Looking for a tanky yet decent dps class (PVE\open\raids, strikes perhaps?)

[Joxer.6024]

Having come from a long history of playing tanks in MMO's, DK in WOW, all that fun stuff, I have no issue with not doing the big pew pew numbers and having a fight take awhile, as long as I dont spend it on my face. Staying out of the bad but being able to dish out "some" damage is what I am after.

Some have suggested hFB and such, but being a healer just aint my thing. I do enjoy Scourge, but is it tanky enough? What works for most of you, and granted I know GW2 doesnt have the good ol "pure" concept of a tank it still is out there to some degree.

What say you?

Edited January 8, 2023 by Joxer.6024

[Joxer.6024]

Im going with a Staff mirage...dont ask me. Based on posts I have seen in here, looks strong and fun.

Correct me if i am wrong!!!!!!!

[Cuks.8241]

Dont mix up tanky open world builds (like for example trailblazer mirage) with raid/strike dps builds. Mirage is very strong in raids right now but is probably one of the most complex builds and I would not call it tanky.

Right now there is a warrior hammer spellbreaker dps build that is super tanky and does very good dps. But just as this build emerged recently it can die in the future. Warrior is not a class that is famous for versatility so I would not make a new warrior just to hope this build would last. But if you already have a warrior or want to try it, its a very fun build (big numbers). It's inherently tanky because spellbreaker warrior and it uses defense trait line as a hammer dps trait line which just makes it more inherently tanky. It also spurts out self stability which is just great for pretty much everything.

Also power herald revenant. You can build it as a quickness dps or dps and both are doing great right now (revenant is also a class that always does good). And same as warrior, revenant is inherently tanky. Decent hp, heavy armour and inherent survive abilities of a herald.

[Joxer.6024]

44 minutes ago, Cuks.8241 said:

Dont mix up tanky open world builds (like for example trailblazer mirage) with raid/strike dps builds. Mirage is very strong in raids right now but is probably one of the most complex builds and I would not call it tanky.

Right now there is a warrior hammer spellbreaker dps build that is super tanky and does very good dps. But just as this build emerged recently it can die in the future. Warrior is not a class that is famous for versatility so I would not make a new warrior just to hope this build would last. But if you already have a warrior or want to try it, its a very fun build (big numbers). It's inherently tanky because spellbreaker warrior and it uses defense trait line as a hammer dps trait line which just makes it more inherently tanky. It also spurts out self stability which is just great for pretty much everything.

Also power herald revenant. You can build it as a quickness dps or dps and both are doing great right now (revenant is also a class that always does good). And same as warrior, revenant is inherently tanky. Decent hp, heavy armour and inherent survive abilities of a herald.

yea good points....not a fan of warrior for reasons you say, i found them squishy as for a "warrior", so not fun. Forgot about Herald...that could work and is fun as well...cheers!!!

 

[Law D Dorma.9362]

Condition Virtuoso dagger/torch.

[Joxer.6024]

34 minutes ago, Law D Dorma.9362 said:

Condition Virtuoso dagger/torch.

ya reckon? I found Virt having to stay ranged to be "safe"...I mean Mirage should as well but dunno, I do have a Virt but have yet to fall in love with the spec, if that makes sense?

[Atomnium.1532]

Honestly it would be faster to list the classes that cannot be tanky dps, between scrapper or mechanist, renegade herald, spellbreaker, celestial untamed even weaver celestial is basically unkillable.

The tankiness is more of an opt-in aspect of every spec with celestial, trailblazer or trait swaps.

I'd pick another criteria to know what to go into 🙂

 

[Gaiawolf.8261]

9 hours ago, Joxer.6024 said:

Some have suggested hFB and such, but being a healer just aint my thing.

Cele HFB is so much more than just a healer. You're always going to give up some DPS building tankiness into your build. Cele HFB is a great mix, because FB really can use every single stat in the game surprisingly well. I use it in all game modes, OW, WVW, Fracs. It's the closest thing I've found that can jump into a Frac, then go kill a legendary, and then support/AOE in a PVP zerg with just a simple cycle through the build tabs. Only real thing it struggles with is WVW roaming/sPVP.

