[June 27th Overview (PvP PoV)]

2 hours ago, semak.7481 said:

As if you are being known for that 🙈

Im known for saying things people don't agree with while siding with the developers. 

Essentially I'm to blame for all the negative changes to the game since I like most if not all the class changes. Even the re-introduction of the second dodge was predicted by me to remove the CC immunity. 

[June 27th Overview (PvP PoV)]

On 6/21/2023 at 12:00 PM, Leonidrex.5649 said:

bruh, the spec is trash with no mechanics. they brute-forced damage numbers patch after patch after patch after patch untill it got broken and left it there. 
Its still uninteresting, pile of garbage with too much dps.
If devs go out tomorrow and buff mechanist dps to 45k it wont change the fact that spec is borking as kitten to play, and braindead.
fun and interesting design trump big numbers, numbers can be adjusted at any time, they made kitten design and bribe people with big numbers to play this kitten.

Okay? How does un-interesting make it bad? 

I mean they nerfed Mirage's over and over after PoF to the point where no one even uses it? Does that make it an interesting Class? 

[June 27th Overview (PvP PoV)]

On 6/21/2023 at 5:06 PM, semak.7481 said:

If you still dont know its a [in]famous troll Mel on new account

Troll as in I was right about Virtuoso DPS all along. 

Liking or not liking the class mechanics is kind of irrelevant. It's a piercing ranged mage, the closest any other class comes to this is Ranger. 

[How about we wait for Mesmer update]

15 hours ago, WhoWantsAHug.3186 said:

There's nothing "easy" about playing vs a virtuoso. You can't outplay it, you simply have to burn through their plethora of defensive CDs before killing them is possible. This task is extremely frustrating for 1 player, especially on specs with a low volume of attacks, IE warrior. The only viable killing strategy is to 1vX it or completely ignore it. Bladeturn requiems CD is too short for how much is does. 

Builds with multiple unblockables can kill it outnumbered fairly quickly. That's less than a handful of viable builds. 

Defending virtuosos unhealthy state with "just outplay it" is cope from the people who abuse it. No one in their right mind enjoys fighting it. 

This is from an sPvP standpoint. 

You bait the Mesmer with auto attacks. Charge in and just hit them with 1, they can't tell the difference and will instantly go invulnerable then wait for it to finish before hitting your other skills. 

They have three types of invulnerability animations you watch for. One is they float which means they can't attack. The other is the shimmer which means they can attack. The last is blades circle them which will turn your attacks into boon.

[SHOULD JUNE 27 BALANCE PATCH GO LIVE IN ITS CURRENT STATE?]

On 6/14/2023 at 12:00 AM, Gibson.4036 said:

That would imply it’s a relatively new thing.

Truth is, status quo over the life of the game has leaned toward lack of communication. Occasionally someone at ANet announces they have a new policy of openness, which lasts a short while, then returns to the status quo.

I don’t think it’s due to any ill will. I expect most of the staff wants to communicate. But over the life of the game it appears ANet’s ambitions have always been larger than their resources, and when you don’t have enough time in your day, the first thing that goes is thorough communication.

I heard some of the streamers complain about it but I believe they have no market department since its all handled by the parent company. That why the lead developers and balance team leads end up doing it for them. 

[One week until the "ratio'd" balance patch goes live - will we hear a response to our feedback before then?]

4 hours ago, Batalix.2873 said:

But notably Virtuoso can still be selfish DPS. They are going after anything but the EoD specs.

Yeah pretty much. I mean Virtuoso has its place and core Mesmer tends to have alot of support elements like using the Inspiration traitline and blade generation to heal other players. 

Thief, Ranger and Warrior in particular were really bad before this up comming patch so hopefully they have some valued support builds atleast for more casual play. 

[One week until the "ratio'd" balance patch goes live - will we hear a response to our feedback before then?]

