June 27 Balance Update Preview

[Skyroar.2974]

3 minutes ago, Awn.1327 said:

So when you removed the CD reduction from elementalist's "Conjurer" trait last round, you did not reduce the cooldown of any conjured weapons as you are doing for pretty much all the skills now where you removed the CD reduction trait. 180 seconds for fiery greatsword is not really fun to play around, especially in WvW. Could you please consider reducing those cooldowns per default as well?

My guess is that they are planning to rework conjures in the future.

[Yngvi.3452]

21 hours ago, SevlisBavles.3059 said:

Mirage needed a buff in PvP. This is effectively a gigantic nerf. Better to have only one dodge than this.

I agree you have already nerfed Mirage to near death why not leave them alone ( except for the last few patches you have nerfed mez's and specificly mirage nearly every patch for years).  Not being able to dodge out of cc was way more unique., interesting game play,  I prefer to deal with only one dodge than lose that. 

Weakening damage to a class that already does less damage than most seems pretty silly and kind of points to you not playing your own game.  Have you looked at reviews of the best classes to play in wvw.  Not one suggests Mirage.   

Why not fix the mechanics of how we dispurse boons like alacrity.  Having to jump hurdles to do so makes them fairly useless.  I would rather see you go back to 3 clones keep the one dodge and give us a bit more practical damage. 

Now we are just faced with one choice which does no damage and basically is a bunker tank that debuffs (chrono), one of the least played classes in the game because they are extremely boring to play.  

 

[zicaB.1794]

The original problem with few professions having access to quick/alac is that these classes ended up being dominant. To correct this, the idea now is that all professions have access to these boons in at least one of their elites. However, some elites were not designed for this purpose and we are seeing unique mechanics being destroyed. In my opinion alac and quick should be introduced into many core traits of all professions, making these boons so common and accessible that it no longer matters what profession you play. This way the balance team could focus on what really matters, balance the game around class fantasy, unique mechanics, weapon skills, utilities, etc.

[stormemperor.3745]

I have been asking for them add self fury generation to power REAPER for 2 years now, you may or may not find my posts about no fury on power reaper. 

Heal alac scourge with fury exists yet fury on POWER REAPER doesn't.

[Yngvi.3452]

21 hours ago, LichOverlord.6329 said:

Removing the ability for mirage to dodge while CC'd is getting rid of one of its unique abilities that define its identity.

You tried to turn scrapper's gyros into generic wells last time which would have destroyed its unique-ness. Thankfully, you listened to us, your players, and prevented yourself from making a huge mistake.

You're about to make another big mistake. If you feel like mirage is going to be overturned in pvp then rather than remove aspects of its unique dodge, add something to make it more balanced.

Removing unique aspects of classes homogenizes the game and continuing to try and ham-fist changes like this into the game mere weeks before it goes live doesn't reflect well on you as developers. I'm sorry to say that, but that's just the truth.

I still believe in you, and believe in your product - your ability to listen to feedback and course correct is one of your greatest strengths - please exercise it liberally.

I agree stop killing mirages with idiotic nerfs.   The most interesting thing about mirage is the ability to dodge out of cc.  Hell we only had one dodge.  Nerfing range of our debuffs as well as reducing damage from clones it going to force everyone into playing Chrono the most boring class to play in the game.  Oh look I'm a bunker taxi driver that sort of debuffs from afar... no wait your taking that away from us.

Please a build that can do damage and roam.  

[Batalix.2873]

After thinking on this a bit more, while the boon additions are generally *fine*--inasmuch as the game is far past commiting to them as soft heal/tank support roles--there are definitely details that I think need ironing out. Although just because I am fine with where the compass is pointing, a lot of these balance changes seem to range from quite under considered to outright reckless in some places. So here are my thoughts (I am generally addressing EoD especs in a subsequent post here: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/topic/131631-june-27-balance-update-preview/?do=findComment&comment=1910316, because I don't have much positive to say about them):

Necro

* Give transfusion pulses back. The game needs a prog rezzer and Necro/Scourge as the "Dark Priest" class has always been the perfect archetype for that. Scourge does not have any actual healing ability so there is absolutely no reason to nerf its' rez potential.

* In a similar vein and yoinking some friends' thoughts, Scourge is already fairly off-meta because it is doesn't really occupy required healerspace so much as "extra security at the cost of efficiency" with rez and barrier. All these reductions of barrier and increase in heals/Regen to "nerf" healScourge and pull it away from rez/barrier and more into healing are just oddly unnecessary--they don't contribute to Necro/Scourge's identity and in fact detract from it, all while homogenizing it disfavorably with other healer especs. You could have just kept everything as is, with alac, and Scourge would not be overpowered, especially with all the other alac healers in the game. Let Life from Death keep revive, don't put regen on Well of Blood, and, again, keep Transfusion pulses. Just a lot of major changes that dilute class identity, remove a very clear, unique support niche, and ultimately are just a lot of harmful nerfs that are totally unnecessary.

