do. He is right, you know. If I see two or more enemies approaching cap I am standing on I am noping out of there with my short bow like there is no tomorrow. While I am noping out I try to +1 my team on mid or where ever it is needed. Then I come back to from where I was chased out and it is usually unguarded. If there is only one I am more often then not able to hold my ground with the help of my fellow thieves (guild of thieves). Exactly and that's where thiefs strengths lie. Other classes cant just leave relatively safely like thief when being approached by to other opponents and are usually 1v2 while trying to escape and destroyed lol.This would be the best play even if thorf had a better burst potential.I think what find is the issue is if thief as a decapper/+1 burst class if ur +1ing with ur teammate and with both attacking the opponent it still takes a long time to down that opponent that should ring some bells toward either the sustain of the opponents or the burst potential of the class +1ing.Not saying thief needs a burst buff just that something needs to be looked at if those scenarios are occurring frequently. If they can't escape then they need enough sustain to wait for reinforcements , you are right saying that the wait aka time to kill cannot be too long for balance reasons obviously but that doesn't change the fact that sustain is necessary for some classes to counterbalance their inability to escape safely as a thief. If a spec invested in sustain then it should survive for enough time, say...40s...if now it's 1m+ then we need to reduce the sustain of such specs to reasonable levels and lower the kill time to 40s from 1m+, I hope thieves are not asking to lower the kill time to 0s like insta kill the +1 player even if he has full CD Uh I dunno, we certainly get instakilled. Why only us? You certainly get insta killed because your build lacks any means of escape, otherwise there is no way to insta kill a thief right now unless you play a "kill or die" spec and thief is afk or with no CD left to spare, either way if you play a burst spec with a zerker/marauder at 0 toughness you can expect always to live far less than somebody who specced in defense with a toughness amulet Wrong assumption as usual. I play Marauder and most of my utilities are stealth / stunbreak / escapes. Just play thief already holy kitten. Play thief and stop trying to pretend you know anything about the class when you don't play thief. So you have all the tools to escape death on thief while using a burst spec...a luxury other professions don't have and that will be all from me to you And as a higher sustain class u can last far longer in situations where a thief would disengage from so ur point?Are u expecting tanks to disengage like thieves or thieves to not be able to disengage and be low sustain or u want thiefs to be high sustain and not need to disengage which isn't very rogue like. Other professions that don't invest in sustain and try to play like a thief instead, will live a far shorter time compared to a thief in the same role..that's all I am saying @Supreme.3164 said: Yes, a l2p issue. Sure. Your post is literally full of stupid assumptions. As I mentionned already (but you didn't read that) I am, shocker shocker,a thief that does NOT use your kitten shortbow. No sir! And my shadowstep is on CD because I used it to reach close fast. But I bet you're some master thief, just LAUGHING your kitten off at players that can't even run after you! They just took your points and they're laughing at you back, but hey, at least you can come here and calling others noobs for not playing with your copy-paste metabattle shortbow build. Just l2p! 1) If you had shortbow and they sent 3 people to your close, you could have zipped out of there and snowball rest of the map..then gone back and reclaimed your close2) Playing a thief without shortbow in PvP..it's like playing an ele with staff or a ranger without GS...don't blame the game for your lack of wisdow, every class must be played to its strength..not some lore background3) If you don't to play +1 decapper/burst then play something that suits your style You are literally a troll. Play thief, don't talk to me until you do. He is right, you know. If I see two or more enemies approaching cap I am standing on I am noping out of there with my short bow like there is no tomorrow. While I am noping out I try to +1 my team on mid or where ever it is needed. Then I come back to from where I was chased out and it is usually unguarded. If there is only one I am more often then not able to hold my ground with the help of my fellow thieves (guild of thieves). Exactly and that's where thiefs strengths lie. Other classes cant just leave relatively safely like thief when being approached by to other opponents and are usually 1v2 while trying to escape and destroyed lol.This would be the best play even if thorf had a better burst potential.I think what find is the issue is if thief as a decapper/+1 burst class if ur +1ing with ur teammate and with both attacking the opponent it still takes a long time to down that opponent that should ring some bells toward either the sustain of the opponents or the burst potential of the class +1ing.Not saying thief needs a burst buff just that something needs to be looked at if those scenarios are occurring frequently. @Psycoprophet.8107 said: Yes, a l2p issue. Sure. Your post is literally full of stupid assumptions. As I mentionned already (but you didn't read that) I am, shocker shocker,a thief that does NOT use your kitten shortbow. No sir! And my shadowstep is on CD because I used it to reach close fast. But I bet you're some master thief, just LAUGHING your kitten off at players that can't even run after you! They just took your points and they're laughing at you back, but hey, at least you can come here and calling others noobs for not playing with your copy-paste metabattle shortbow build. Just l2p! 1) If you had shortbow and they sent 3 people to your close, you could have zipped out of there and snowball rest of the map..then gone back and reclaimed your close2) Playing a thief without shortbow in PvP..it's like playing an ele with staff or a ranger without GS...don't blame the game for your lack of wisdow, every class must be played to its strength..not some lore background3) If you don't to play +1 decapper/burst then play something that suits your style You are literally a troll. Play thief, don't talk to me until you do. He is right, you know. If I see two or more enemies approaching cap I am standing on I am noping out of there with my short bow like there is no tomorrow. While I am noping out I try to +1 my team on mid or where ever it is needed. Then I come back to from where I was chased out and it is usually unguarded. If there is only one I am more often then not able to hold my ground with the help of my fellow thieves (guild of thieves). Exactly and that's where thiefs strengths lie. Other classes cant just leave relatively safely like thief when being approached by to other opponents and are usually 1v2 while trying to escape and destroyed lol.This would be the best play even if thorf had a better burst potential.I think what find is the issue is if thief as a decapper/+1 burst class if ur +1ing with ur teammate and with both attacking the opponent it still takes a long time to down that opponent that should ring some bells toward either the sustain of the opponents or the burst potential of the class +1ing.Not saying thief needs a burst buff just that something needs to