They want to ban dps meters, I gave my reason why they shouldn't ban dps meters. I'm fairly on topic of the thread even while having doubts as to the OPs arguments, after all they WANT something, and that's what I'm against. I gave my side of the "ban dps meters argument". What are you doing here? Your argument against the OP and others who claim similar is its all lies? My purpose in these replies is simply to point out that just because you do not use DPS meters that way, within your subsection of the community, does not mean that it is not used that way. Its not a great arguement to say it does not exist, because, lets be honest, you have been on these forums for awhile, and been a part of many discussions, i am sure you have seen other accounts, and probably witnessed first hands people kicked with less actual evidence for the belief they werent doing well. If you havent, you have been very lucky. My other point, is that the baseline agreement for entering lfg content is a desire to succeed, the assumption should not be specialized meta. People who create specialized meta type lfgs should definitely expect that, but some one who just posts Ascalon catacombs, has no just right to expect speed clear type players. I personally am not against dps meters, because they created content recently where it is basically designed such that dps meters and tracking of other data is probably the most useful tool for improvement in said content, and building toward success. But the reality is that some people will use that data in bad ways. they cant have raids, and ban dps meters, at this point it almost doesnt matter if widespread abuse is happening(i am not saying this is the case), you will not get a high success ratio on raids without tools that give players feedback on their performance, and allow people guiding them to see where the group is missing out. The only way that could happen, is if they built some of their own tools that serve similar purposes, and give similar feedback perhaps with better execution and hidden facets to avoid abuse, but thats unrealistic, and even then there might be little qualitative difference.