* Sand shades should probably not lose the duration. Outside of discrete ability activations they don't actually do any damage as far as I am aware, so the only thing you are doing is forcing players to spam the plops more often and lose out on the fun of area control. The current pace feels fairly good, I could see cutting a few seconds maybe, but not halving it. I recognize this is a sort of soft limit on barrier alac/targets, but someone suggested somewhere just shortening the shades just for desert empowerment and I think that is a really good fix.

* Removing corruptions is cowardly, pardon my bluntness. One of the core pedestals of Necro identity just knocked out from under it. Put them back please. They aren't even really hurting anyone outside of PvP modes, so why not keep them in PvE at least. Also, just keep Feed from Corruption even if it is tacked onto another trait. Scourge is a Dark Priest. The things I see a Dark Priest doing are: mummification (barrier, check), resurrection (transfusion, check), burning incense (a whole traitline), and curses (feed from corruption). It may not be the most impactful facet of Scourge, but it is better to have and refine than replace everything with burning, sand barrier, and overall generic "desert-themed" stuff that we already have way too much of on every other class. I actually would prefer if Feed From Corruption replaced Sadistic Searing and made Punishment skills corrupt boons instead of apply burning. Feed from Corruption is a good piece of flavor that should stay, and afaik Punishment skills are not used much as a source of damage anyway.

Mesmer

* Confusion contour flattening is a dangerous road to go down. I have never complained as a Mirage raider that I do less DPS on some bosses than others--i still do plenty with torment on less active bosses. This feels like when FFXIV made Samurai autocrit and just reduced numbers across the board--prioritizing "consistency" as the cost of unique job feel.

* Mirage dodges concern me for a similar reason. It may not affect play much but every light class needs to find survivability somewhere to make up for the hardcoded armor penalty. Except arguably Weaver which justifies high risk-reward with a high DPS ceiling. Mirage does not do Weaver damage despite being a fairly melee class (when running axe as INTENDED): it needs risk mitigation. Bear in mind: this is the change I am least concerned about since it seems like it mostly affects PvP modes. But I do still think the nerf is largely unnecessary when, unlike Virt, Mirage needs to be melee AND has quite variable DPS depending on clone uptime. Mirage being an escape artists isn't that broken when Virt exists and barely has to interact with mechs at all.

* Chrono is going to have some difficulty keeping up boons now that they are tied to phantasms. Putting alac on well of action will help, so good call there. An even better idea: put quickness on well of action as well for the quickness builds. Maybe also make those swap by trait, or don't. Giving Chrono one well, Well of Action, that provides both alac and quickness is flavorfully on point for a time mage, would very elegantly condense its support wells to a single versatile utility skill, and actually would make Chrono valuable for filling group uptime for less experienced raiders. I.e. even if untrained Well of Action provided both alac and quickness, Quick Chrono could be the only quick class that offers a smidge of alac to help a lagging Alac support, or vice versa.

* I'm a little meh about Chrono applying alac/quickness with phantasms, when it really feels more like a "shatter-support" time mage.

* I'm gonna slide this in here, but Mirage has always been at odds with shatters. It is the only espec to retain core shatters exactly. And playwise it wants to have clones up to hide in a crowd--it doesn't *want* to shatter all its clones. It is a pain rebuilding clones for ambush damage on mirrors axws, and it is a pain collecting three mirrors at once with desert distortion; granularity with clone shattering/keeping would give it so much more control and strategy. Consider letting Mirage shatter only one clone at a time, for roughly a third of the effect (and maybe on top of that have a shatter swap you into the clone's place like Axe 3). Just a thought, Mirage could stand to be shifted away from core Mesmer a bit more.

Engi

* Scrapper combo quickness is fine by me, although I am hoping superspeed is still tied to gyros. It has access to a lot of combo fields. But the arbitrary distinction between which finishers trigger quickness puzzles me. No whirl finishers means hammer 2 and shredder gyro are useless, practically forcing players to slot blast gyro and rocket boots. And I could even see a case the projectile finishers should be included as well given that would basically open up pistol and rifle. So why can't this just trigger on all finishers? Why is only mobile leaping quickscrapper being made viable for WvW but not more stationary tank quickscrapper for raids? I never really thought of Scrapper as *the* combo class after Catalyst tried to steal its thunder, but if we are making it the combo quickness class, why isn't it fully the combo quickness class? It just flows so well aesthetically and intuitively to just blanket "combo = quickness" for QScrapper. Given that Scrapper has access to like 20 different blast abilities, adding its two whirl finishers isn't going to impact combing substantially; and its two projectile finishers really should be moved off weaponskills 1 for rifle and pistol anyway.