be looked at if those scenarios are occurring frequently. If they can't escape then they need enough sustain to wait for reinforcements , you are right saying that the wait aka time to kill cannot be too long for balance reasons obviously but that doesn't change the fact that sustain is necessary for some classes to counterbalance their inability to escape safely as a thief. If a spec invested in sustain then it should survive for enough time, say...40s...if now it's 1m+ then we need to reduce the sustain of such specs to reasonable levels and lower the kill time to 40s from 1m+, I hope thieves are not asking to lower the kill time to 0s like insta kill the +1 player even if he has full CD Uh I dunno, we certainly get instakilled. Why only us? You certainly get insta killed because your build lacks any means of escape, otherwise there is no way to insta kill a thief right now unless you play a "kill or die" spec and thief is afk or with no CD left to spare, either way if you play a burst spec with a zerker/marauder at 0 toughness you can expect always to live far less than somebody who specced in defense with a toughness amulet Wrong assumption as usual. I play Marauder and most of my utilities are stealth / stunbreak / escapes. Just play thief already holy kitten. Play thief and stop trying to pretend you know anything about the class when you don't play thief. So you have all the tools to escape death on thief while using a burst spec...a luxury other professions don't have and that will be all from me to you And as a higher sustain class u can last far longer in situations where a thief would disengage from so ur point?Are u expecting tanks to disengage like thieves or thieves to not be able to disengage and be low sustain or u want thiefs to be high sustain and not need to disengage which isn't very rogue like. Other professions that don't invest in sustain and try to play like a thief instead, will live a far shorter time compared to a thief in the same role..that's all I am saying Nope. They would still live a much longer time. Higher base stats, and higher defenses you happen to have anyway. Hell just take Spellbreaker, or as I like to call it, "Fat Thief". Even when it doesnt invest in sustain, it still will live much longer. You mention spellbreaker but that's a sustain line sort of, I was comparing a profession using a DPS spec to a thief, in warrior case it would be Berseker which yes would live far less than a thief in the same role, while using dps lines like strength , discipline and Berseker. I have said that a profession trying to play like thief while using dps lines and amulet..would not live as long, not forgetting that you won't be able to relocate just as fast if at all. Spellbreaker is not a sustain line at all. It has no sustain. Its a DPS and Boonrip line. It also feels like thief, hence fat thief. But sure, lets go Berserker. That one too, lives much longer than thief does. Even if they go full offense. I mean, the obvious strength thief has is mobility. But thats it. Thief has also , the element of the first strike . Thats dealt 2/3 of the target hp and then toy him with Daze .Or re-stealth and do that again or run away You really need to stop talking about thief, the more you do, the more clear it becomes to everyone you dont know thief at all. You dont even do 1/2 of a targets HP out of stealth. You will struggle to even do 1/3. 1/4, maybe. Good thieves still dont restealth mid-combat. They will run away. You still havent answered why if in-combat stealth is so good, Sindrener never uses it. Dont forget to answer. Well u could run CS/DA/TRICK with zerk,scholars and assassin sig and do high backstabs on squishier builds but issue is builds got low clears and low utility so not very useful outside of that initial burst, thsts fine issue is other classes can build far more useful and tanky builds in general while bursting the same as that thief build lol. zerkhhhhahahahahaha People don't play thief past bronze where zerk flies. Anything less than 16k HP will get melted in one shot. Anything around 16k, ie Marauder, ie the thing you should be running as a power thief, will only get you melted in two hits, which is a 200% efficiency increase. Amazing. Of course, to be viable, you still have to take Flickering Shadows, and multiple ports, and at least two stunbreaks, and... ...And the only way I can make core power thief work in this meta, especially with P/P bang bang, is to put 70% of the build into disruption or defense. I wish I had a fourth specline so I could also take Acrobatics, but alas I have to be a minimum relevant at some point and have to take Deadly arts for that Executionner's Strike, so I can at the very least try to go for food the grownups on my team have chewed up a little for me. 'Thief is fine' Not it's not. Shame on that guy for being misleading for the sake of drumming up drama and therefore attention. Several mechanics are broken but beyond that, is thief 'fine' on its own? It's fun, it doesn't delete people if you don't run the current condi meta, yes, it's 'fine', it's 'fine' as in it would be actually fine if the rest of the game was balanced around thief right now. If you brought all the other classes back to Thief's current powerlevel, the PvP meta would be a lot less cancerous. But it's not, actually, fine to play right now. At all. It's kitten. Also, you can't even tell what's a squishy build anymore. There is no tell whether that guy is wearing Paladin Amulet or Zerk. Eles can just rock attune and give you the middle finger, mesmer you have no reason to try and attack them, necros are the entire opposite of what a guy with a cloth robe should be in a knife fight. What exactly is a squishy build to a thief? Well, any other thief. I know, my point was the full dps build vallun advocated was basically a way to show thief could do high dps, to bad build is bad and would be useless in serious play, like a 3 min cd elite. Also I've never been near bronze so not sure what flies there, I'm guessing anything.'Hey look thief can do damage! With this build he can do as much as a one-armed warrior. He's just going to die from retaliation damage alone' You summed thief right now pretty well. EDIT: Also P/P is good, it's fine and fun. Continuous unload is the only thing that works on necros, and even with landing it all the time without being bothered by anyone it still takes more than thirty seconds to get them to a state where they have to consider taking cover. I never got the aversion for P/P, it's a great power build choice and my mainstay in this current meta where approaching anything will murder you. It's got some (too costly) utility, it can daze to save teammates, it's got an immobilize (never use this) and it's got an easygoing stealth attack. Use it in duelling and keep switching from daggers to dual pistols all day to confuse your opponent and keep his rotation on the wrong schedule. Bait him in melee then port away and shoot him, then when he walks back and takes ranged or projectile shield take daggers and do a steal-stab. You still hit like a noodle so it's not what's going to kill, but it's mostly that you confuse your opponent and so make it easier for you to avoid getting it by his worst skills. Once he's all nice and worn out drop him safely from a distance or use heartseeker, but always expect to get stunslammed, so don't forget to use your basilisk venom first. That's how I do it, and it's dirty work that feels like wrangling a bear into submission... But that's Power Thief right now.