14 hours ago, soulknight.9620 said:

Im not a fan of that either. But thats how a lot of people see gw2 endgame. And even some "content creators" are making this a mantra for anyone that wants to get into end game content. Ive even seen a guy that actually said that if you dont play a boon support in OW you are selfish and useless and shouldnt play gw2 at this point. 

This is exactly what happened when EoD Elites came out and was the primary complaint about Virtuoso. It probably still is in the open world.

They get called selfish DPS so I guess this patch is an attempt at fixing that a little, especially with something like Deadeye. 

[With Mirage getting it's 2nd dodge do you think it will be suitable for WvW Zergs ?]

In terms of Zerg usability most of the time you want lock someone down and blow them up.this tends to be the best thing a Mesmer can do. I feel like Chronomancer will still be better at this due to Gravity Well. 

Maybe some Greatsword along with Axe? Tag with Greatsword and then swap for the burst on a single target. 

[One week until the "ratio'd" balance patch goes live - will we hear a response to our feedback before then?]

On 6/22/2023 at 1:29 PM, Gaiawolf.8261 said:

To be fair, that's mostly just true for optimizers. Most players pick their class by concept, theme, and playstyle rather than which one outperforms the others by 5-15%. Some players love necromancers so much, that's all they play. Some are warrior diehards, no matter the game. Many players just chose whatever class they find the most fun, and never know another class is doing their role or playstyle several % better than them. That said, a unique feature that sets each class apart is a highly valued game design, but it does NOT have to be tied to "what they do well."

Just because all classes/especs can perform the same role, doesn't mean each won't have an audience as long as it brings something unique to the table, and that unique feature can be of concept, theme, playstyle, or role. Personally, I prefer games when most class concepts are versatile enough to be able to play any role I want to play, but offers a unique theme and playstyle. That way, I can pick my theme, and not be locked out of a role solely because of my choice in character concept.

Example, firebrand is my absolute favorite endgame "class" because a) it's the only class representing the divine caster theme in the game, b) it can play any role without having to drastically alter my character concept or class/subclass (smiting priest/healer/protector, etc.), and c) it provides a uniquely distinct playstyle from every other class, even when they overlap roles.

But the bottom line, this patch goes too far into deleting unique aspects of classes/especs to make them work into Anet's weird role designations, which is the heart of the problem. I'm fine with expanding versatility and roles, but not at the expense of unique aspects. There is plenty of design space for both, as several of the better designed, versatile classes/epsecs show us.

(Also, since I didn't use Anet's terminology, I'm considering each espec as an endgame class/subclass from other games, since many especs alter the profession mechanics, theme, and playstyles so much that they might as well be entirely different character concepts. Sorry for any confusion that caused.)

I fell like after this update the most likely complaint will be, My X role with X class is not longer the most demanded role. 

When you get too end game two things happen, one you realise that your favourite class can't do something. Two it excels at a specific game-mode/role. Theif is probably the best example with it only really being used in PvE on a very specific raid bosses. Outside this it is only a PvP class at the highest level. 

Now I guess you can bring that same class into any game mode / role and not be booted. Or atleast that is what Arena Net is trying to do. 

[ANET listen to me suggestion for alac mirage]

If we start seeing Chronomancer Alacrity take off then I would say it's more likely they will remove Mirage Staff alacrity entirely and return the weapon to a more dps one. 

There is a bit a gap for a more melee focused Mesmer since Virtuoso can be reflected, some PvE content prefer Mirage but it does tend to be rare. 

[One week until the "ratio'd" balance patch goes live - will we hear a response to our feedback before then?]

12 minutes ago, AresGuildwars.6372 said:

I did all the stages of grief and am now at acceptance to just quit and not care much further. Haven't logged it once since the preview and touched some grass. Turns out, other devs also have pretty games. Quite the easiest solution. They gonna make more money with a heavily fluctuating playerbase anyway so I shouldn't see myself as the target audience at all. *shrug*

I left becouse the class I played where getting reworked so now they have reworked Untamed I want to jump back in to try it out. 

