Whats the point of "pure DPS" elite specs now?

[Obtena.7952]

1 minute ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

Just tell me why the kkkitteeennn all my raids groups / strikes and even now fractals are full of mechs ? why my 3 statics all say the same "we dont play mech because it is fun , we play because it is broken" and thats from a guy who cleared ht cm 3 days after teapot , so he know the game issues , trust me. 

because the people you play with want to use mechs. Again, explain to me why it's a problem for you what other people are playing?

[Zaret.1450]

Just now, zaswer.5246 said:

then why do you keep deniing that mech and other clases are objectively better and thus have much more use?

and why, if you like playing whatever you want, keep saying that buffing dps that are objectively worse isnt needed?

See the point? youre just saying that because youre fine as things are then things are perfect and theres no need for changes

i mean why the need to refute what others say when you suposedly dont care about anything?

[zeyeti.8347]

Just now, Obtena.7952 said:

because the people you play with want to use mechs. Again, explain to me why it's a problem for you what other people are playing?

Cause it complitely make the other classes useless in endgame as for diversity in the game is inexistent in endgame , so as told up arena need to uber buff the others classes 

[Obtena.7952]

Just now, zaswer.5246 said:

then why do you keep deniing that mech and other clases are objectively better and thus have much more use?

I never did. That's just something you're making up. 

Just now, zaswer.5246 said:

and why, if you like playing whatever you want, keep saying that buffing dps that are objectively worse isnt needed?

Those things aren't in conflict ... if you play how you want, you don't really concern yourself with DPS. 

Just now, zaswer.5246 said:

See the point? youre just saying that because youre fine as things are then things are perfect and theres no need for changes

No I don't see the point because you are making that point based on things I never said or don't conflict. 

[Zaret.1450]

1 minute ago, Obtena.7952 said:

because the people you play with want to use mechs. Again, explain to me why it's a problem for you what other people are playing?

because its not wether they want or not, its simplres than that, if its broken youll use it for convenience.

But is it wrong to see something broken an then ask for balance? so instead of using mec you can use other classes without being looked at?

or simpler even, if mech is broken and it feels powerfull then every other class thats weak will feel worse, thus i want my class to be buffed so it feels good again

[Zaret.1450]

1 minute ago, Obtena.7952 said:

I never did. That's just something you're making up. 

Those things aren't in conflict ... if you play how you want, you don't really concern yourself with DPS. 

No I don't see the point because you are making that point based on things I never said or don't conflict. 

ok then what the hell are you saying from the start, please tell me

[Obtena.7952]

5 minutes ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

Cause it complitely make the other classes useless in endgame as for diversity in the game is inexistent in endgame , so as told up arena need to uber buff the others classes 

That makes no sense. You play how you want. They play how they want. That's how it works. What other people play doesn't affect you.  You don't get to impose how you want the game to work on what people want to play. The idea that something needs to be nerfed because it offends your sensibilities to how the game should work is a lack of respect for how people want to play and use their time in game. 

Edited August 18, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Obtena.7952]

1 minute ago, zaswer.5246 said:

because its not wether they want or not, its simplres than that, if its broken youll use it for convenience.

But is it wrong to see something broken an then ask for balance? so instead of using mec you can use other classes without being looked at?

or simpler even, if mech is broken and it feels powerfull then every other class thats weak will feel worse, thus i want my class to be buffed so it feels good again

No, it's not that simple. People have LOTS of reasons to play different things and they do play different things. Not everyone is simply choosing mech because convenience.

[Zaret.1450]

1 minute ago, Obtena.7952 said:

That makes no sense. You play how you want. They play how they want. That's how it works. What other people play doesn't affect you. 

Ok how in the world does other people not affect you in a mmo game? be it pvp or pve you have people around, and even if you were alone, you play a class, its overpowered, then play another, its underpowered, you have more fun with the second but as it just makes things more dificult and feels bad you play the first.

Thats what usualy happens, im not talking about how you feel or play, im talking about 90% of the player population here

[Obtena.7952]

3 minutes ago, zaswer.5246 said:

Ok how in the world does other people not affect you in a mmo game? be it pvp or pve you have people around, and even if you were alone, you play a class, its overpowered, then play another, its underpowered, you have more fun with the second but as it just makes things more dificult and feels bad you play the first.