Yes, a l2p issue. Sure. Your post is literally full of stupid assumptions. As I mentionned already (but you didn't read that) I am, shocker shocker,a thief that does NOT use your kitten shortbow. No sir! And my shadowstep is on CD because I used it to reach close fast. But I bet you're some master thief, just LAUGHING your kitten off at players that can't even run after you! They just took your points and they're laughing at you back, but hey, at least you can come here and calling others noobs for not playing with your copy-paste metabattle shortbow build. Just l2p! 1) If you had shortbow and they sent 3 people to your close, you could have zipped out of there and snowball rest of the map..then gone back and reclaimed your close2) Playing a thief without shortbow in PvP..it's like playing an ele with staff or a ranger without GS...don't blame the game for your lack of wisdow, every class must be played to its strength..not some lore background3) If you don't to play +1 decapper/burst then play something that suits your style You are literally a troll. Play thief, don't talk to me until you do. He is right, you know. If I see two or more enemies approaching cap I am standing on I am noping out of there with my short bow like there is no tomorrow. While I am noping out I try to +1 my team on mid or where ever it is needed. Then I come back to from where I was chased out and it is usually unguarded. If there is only one I am more often then not able to hold my ground with the help of my fellow thieves (guild of thieves). Exactly and that's where thiefs strengths lie. Other classes cant just leave relatively safely like thief when being approached by to other opponents and are usually 1v2 while trying to escape and destroyed lol.This would be the best play even if thorf had a better burst potential.I think what find is the issue is if thief as a decapper/+1 burst class if ur +1ing with ur teammate and with both attacking the opponent it still takes a long time to down that opponent that should ring some bells toward either the sustain of the opponents or the burst potential of the class +1ing.Not saying thief needs a burst buff just that something needs to be looked at if those scenarios are occurring frequently. @Psycoprophet.8107 said: Yes, a l2p issue. Sure. Your post is literally full of stupid assumptions. As I mentionned already (but you didn't read that) I am, shocker shocker,a thief that does NOT use your kitten shortbow. No sir! And my shadowstep is on CD because I used it to reach close fast. But I bet you're some master thief, just LAUGHING your kitten off at players that can't even run after you! They just took your points and they're laughing at you back, but hey, at least you can come here and calling others noobs for not playing with your copy-paste metabattle shortbow build. Just l2p! 1) If you had shortbow and they sent 3 people to your close, you could have zipped out of there and snowball rest of the map..then gone back and reclaimed your close2) Playing a thief without shortbow in PvP..it's like playing an ele with staff or a ranger without GS...don't blame the game for your lack of wisdow, every class must be played to its strength..not some lore background3) If you don't to play +1 decapper/burst then play something that suits your style You are literally a troll. Play thief, don't talk to me until you do. He is right, you know. If I see two or more enemies approaching cap I am standing on I am noping out of there with my short bow like there is no tomorrow. While I am noping out I try to +1 my team on mid or where ever it is needed. Then I come back to from where I was chased out and it is usually unguarded. If there is only one I am more often then not able to hold my ground with the help of my fellow thieves (guild of thieves). Exactly and that's where thiefs strengths lie. Other classes cant just leave relatively safely like thief when being approached by to other opponents and are usually 1v2 while trying to escape and destroyed lol.This would be the best play even if thorf had a better burst potential.I think what find is the issue is if thief as a decapper/+1 burst class if ur +1ing with ur teammate and with both attacking the opponent it still takes a long time to down that opponent that should ring some bells toward either the sustain of the opponents or the burst potential of the class +1ing.Not saying thief needs a burst buff just that something needs to be looked at if those scenarios are occurring frequently. If they can't escape then they need enough sustain to wait for reinforcements , you are right saying that the wait aka time to kill cannot be too long for balance reasons obviously but that doesn't change the fact that sustain is necessary for some classes to counterbalance their inability to escape safely as a thief. If a spec invested in sustain then it should survive for enough time, say...40s...if now it's 1m+ then we need to reduce the sustain of such specs to reasonable levels and lower the kill time to 40s from 1m+, I hope thieves are not asking to lower the kill time to 0s like insta kill the +1 player even if he has full CD Uh I dunno, we certainly get instakilled. Why only us? You certainly get insta killed because your build lacks any means of escape, otherwise there is no way to insta kill a thief right now unless you play a "kill or die" spec and thief is afk or with no CD left to spare, either way if you play a burst spec with a zerker/marauder at 0 toughness you can expect always to live far less than somebody who specced in defense with a toughness amulet Wrong assumption as usual. I play Marauder and most of my utilities