June 27 Balance Update Preview

[Myror.7521]

@Urud.4925 nah Spellbraker is fine actually. Its legit the only spec of those 3 that could remove boons. While this other 2 are now allowed to loose somewhat DPS in Case of get Access to quickness or alac. Overall its totaly fair enough i think ^^

[Girth.9731]

1 minute ago, Myror.7521 said:

@Girth.9731 the reason you use strength is not straight up the CD of this skills. The reasons are the DPS buffs plus might makes right. Strength will be still pretty decent while Builds that using this skills but not strength saw a small buff though it so its Just okay over all ^^

You are mistaken, the reduced cooldown of Mending was one of the few things keeping Strength based builds alive in PvP/WvW. If they remove that without any sustain buffs to the Strength tree, it will further kill those mediocre builds and essentially force everyone to play X/Defense/Discipline. Horrible change.

[Laivine.9308]

Removing boon corruption from WvW is infuriating. What do you actually try to accomplish by nerfing Scourges and Spellbreakers? Isn't boon vomiting boonballs a problem anymore? 

Don't release this patch.

[svnset.8206]

This is one of the most terrible patch notes I ever read. Almost every suggestion makes NO sense to me. You are basically deleting classes at this point without any reason, some are not even on top of the food chain. The necro changes and boon corruption changes in general will seriously consider me taking a long break. You destroy scourge without any reason, just to make your game shittier and every class doing the same thing. You seriously destroying an archetype that was niche anyways. Also Spellbreaker and Necro had the ability to boonbreak and even though it is a niche playstyle imo you act like it is a threat. Seriously boon corruption was and is a cool idea, why remove it????? There are so many more terrible ideas here I do not even know where to start. But many other people thankfully took the time to go through this nonsense one by one.

We finally had a good pvp meta and some balance after months of terrible balance choices. So why not just buff other classes to the same level instead of basically nuking specs again?

 

I urge you to please listen to the community! We love your game and ofc we will try to stop you from destroying it. 

Let's see what happens on June 27. I main all of these specs (all necro specs, scrapper, spellbreaker, mirage...) So you basically would force me to take a break 😞

Edited June 10, 2023 by svnset.8206

[Myror.7521]

@ZEUStiger.3590 sry but when it comes to PvP its just a straigth up. Yes your burst will now get downed to 0 dmg if you hit aegis Block invuln and stuff. But on the other side if you hit it it just does all its dmg instantly and faster. Before rework you simply hit once of the 3 hits only most of the time. This ends up in 1k dps only. Now compare that to a skill dealing instantly around 4k. See? Its just an overall buff. The old arc divider was only good against peops that Just staying in the dps of the Skill and doing legit nothing.

 

In PvE however i could See why its a Nerf to the Skill tho but as said its nothing you can't fix by let it Deal more DPS means Numbers tweaking

Edited June 10, 2023 by Myror.7521

[ZEUStiger.3590]

1 minute ago, Myror.7521 said:

In PvE however i could See why its a Nerf to the Skill tho but as said its nothing you can't fix by let it Deal more DPS means Numbers tweaking

The problem isn't damage, the problem is its functionality (and flavor). This change was done with the assumption that it "improves usability", but it's going to accomplish anything but.

[Myror.7521]

@Girth.9731 Yes it makes Defence stuff somewhat better now. Strength warr on the other side still gets its DPS buff while using it. So indeed its a straigth buff though Builds Not use the strength line.

[Myror.7521]

@ZEUStiger.3590 yea i get that the flavor will be indeed different. We might need to wait here before we will see how it rly works. All I could say is. There was a reason why this Arc Divider was meta zerker Back then. Just don't understimate that one big hit Version Sir ^^

[Girth.9731]

1 minute ago, Myror.7521 said:

@Girth.9731 Yes it makes Defence stuff somewhat better now. Strength warr on the other side still gets its DPS buff while using it. So indeed its a straigth buff though Builds Not use the strength line.

You don't understand what I am saying. This is an unintentional nerf to ALL of the Strength-based Warrior builds. (i.e. Core Warrior, Strength Spellbreaker, Strength Bladesworn). These builds are mediocre at best and will become even WORSE. They must add some sustain to the Strength tree as compensation or simply reduce the cooldown of Mending to prevent this from happening.

[Myror.7521]

@Girth.9731 in what case is it a straigth up Nerf? All of the skills will be as good as before the patch. Only difference will be that the CDs are overall reduced and not only while using strength.

[Sephention.1267]

Please reconsider the price you pay to make Alacrity Scourge a thing.

