Suggestion - Gold Find account statistic and Essences of Gold

[Eowin Of Rohan.2619]

Hi,

I just met a developer ingame (complete with Anet tag :D) who told me that this idea is worth a forum post, so here we go.

My suggestion is : make the account's Gold Find statistic work like Magic Find.

Which means that instead of a global %, we get

• GF % from achievement rewards. Uncapped.
• GF % from Essences of Gold (resp. essences of luck). Capped (300% for MF, TBD for GF).

With this in place, there is no real need to prevent endless GF inflation by making Essences of Gold hard to obtain (currently 1000 Astral Acclaim per %, capped at 2% per season, vs 2%/28d in the old system). The EoG could be made cheaper (around 250AA/% ?), and have a higher cap (around 10%/season ?). This would allow veteran players to plan ahead how they want to reach the cap (instead of the current common opinion that "EoG is a bad WV purchase"), and new players to catch over time (both due to the existence of a cap, and better availability as 2%/season won't allow them to get as much GF as veterans have right now).

[Linken.6345]

14 minutes ago, Eowin Of Rohan.2619 said:

Hi,

I just met a developer ingame (complete with Anet tag :D) who told me that this idea is worth a forum post, so here we go.

My suggestion is : make the account's Gold Find statistic work like Magic Find.

Which means that instead of a global %, we get

• GF % from achievement rewards. Uncapped.
• GF % from Essences of Gold (resp. essences of luck). Capped (300% for MF, TBD for GF).

With this in place, there is no real need to prevent endless GF inflation by making Essences of Gold hard to obtain (currently 1000 Astral Acclaim per %, capped at 2% per season, vs 2%/28d in the old system). The EoG could be made cheaper (around 250AA/% ?), and have a higher cap (around 10%/season ?). This would allow veteran players to plan ahead how they want to reach the cap (instead of the current common opinion that "EoG is a bad WV purchase"), and new players to catch over time (both due to the existence of a cap, and better availability as 2%/season won't allow them to get as much GF as veterans have right now).

we dont have a global goldfind now it only affect coin droped directly from mobs.

Edited September 9, 2023 by Linken.6345

[Eowin Of Rohan.2619]

2 hours ago, Linken.6345 said:

we dont have a global goldfind now it only affect coin droped directly from mobs.

Yes, that's exactly what I'm talking about. What is or isn't affected by the account GF stat isn't the point TBH.
(btw the account MF stat doesn't affect everything either)

[Linken.6345]

19 minutes ago, Eowin Of Rohan.2619 said:

Yes, that's exactly what I'm talking about. What is or isn't affected by the account GF stat isn't the point TBH.
(btw the account MF stat doesn't affect everything either)

it affect everything with exception of most containers.

So how would this new idea work you could get 10 times the gold find and it would only affect the 40 copper you get from monsters once in a blue moon?

How is this in any way better or worse then what we got now most coin come from containers or dailies that are not affected by the gold find we have now would the new gold find affect it?

Reading your post it dont look like it so I fail to see how upping the limit to what ever your OP suggest in anyway changes from what we got now.

Edited September 9, 2023 by Linken.6345

[Eowin Of Rohan.2619]

My idea has nothing to do with the basis of effect for Gold Find.

You're apparently trying to find how my suggestion would give more gold or make the stat overall more impactful. Which is why you don't understand. You will not find anything about getting more gold in my suggestion. A given % total Gold Find would still have the exact same effect. You'll need to make a distinct suggestion if you want to change that aspect.

It is a change to the way the stat itself is calculated and obtained, and gives advantages that are explained in my last paragraph.