are stealth / stunbreak / escapes. Just play thief already holy kitten. Play thief and stop trying to pretend you know anything about the class when you don't play thief. So you have all the tools to escape death on thief while using a burst spec...a luxury other professions don't have and that will be all from me to you And as a higher sustain class u can last far longer in situations where a thief would disengage from so ur point?Are u expecting tanks to disengage like thieves or thieves to not be able to disengage and be low sustain or u want thiefs to be high sustain and not need to disengage which isn't very rogue like. Other professions that don't invest in sustain and try to play like a thief instead, will live a far shorter time compared to a thief in the same role..that's all I am saying @Supreme.3164 said: Yes, a l2p issue. Sure. Your post is literally full of stupid assumptions. As I mentionned already (but you didn't read that) I am, shocker shocker,a thief that does NOT use your kitten shortbow. No sir! And my shadowstep is on CD because I used it to reach close fast. But I bet you're some master thief, just LAUGHING your kitten off at players that can't even run after you! They just took your points and they're laughing at you back, but hey, at least you can come here and calling others noobs for not playing with your copy-paste metabattle shortbow build. Just l2p! 1) If you had shortbow and they sent 3 people to your close, you could have zipped out of there and snowball rest of the map..then gone back and reclaimed your close2) Playing a thief without shortbow in PvP..it's like playing an ele with staff or a ranger without GS...don't blame the game for your lack of wisdow, every class must be played to its strength..not some lore background3) If you don't to play +1 decapper/burst then play something that suits your style You are literally a troll. Play thief, don't talk to me until you do. He is right, you know. If I see two or more enemies approaching cap I am standing on I am noping out of there with my short bow like there is no tomorrow. While I am noping out I try to +1 my team on mid or where ever it is needed. Then I come back to from where I was chased out and it is usually unguarded. If there is only one I am more often then not able to hold my ground with the help of my fellow thieves (guild of thieves). Exactly and that's where thiefs strengths lie. Other classes cant just leave relatively safely like thief when being approached by to other opponents and are usually 1v2 while trying to escape and destroyed lol.This would be the best play even if thorf had a better burst potential.I think what find is the issue is if thief as a decapper/+1 burst class if ur +1ing with ur teammate and with both attacking the opponent it still takes a long time to down that opponent that should ring some bells toward either the sustain of the opponents or the burst potential of the class +1ing.Not saying thief needs a burst buff just that something needs to be looked at if those scenarios are occurring frequently. @Psycoprophet.8107 said: Yes, a l2p issue. Sure. Your post is literally full of stupid assumptions. As I mentionned already (but you didn't read that) I am, shocker shocker,a thief that does NOT use your kitten shortbow. No sir! And my shadowstep is on CD because I used it to reach close fast. But I bet you're some master thief, just LAUGHING your kitten off at players that can't even run after you! They just took your points and they're laughing at you back, but hey, at least you can come here and calling others noobs for not playing with your copy-paste metabattle shortbow build. Just l2p! 1) If you had shortbow and they sent 3 people to your close, you could have zipped out of there and snowball rest of the map..then gone back and reclaimed your close2) Playing a thief without shortbow in PvP..it's like playing an ele with staff or a ranger without GS...don't blame the game for your lack of wisdow, every class must be played to its strength..not some lore background3) If you don't to play +1 decapper/burst then play something that suits your style You are literally a troll. Play thief, don't talk to me until you do. He is right, you know. If I see two or more enemies approaching cap I am standing on I am noping out of there with my short bow like there is no tomorrow. While I am noping out I try to +1 my team on mid or where ever it is needed. Then I come back to from where I was chased out and it is usually unguarded. If there is only one I am more often then not able to hold my ground with the help of my fellow thieves (guild of thieves). Exactly and that's where thiefs strengths lie. Other classes cant just leave relatively safely like thief when being approached by to other opponents and are usually 1v2 while trying to escape and destroyed lol.This would be the best play even if thorf had a better burst potential.I think what find is the issue is if thief as a decapper/+1 burst class if ur +1ing with ur teammate and with both attacking the opponent it still takes a long time to down that opponent that should ring some bells toward either the sustain of the opponents or the burst potential of the class +1ing.Not saying thief needs a burst buff just that something needs to be looked at if those scenarios are occurring frequently. If they can't escape then they need enough sustain to wait for reinforcements , you are right saying that the wait aka time to kill cannot be too long for balance reasons obviously but that doesn't change the fact that sustain is necessary for some classes to counterbalance their inability to escape safely as a thief. If a spec