Ranger

* Alac Druid will likely need some additional help generating CA, and/or sources of Alac outside of CA. CA is like Berserk's twin, fairly binary state with a cooldown, but while it looks like Quickzerker will still be able to generate quickness on normal bursts outside of berserk, Druid has nothing outside of CA. Imo it would not hurt to put alac on a staff ability here, maybe staff 2: makes much more sense than staff mirage getting alac.

* I use Ancient Seeds in open world. It's a fun, flavorful trait. I don't mind it being shifted around or tacked on to some other trait, but please don't remove it. I suppose the world wouldn't end without it but it's one of those little finishing touches of Druid that will be sorely missed. (I am never angry when I get rooted in PvP; but you know what DOES make me angry? Fighting off your POS Mech class while downed.)

* Can you give Spirits back their dawdle please? These changes aren't the worst, but I am getting tired of every unique skill type being reworked into effectively wells. Gyros shouldn't even have the well typing since they don't function as wells, but also Spirits deserve a little more personality.

Warrior

* I don't like the alac/quickness solution here; it is clunky and kind of sideswipes banners as the more elegant solution. While I guess Berserker and Bladesworn work, they will easily be the hardest to maintain uptime with due to needing to build their bursts first. Their implementation is also the least resonant compared to the other quick/alac specs (why does hitting a thing provide boons around your allies?), and unlike spirits Banners somewhat work in their current form. Warriors can largely hold quickness with only two slots and the right gear--and as far as boon supports go, the one-two combo-blast actually feels quite satsifying. And I'm looking over at the deletion of Alac Mirage and the ability for Chrono to do either/or Alac/Quick (both very good, responsible things), and thinking why can't banners just be that? Warrior is the "low/no magic" class. Warrior is the "all DPS brr" class. If any profession deserves to not have alac/quick especs and modularly slot in utility skills at the cost of DPS, it would be Warrior. Banners are perfectly flavorful for that, and I don't see why we can't just trait for alacrity instead of quickness on them and slap alac onto Banner of Defense.  That way Warrior supports would have reason to use all four banners regularly in different combinations: alac combo field, quick combo field, condi blast, power blast. Banners, with alac, will actually work much better on Warrior now than previously, now that we have more sources of alac and quick elsewhere. Warrior could finally focus on DPS like it wants and more voluntarily spec into alac and quick when needed on abilities that actually make sense and could easily permutate by pairing up two of four banners: alac power, alac condi, quick power, quick condi. Banners are already the better solution to current problems, and you are creating even more problems with this change that banners will also solve. So just do banners. Also, make banners have a unique mechanisms like kits again, now that Warrior isn't one of only two quickness classes--give Warrior supports a distinct playstyle/minigame for those that enjoy it.

* Why are you messing with Arc Divider and not Flaming Flurry? Why can't you just let me play torch? Berserker is actively punished for using long animation primal bursts, but those are also the coolest abilities. Uptune them, make them count as multiple bursts, do anything to make them viable please. Don't cut the cool, feel-good moves just because you don't incentivize them enough. Thanks.

Guardian

* Firebrand should do alacrity and Willbender should do quickness. It's been all wrong this entire time.

Thief

* I don't play Thief but simplifyng flanking/backstabbing is a pretty bad idea. Freedom of movement and positioning strategy are a huge strength, possibly GW2's biggest that offers actual variety and reactive gameplay potential. You don't have true tanking roles because you keep designing away from them. You don't have true mezzer roles and your support roles amount to only two flavors. Everyone has all the other support boons so there is very little design space for niches around things like might or fury. And your healing roles are limited to AoE group blobbing with very little granularity. So by and large movement and positioning, differentiating and incentivizing that, is a large aspect of the game's appeal, absent deliberately carving out and bolstering healer/tank/mezzer niches. Removing flanking is just shooting one of your toes off.

* While I understand stealth thief in PvP/WvW is a pain and am fine with changing the functionality in competitive modes, be careful here. Things like stealth in PvE are massively appealing for job fantasy differentiation.

* In looking at how you have solved alacrity/quickness on Mesmer by condensing it into Chrono, and how you probably *should* condense alacrity and quickness onto Warrior with banners...I think Thief is the last profession that just feels...off when trying this espec mechanic solution. Alac on Specter always felt dissonant flavorfully, and Quickness on DE feels the same. Thief has shadow magic and stealing generally, so why do these specific especs get to apply alac/quickness using fairly universal thief features, but not the others? Especially a fairly selfish DPS class like DE. I think a more elegant solution would be to put alac and quickness on core Thief trickery traits? I don't know this is the idea I have thought out the least.