Here is some more context in case you missed news. Gold Find is now quite high for veteran players. My own account's GF is +257%. On the other hand, you have the changes that came with Wizzard's Vault (which I abbreviated WV in OP). Before WV, we got +2% GF every 28 days (which is why after many years, we reached very high numbers). After WV, we can buy at most +2% GF every season (supposedly ~3 months). Before WV, it was free. After WV, you have to pay a lot for it (1000 Astral Acclaim, so the GF boosts -aka Lesser Essence Of Gold- competes with better rewards). The overall playerbase reaction about LEoG is mostly negative : 1000AA isn't worth it (as you said, the +1% will only affect copper from random monsters) and people calculated that using AA on pure gold (or pretty much anything else) is much better. Making the LEoG a very bad purchase, even despite the desire to get limited account upgrades.
Meanwhile, you have the case of new players : they start at +0%. And now they're not just 8-9 years behind like before, they also can't hope ever getting the high numbers we veterans have. They can't catch, which is frustrating regardless of how useful MG is. They would need 25 years at 2%/season  to stack +200% MF from essences of gold, assuming they buy it all (which they shouldn't, given the very high AA price and the very low return) !
I assume that the current state of LEoG in WV is because the devs don't want us to keep skyrocketing the GF numbers, even if this account stat doesn't do that much. They want to slow this down. But it leads to a frustrating situation for players : new players have to ignore GF altogether (no catch in sight ; advice against buying LEoG anyway), veterans have to actively avoid a permanent account upgrade due to how bad the ROI is.
Which is where my suggestion comes. The "global" % (I call it global , not because it would affect everything, but because it's a single % stat that encompasses both sources of account GF : essences of gold and achievements). The "global %" would be split, just like the MF % was split many years ago. If you open the game and put your mouse over your account MF stat (in the achievement tab), you'll see that the game tracks 2 numbers : MF from achievements and MF from essence of luck (for example, I have +329% MF account-wide, including +300% from essences and +29% from achievements). The MF from essence [of luck] is capped at 300%, and the MF from achievements is heavily restrained anyway. The MG doesn't follow this rule : we only have a global number (achiev+essence) and it's not capped at all ... except from the new frustrating method of acquisition of essence [of gold].
The suggestion is to do the exact same thing with MG that was done with MF. Separately track 2 numbers (MG from essence, MG from achievements) and hard cap the MG from essence.
Once this hard cap is in place, there is no fear of an ever rising account stat anymore. The reason for the very expensive (1000 AA per %) and very limited (2 per season) essence of gold is gone.
Thanks to this cap, the numbers in WV could be brought to something a bit more engaging for players (even if MG is still something that doesn't do much, as you pointed out). Way cheaper price in Astral Acclaim (250 instead of 1000 imho), and way higher seasonal cap (10 instead of 2 imho).
It would be good for veterans : we have a given amount of MG currently. Given that it's a permanent account stat, I'm sure that many of us would be happy to work towards maxing it (regardless of how useful it actually is). With the cap in mind, we can choose when and how to spend AA on it and progress towards the goal : the new cap. (vs the current uncapped situation where progress isn't tied to any goal so we just look at the very bad ROI)
It would be good for beginners : they get a system where they have a chance to catch the veteran players, both because the latter will be capped, and because the former will be able to progress slightly faster than in the old system (if WV allowed the purchase of 10 LEoG/season, you could get up to 40%/year, vs 8% right now, vs 26% before SotO).

Edited September 9, 2023 by Eowin Of Rohan.2619
typos

[Funky.4861]

Account-wide bonuses are supposed to be high for veterans who have put the hours into playing the game. This fad of jealously wanting what other players have for a fraction of the cost is getting to be annoying. If i start playing a game that's been out for a few years, i have no right to expect to achieve/earn what people who have played that game since launch have in any shorter a timeframe. They have put their lives into the game and have the corresponding rewards; it's frankly a bit disgusting to want to take that away from them.

[Linken.6345]

It could cost 5 AA and would still not be worth the investment.

So yea I dont see your idea as a good thing at all the % gold find should just be removed from the store since it is a noob trap.

But then again the essence of luck obsidian shard is crap aswell so I guess Anet want some useless items in there to pad out the store.

[ShadowCatz.8437]

5 minutes ago, Funky.4861 said:

Account-wide bonuses are supposed to be high for veterans who have put the hours into playing the game. This fad of jealously wanting what other players have for a fraction of the cost is getting to be annoying. If i start playing a game that's been out for a few years, i have no right to expect to achieve/earn what people who have played that game since launch have in any shorter a timeframe. They have put their lives into the game and have the corresponding rewards; it's frankly a bit disgusting to want to take that away from them.

What "fad of jealously" are you talking about? I have an old account which is around 100% in GF toady and another account which is only around 30% GF. On the old account I have worked pretty hard to catch up with Achievement Points which also reward GF at certain steps. On the newer account I work to get that account as much on the same level as the old.

@Eowin Of Rohan.2619 suggest that there need to be a way to even out the difference somehow and that have nothing to do with being jealous. The way Wizard's Vault changed that is that it now isn't something you gain from log in and play (for each 28 day you get an increase in GF), but you now have to decide what to use your Astral Acclaim on in that situation 2000 AA to increase GF with 2% means competes with Gold, Mystic Clovers, Mystic Coins, different types of Crafting Containers, ascended gear, upgrades to template and skins.