invested in sustain then it should survive for enough time, say...40s...if now it's 1m+ then we need to reduce the sustain of such specs to reasonable levels and lower the kill time to 40s from 1m+, I hope thieves are not asking to lower the kill time to 0s like insta kill the +1 player even if he has full CD Uh I dunno, we certainly get instakilled. Why only us? You certainly get insta killed because your build lacks any means of escape, otherwise there is no way to insta kill a thief right now unless you play a "kill or die" spec and thief is afk or with no CD left to spare, either way if you play a burst spec with a zerker/marauder at 0 toughness you can expect always to live far less than somebody who specced in defense with a toughness amulet Wrong assumption as usual. I play Marauder and most of my utilities are stealth / stunbreak / escapes. Just play thief already holy kitten. Play thief and stop trying to pretend you know anything about the class when you don't play thief. So you have all the tools to escape death on thief while using a burst spec...a luxury other professions don't have and that will be all from me to you And as a higher sustain class u can last far longer in situations where a thief would disengage from so ur point?Are u expecting tanks to disengage like thieves or thieves to not be able to disengage and be low sustain or u want thiefs to be high sustain and not need to disengage which isn't very rogue like. Other professions that don't invest in sustain and try to play like a thief instead, will live a far shorter time compared to a thief in the same role..that's all I am saying Nope. They would still live a much longer time. Higher base stats, and higher defenses you happen to have anyway. Hell just take Spellbreaker, or as I like to call it, "Fat Thief". Even when it doesnt invest in sustain, it still will live much longer. You mention spellbreaker but that's a sustain line sort of, I was comparing a profession using a DPS spec to a thief, in warrior case it would be Berseker which yes would live far less than a thief in the same role, while using dps lines like strength , discipline and Berseker. I have said that a profession trying to play like thief while using dps lines and amulet..would not live as long, not forgetting that you won't be able to relocate just as fast if at all. Spellbreaker is not a sustain line at all. It has no sustain. Its a DPS and Boonrip line. It also feels like thief, hence fat thief. But sure, lets go Berserker. That one too, lives much longer than thief does. Even if they go full offense. I mean, the obvious strength thief has is mobility. But thats it. Thief has also , the element of the first strike . Thats dealt 2/3 of the target hp and then toy him with Daze .Or re-stealth and do that again or run away You really need to stop talking about thief, the more you do, the more clear it becomes to everyone you dont know thief at all. You dont even do 1/2 of a targets HP out of stealth. You will struggle to even do 1/3. 1/4, maybe. Good thieves still dont restealth mid-combat. They will run away. You still havent answered why if in-combat stealth is so good, Sindrener never uses it. Dont forget to answer. Well u could run CS/DA/TRICK with zerk,scholars and assassin sig and do high backstabs on squishier builds but issue is builds got low clears and low utility so not very useful outside of that initial burst, thsts fine issue is other classes can build far more useful and tanky builds in general while bursting the same as that thief build lol. zerkhhhhahahahahahaPeople don't play thief past bronze where zerk flies. Anything less than 16k HP will get melted in one shot. Anything around 16k, ie Marauder, ie the thing you should be running as a power thief, will only get you melted in two hits, which is a 200% efficiency increase. Amazing. Of course, to be viable, you still have to take Flickering Shadows, and multiple ports, and at least two stunbreaks, and... ...And the only way I can make core power thief work in this meta, especially with P/P bang bang, is to put 70% of the build into disruption or defense. I wish I had a fourth specline so I could also take Acrobatics, but alas I have to be a minimum relevant at some point and have to take Deadly arts for that Executionner's Strike, so I can at the very least try to go for food the grownups on my team have chewed up a little for me. 'Thief is fine' Not it's not. Shame on that guy for being misleading for the sake of drumming up drama and therefore attention. Several mechanics are broken but beyond that, is thief 'fine' on its own? It's fun, it doesn't delete people if you don't run the current condi meta, yes, it's 'fine', it's 'fine' as in it would be actually fine if the rest of the game was balanced around thief right now. If you brought all the other classes back to Thief's current powerlevel, the PvP meta would be a lot less cancerous. But it's not, actually, fine to play right now. At all. It's shit. Also, you can't even tell what's a squishy build anymore. There is no tell whether that guy is wearing Paladin Amulet or Zerk. Eles can just rock attune and give you the middle finger, mesmer you have no reason to try and attack them, necros are the entire opposite of what a guy with a cloth robe should be in a knife fight. What exactly is a squishy build to a thief? Well, any other thief.

In this thread: people that never made a thief and never play PvP try to tell high-ranking thief mains how to play their class in PvP. Hilarious if sad. 'Thief, what can your class do?''Uhh it can go a little fast if I put all my utilities into it''That's it?''Uhh yeah''OMG op!'

