Guardian Core Virtues

[Infusion.7149]

@otto.5684 said:@"Infusion.7149" Again, core is not ran over DH or FB dps, cuz you will not have any consistency in keep unscathed contender. When you provide the raid numbers, they assume 100% uptime of modifiers, which you can never do running virtues. Zeal and radiance modifiers are up all the time in PvE, and most of the time in PvP.

I dunno why you keep bring WvW, FB and permuting wraith. I have not made a single suggestion that impact these. As I said I do not WvW... so not much I can say about this topic. But if there tons of things that I do think should be nerfed, or changed for guardian.

Zeal buffs to symbols.Zeal making permuting wraith proc faster.VoJ dealing double damage in sPvP.The mantras. All of them need modification in both PvP and PvE. MoS should never have been able to provide aegis on 9.5 sec CD. Even in PvE this is ridculos. And Anet solution to just nerf the healing was dumb. Cuz it only hurt none support builds.Instant rez should be removed.

But that does not mean there are other stuff that needs to buffed or fixed. See.. I would like the virtues damage modifiers to be consistent. That would be nice... but it is not. Not even remotely.

When you run support FB in PvE, most of the time you will run radiance, better known as Quickbrand. You could run the virtue variant for healing, but... why? Unless your group is struggling in survivability, you are dropping team damage for no good reason.

And, I want to be clear, this is guardian forums and guardian suggestions. I do think there are many classes and many changes that do take priority, but this is not the place to discuss them. Necro can barely pull 30K. They should be ahead. But, feel free to post in necro forums about that. It is worth bringing-up. It has nothing to do with this thread though.

Except I have already delineated how that is possible with a firebrand (or multiple) in your party. In fractals if the boss is CCed with "Exposed" it literally means it is impossible to drop aegis because it can't attack or do anything. I don't know if you're just replying without even bothering to read the links that I referenced or what. The first post I merely referenced them without linking them, but this time I directly linked to the page and section, it doesn't get more direct than that.

Re: Zeal buffs to symbols, there's already vulnerability and a damage bonus. On top of that there's a damage bonus to symbols whenever they hit that makes them progressively more impactful. On the flip side someone literally needs to be sitting in it , which is only an issue in PVP where capture points are involved : it's a nonissue elsewhere.

"Instant res" doesn't exist contrary to what complainers in PVP would have you believe. Merciful Intervention no longer resses any appreciable amount (it's 5% only) and Signet of Mercy has a 2s cast time. Both requiring giving up a utility slot.

You're confusing power quickbrand or Condi Quickbrand with healbrand (which normally won't be run in a 10 man group with a druid unless it's a strike mission sans druid). Radiance only affords you signet passive sharing (if you're running harrier since your critical chance will still be mediocre with the 10% from Omnipot at 150AR , 10% from Radiant Power and 80 precision aka ~4% crit chance from Right Hand Strength unless you have a full on meta comp with BS for +Soulbeast that has spotter for 100 precision / ~ 5% chance each = 10+10+4+10+10+20 from fury = ~69% including the base 5% crit chance) and 10% crit damage, which if you are PUGing is much riskier than running virtues. Go look on any LFG for fractals and it will be "LF HB". That's a trend ever since chrono was nerfed and made HB+Alacrity renegade replace chrono (quickness/alac)+ druid (might , frost spirits/heals). Why do I know this? I used to play chrono and I also play revenant (since HOT) and firebrand (I play all classes).

Anything that is changed in PVE also affects WVW and PVP because they have said that there can only be numerical changes between modes (whether it is recharge, damage, etc).

In this thread , you have done no convincing argument to anyone that is impartial that guardian needs these buffs. You just want them. Ultimately that is what it comes down to.

Again, who do these proposed changes even help? Players that don't have any expansions and somehow need to do high end content? Because if they are just doing casual content it is completely pointless to introduce these changes. If it's for fractals (which core has access to), then a core guardian will never be taken over a firebrand first , right now not even DH is.

Imagine if every player of every class made a thread like this where it's "because I think so" without any hard facts. Especially if the class (not the spec) is one of the strongest if not the strongest.

P.S. in your original post you wrote the following:

Improve core guardian performance. It is not meant to catch-up with DH or FB. Just be a bit closer.I proved this to be a false premise, as shown by Snowcrows and LN.Core guardian to have a slight come back in PvP.It's already meta per GodsofPVP + "good" per Metabattle, even if I don't agree with half the stuff that goes on those places.

[Frozen.7245]

Yes, there is a trait that allows them to maintain the effects on the Firebrand tree. The problem I've found is (I'm not sure if this is a bug or not, but it's why I'm here because I was going to suggest it when I saw this post) when you use Firebrand or Dragonhunter with the Virtues trait line, I'm noticing (for certain on the Firebrand, and only suspecting it on the Dragonhunter) I'm not getting the perks from my virtues trait line, when they reference the specific virtues, as each elite spec changes the name of the skill. It's pretty upsetting. I would love to see them move the trait to allow you to keep your perks passive effect while on recharge as a higher end trait.

[cat.8975]

I'm a little late to this thread, but...

@otto.5684 said:@"Infusion.7149" Again, core is not ran over DH or FB dps, cuz you will not have any consistency in keep unscathed contender. When you provide the raid numbers, they assume 100% uptime of modifiers, which you can never do running virtues. Zeal and radiance modifiers are up all the time in PvE, and most of the time in PvP.

I've been running core guard in raids for the last 2-3 years now (I was sorta the guy that pioneered the build, actually). Keeping aegis up ranges from "impossible, play something else", to "moderately difficult but doable", to "hilariously easy lol" depending on the boss.

For easy bosses you have: Gorseval, Cairn, Mursaat Overseer, Samarog, Dhuum, and Adina.

Difficult but doable: Vale Guardian, Sloth, Keep Construct, Deimos, Statues, Conjured Amalgamate, Qadim1

Masochist tier (it's possible but you'll hate yourself): Sabetha, Soulless Horror, Sabir (his autos don't strip aegis)

I don't recommend it anywhere else.

That being said, I'd still like to see a small buff to core/dh burn output though. It's a shame FB is leagues ahead of the other two specs in the condi department, and that's before you even factor in tome resets. (Also wish they'd rework torch 4 and the trait but that's a different topic entirely.)

[RedCobra.7693]

I feel its a bit unfair to dismiss tharan completely albeit he was a bit rude.changes to traits functionality will also need to be changed in pvp they are directly linked. only the numbers of traits can be played around with in pvp. so if you buff virtues in pve by making the functionality of the traits better you are also making an already terribly annoying build core guard bunker incredibly worse.

this is why it takes so long for balance changes in terms of functionality, it is done by game developers and not solely by the balance team. the balance team are responsible for tweaking the numbers to make them fair for their relevant gamemode anet have quite a lot on their hands this way but its not their fault theyre working with an old in house engine.

[Hagion.1086]

agree...core virtues are bad and weak...DH virtues does same passive with much more strong active effect.