Revenant

* I see a lot of commenters saying this quickness upkeep threshold will throttle healing and make the builds less versatile. While I'm not sure yet and want to wait to see how the numbers play out, I do think that Herald facets are the least oppressive "pop off cooldown" boon source (1) because they have so many other tradeoffs with upkeep traits and their own inherent pulses to create meaningful strategic choice and (2) Rev has a unique situation where you *can't* swap slot skills out on Herald so choice isn't being limited here (but their inherent flexibility of choosing another legend for alternate slots is not impacted either way). That said, I do really like the elegance of making Herald stance less mandatory for Quickness builds and effectively putting Quickness on each Legend's upkeep ability. That should in theory open up a lot of build options even if healing costs might need to be tweaked.

Edited June 21, 2023 by Batalix.2873

[Freedoms.2635]

instictive engage: on the wiki states its losing its ammo and but gets a cooldown reduction and Power increase. 

Dagger is basically strictly used for Condition builds  could poison or bleed be added to the skill? 

Traps why is spike trap and healing spring get the cooldown reduction but not anything else? there are 5 traps total and only 2 get it? 

 could dagger auto attack chain be alittle more or less deadly delivery getting a cd reduction? 

[Yngvi.3452]

21 hours ago, Ghostilocks.5312 said:

The Chrono changes have likely killed heal chrono significantly. It was already a niche build that relies on teammates (herald) for prot coverage and scepter for clone generation healing. Moving quickness and alac to phantasm summoning would probably require phantasms in all utility slots to generate the boons that were super easy to keep up with scepter. All heal chrono needed to be a great spec was reliable regen and prot and instead it gets deleted. Nice. 

Guess they don't want us in the game... Can't play mirage they are nearly useless now, Chrono's to me are like taxi drivers they provide speed which is not needed any more mostly,  mass stealth which I can do with less stealth not more and, portal bombs at the expense of anything else that is more fun to play or important to survive( like blink).  Please find a way to give us some thing to play instead of nerfing us like this.   Hell look at thieves you continually improve on them.  Finally after 10 years you got rid of the ridiculous permanent stealth only to give them buffs and superspeed 4 days later.   Resulting in near permastealth and even more impossible to catch up with.  

[Yngvi.3452]

21 hours ago, AresGuildwars.6372 said:

I'm a tad salty; even tho I thought it couldn't get worse, you somehow decided to supernerf Mirage (Dodge) across all gamemodes and builds (Mes doesn't bring that many condi cleanses to begin with), but also ripped chrono further apart. I'd say those notes look way worse than last years for Mes and I never thought that could happen. 

Poor Necro and Ranger as well. Professions not only need to give up power for bringing boons, but moreso their identity as a whole/concept and their flavor, it seems. Old Scourge was so much better designed even tho there is no alac. 

I'd prefer you just revert to back before last years patch or at least just skip this update, scrap it and try it next year again. Pls don't ruin Mes, but have a nice day anyway! On the bright side: I for sure know now, that I'll have plenty of free time to touch grass this summer.

(Also that Tempest Joke was hilarious. XD 10/10 Shout out to that!)

Again I agree does anyone on your team even play Mezmers?  

[Volcanis.4872]

Bladesworn should not provide group alacrity. Instead, Berserker should provide group alacrity and Spellbreaker should provide group quickness. Here’s why:

1. Berserker depends on alacrity to enter Berserk as often as possible. Even open world and competitive Berserker builds would appreciate some alacrity. 
2. Core Warrior will still be able to provide group quickness with Martial Cadence and Warhorn 4 Charge mainly for support Spellbreaker builds in competitive modes. If the balance team wants support Spellbreaker to provide quickness, simply make it the group quickness spec. One argument is Berserker is more thematic to provide quickness, but I would counter that Willbender and Renegade are more thematic to provide quickness - and they both provide alacrity. Also, with the right balance, quickness heal Shoutbreaker could be meta in all game modes providing Warrior with a good support option.
3. Daring Dragon doesn’t make intuitive sense to provide group alacrity. I’m sure Anet can make up a reason why it does, but I think slashing with a gunsaber should not spit out boons to the party.

Therefore, here are my simple suggestions:

1. Heat the Soul will now provide group alacrity instead of quickness (but on skill activation, not on hit)
2. Revenge Counter will now provide group quickness instead of resistance (Full Counter will provide quickness on skill activation, not on hit)
3. Revert Daring Dragon

One critique is these boons will only provide quickness and alacrity in combat (like Willbender). My additional suggestion is to increase the amount of adrenaline of skills and traits that grant adrenaline. For example, Mace 2 and Sword 5 Adrenaline Rush could provide 15 adrenaline (15 to account for decay out of combat) so Berserker and Spellbreaker can use F1 and F2 respectively in preparation of combat after using Adrenaline Rush. 