Yes, a l2p issue. Sure. Your post is literally full of stupid assumptions. As I mentionned already (but you didn't read that) I am, shocker shocker,a thief that does NOT use your kitten shortbow. No sir! And my shadowstep is on CD because I used it to reach close fast. But I bet you're some master thief, just LAUGHING your kitten off at players that can't even run after you! They just took your points and they're laughing at you back, but hey, at least you can come here and calling others noobs for not playing with your copy-paste metabattle shortbow build. Just l2p! 1) If you had shortbow and they sent 3 people to your close, you could have zipped out of there and snowball rest of the map..then gone back and reclaimed your close2) Playing a thief without shortbow in PvP..it's like playing an ele with staff or a ranger without GS...don't blame the game for your lack of wisdow, every class must be played to its strength..not some lore background3) If you don't to play +1 decapper/burst then play something that suits your style You are literally a troll. Play thief, don't talk to me until you do. He is right, you know. If I see two or more enemies approaching cap I am standing on I am noping out of there with my short bow like there is no tomorrow. While I am noping out I try to +1 my team on mid or where ever it is needed. Then I come back to from where I was chased out and it is usually unguarded. If there is only one I am more often then not able to hold my ground with the help of my fellow thieves (guild of thieves). Exactly and that's where thiefs strengths lie. Other classes cant just leave relatively safely like thief when being approached by to other opponents and are usually 1v2 while trying to escape and destroyed lol.This would be the best play even if thorf had a better burst potential.I think what find is the issue is if thief as a decapper/+1 burst class if ur +1ing with ur teammate and with both attacking the opponent it still takes a long time to down that opponent that should ring some bells toward either the sustain of the opponents or the burst potential of the class +1ing.Not saying thief needs a burst buff just that something needs to be looked at if those scenarios are occurring frequently. @Psycoprophet.8107 said: Yes, a l2p issue. Sure. Your post is literally full of stupid assumptions. As I mentionned already (but you didn't read that) I am, shocker shocker,a thief that does NOT use your kitten shortbow. No sir! And my shadowstep is on CD because I used it to reach close fast. But I bet you're some master thief, just LAUGHING your kitten off at players that can't even run after you! They just took your points and they're laughing at you back, but hey, at least you can come here and calling others noobs for not playing with your copy-paste metabattle shortbow build. Just l2p! 1) If you had shortbow and they sent 3 people to your close, you could have zipped out of there and snowball rest of the map..then gone back and reclaimed your close2) Playing a thief without shortbow in PvP..it's like playing an ele with staff or a ranger without GS...don't blame the game for your lack of wisdow, every class must be played to its strength..not some lore background3) If you don't to play +1 decapper/burst then play something that suits your style You are literally a troll. Play thief, don't talk to me until you do. He is right, you know. If I see two or more enemies approaching cap I am standing on I am noping out of there with my short bow like there is no tomorrow. While I am noping out I try to +1 my team on mid or where ever it is needed. Then I come back to from where I was chased out and it is usually unguarded. If there is only one I am more often then not able to hold my ground with the help of my fellow thieves (guild of thieves). Exactly and that's where thiefs strengths lie. Other classes cant just leave relatively safely like thief when being approached by to other opponents and are usually 1v2 while trying to escape and destroyed lol.This would be the best play even if thorf had a better burst potential.I think what find is the issue is if thief as a decapper/+1 burst class if ur +1ing with ur teammate and with both attacking the opponent it still takes a long time to down that opponent that should ring some bells toward either the sustain of the opponents or the burst potential of the class +1ing.Not saying thief needs a burst buff just that something needs to be looked at if those scenarios are occurring frequently. If they can't escape then they need enough sustain to wait for reinforcements , you are right saying that the wait aka time to kill cannot be too long for balance reasons obviously but that doesn't change the fact that sustain is necessary for some classes to counterbalance their inability to escape safely as a thief. If a spec invested in sustain then it should survive for enough time, say...40s...if now it's 1m+ then we need to reduce the sustain of such specs to reasonable levels and lower the kill time to 40s from 1m+, I hope thieves are not asking to lower the kill time to 0s like insta kill the +1 player even if he has full CD Uh I dunno, we certainly get instakilled. Why only us? You certainly get insta killed because your build lacks any means of escape, otherwise there is no way to insta kill a thief right now unless you play a "kill or die" spec and thief is afk or with no CD left to spare, either way if you play a burst spec with a zerker/marauder at 0 toughness you can expect always to live far less than somebody who specced in defense with a toughness amulet Wrong assumption as usual. I play Marauder and most of my utilities are stealth / stunbreak / escapes. Just play thief already holy kitten. Play thief and stop trying to pretend you know anything about the class when you don't play thief. So you have all the tools to escape death on thief while using a burst spec...a luxury other professions don't have and that will be all from me to youYes. Nonsense. That's all you ever contributed here. Please don't give me any more.