DPS Scourge is already at the bottom of the list consisting of the currently viable condition specs. It also bears the additional gameplay issue of spamming Sand Shades off-cooldown which, even with a 20s shade uptime is somewhat annoying and is far less engaging than other condition spec rotations such as Holomancer or Mirage. With that being said, removing the ability to corrupt boons and making it impossible to maintain 3 shades at the same time is going to further reduce the damage output of Scourge. Not to mention the Sand Shade placing mini-game is going to get even more obnoxious.

Reducing revive potential on the currently existing Support Scourge is also concerning. Running the Blood traitline is a unique feature to Necromancer that is actually a very fair trade-off to Scourge having even lower DPS to include Transfusion in a build. Some other players straight-up optimize for the additional downstate-management and sacrifice one DPS slot in a raid encounter to provide some safety net. While the latter might be niche, Blood DPS Scourge is a very welcome addition to any instanced PvE, plus it's very reactive and therefore fun and engaging to play.

In order to introduce Alacrity Scourge, you are planning to make every other Scourge build very unappealing. I find this price way too high just to have an option to give Alacrity. If you are worried about Scourge having access to too many things while also being capable of providing Alacrity, consider making high-dps traits and revival traits unavailable or unappealing to Alac Scourge only, not the rest of Scourge players. It is a rare sight in raid groups to find Scourge mains as is.

 

As for Virtuoso's Bladeturn Requiem, please consider removing the block in competitive gamemodes only. There is no use to that ability in any PvE build outside of blocking.

Edited June 11, 2023 by Sephention.1267
typo

[ZEUStiger.3590]

4 minutes ago, Myror.7521 said:

@ZEUStiger.3590 yea i get that the flavor will be indeed different. We might need to wait here before we will see how it rly works. All I could say is. There was a reason why this Arc Divider was meta zerker Back then. Just don't understimate that one big hit Version Sir ^^

I'm providing feedback for the balance patch PREVIEW. If your response is "wait and see" then what's the bloody point of balance PREVIEWS?

[Aalter.2950]

Thanks for all your hard work ANet! People will complain, but the patch looks good to me. 🙂

I am hoping that, looking forward, you'll notice with Support Specter and Mechanist one of the primary issues is fighting the UI more than the enemy.

We *desperately* need some QoL improvements on the game UI, especially when it comes to targeting allies and managing pets/summons. (why can the Mech fly but be confounded by stairs???)

Looking forward to testing out the patch changes, and hoping to see more Player Pain Points addressed with QoL updates in future patches!

Edited June 10, 2023 by Aalter.2950
Accuracy

[Muffin Nook.5923]

dev and qa players must be playing a completely different game from everyone else if they think the changes to engineer and necro make any sense whatsoever. if released as currently described probably going to see a lot of people shrug and move on at this point

none of the proposed changes to these classes makes any sense from a gameplay standpoint, since they are effectively removing  what defines the support necro being able to mass res his downed team mates even though their healing is lacking.

why arent they reworking how revs do quickness since they are basically handicapping scrappers by forcing them to leap and blast to do the same thing they get by spamming they facets.

ah well lets see whats released on the 27th and see if there is a mass exodus 

nothing has made sense from a gameplay standpoint since they added mechanist that basically broke all sense of balanced gameplay, as all i see these days are those robot parking lots whenever there are a large group of players

[Girth.9731]

Just now, Myror.7521 said:

@Girth.9731 in what case is it a straigth up Nerf? All of the skills will be as good as before the patch. Only difference will be that the CDs are overall reduced and not only while using strength.

If the cooldown reduction to Mending is PvE only, it will further nerf all of the Strength based builds that rely on having a shorter Mending cooldown for sustain. I assume it may be a typo because Mending already has a cooldown of 15 seconds in PvE, but if it is not then they need to add some sustain buff to the Strength tree to compensate for this heavy nerf.

[Atomnium.1532]

9 minutes ago, Muffin Nook.5923 said:

why arent they reworking how revs do quickness since they are basically handicapping scrappers by forcing them to leap and blast to do the same thing they get by spamming they facets.

They are, quickness will now pulse by having 6 pips in use (so using the draining skill from legends). You no longer get quickness when facets are consumed. Qherald is also dead, only remaining Qpower is catalyst.

Edited June 10, 2023 by Atomnium.1532

[Myror.7521]

@Girth.9731 ah so your reference is just for mending Might. Okay i mean it was a Bit to good cause it got a 16 Seconds CD only by using strength. I gues that PvE only thing was made to bring it in line with most of the healing skills in this Game. This is a nerf yea but I think 4 seconds is not a too high difference i think.