[Cuks.8241]

5 hours ago, Atomnium.1532 said:

Honestly it would be faster to list the classes that cannot be tanky dps, between scrapper or mechanist, renegade herald, spellbreaker, celestial untamed even weaver celestial is basically unkillable.

The tankiness is more of an opt-in aspect of every spec with celestial, trailblazer or trait swaps.

I'd pick another criteria to know what to go into 🙂

 

As far as I understood he would like inherently tanky class that keeps that tankiness also in competitive Pve. 

Yeah all classes can be tanky, but not many are on meta raid dps builds. 

For example someone mentioned Virtuoso or mesmer in general. Yeah can be tanky with right gear. But on dps builds you wont be tanky. You have inherent active defenses which I am not sure if it counts for op. But using those abilities or using at the wrong time is also a big dps loss. 

Scrapper or Mechanist are inherently tanky though even on competitive builds. 

And spellbreaker dps right now just casualy walks through stuff that kill an ele in a blink of an eye. 

[Sindust.7059]

The only "tanky" dps that I can think of is scrapper. You get the more shields the harder you smack your enemies in your no compromise full DPS build. But honestly it barely makes a difference compared to other classes if you don't change to tankier gear. If you want to stay pure DPS, you're better off picking something ranged to stay alive. My personal favorite pick in this case would be p/p condi mech. You can go ranged when needed just like the power build, but you have better passive self heals from the healing signet, and you keep them while the signet is on cooldown.

 

If you want to actually be tanky, you will have to give up some DPS though, because you will have to change your gear. And here you have basically 2 options:

1. Give up a little DPS while staying "good enough". This will however be noticeable, and people might point to you if the group fails a DPS check.

2. Give up a bit more DPS and become a boon support, so nobody expects you to do good DPS.

 

For option 1, the builds that I've tested that don't lose much DPS when switching from their full DPS gear (berserker/viper/grieving etc) to celestial: condi tempest, condi mechanist, condi soulbeast. There probably are more that I haven't tested, but the general rule is, you want something condi based, because power builds lose a lot more when swapping to celestial. With condi tempest in celestial you get the added benefit of being able to provide some decent off-healing to the group, not just yourself, should you ever be in a situation when this is needed.

 

For option 2 my personal favorite would be condi shortbow alac renegade. You can play this build with full celestial gear while providing 100% alac uptime, and still do enough DPS for a boon support. And also be ranged if needed. The meta build for alacrity tempest also has a lot of celestial gear, so maybe it's already good enough for what you want with no modifications. Another option could be alac specter. I haven't tried it myself, but you run with ritualist gear (no toughness, but gives you even more HP than cele), and you also have a shroud that gives you a massive barrier. Maybe it works with cele too, but I haven't tried it, so I can't vouch for it. Other condi boon supports might work too, but if you want to get close to the benchmark, pick one that requires a lot of concentration from gear in the meta build, because otherwise going from viper to cele/ritualist would also be a sizeable DPS loss.

[Joxer.6024]

ok, lets swap this around cuz "tanky" is just a whole different ballgame. Throw out some strong open world\strike builds? Yea, pretty much anything can do the story and open but what is really shining? 

NVM...Hardstuck has a great list!

Edited January 9, 2023 by Joxer.6024

[Sindust.7059]

16 minutes ago, Joxer.6024 said:

strong open world\strike builds

Strike builds are the same as raid builds, so what I wrote in my previous post applies to those.

 

In terms of open world builds, pick something ranged and mobile. It will make it easier for you to tag mobs. Ideally power, because it will allow you to burst down smaller mobs quickly. Stability and/or stun break are very good to have too. Here you have quite a few options, but here are my favorites:

1. Power mech in celestial, since actually good DPS numbers aren't critical, and swap in J-Drive trait to keep the healing when signet is on cooldown.