W> @Supreme.3164 said: Yes, a l2p issue. Sure. Your post is literally full of stupid assumptions. As I mentionned already (but you didn't read that) I am, shocker shocker,a thief that does NOT use your kitten shortbow. No sir! And my shadowstep is on CD because I used it to reach close fast. But I bet you're some master thief, just LAUGHING your kitten off at players that can't even run after you! They just took your points and they're laughing at you back, but hey, at least you can come here and calling others noobs for not playing with your copy-paste metabattle shortbow build. Just l2p! 1) If you had shortbow and they sent 3 people to your close, you could have zipped out of there and snowball rest of the map..then gone back and reclaimed your close2) Playing a thief without shortbow in PvP..it's like playing an ele with staff or a ranger without GS...don't blame the game for your lack of wisdow, every class must be played to its strength..not some lore background3) If you don't to play +1 decapper/burst then play something that suits your style You are literally a troll. Play thief, don't talk to me until you do. He is right, you know. If I see two or more enemies approaching cap I am standing on I am noping out of there with my short bow like there is no tomorrow. While I am noping out I try to +1 my team on mid or where ever it is needed. Then I come back to from where I was chased out and it is usually unguarded. If there is only one I am more often then not able to hold my ground with the help of my fellow thieves (guild of thieves). Exactly and that's where thiefs strengths lie. Other classes cant just leave relatively safely like thief when being approached by to other opponents and are usually 1v2 while trying to escape and destroyed lol.This would be the best play even if thorf had a better burst potential.I think what find is the issue is if thief as a decapper/+1 burst class if ur +1ing with ur teammate and with both attacking the opponent it still takes a long time to down that opponent that should ring some bells toward either the sustain of the opponents or the burst potential of the class +1ing.Not saying thief needs a burst buff just that something needs to be looked at if those scenarios are occurring frequently. @Psycoprophet.8107 said: Yes, a l2p issue. Sure. Your post is literally full of stupid assumptions. As I mentionned already (but you didn't read that) I am, shocker shocker,a thief that does NOT use your kitten shortbow. No sir! And my shadowstep is on CD because I used it to reach close fast. But I bet you're some master thief, just LAUGHING your kitten off at players that can't even run after you! They just took your points and they're laughing at you back, but hey, at least you can come here and calling others noobs for not playing with your copy-paste metabattle shortbow build. Just l2p! 1) If you had shortbow and they sent 3 people to your close, you could have zipped out of there and snowball rest of the map..then gone back and reclaimed your close2) Playing a thief without shortbow in PvP..it's like playing an ele with staff or a ranger without GS...don't blame the game for your lack of wisdow, every class must be played to its strength..not some lore background3) If you don't to play +1 decapper/burst then play something that suits your style You are literally a troll. Play thief, don't talk to me until you do. He is right, you know. If I see two or more enemies approaching cap I am standing on I am noping out of there with my short bow like there is no tomorrow. While I am noping out I try to +1 my team on mid or where ever it is needed. Then I come back to from where I was chased out and it is usually unguarded. If there is only one I am more often then not able to hold my ground with the help of my fellow thieves (guild of thieves). Exactly and that's where thiefs strengths lie. Other classes cant just leave relatively safely like thief when being approached by to other opponents and are usually 1v2 while trying to escape and destroyed lol.This would be the best play even if thorf had a better burst potential.I think what find is the issue is if thief as a decapper/+1 burst class if ur +1ing with ur teammate and with both attacking the opponent it still takes a long time to down that opponent that should ring some bells toward either the sustain of the opponents or the burst potential of the class +1ing.Not saying thief needs a burst buff just that something needs to be looked at if those scenarios are occurring frequently. If they can't escape then they need enough sustain to wait for reinforcements , you are right saying that the wait aka time to kill cannot be too long for balance reasons obviously but that doesn't change the fact that sustain is necessary for some classes to counterbalance their inability to escape safely as a thief. If a spec invested in sustain then it should survive for enough time, say...40s...if now it's 1m+ then we need to reduce the sustain of such specs to reasonable levels and lower the kill time to 40s from 1m+, I hope thieves are not asking to lower the kill time to 0s like insta kill the +1 player even if he has full CD Uh I dunno, we certainly get instakilled. Why only us? You certainly get insta killed because your build lacks any means of escape, otherwise there is no way to insta kill a thief right now unless you play a "kill or die" spec and thief is afk or with no CD left to spare, either way if you play a burst spec with a zerker/marauder at 0 toughness you can expect always to live far less than somebody who specced in defense with a toughness amuletWrong assumption as usual. I play Marauder and most of my utilities are stealth / stunbreak / escapes. Just play thief already holy shit. Play thief and stop trying to pretend you know anything about the class when you don't play thief.

Yes, a l2p issue. Sure. Your post is literally full of stupid assumptions. As I mentionned already (but you didn't read that) I am, shocker shocker,a thief that does NOT use your kitten shortbow. No sir! And my shadowstep is on CD because I used it to reach close fast. But I bet you're some master thief, just LAUGHING your kitten off at players that can't even run after you! They just took your points and they're laughing at you back, but hey, at least you can come here and calling others noobs for not playing with your copy-paste metabattle shortbow build. Just l2p! 1) If you had shortbow and they sent 3 people to your close, you could have zipped out of there and snowball rest of the map..then gone back and reclaimed your close2) Playing a thief without shortbow in PvP..it's like playing an ele with staff or a ranger without GS...don't blame the game for your lack of wisdow, every class must be played to its strength..not some lore background3) If you don't to play +1 decapper/burst then play something that suits your style You are literally a troll. Play thief, don't talk to me until you do. He is right, you know. If I see two or more enemies approaching cap I am standing on I am noping out of there with my short bow like there is no tomorrow. While I am noping out I try to +1 my team on mid or where ever it is needed. Then I come back to from where I was chased out and it is usually unguarded. If there is only one I am more often then not able to hold my ground with the