[How about we wait for Mesmer update]

1 hour ago, Leonidrex.5649 said:

99% of mesmer haters cant even tell a difference between builds.
And think that the 3x dps traitline virtuoso that killed them is the same virtuoso that runs 3 signets and inspiration, it has always been this way. Mesmer is a class that most players are unwilling to learn, and this pvp culture is all about nerfing the competition and never actually getting better.

Pretty much but that is the game we have. It's very casual with the most popular PvP game mode being WvW where you can just join a massive zerg of players and get carried. 

[anet u need to make up ur mind]

2 hours ago, JTGuevara.9018 said:

Well then! Wait until you see how many times banners got reworked in their entire history!

(Source: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Banner_of_Strength )

(leans back)...Ahhh...just give me my likes, already...

 

The problem was they were always mandatory buffs for benchmarks so if you where playing a Warrior and didn't want to use banners you would be kicked since it would drastically lower the group DPS. 

[One week until the "ratio'd" balance patch goes live - will we hear a response to our feedback before then?]

On 6/21/2023 at 1:22 PM, LichOverlord.6329 said:

I don't see how that's possible considering the Guild Wars 2 subreddit has been private for the past month and has only just now come back online yesterday, with the forum locked except for a poll on whether it should stay private or not. 

I have been able to read quite a few posts on the topic. The most common complaint is the upcoming lack of class diversity but people rightly point out that if you mean broken builds as class diversity then this patch is a good thing. 

[How about we wait for Mesmer update]

5 hours ago, REMagic.8937 said:

Most people here on the forums seem to look at Virtuoso especially from a PvP standpoint, where losing the block on Bladeturn Requiem is a significant downside.

For example, in raids and strike missions, Condition Virtuoso is going to be buffed by a lot and will dominate the meta even more. But that type of game mode (endgame group content) and playstyle (actually running DPS meter and caring about the numbers you get) is very rarely represented on this forum.

There are probably more regular posters here who legitimately play this game only for fashion wars (and wish for cosmetic changes, like being able to hide daggers, or like it when skills have flashy cool animations) than who care about DPS numbers.

That being said - the point of a patch preview is to be able to talk about the changes. Anet literally wants us to give feedback and voice our concerns, so that's why we are doing it.

Virtuoso especially has been a large part of Mesmer critism lately with its long drawn out invulnerabilities. To be honest playing against a Mesmer while myself knowing it mechanics makes fighting them very easy but the guess the player base as a whole still has an issue. 

Im all for providing feedback but some people want to jump off a cliff when they see that Mirage second dodge isn't going to come back without a nerf to the CC immunity. 

[One week until the "ratio'd" balance patch goes live - will we hear a response to our feedback before then?]

It's only on the forum I would say for the most part it is received quiet well if you go to Reddit. 

[How about we wait for Mesmer update]

Again even though I come off as a troll to the entire Mesmer community isn't there still some sense in waiting for the Update to come about before slandering any changes. 

I have brought this up before but almost any discord I'm on people Hate Mesmer. Most players even the ones playing Mesmer let me know it's OP and generally just play the Meta Builds due to that fact. 

I have never come across anyone in game besides myself that defend Mesmer and this is comming from Mesmer forum troll. 

[June 27th Overview (PvP PoV)]

1 hour ago, Leonidrex.5649 said:

eh same kitten happened when the garbge of a spec virtuoso released.
Dysfunctional in every single game-mode yet simps were praising it as if its the best thing since sliced bread.
simps be simpin

I mean it is an amazing spec? 

Probably the single most recommended Mesmer Elite for most game modes except WvW. Even then it is definitely most noob friendly PvP Elite with its many invulnerabilities. 

[Flow of Time (WvW Perspective)]

On 6/19/2023 at 2:48 PM, Roadkizzle.2157 said:

What you're missing is that is the point. 