[Eriard.7840]

A lot of good changes, but i think the balance team are making a HUGE misstep in giving almost all classes Alac and Quickness!
Scourge does not need alac, and should keep what makes it unique. Yes its OP in some areas, fix those please.

I think a much better design direction would be for some classes/specs to be masters of some boons. And not giving any class mastery over ALL boons . I would love for scourge to be a Barrier and possibly Stability focused spec,, or whatever really, just dont make everything the same. I know Anet wants "Bring the Player, Not the Class", but for that to be functionally possible, all classes need to be mechanically the same, with different fluff, and that dont sound fun.

Please reconsider this direction to give something unique and interesting to classes. If Alac and quickness are so important to the game, then you need to fix those boons instead of putting them on every class. 

[raido.4073]

Look like an balance patch made by ESO devs (that's not a good things at all), more is broken than fixed for no reasons.

Like "Bladeturn requiem", the whole point of the skill is to help with the lack of clones to survive in case you get ganged up in melee (because virtuoso doesn't have a lot of kiting options to keep enemy off him) but in a Virtuoso fashion by also slicing enemy to proc all the "blade" passive, so instead of killing the skill by turning off his primary function why not simply increase the cooldown or change it to an aoe stun ? 

I won't comment much on Scourge because enough people have explained the insanity of the changes (that also affect Reapers and Harbringer) but i will comment on the fact that you looked at signets and didn't change them at all : 

- Signet of vampirism : need to make love to enemy to get the leech from that 180 radius effect, 1,25 cast time...., short duration effect (6sec), scale horribly and like all heal doesn't work in shroud.

- Signet of Spite : Passive power buff with an on use that scale from condition damage and expertise that only target one enemy and has a very long 60 sec CD, nothing work on that signet....one of his redeeming use which is to buff shroud for power spec has been killed.

- Signet of undeath : could have reduced the health cost since you nerfed every revive passive from necro.

- Signet of Locust : the only good signet, provide much needed healing boosted when boon ripping while also having a good range (600) provide a good passive buff in shroud in the form of 33% movement allowing necromancer to have an uncorruptible swiftness while in shroud but you killed that.

- Signet of Plague : the best way to die because you got transfered an immob or cripple at the worst moment, to be fair i wish necromancer in general had access to "Resistance" and "Resolution" buff it would help so much with the thematic of the class because necromancer doesn't feel like a master of condition right now, you feel more like the g.i.m.p from Pulp Fiction movie or Mister slave from South Park show.

You also didn't compensate cooldown of signets properly, i got most of the time 40% reduction cooldown for signets from shroud since i stay 10 sec in it on average but for example you just reduced locust and vampirism cooldown by 5/6 sec (15% reduction), signet of spite by 20 sec (33% reduction) and signet of plague by 5 sec (20% reduction).

I will wait and see for patch day to know if i continue my legendary farming this summer or shelf the game until the devs decide to no longer take fentanyl, because the true joke is the fact that i play reaper and am completly kitten on by these changes that should have affected scourge mostly.

Why use a scalpel to operate when you can use a tactical nuke.

Edit : Would be nice also to change "Barbed precision" trait in Curses to increase bleed damage instead of duration and "Cold shoulder" trait in Reaper line to provide expertise, it would allow more choices in runes and sigil.

And if "Rune of the reaper" was baseline (so all shouts would apply an instance of chill against target in a 360 radius because all shout should apply chill baseline with so much trait that revolve around chill) and instead replaced by : "Gain one stack of stability for X sec when executing a shout skill" it would help Reaper out of shroud (and other spec could profit from it greatly like tempest or Warrior).

Edited June 10, 2023 by raido.4073
Forgot things in the heat of frustration

[Croissant.2671]

Mirage

• Mirage elite specialization has been removed. Characters interested by this change will temporarily revert to rifle mechanists.

[Lacidrutt.3678]

How about we do a balance update on the devs working on this, seems like they need a rework. Lol

[Endaris.1452]

There is one crucial problem I see with the current approach to handing out boons to elite specs:

Utility skills can never compete with gear stats.

We're at an unprecedented high of boon support DPS and the reason for that is that boon support DPS do no longer have to run  any significant losses on their DPS gear stats in order to achieve 100% uptime on their quickness or alacrity boon.

The reason why scrappers are running many gyros right now and why deadeyes will stack cantrips in the future is that no utility can make up for the loss in damage for having to take boon duration on their gear. Stats are too strong and skills are too weak.

Spreading the available boon uptime evenly over at least 4 available skills will always shoehorn DPS supports into stacking these skills until they no longer need to take boon duration or the next additional skill would overcap by so much that a small amount of BD and a DPS skill are actually better.

The solution to this dilemma is to greatly lower the boon uptime given "for free" through the trait but instead have one skill of that category give a decent amount of that boon innately. That way the utility skills lose value for the boon beyond that first dedicated support skill and actually have a chance to compete with gear stats so that we may see builds running a higher boon duration in favor of being able to take more diverse utilities.