help of my fellow thieves (guild of thieves). Exactly and that's where thiefs strengths lie. Other classes cant just leave relatively safely like thief when being approached by to other opponents and are usually 1v2 while trying to escape and destroyed lol.This would be the best play even if thorf had a better burst potential.I think what find is the issue is if thief as a decapper/+1 burst class if ur +1ing with ur teammate and with both attacking the opponent it still takes a long time to down that opponent that should ring some bells toward either the sustain of the opponents or the burst potential of the class +1ing.Not saying thief needs a burst buff just that something needs to be looked at if those scenarios are occurring frequently. @Psycoprophet.8107 said: Yes, a l2p issue. Sure. Your post is literally full of stupid assumptions. As I mentionned already (but you didn't read that) I am, shocker shocker,a thief that does NOT use your kitten shortbow. No sir! And my shadowstep is on CD because I used it to reach close fast. But I bet you're some master thief, just LAUGHING your kitten off at players that can't even run after you! They just took your points and they're laughing at you back, but hey, at least you can come here and calling others noobs for not playing with your copy-paste metabattle shortbow build. Just l2p! 1) If you had shortbow and they sent 3 people to your close, you could have zipped out of there and snowball rest of the map..then gone back and reclaimed your close2) Playing a thief without shortbow in PvP..it's like playing an ele with staff or a ranger without GS...don't blame the game for your lack of wisdow, every class must be played to its strength..not some lore background3) If you don't to play +1 decapper/burst then play something that suits your style You are literally a troll. Play thief, don't talk to me until you do. He is right, you know. If I see two or more enemies approaching cap I am standing on I am noping out of there with my short bow like there is no tomorrow. While I am noping out I try to +1 my team on mid or where ever it is needed. Then I come back to from where I was chased out and it is usually unguarded. If there is only one I am more often then not able to hold my ground with the help of my fellow thieves (guild of thieves). Exactly and that's where thiefs strengths lie. Other classes cant just leave relatively safely like thief when being approached by to other opponents and are usually 1v2 while trying to escape and destroyed lol.This would be the best play even if thorf had a better burst potential.I think what find is the issue is if thief as a decapper/+1 burst class if ur +1ing with ur teammate and with both attacking the opponent it still takes a long time to down that opponent that should ring some bells toward either the sustain of the opponents or the burst potential of the class +1ing.Not saying thief needs a burst buff just that something needs to be looked at if those scenarios are occurring frequently. If they can't escape then they need enough sustain to wait for reinforcements , you are right saying that the wait aka time to kill cannot be too long for balance reasons obviously but that doesn't change the fact that sustain is necessary for some classes to counterbalance their inability to escape safely as a thief. If a spec invested in sustain then it should survive for enough time, say...40s...if now it's 1m+ then we need to reduce the sustain of such specs to reasonable levels and lower the kill time to 40s from 1m+, I hope thieves are not asking to lower the kill time to 0s like insta kill the +1 player even if he has full CDUh I dunno, we certainly get instakilled. Why only us?

when you start you use what others deemed working, you learn to play it, after time you understand why its working and how its working,after you do that you start testing other things and theorycrafting other things. most people stop at copying builds from others, its fine. but there are some that just theory craft with no skill and no understanding of what and why, and you end up with what @AldKai.9712 is doing.He died due to his mistakes, refused to learn WHY that happened, he didnt even learn how his enemies attacked him, refused to adopt his build and his stance against the enemies, and its all fine. Problem is he went to the forum with it, started whining and insulting others.Thiefs are indeed sheep, they copy what others streamers do, I suspect it might have something to do with the amount of people streaming thief gameplay.sind showed S/P insta every thief played it, D/P now everyone plays DP, it is how it is. You are full of shit. Please stop tagging me. Yes, a l2p issue. Sure. Your post is literally full of stupid assumptions. As I mentionned already (but you didn't read that) I am, shocker shocker,a thief that does NOT use your kitten shortbow. No sir! And my shadowstep is on CD because I used it to reach close fast. But I bet you're some master thief, just LAUGHING your kitten off at players that can't even run after you! They just took your points and they're laughing at you back, but hey, at least you can come here and calling others noobs for not playing with your copy-paste metabattle shortbow build. Just l2p! 1) If you had shortbow and they sent 3 people to your close, you could have zipped out of there and snowball rest of the map..then gone back and reclaimed your close2) Playing a thief without shortbow in PvP..it's like playing an ele with staff or a ranger without GS...don't blame the game for your lack of wisdow, every class must be played to its strength..not some lore background3) If you don't to play +1 decapper/burst then play something that suits your style You are literally a troll. Play thief, don't talk to me until you do. He is right, you know. If I see two or more enemies approaching cap I am standing on I am noping out of there with my short bow like there is no tomorrow. While I am noping out I try to +1 my team on mid or where ever it is needed. Then I come back to from where I was chased out and it is usually unguarded. If there is only one I am more often then not able to hold my ground with the help of my fellow thieves (guild of thieves). No he is not. Again, I've explained why I couldn't, and wouldn't just shadowstep away immediately, and please remember that I still had to cap the point. I don't think it takes more than elementary reading skills to understand that I got ganked by three players' worth of stuns at the same time. Nowadays every single class has closeup skills and easy access to swiftness. Also, you use the easy mode elite skill, good for you, but I run basilisk venom, which was on cooldown at the time as well as I used it to give my team a possible advantage. What happened was that even though I distracted three players the team couldn't handle a 4v2. The same people that call thief mains dumb sheep are the same people that screech at us that we have to follow some streamer that says thief is fine, or that we have to play only bow ever because the meta says so. Without playing thief themselves. They're the sheep, not us, but they will insult you if you don't play according to the bitch place they want your class to be, just like your teammates will. This community is the cancer killing itself and it's not getting a chemo anytime soon.