Heal Scourge is not doing ok in endgame content

[Methuselah.4376]

53 minutes ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

Sorry i do not agree , healherald is a bit new so it's coming out step by step , but think you forgot aegis ? healherald is also very depending on his energy management , especially if you want to upkeep the boons from brill , also what does hherald has that hfb doesnt have ? cc ? 5 sec super speed ? 

Hfb has his tome that he can go in anytime in the game , hherald is hold by his energy management trough elevated compassion , meaning you will have to move from a legend to another at some point , also i doubt that they will keep this 40% boon duration for free , that is insanely overpowered , but as healer i don't see the big deal taking it instead of a hfb , he has more cc and access to superspeed , while hfb is a monster with stab and aegis and have indeed little cc , but no access to superspeed.

But i should try this one too , it seems that for tanking peculiar bosses it's quite effective with brill healing , block from staff and shield 5 , just regret there is very little stab (hard to use with good timing needing tablet special effect with ventari ult costing 35 en) and no aegis.

I think your whole argument style is starting from the "HFB is amazing everything else is not at good" without really experiencing what everything else does as showcased when you initially didn't understand heal Scourge's strengths because you hadn't tested them yet. The only real thing HFB has going for it better than anyone else is its ability to kitten out blocks. Herald with Legendary Dwarf can provide just as much if not more stability than HFB, it's not just limited to Ventari. 

Again, every build has it's strengths and weaknesses; HFB can kitten out blocks but those can be stripped by a 1 damage tick, Scourge can safe guard the group's HP while saving its singular block saved for a big mechanic/hit. Yes, HFB can do the same, but if we're talking sheer HP protection level, I think Scourge would win out more consistently. 

[zeyeti.8347]

15 hours ago, Methuselah.4376 said:

I think your whole argument style is starting from the "HFB is amazing everything else is not at good" without really experiencing what everything else does as showcased when you initially didn't understand heal Scourge's strengths because you hadn't tested them yet. The only real thing HFB has going for it better than anyone else is its ability to kitten out blocks. Herald with Legendary Dwarf can provide just as much if not more stability than HFB, it's not just limited to Ventari. 

Again, every build has it's strengths and weaknesses; HFB can kitten out blocks but those can be stripped by a 1 damage tick, Scourge can safe guard the group's HP while saving its singular block saved for a big mechanic/hit. Yes, HFB can do the same, but if we're talking sheer HP protection level, I think Scourge would win out more consistently. 

All you state comes with trade offs , if you take dwarf , you have no ventari , does the hfb has such a trade off ? you have everything all rev's legends have for support purpose in your bag as hfb , condi cleanse , bubble , aegis , stab , resistance , +x% healing and condi conversion and avaiblable 100% of the time , so you sure you have it anyway in any situation , on the other hand if you need a bubble as herald and you just switched to brill , well you have not access to the tool for 10 secs .

And you are right about the healscourge i made a pre made stupid opinion i recognize it , i have tested it and actually enjoyed it , i must have stayed on the hfb for so many years that i can't see any other potential healer going near him , i still believe it a bit tough. Franckly i cannot understand why hfb has skills like stand your ground , who is 12 sec 5 stabs ona  24 sec cd vs druid who is 1 stack for 10  sec and ele 1 stack 10 sec with a 30 secs cd, yes those skills have other effeftct , but don't fool us thinking you take those skills because there is some condi cleanse on it or 5 sec superspeed... not even talking about the absolutely non reactiv mechanic hherald has to go trough to put some stab in ventari.

but i have also tested the healherald and personnaly didn't enjoyed it , too depending on energy management , especially with brill , the might goes up to 25 , but it is slow compared to other healers and having too many facets active result in a quick swap while using any skills who require energy is punished . Maybe i need to train more with it to enjoy it , but i don't really like the way it heals and provide boons , so guess i am gonna skip this one.

[xellink.7568]

19 hours ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

 And you are right about the healscourge i made a pre made stupid opinion i recognize it , i have tested it and actually enjoyed it , i must have stayed on the hfb for so many years that i can't see any other potential healer going near him , i still believe it a bit tough. Franckly i cannot understand why hfb has skills like stand your ground , who is 12 sec 5 stabs ona  24 sec cd vs druid who is 1 stack for 10  sec and ele 1 stack 10 sec with a 30 secs cd, yes those skills have other effeftct , but don't fool us thinking you take those skills because there is some condi cleanse on it or 5 sec superspeed... not even talking about the absolutely non reactiv mechanic hherald has to go trough to put some stab in ventari.

The reason why hfb is easier is that the baseline population is better at playing hfb.

Scourge hybrid is where statics would move toward, being able to be extremely efficient, outputting 16-20k damage on a sliding scale of heal/damage and a single skill with 10 man stab which definitely beats SYG. Plaguedoctors and celestials as you said are what you considered a trash stats but it is very good at what it does, very efficient and scourge is one of those very few classes that can output white green and blue numbers at the same time. 

That also means dropping protection and that's why you need to consider that in a static. If you drop herald of sorrow, you have a very tight alac uptime and no 100% prot but you get lots of dps. When to drop it will depend on group composition. Most players aren't at the commitment level to make such changes to improve their runs. Most players just want 1 good build and kill bosses. 

The same tactic of 10 HS can also be done by a hybrid combo of 10 celestial FBs. I don't see how outhealing sloth with lots of healers is unique. I earlier raised those examples as a counter example to the 'strength in numbers' statement. That doesn't apply to scourge. That is what I am calling you out for misrepresentation. Multiple reapers using ice fields is another way, and DH upkeeping resolution uptime. Those benefit from class clustering. HS isn't that kind of class so here are more examples to erase any form of doubt. 

As to your question on serpent siphon, it misses 1-2 targets when the snake somehow penetrates the ground and hits nobody. That is okay for most content but when the aegis is do or die, eg. Deimos CM, you can't possibly 100% rely on it without getting hate from your squad. 

Edited August 18, 2023 by xellink.7568

[zeyeti.8347]

On 8/18/2023 at 7:18 AM, xellink.7568 said:

As to your question on serpent siphon, it misses 1-2 targets when the snake somehow penetrates the ground and hits nobody. That is okay for most content but when the aegis is do or die, eg. Deimos CM, you can't possibly 100% rely on it without getting hate from your squad. 

Noted , hope they patch it , ty for the answer .

As for your comparison against a hybrid scourge and firebrand , scourge shine more cause firebrand deals 0 damage out of his f2 tome , while scourge can pull barrier and condi cleanse without any cast time , making a good hybrid support damage , able to susatin damage 100% of the time while supporting.

but i am pretty sure today with the power creep any group comp with a minimum of healing can pull out a sloth kill without shroom mechanic , maybe it's a bit easier as scourge.