Until a mechanism for diminishing returns for taking the same skill type to upkeep boons like this is implemented, you will always run into the same situation where people are simply forced to stack up on a near non-selection of utility skills because it is by far the most optimal setup for damage.

In that context:

Please give us our old chrono wells back. You already added alac back, I don't see why you have to be afraid of adding quickness back too. Mesmer is the spec that is furthest from having a viable healing build, lacking the required access to core defensive boons like regeneration and protection so there is no risk of creating a dominant healing build that can provide all boons at once (although I almost don't see how it would make a difference with the DPS levels of boon support DPS these days).

Ultimately, whatever skill you designate to give the boon, it always needs to be pressed off-cooldown in optimizd builds. In my opinion it is much better to have a dedicated support utility because it dictates your playstyle AND utility choices less while also making the press of your boon-support skill more impactful on its own.

[Antina.5973]

On 6/8/2023 at 11:12 PM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

"Advance!": Reduced ammunition recharge from 40 seconds to 32 seconds.

It's 30 seconds right now, what do you mean? 😮 "Advance" has no pvp/wvw/pve split and with Pure of Voice if went from 30seconds to 24sec, so why this change claims to reduce recharge when for the past 7 years it WAS NOT 40 seconds recharge... https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/"Advance!"

Edited June 10, 2023 by Antina.5973

[Cass.7352]

Having been a Virtuoso main for over 1.5k hours, I do not like these changes at all. I would prefer distortion to be removed entirely from virtuoso and keep bladeturn requiem as its primary defensive skill. I personally never use distortion, ever.
 

“Unstable Bladestorm: This skill is now a ground-targeted spell instead of a projectile. The spell strikes enemies in range in addition to firing projectiles at nearby enemies.”

Why? Even if this results in more dps, I’m not impressed by this skill. It’s going to mess up the flow of the build and make it clunky and un-fun. It feels like you’re making changes for the sake of it when it works fine as it is. Is it perfect? No, but this change is going to make it worse and it’ll be an eyesore for other players constantly seeing this on a boss or whatever. Instead, why not make it move a couple meters and then stop in place and spin so it’s a bit of a hybrid. Having to place this down just feel like it’s going to get tiring and I’ll probably just remove this skill from my rotation entirely. 

[Feng Shuigent.2897]

Who could have foreseen that the game would still be being reworked explicitly around quickness and alacrity years later despite having content that hasn't changed?

What a shocking and unpredictable turn of events.  If only thousands of players had warned us. Repeatedly.

[nondesu.3986]

i have a suggestion, leave ancient seeds just the way it is

[Batalix.2873]

One more thing:

EoD Especs

Small tweaks are still not fixing how half-developed these specs have been. You need a larger paradigm shift and just overall better refinement of identity for these especs, because across the board they suck and your tweaks continue to reaffirm that you don't seem to know what they are or want to be.

I have yet to play ANY of the EoD especs outside of PvP lounge because they lack distinct identities and generally compare disfavorably to HoT/PoF especs in every respect outside of their overtuned DPS/boon potential. I am barely even concerned with or am addressing their particular balances from patch to patch because it is always aimless faffery trying to use superficial tweaks to fix classes that were fundamentally unfinished--as evidenced by the fact that even my cursory musings below evolve them toward clearer archetypes/identities--at launch.

Again I have to emphasize that these especs are not unsalvageable, they have a lot of good kernels of ideas. But virtually none of them have been refined and polished and realized into full especs on the level of HoT/PoF, and most of them feel like they are missing parts or facets. I would not be making this post if I did not think they could be fixed, and I think they could do so quite easily in ways that (a) more fully realize the job fantasy, (b) offer more fun aspects of gameplay, while (c) not depriving current players of the things they enjoy about them. Except maybe Mech, which was overall a huge mistake, but which also missed the most potential for fun and interesting gameplay. So please consider these comments and the possibility of an "EoD espec rerelease".

Untamed

You didn't know what to do with Untamed as a kind of Berserker/Spellbreaker 2.0, found a niche with Fervent Force, then pulled it back so now it doesn't have any real identity anymore. Adding a FF-like skill to the minor GM to bake "cripple-hunting" into the spec would give Untamed some much needed identity, but even beyond that it needs more work. In general, I would recommend leaning into making this the "hunter" Ranger espec players keep asking for, since it is practically there with the feral/predatory vibe and FF. Random aside: make the pet models BIGGER when unleashed. If I can't summon big beasts on a Ranger espec, at least give me that.

