[Holosmith] Please consider adding heat mechanics to other weapons

[Suishou.9381]

Anything, really. Even a tiny damage increase per heat level would be great. Personally, I use a rifle a bit more often than I'd like and this complete lack of synergy with the core mechanic of Holo just doesn't feel good. I'm not really asking for numbers, just the feeling. Weavers and Mirages got brand new skills for all their weapons if I'm not mistaken (and Engis can't even use that many), so please give us just a bit more love.

[wasss.1208]

This is honestly a missing feature ever since Holosmith came out. Imagine not having ambushes on Ranger weapons, only on Hammer... you still have the mechanic of the spec, but you are hindered, if you aren't playing the spec weapon. Or not having ambushes on Mirage weapons, only on axe. You still have Mirage cloak... or not having dual attuned skills on Elementalist weapons... you can still dual attune...

[SleepyBat.9034]

This seems like a reasonable request so I will add it to the list.

[Jerus.4350]

I’d love to see rifle get a boost from heat.  Not sure pistols should get anything considering how cholo is doing right now.

[Wolfb.7025]

Double the damage of Blunderbuss and Jump Shot while under the effect of Overheat.

[jason.1083]

Although it does make sense as a concept, it would require balancing of all of the weapons in order to not end up with extremely overpowered attacks, and some of them are pretty full already, like shield for example, what else would you add to that? (if what you want is to make all the weapons have heat tiers like holo sword and utilities) 

And well, every skill is affected by hear level to a degree, from solar focusing lense and laser's edge so there's that. 

If you really want to have more interaction with the heat mechanic, just do what I do and play a build using holosmith skills exclusively, works great since the buff on ECSU. 

Edited June 6, 2023 by jason.1083

[Suishou.9381]

7 hours ago, jason.1083 said:

it would require balancing of all of the weapons

So... Three? As I  mentioned, eles and mesmers (and maybe something else too) got quite a few new skills and I guess they're not broken.  I'm sure they could figure it out.

7 hours ago, jason.1083 said:

every skill is affected by hear level to a degree, from solar focusing lense and laser's edge so there's that.

Well not really, solar focusing lens has nothing to do with heat level, only activating/deactivating photon forge (unless you really want to overheat to get 6 stacks, lol). And laser's edge only works in holo mode. Let's not pretend other weapons can benefit from heat like sword does. Why defend a bad design? Or lack of any design, more like.
 

 

7 hours ago, jason.1083 said:

just do what I do and play a build using holosmith skills exclusively

I'll stick to what i do 😛

Edited June 7, 2023 by Suishou.9381

[jason.1083]

As I said, it's not a bad idea, it's just something that's already made in this way and it's a big rework so be done to fix it, so it's unlikely, I'm not trying to defend it, I'm trying to be realistic, the fact that they made ESCU add a 3rd tier of heat on all the holosmith related skills and not just the sword and a couple of traits was already a blast.

Implementing this to other weapons as well would make for them to be more viable with holo, I agree to that. But I doubt Anet does.

I'd be a fool to dissagree as well, since holosmith is the only thing I play in this game, I got 7.000+ hours on holo exlusively.

It's the same for all the things that don't make much sense in the proffesion, scrapper loosing the mobile defense field and having sneak gyro be completely obsolete in WvW, mechanist mech be unable to go in the water, or another neat idea I heard about the holosmith heal skill, coolant blast, actually do what it says and remove heat as well.