Any veteran player will have other items that a new play would have to invest much more time to catch up with and there are also items that isn't possible to get any more, so I don't see why you,  @Funky.4861 , are getting upset about something that would make it possible for later players then veterans to get motivation to continue to play?

Getting told (especially from veteran player which already have rather high GF) that there is not a very useful investment to use AA on GF as it work right now means that there is something wrong with this system.

Independent of being a veteran or a new player you still have to kill mobs to get any gain out of GF, so it isn't exactly something that would create an extreme advantage for a new player or make veterans loose something. It doesn't make any new play suddenly rich from just being having a new account (or an account which isn't as old as the oldest veterans in GW2).

[Eowin Of Rohan.2619]

Exactly.
Especially with how the available GF/time ratio just dropped 3.2-fold. New people will get less than veteran people regardless of investing as much time in the game.
And I'm definitely not jealous : as I said I'm a veteran myself, my GF is +257% on 2 accounts (and +244% on a 3rd one which, just like @ShadowCatz.8437, I worked a lot on to catch some achievements and gear and so on ... Except I luckily bought the account long ago so it had good GF progress by pure chance ... it's not like I "worked" on it, the account was just idle farming daily rewards ... The same that now require actual gameplay for newer people).
@Funky.4861 with the cap in place, veterans would actually have a huge advantage : they'd get to max the stat soon and choose at what rate they buy essence of gold to do so. While new players would still look at years of building up to the cap, just like they do for many other things (MF, AP, daily AP, festival rewards ...)

@Linken.6345 yesterday I was wondering why I had to explain things so thoroughly but tbh I regret spending so much time doing it. The reason why you didn't really understand the suggestion is that you play the forums, not the game 😞. I opened a few threads, you're in every single one, 13.1k messages, and openly admit that you're not playing SotO ! Of course at this rate, GF will be a "noob trap even a 5 AA". With prices much lower than 1kAA (maybe my proposed 250aa is still too high), it isn't as bad granted you plan to (actively) play the game for a long time ... Also buying LEoG now makes you progress towards the goal that is maxing an account stat, so it's more than just its pure gold ROI.

Edited September 10, 2023 by Eowin Of Rohan.2619
added middle §

[Linken.6345]

7 hours ago, Eowin Of Rohan.2619 said:

Exactly.
Especially with how the available GF/time ratio just dropped 3.2-fold. New people will get less than veteran people regardless of investing as much time in the game.
And I'm definitely not jealous : as I said I'm a veteran myself, my GF is +257% on 2 accounts (and +244% on a 3rd one which, just like @ShadowCatz.8437, I worked a lot on to catch some achievements and gear and so on ... Except I luckily bought the account long ago so it had good GF progress by pure chance ... it's not like I "worked" on it, the account was just idle farming daily rewards ... The same that now require actual gameplay for newer people).
@Funky.4861 with the cap in place, veterans would actually have a huge advantage : they'd get to max the stat soon and choose at what rate they buy essence of gold to do so. While new players would still look at years of building up to the cap, just like they do for many other things (MF, AP, daily AP, festival rewards ...)

@Linken.6345 yesterday I was wondering why I had to explain things so thoroughly but tbh I regret spending so much time doing it. The reason why you didn't really understand the suggestion is that you play the forums, not the game 😞. I opened a few threads, you're in every single one, 13.1k messages, and openly admit that you're not playing SotO ! Of course at this rate, GF will be a "noob trap even a 5 AA". With prices much lower than 1kAA (maybe my proposed 250aa is still too high), it isn't as bad granted you plan to (actively) play the game for a long time ... Also buying LEoG now makes you progress towards the goal that is maxing an account stat, so it's more than just its pure gold ROI.

Oh I play the forum when I cant play the game waiting for meta events, world bosses and 12 hour work shift can easily rack up the post count.

I have 5 accounts highest 208% second 129% and the last 3 48-52%.

They all gain gold at the same rate since 99% the gold get aint affected by gold find hence why that and your suggestion is worthless in my oppinion.

My main account get 1s20 copper instead of 40 copper on a random kill every once in a while is not going to affect anything when my alt can just harvest 1 node and gain more then that.

And so can any new player aswell btw.

Yes I dont play SotO but the AA system is introduced to all of us so I play that system the same as you.