Specter

You released Specter as a do-everything ST Scourge 2.0 monster, and are now walking it back to be even more Scourge 2.0 because ST turned out to be kind of bad. Decouple ports from wells and make them on-command flip skills. Inject more Mesmer into a class that overwhelmingly just feels like Necro. Even more radically, pull away from barrier and find some other support niche for Specter because we already have Scourge. Honestly I have no idea how to fix Specter because it is so thoroughly just recycled Necro. Possibly the worst new addition to the game, on a class that *already* had a shadow mage in Deadeye, and which sorely wanted a Gambler or Corsair/swashbuckler espec. EDIT: I've got it. Make Scepter work like a mid-range whip rather than a generic ball lobber. Give Specter a few grapples it can use to pull allies toward the Specter. Specter already has a tether theme. And it would more on brand for thief--the dodging profession--to be able to pull allies out of damaging mechs (i.e. helping allies dodge) or into boons.

Willbender

Willbender is like a crummier version of Daredevil that also steps on Firebrand's toes. Remove the dumb fire trails. Core Guardian only has like two fire abilities outside of torch, I don't know why you leaned so hard into "burning zealotry" on two especs when Guardian is much more about a kind of light/holy magic aesthetic, as well is more about wards, defense, and healing. Turn down the flame, lean harder into ritualist-like spirit magic, wards, and lightbending on this one. I don't mind speedy guardian, but make it at least feel remotely like a Guardian spec please. These tantalizing tints of Ritualist in it that go thoroughly unexplored in favor of stupid flame trails...it is so frustratingly not a Canthan or even A Guardian fantasy.

Mechanist

Mechanist was always a stretch because Scrapper already had little robot buddies. But it's biggest problem has always been that it is a two-body class like Ranger that gives way too much health, damage, and boon application to both bodies. You have repeatedly tried ways of resolving this by imposing handicaps on the robot, and they repeatedly fail because the player still has rifle (and to a lesser extent pistol) autoattack that they can perform at any range. The mech needs to be strong to fit the job fantasy, but it is too strong on top of the strongest ranged class. You *need* to make it a proper puppeteer class and impose more restrictions on the player. Take away weapon attacks from the mech player and replace them with robot commands (that could even change based on whether the player has rifle, pistol/pistol, or mace/shield--if you did it for Weaver three weapons is not much to develop). Encourage the player to manage the robot more--i.e. consolidate the DPS potential and focus onto the Mech and balance away from the player being able to spam rifle/pistol on top of the Mech's damage. It would be more engaging, more balanced, and more fun. Put another way: stop punishing mech players for enjoying their super robot buddy--the entire point of the espec--and instead more heavily restrict their ability to play core Engi on top of a very strong pet. The J-Mech *is* Mech's weapon, don't give it a second ranged weapon in tandem. Instead implement more direct involvement with the J-Mech itself to replace the weapon.

Catalyst

Catalyst is the worst, most ambivalent amalgamation of Scrapper's hammer/combo fields, Tempest's Overloads, and Weaver's Weave Self. All three aspects are made more frustrating. It has so little actual identity when it could have been this really cool geomancer/shaman/summoner class. It needs so much to be reworked. Energy generation needs to be generated by more than just landing hits. Hammer needs more range and orb slinging. Hardened auras needs buffing to incentivize tanking. And hammer 3 is a boring repetitive loop with no real player choice--we need two different traitlines, one that incentivizes "weave self all elements", and one that incentivizes camping or mixing specific elements. Y'know, parts that actually make it feel like Catalyzing/Augmenting instead of just rotely going through motions. Also make the kitten traits green, or make Tempest's red. My OCD is offended as it is. Bottom line: Catalyst should really have leaned harder into a "geomancer" identity, focusing on area control as a kind of inverse Scourge--but that's generally not how it plays.

Vindicator

You released Vindicator with a schizophrenic kit of generic attack/heal skills, and are now walking back the heal half. Make Vindicator the "artifact" espec, have them actually use the spear and urn in more ways across all the slot skills instead of having these overwhelmingly generic skills. Give 6-10 Vindi an actual identity and you won't have problems finding play niches for power/heal Vindi. Also remove the cooldown for alliance flipping because that's just tedious and undermines the "collaborative" theme behind the spec.

Virtuoso

Virtuoso is so one-note. Everything is blades. There's this psychic aspect to the class flavor, as well as some singer/bardy undertones. But none of that is capitalized on, it's just blades and more blades. Since this alac/quickness rework pretty solidly confirms you are keeping no design space for no new especs, give Virt some dimension. Give it some mind control musicy traits and abilities. Let the ranged psionic class have more support capabilities. And also, while you are at it, tune down the DPS because Virt does too much damage for being ranged and having a simple rotation.

Harbinger

Give Harbinger a new name. It harbings nothing. It is an apothecary Dr. Jekyll class with a weird poisony injection gun. What cringey edgelord wrote and passed off on the name, seriously.  Also while I kind of see some logic to blight and elixirs, I have seen complaints that the whole thing is just a convoluted mess of contradictory and counterproductive features.