2. Power soulbeast with axe/warhorn in celestial, and swap out Signet of the Wild for Dolyak Stance for the stun break and stability. Optionally you can use Rune of Speed. It will basically turn swiftness into super speed, and with warhorn 5 and We Heal As One you can keep swiftness up permanently with ease, giving you 100% speed boost all the time, allowing you to keep up with the scrappers out there.

3. Condi tempest with celestial. Use scepter+warhorn, and swap out one of your utility skills for Signet of Air for the 25% speed boost, because keeping swiftness up is impractical with this build, and you will also get (an additional if you keep Glyph of Elemental Power) stun break. Because it's condi, it doesn't have as good a burst as either of the 2 above, but it loses the least amount of sustained DPS compared to the pure DPS build, so you might save time on bigger mobs. If you stay in fire attunement, your ranged scepter attacks will also not count as projectiles, so it might save you some headaches on certain mobs and events.

 

All 3 of the above either have pets by default, or can bring them to distract the enemies helping you to stay alive. Mech and soulbeast come with passive healing, tempest has better active healing.

 

I don't like other specs in open world for various reasons, but that is not to say there aren't any, it's just that I couldn't find builds that work for me.

[Joxer.6024]

15 hours ago, Gaiawolf.8261 said:

Cele HFB is so much more than just a healer. You're always going to give up some DPS building tankiness into your build. Cele HFB is a great mix, because FB really can use every single stat in the game surprisingly well. I use it in all game modes, OW, WVW, Fracs. It's the closest thing I've found that can jump into a Frac, then go kill a legendary, and then support/AOE in a PVP zerg with just a simple cycle through the build tabs. Only real thing it struggles with is WVW roaming/sPVP.

I went with FB, we shall see how I go. Cheers!!

[Gaiawolf.8261]

14 hours ago, Joxer.6024 said:

I went with FB, we shall see how I go. Cheers!!

Good luck! That's my main at the moment, so let me know if you need any help or advice. 

[Joxer.6024]

On 1/10/2023 at 8:47 AM, Gaiawolf.8261 said:

Good luck! That's my main at the moment, so let me know if you need any help or advice. 

Ok, loving it atm ...feels very DK like, so fun. But...whats up with my F1 skill? seems like i stay in it longer than before? Is that since a change? Havnet followed Fb changes so not sure....

[Gaiawolf.8261]

11 hours ago, Joxer.6024 said:

Ok, loving it atm ...feels very DK like, so fun. But...whats up with my F1 skill? seems like i stay in it longer than before? Is that since a change? Havnet followed Fb changes so not sure....

The class got reworked recently. It used to be you could enter Tome of Justice every 30 seconds, 24 seconds if traited, and fire off five skills, eight if traited. Then f2 and f3 had their own pages on separate CDs.

Now there are no CDs for the tomes themselves, and all tomes share the same five or eight pages. You can go in any Tome and use the pages for the skills you want, but you have to be more mindful of which skills you select because pages are now the limiting resource instead of cooldowns.

So you can choose to go into Tomes more frequently for a few needed skills, or wait longer and fire off a bunch of them. 

[Gaiawolf.8261]

11 hours ago, Joxer.6024 said:

 

Double post. 

Edited January 12, 2023 by Gaiawolf.8261
Double post

[Joxer.6024]

7 hours ago, Gaiawolf.8261 said:

The class got reworked recently. It used to be you could enter Tome of Justice every 30 seconds, 24 seconds if traited, and fire off five skills, eight if traited. Then f2 and f3 had their own pages on separate CDs.

Now there are no CDs for the tomes themselves, and all tomes share the same five or eight pages. You can go in any Tome and use the pages for the skills you want, but you have to be more mindful of which skills you select because pages are now the limiting resource instead of cooldowns.

So you can choose to go into Tomes more frequently for a few needed skills, or wait longer and fire off a bunch of them. 

gotcha! thought it felt different, thanks for that!  😉