Edited June 7, 2023 by jason.1083

[Suishou.9381]

Oh well, let's just hope this next expansion will fix some of the silliness and inconsistencies, after all it's supposed to "further augment the combat options for each profession by adding new tools to their arsenal and by lifting constraints that will unlock an unprecedented number of playstyle customization options", as the wiki says, so it seems like the perfect time. If not, I'm just gonna coolant blast myself with my tears

[wasss.1208]

20 hours ago, jason.1083 said:

Although it does make sense as a concept, it would require balancing of all of the weapons in order to not end up with extremely overpowered attacks, and some of them are pretty full already, like shield for example, what else would you add to that? (if what you want is to make all the weapons have heat tiers like holo sword and utilities) 

It would need some rebalancing, but it could be easily done. Shave off a little of that new burning, that Holo got in forge, and put some on heat-state of weapons. Like having 50 heat on rifle would turn one of the bleeds into a burn. 100 heat would turn 2 burns... I doubt it would mess up balancing that bad, since Rifle is a power weapon, it would get a small dmg increase, get the fantasy, that we all ask for, but doesn't break the game. Or shield getting an 1-2-3 second Fire Aura, on the second activation of 4, Rifle 5 getting a leap finisher on high heat. Rifle 1 getting velocity, Pistol 1 getting an actual AoE condi component... Rifle 2 reducing your heat by a small amount. Pistol 4 doing the same, while doing an extra little burn damage... pistol is an underwhelming weapon anyways... Pistol 5 getting extra condies based on heat-level... These are all just instantly off the top of my head, and I don't think any of them would break the game to an extent, where small numerical changes couldn't bring the build back into its sweet spot.

They could also break away from the usual mold, where heat just makes skills stronger... They could add heat venting skills, so we have more ways to play around our heat mechanic. Or change how they work. Like Pistol 5 is a soft cc at the moment. Turn it into an unblockable hard damaging pulsing aoe on high heat.

This would mean, that Holo would be less reliant on kits, and that was the original intent of the devs as far as I know.

[jason.1083]

It would probably be better to buff their power damage aspect, burning is good and all, but we already have a lot, and the more of the same condition you have increases the risk of all your damage to get negated with a condi cleanse.

Maybe a bit more Vulnerabilty since it's good for both Power and Condi damage and it's inkeeping with the holosmiths strong suits.

Heat venting is interesting, I used to use Thermal Release Valve before the buff on the ECSU, it worked great with Adrenaline Implant from Tools and Vigor together, increasing the heat venting capability. But I doubt they would add that to a universal engineer weapon, Anet clearly doesn't want holosmiths to stay on Photon Forge for too long.

 

I'ts interesting how you guys haven't mentioned making core traits be affected by heat level,

but well, maybe that would actually be OP.

 

[Endaris.1452]

On 6/6/2023 at 2:37 PM, jason.1083 said:

If you really want to have more interaction with the heat mechanic, just do what I do and play a build using holosmith skills exclusively, works great since the buff on ECSU. 

Sword and Rifle used to be comparable DPS options on Holo until anet decided to buff sword baseline, including the heat bonus on AA, leaving rifle in the dust. For no particular reason other than enforcing powercreep really.

In my opinion there would be no problem whatsoever in giving rifle skills heatboni to draw even with sword again.

Sure, they can be weaker than on sword as the espec weapon but they should still be there.

As mentioned by wasss, this is not a huge effort as long as you keep it underpowered. Adding a little bonus damage here, a little burning there, maybe increase projectile speed on shield 5 throw by 10/20%. Anything is better than nothing and feeling completely shoehorned into sword. It's not even that big of an effort, considering you literally only have to look at a total of 12 skills.

 

[The Boz.2038]

It is insane to me that this is still not fixed.

[jason.1083]

1 hour ago, Endaris.1452 said:

Sword and Rifle used to be comparable DPS options on Holo until anet decided to buff sword baseline, including the heat bonus on AA, leaving rifle in the dust. For no particular reason other than enforcing powercreep really.

Anet probably wants peaople to use the weapons that come with the elite spec, I switched to sword beacause of the quickness, but I don't mind a beefy auto attack for when I can't be bothered to actually use anything else, it also helps with forge downtime overall dps, it makes kitless holo a bit more viable, since even sword alone can do a decent amount of damage until forge has cooled down.

But yeah having other weapons get heat tiers doesn't sound that bad, if they're done correctly at least.