Thats what usualy happens, im not talking about how you feel or play, im talking about 90% of the player population here

Because what they play doesn't affect what I play. You simply imposing yourself on these people and taking offense to it to justify changes. They press 1 or 100 buttons ... doesn't affect me. They get top 1% DPS or average DPS ... doesn't affect me. I can choose what I want and play that build how I want, regardless of what other people are doing. That's not unique to me either. That's how the game is designed. 

You don't speak for 90% of the population here. The fallacy of the majority ... 

Edited August 18, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Zaret.1450]

2 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

No, it's not that simple. People have LOTS of reasons to play different things and they do play different things. Not everyone is simply choosing mech because convenience.

people play mech for 2 things, 1 they like the mecha robot pet and tematic, 2 its stupidly strong and one of the best options for any end game content thus people want it in groups and you end up using it.

 

Theres nothing else to that, do you realy think even half of the mecs you see around like it? nah its just too strong, and thats a problem, a problem because end game, if you play a bit seriously, requires you to use good builds, good characters and play decently so noone in your group looses its time.

 

I mean please, tell me why do you need to enter the discussion, if you dont have any complain, and the only thing you say is, not everyone plays because its strong, people play for different things, yeah, but between firebrand and mech they take all the suport spots in more than 85% of the groups in raid, fractals and strikes, is it realy a personal choice that almost everyone does that? or maybe you are the exception that doesnt wanna see reality?

[zeyeti.8347]

 

Just now, Obtena.7952 said:

That makes no sense. You play how you want. They play how they want. That's how it works. What other people play doesn't affect you. 

Omg you are a troll , i am feeding ? It affects a lot of people ! Lots of ppl play what destroy arcdps , thats their way of playing , the day you will see ele having a not piano like rotation dealing 45k on raidbosses with a ranged weapon , i ll play ele , tahts how i choose to play iam not bend to a class cause it's flashy or has some kewl mechanics , i play it cause i obliterate bosses with it , so having a team with 8 mechs and two firebrands only metas , for me, destroy the diversity of the game , i freaking wish i could play ele as heal as dps or whatsoever , but if i do i will be a burden fo my team. If nobody take a spec for endgame , that mean the spec is unbalanced and not attractive neither for it's mechanic neither for it's effectiveness , so arena need to patch those heavely to make them attractive , it count DH , holosmith , scrapper , Reaper , weaver , tempest , catalyst , willbender and sovort... All those classes are not played in endgame content and so need a good boost.

[Zaret.1450]

5 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Because what they play doesn't affect what I play. You simply imposing yourself on these people and taking offense to it to justify changes. They press 1 or 100 buttons ... doesn't affect me. They get top 1% DPS or average DPS ... doesn't affect me. I can choose what I want and play that build how I want, regardless of what other people are doing. That's not unique to me either. That's how the game is designed. 

You don't speak for 90% of the population here. The fallacy of the majority ... 

fallacy? what game are you playing? you play whatever you want, then why even bother entering the discussion man? and also, go enter a raid group with a heal reaper, lets see how much you stay in.

Im tired already.

[Urphen.2857]

1 minute ago, zaswer.5246 said:

I mean please, tell me why do you need to enter the discussion, if you dont have any complain, and the only thing you say is, not everyone plays because its strong, people play for different things, yeah, but between firebrand and mech they take all the suport spots in more than 85% of the groups in raid, fractals and strikes, is it realy a personal choice that almost everyone does that? or maybe you are the exception that doesnt wanna see reality?

because it is what he is always doing, you should stop and ignore him, trust me the frustration is not worth it, you are talking to a person that now over a year trys to defend anet no matter what, people before said how biased anet is with speccs und that they have golden childs and gues who was in every thread saying "noooooo, they have a plan, a big vision thats why they make (unjustified) nerfs" and at the end what we got? a leak that showed us how right everyone was, and still the same person is here defending everything because people arent allowed to have their own opinion.

[Obtena.7952]

7 minutes ago, zaswer.5246 said:

people play mech for 2 things,

And this is why you have a problem ... you don't know all the reasons people choose to play mechs, or you are ignoring them to make a contrived argument why they need to change it. 