[Saurus.5361]

I don't know why they felt like removing both quickness/alacrity off shield was neccessary. I get that you will probably overcap both boons by phantasms and shatter alone but there is barely a reason to take shield now which is a shame considering chrono shield skills were like the only decent ones in the game... 

I also don't like that spellbreaker neither got quick nor alacrity. spellbreaker is the closest thing we have to a full support warrior but for some reason they don't want that to be a thing.

Overall it is a somewhat decent patch but these two points and dps scourge being completely gutted should change.

[Myror.7521]

@ZEUStiger.3590 the Point is you want them to not rework Arc Divider cause of its flavor in PvE (instanced). Yes it might indeed going to flow less (or maybe not as said we might need to see) but I think that is not rly a reason to not rework it at all.

Edited June 10, 2023 by Myror.7521

[Xephir.7635]

Warrior nerfed, Virtuoso nerfed, Mirage nerfed, Scourge nerfed too.....like what? No one has been crying for these changes. We'll see but if you keep nerfing stuff because ppl cant dodge this will turn into tank meta.

Edited June 10, 2023 by Xephir.7635

[ilabsentuser.8726]

Spoiler

So, I can't understand why all rifle and longbow reductions are PvE only, this weapons are the only choices for ranged combat to a warrior in situations when melee isn't possible (most of the time in WvW) and they are subpar to other professions ranged weapons. So why? They should at least have some love on those modes too, we have been getting the short end of the stick since forever with ranged capabilities when every other class has good choices. Also, Arc Divider is now well below its previous damage output, too far below. And just a reminder Break enchantments is a boon ripper, like the ones other classes have plenty of, removing just 1 will make it even less desirable, I don't get it others rip or corrupt voons from a mile away, several, but we only 1 in your face... I don't want to evwn get started on the other changes or classes I play. I was hoping something nice for warrior this time, real changes to "underused" weapons and skills. Bolas and their family are just the same as with the trait, mending is now worse cuz its cooldown reduction is PvE only and you can't lower it anymore. Maces seing a change? Warhorn or torch getting some love? When was the last time someone saw a torch WvW player? Nah, I am wasting my time gere...

 

[ZEUStiger.3590]

Just now, Myror.7521 said:

@ZEUStiger.3590 the Point is you want them to not rework Arc Divider cause of its flavor in PvE (instanced). Yes it might indeed going to flow less (or maybe not as said WE might need to see) but I think that is not rly a reason to not rework it at all.

Flavor is the lesser of my concerns (that's why it was in parenthesis, HINT-HINT), the loss of functionality is greater. Also this change will barely affect instanced PvE, it will affect open world players much more. The reason given by ANet for this rework is to improve its functionality, this change accomplishes the opposite, so no, this IS rly a reason to not rework it if the rework accomplished the opposite of the stated goal.

Stop wasting my time, your main interest seems to be PvP, mine is PvE, provide your own feedback instead of arguing with mine because we have nothing in common. The community response to this change in PvE has been overwhelmingly negative, you're in the minority here.

[VulcanPyroman.8571]

Please don't release this patch. Some of the basic goals you are trying to achieve sound good, but the implementation is terrible. And not only for one or two specific things, but across the board for all professions basically. Changing things that don't need changing and replacing one type of spamming by another. This just needs more time in the cooker, just delay this and do a thorough rethink. This ain't it. Please don't just release this patch for the sake of releasing a skill patch and release changes only very few will be happy with.

[Girth.9731]

Just now, VulcanPyroman.8571 said:

Please don't release this patch. Some of the basic goals you are trying to achieve sound good, but the implementation is terrible. And not only for one or two specific things, but across the board for all professions basically. Changing things that don't need changing and replacing one type of spamming by another. This just needs more time in the cooker, just delay this and do a thorough rethink. This ain't it. Please don't just release this patch for the sake of releasing a skill patch and release changes only very few will be happy with.

Well said. This would be a disaster. They need to slow the balance patches down, the game is mostly well balance across the game-modes right now. This feels like change just for the sake of change.

[Xainou.1502]

I've mained necro for a couple of years now, but if these changes go through I honestly don't see myself playing scourge.

You claim your goal is to reduce spamminess in builds and stupid gameplay. Yet you want to give shades a duration of 8 seconds in favour of alac?? This is exactly what I've hated about druid so far. Stationary boon providing objects that I have to spam. And with scourge they're even tied to a ressource (life force) on top.
This is stupid for a boondps. And even worse for the dps scourge. It's already not a great condi dps but this is gonna hurt it badly and make it ridiculously repetitive to play.

 

Sorry, 8 second shades are a kitten idea.