Players of other classes complain about fighting against Mesmers so CMC is trying to make the players of every other class happy.

Pretty much, plenty of Guild groups and Zerg leaders where running Chronomancer to port players on engagement so this is not going to be as strong. 

[June 27th Overview (PvP PoV)]

Sigh the only reason I use this account is becouse it's not cursed like the other one which seems to be on a watch lists by the Mods. 

Anyway good luck with shouting on the forums about stuff that will never change. 

[Why do we rarely see changes reflective of what players are actually asking for?]

On 6/10/2023 at 6:39 PM, Helgaley.3619 said:

This is a reasonable response. What really bothers me is that the June 2022 balance patch also left a lot of people scratching their heads, and then those Discord chats leaked and we saw the lead balance dev admitting flat out to 1) making design decisions based on personal preference and 2) being so unfamiliar with other professions he had to use the wiki. That individual also happened to be responsible for designing the mechanist, and he enjoyed staff mirage, and both of those specializations received buffs that year. 

This year, for the June 2023 patch, we have a lead balance dev who mains elementalist and who has a PVP background, and we have a balance patch that's still filled with head scratchers, but it also just happens to buff a number of elementalist skills and traits used in PVP builds. 

I think it's fine for developers to put their own personal stamp on a profession that reflects their vision for the class, but that isn't what we're seeing. This is just personal bias. 

Wasn't the problem before this discord leak and all pior balance patches is that there was no vision for each class. 

The discord leaks proved one thing, that Arena Net was actually playing the game and the balance team did have some personal opinions on the balance. 

I think people have very rosey interpretation of early Guild Wars 2 which was pretty horrible. I mean prior to EoD we had some unkillable PvE builds and Necro dominated most game modes. 

[June 27th Overview (PvP PoV)]

20 hours ago, Veprovina.4876 said:

You said yourself we're getting nerfs because of some hypothetical future "problem" that might never happen, while everyone else, gets adjusted (badly) based on what they can do now. So we're not even allowed a chance to become decent, let alone a problem, they're intentionally keeping us down, and you pointed that out.

 

And then you said "chaos mirage got buffs" like, what in the copium is that logic? 🙄

Lol, why don't you play another game/class. Waffles tells me that Elementalist is open if you want the OP experience. 

[June 27th Overview (PvP PoV)]

Pretty well rounded break down. 

Most people on this forum won't listen sadly they are stuck in there own world where Mesmer is the only class in the game.

The biggest complaint about Mirage is that it always felt like two different classes between PvE and PvP. Now players can finally dip into PvP and not change how they play. 

 

On a more positive note seems like every class got some nerfs this patch so some stuff is probably fair in relation to other class nerfs. 

[Return our second dodge and fix mesmers!]

3 hours ago, Waffles.5632 said:

 

 

@Waffles.5632 I'm not mad or anything so it all good, I agree with you in alot other threads. 

Im just so delusional about any fix I don't know why any of you even bother trying to argue. Just let them do what they want with Mirage. 

Its dead and will always be dead. No second dodge will bring it back, the rest of the player base probably want more nerfs so expect that next patch. 

[Return our second dodge and fix mesmers!]

2 hours ago, Varis.5467 said:

Fact check: many other specs could be consider toxic and none got the treatment mirage received. 

Whatever you want to dress it up as - timeout or otherwise - the bias within the balance team is the real issue. 

And look, scourge having their boon corrupt removed is just the beginning of the same 💩 all over again. 

Well Chronomancer was once the only class that could provide group Alacrity and decent Quickness so any attempt at re-imagining that Elite will never bring it back to its former glory. 

Being able to dodge even while stunned or rooted to avoid all the in comming damage will never come back. Atleast I can admit that and not live in the past like you lot are. 

How many month has this thread been going? Just play another game or OP class untill that is nerfed.