[Obtena.7952]

14 minutes ago, zaswer.5246 said:

you play whatever you want, then why even bother entering the discussion man? 

Because everyone should respect the reasons people choose to play different things so they can play how they want as intended by how the game is designed.

I mean, don't you want other players to respect the choices you make for what and how you play the game? I would be careful here if I were you because you don't want to set a double standard for you and mech players here. 

 

Edited August 18, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[zeyeti.8347]

Yeah play how you want it doesnt affect you , go full clown into a raidgroup gonna see what happens , take a bomb from dhuum and wipe it on the group or play weaver and do 15k dps cause you are melee only gonna see what happens if it is a serious group , you gonna take a feet to the butt of the group then get frustrated and say the sorry excuse "but dps doesnt matter ..." yeah thats the loser excuse , like in real life i try my best to win and dont make sorry excuse like "it's okay to be weak at dps" at some level no ! Thats the main issue here we dont play the game on the same level no need to argue more you will never understand us and we will never undertsand you . As many other i am pretty sure have done you go my Bl list , will be better for the both of us , good night.

Edited August 18, 2022 by zeyeti.8347

[Obtena.7952]

12 minutes ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

Yeah play how you want it doesnt affect you , go full clown into a raidgroup gonna see what happens , take a bomb from dhuum and wipe it on the group or play weaver and do 15k dps cause you are melee only gonna see what happens if it is a serious group , you gonna take a feet to the butt of the group then get frustrated and say the sorry excuse "but dps doesnt matter ..." yeah thats the loser excuse , like in real life i try my best to win and dont make sorry excuse like "it's okay to be weak at dps" at some level no ! Thats the main issue here we dont play the game on the same level no need to argue more you will never understand us and we will never undertsand you . Endline good night.

No hold on ... that's unfair. I'm not saying people should be playing in a way that is malicious or incompetent on purpose. That's just you arguing in bad faith at this point. I'm just going to repeat my point to you because being sensational or taking my point out of context doesn't make you correct or win any argument here.

If you want people to respect what choices you are making for the builds you play, you have to give the same respect back to the people making their choices, EVEN if you don't like their choices. 

True, we don't play the game at the same level ... but you don't need to understand the game is designed to allow people to play how they want with a large variety of options they can be successful with. 

Edited August 18, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[zeyeti.8347]

saw that before the BL, ....

 

"True, we don't play the game at the same level ... but you don't need to understand the game is designed to allow people to play how they want with a large variety of options they can be successful with. "

 

large variety of option , hahahahahahahaha good one ! made me laugh... sure you dont do a lot of endgame content because you dont know the few endgame content that went out , not gonna argue about play whatever content you want thats fine , so you really cannot understand the game  trough the eye of a competitive way. NO you dont have choices in endgame content , when you wanna clear things hard like kaineng overlook cm , you have pretty defined roles that only few classes can do or achieve , you have to upkeep most of the offensive boons cause you have a timer ! and so dps matters ! try Ankka cm title "gaze into the void" , you dont have the dps to get trough ! you dont get it ! thats all ! No you cannot play weaver sword/dagger on ankka cm for title run , because you will be a burden to the group , not being able to dps at range. With not the intention of being mean , you live in a "care bears" game , where something or someone has told you every class is equal , every class can achieve the same challenge , open your eyes , look at the storm sh it and speak the truth , game is as well balanced atm as a fight between a mouse and a hyppo.... sure there will be always super duper people who will achieve it with a "armless class" but those people represent 0,001% of the playerbase.

Edited August 18, 2022 by zeyeti.8347

[Obtena.7952]

19 minutes ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

kitten got that message before the BL.... , i dont respect a dps class who is far below the others because that make them leechers and i personnaly when commanding a squad or in my raid training guild push people to play only mechs ! And then everybody has the same reaction "kitten never done so much damage so easily" . If we listen to you the game is gonna be some fastfood easy kitten so called game making everything easy and accessible even for young embryos , cause yes embryos has also the right to play the game , no ? Elitism is a good thing ! who you think made up the path for all raids tactics ? who made some guides for all endgame content ? Teapot can be nice sure , bu you think he will accept a dps at 11k on ht cm when he wants to clear it , no ! he will politely kick the guy off , in order for a spec to be used it must be competitive ! being shiny , "kewl look i make purply rainbows dropping from the skyyys" "yes but does it make damage ? no ? so it's useless" . I am like St thomas apostle , i only believe what i see ! and what i see is mechs everywhere !!!! 