Bladesworn

Bladesworn needs sword to be viable for mainhand because why is a samurai wielding an axe, come on. Also alac should be on Immortal Dragon, not Daring Dragon. Actually that's all I have here, BS is surprisingly the only not garbo EoD espec that has a coherent, fleshed out concept and didn't steal it from prior especs.

I really don't like having to make these comments, but the disparity in quality is clear and has remained stark since EoD's release. These especs do not feel like they were designed by the same people who made the brilliant HoT/PoF especs, and they likely were not. They feel like a new lead manager hire trying to inject "new and cool" ideas into a corporate system that was already working just fine, to try to justify their position and hide the fact that the company just lost a lot of real talent. They feel like luxury tech that only exists to preserve and monetize some overpaid engineer's useless patent (whatabout cyberninja Guardian?) rather than reading the room and filling actual needs. They feel bad because they all feel like the same, shallow "keep up in PvP/WvW" or "mow down Open World solo" DPS+ class, and not really specialized at all for group play outside of Mech practically playing support for you. These do not feel like fully-realized job fantasies: they feel like rehashes of prior especs (Catalyst, Willbender, Specter, and Mechanist) or little more than core with a different weapon and no real traitline/slot skill niches (Untamed, Vindicator, and Virtuoso).

Edited June 14, 2023 by Batalix.2873

[LazloW.8194]

I dont post and am mostly very content but this balance patch made me voice my opinions.

Just get rid of alacrity and quickness if keeping those boons means losing class flavor. We don't need more and more sources of this, different classes shouldn't feel the same.

Healscourge was one of the great themes you had in the game.
A necromancer reviving the dead, even their own allies... That is a golden concept and most of all, very fun to play.
Just being turned into a worse version of every other alacbuild in the game is not worth it.
The boon corrupts were another great thing necromancers had going for them.
It feels like necros as they were are being killed off and their rez potential taken away so it stays that way 🥲

Please reconsider these changes

[Xzygy.1452]

The stated goals and the changes don't match.  Bring vindi wvw healer in line with other supports.  Ok, so I'd think you'd reduce healing boost cleansing since they're doing a lot of healing and maybe 2/3 cleansing.  But you nerfed both?  My guild will drop vindi as a supported build due to these changes, which is a shame.

[MuscleBobBuffPants.1406]

We had a dev surface level philosophy explanation months ago, it might be time to dive much deeper the second time around and explain your thoughts about alacrity, quickness, boons, movement, damage, stealth etc.  etc.  How much is too much?  How much is too little?   What is the end goal for damage output, mitigation etc?  What is the end goal regarding WvW and boon balls?  What is your plan regarding class identity?  How do you balance around making sure one class doesn't do everything and there are give and takes?  If we had a better idea of your goals and directions, maybe these decisions would make more sense....

[Nogothanc.5014]

I dont understand the scourge changes. Why does a scourge need alactricity? You take away the rez ability? Isn't that exactly an unique ability of a necromancer?  Resurrection? Necros have slow heal, fast rez and gives barrier. That fits. It was fine. And what about the corruption of boons,,,  boon conversion...  How is removing a boon a corruption?  Removing a boon is removing a boon.  I dont get it... why remove those unique and class identifying abilities and turn a necromancer into something that he is not.

[SpottedWithin.8062]

This feels exactly like the deadeye kneel thing all over again, and thankfully y'all saw the light on the kneecapping decision it was and did not implement it in the end. And I really appreciate having these "previews" to voice our opinions, and that I shall do. 

Boon strip/corrupt is like a class defining feature for necro. And the big revives is a big selling point of playing scourge vs other Necro specs. You just gave love to reaper, please don't rob scourge for it though. It's killing DPS and HEAL scourge all at once. Imo, no one asked for alacrity on [heal] scourge, these changes would make no one want to PUG up with a scourge because they can only bring a fraction of their DPS/"healing" that they used to, when other classes can fill that slot. People just have to face the facts that not every class can give alac. And that's okay! 

Not the biggest fan of the druid changes (but I could get used to them), they aren't class breaking. Scourge however is getting beat up and I really humbly request you rethink some of the reasons you are trying to give scourge alacrity in the first place. I agree with someone that said a 5 man alac  application is a nice middle ground if you really really want to dump alacrity on scourges.

I'm not an expert at game design, but as a Necro main, this kinda feels like a huge step backwards from the positive changes reaper got last time. I don't want to be rude and flail my hands around cause I'm a civil adult who was asked her opinion civilly and I can't offer more alternatives to how to get what you want if you want to make alac scourge actually work. But I agree with the general consensus of: Please no, Please.

Edited June 10, 2023 by SpottedWithin.8062
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