OK ... so you make your choices based on your value system ...  so other people get the SAME freedom to make choices based on their value system and what they choose doesn't impact your choices. If someone wants blue, you can take whatever colour you like. If someone taking blue offends you, it's only because you take offense to it to dishonestly launch criticism against it. That's not how a game designed to play how you want works. 

Edited August 18, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[zeyeti.8347]

18 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

OK ... so you make your choices based on your value system ...  so other people get the SAME freedom to make choices based on their value system and what they choose doesn't impact your choices. If someone wants blue, you can take whatever colour you like. If someone taking blue offends you, it's only because you take offense to it to dishonestly launch criticism against it. That's now how a game designed to play how you want works. 

NOOOO i cannot  , if i take a burden class i ll be kicked out of the raid cause i am a high risks player to fail a mechanic or make my squad in danger , how you dont understand that ..... the game has no equality within the class comp. , just tell me why nobody plays untamed or catalyst ? Have you just ever played one of the last cm strikes ? try take your average dps class there , fail 3 times and get kicked thats what you gonna have , or play mech go full pew pew and be saved. people dont play how they want , they are more or less obliged to have a way to play.

Edited August 18, 2022 by zeyeti.8347

[the krytan assassin.9235]

46 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Because what they play doesn't affect what I play.

Except it does... 

50% of the groups (closer to 80% on experienced groups) ask specifically for guard, engie, necro and mesmer for strikes/raids and dealing insufficient dps/support can easily result in a kick if the squad is struggling. If you keep playing casual or with a non hardcore guild only you won't notice that much of a struggle, but when using the lfg tool you'll definitely notice. 

Also i cant Imagine someone being perfectly fine with playing the fcking piano while having limited cc, support & surviveability simply get out dps'ed by an engie who's afk. Sure you can choose to play your favourite class despite all these limitations, but argueing the situation is perfectly fine is ridiculous. 

You act like someone who's happy to get beaten by a wooden stick, simply because it also could've been a steel Rod. 

[Obtena.7952]

3 minutes ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

NOOOO i cannot  , if i take a burden class i ll be kicked out of the raid cause i am a high risks player to fail a mechanic or make my squad in danger , how you dont understand that ..... the game has no equality within the class comp. , just tell me why nobody plays untamed or catalyst ? Have you just ever played one of the last cm strikes ? try take your average dps class there , fail 3 times and get kicked thats what you gonna have , or play mech go full pew pew and be saved.

That doesn't make sense ... you have the choice to not take a 'burden' class. 

[Obtena.7952]

3 minutes ago, the krytan assassin.9235 said:

Except it does... 

50% of the groups (closer to 80% on experienced groups) ask specifically for guard, engie, necro and mesmer for strikes/raids and dealing insufficient dps/support can easily result in a kick if the squad is struggling. If you keep playing casual or with a non hardcore guild only you won't notice that much of a struggle, but when using the lfg tool you'll definitely notice. 

Also i cant Imagine someone being perfectly fine with playing the fcking piano while having limited cc, support & surviveability simply get out dps'ed by an engie who's afk. Sure you can choose to play your favourite class despite all these limitations, but argueing the situation is perfectly fine is ridiculous. 

You act like someone who's happy to get beaten by a wooden stick, simply because it also could've been a steel Rod. 

It's your choice to play in those teams. Isn't it funny how that works ... you have access to all the choices you need to avoid being impacted by people play mechs but instead of making those choices, you are justifying removing someone else's choice. 

If you are offended by how someone else plays the game, it's because you took offense to it. 

Edited August 18, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[zeyeti.8347]

Just now, Obtena.7952 said:

That doesn't make sense ... you have the choice to not take a 'burden' class. 

It's you who dont make any sense , what about class diversity ? you dont understand that people who i play with are somehow forced into play what is efficient , so we play mech , you know what , stay at your low level gameplay , go clean tarir meta , feeling like thats endgame content.