Mesmer clones feel very clunky

[Aewenlir.5971]

(This is all in reference to PvE: mostly open world, metas, and fractals. Very new to PvP and WvW, so these suggestions don't address those game modes at all.)

I've been playing the game on and off for a year, and really like the mesmer class: it's unique class, has great visuals, and has a really nice toolkit. 

However, whenever I play a spec that isn't virtuoso, I just feel completely hamstrung by clone generation. Having the clones disappear upon the death of the mob makes it feel clunky to play, especially in the open world and fractals. I really like to play support builds, and when I compare how the mesmer boon generation feels in comparison to something like the herald, it feels slow and kind of useless unless we're sitting on a boss, because I just cannot get clones up fast enough to do my job before the mob dies. It's a base profession mechanic that I think really isn't working that great across a pretty significant swath of PvE gameplay cases. 

I think that allowing some "grace period" during which you can switch to a new target and not lose clones would make a world of difference. Let the clones have an expiration time, so we still need to worry about actively generating them, but don't have them vanish as soon as the one mob in the swarm we are fighting dies. I'm imagining your clones stay up, modulo some baked-in expiration time, as long as you are in combat and haven't shattered them. I know this is not a new idea, but I wanted to raise it again after being reminded this week of just how clunky mesmer feels outside of virtuoso. We can already lose clones to area damage, so that kind of clone management stays in place. We're motivated to shatter them, because boons and damage are very much tied to shatters (except maybe poor alac mirage). This kind of change would help with the flow of combat and the feel of the class.

 

[Junkpile.7439]

Haven't notice. I create clone and it goes boom instantly. I haven't never figured out why some people make clones and just let them stand there.

[Geronmy.3298]

38 minutes ago, Junkpile.7439 said:

Haven't notice. I create clone and it goes boom instantly. I haven't never figured out why some people make clones and just let them stand there.

If you play condi leaving them be is a big chunk of your dps.

[Eekasqueak.7850]

Can always play Virtuoso if you don't like them. 

[ZephidelGRS.9520]

So is your problem specifically because you want to play a supportive build? Because if it is then you have to run a few specific setups/traits.

It's true that a supportive Mesmer build relies a lot on Shattering, so you will have to run traits that help you create/retain Clones, namely Ego Restoration (along with the heal Mantra) and Illusionary Reversion.

Also you want to run Scepter. Scepter 1 creates a Clone at the end of every auto attack chain, and Scepter 2 has been reworked so you can proactively trigger it and create 2 Clones. These can create 3 Clones in a relatively short time, so if you target the enemy with the highest HP then it should allow you to shatter 2-3 times before it's dead. 

Off-hand can be whatever, but I've found Shield to be the right supportive fit. With a well-timed press, Shield 4 can easily trigger twice and create 2 Clones.

I'm also running Signet of Illusions, and while the passive Clone is slow it still contributes meaningfully to my Shatter frequency.

With these setups I've often found myself being able to pump out more Clones than I could Shatter. 

Edited December 15, 2023 by ZephidelGRS.9520

[ShadowKatt.6740]

15 hours ago, Aewenlir.5971 said:

I think that allowing some "grace period" during which you can switch to a new target and not lose clones would make a world of difference.

Have I got news for you! Since you said you're a Virtuoso player then you might have missed this: Exclusively from the sands of Elona let me introduce you to THE MIRAGE! This sexy new import all the way from the Crystal Desert features new tools to let you handle any challenge ahead of you, Mirrors on demand giving you an unprecidented panoramic view of the rolling dunes and verdant oasis, many new surprises to keep every day feeling fresh and exciting, and the brand new ability to retarget your clones to a new foe after your first target is defeated! Financing is available, terms and conditions will apply. Subject to State and Federal laws.

It takes a bit of practice and a bit of luck with the battle, but if extending the life of your clones is a priority for you then this is where you want to be. A properly played Mirage can generate three clones on one target, kill it, and then retarget those clones to the next without having them disappear. Axes of Symmetry is a decent CD on your axe and so your primary go-to when it comes to redirecting your clones, and Illusionary Ambush can help fill in the gaps. Now the grace period COULD be a bit longer, I agree, and myself personally I would love to see an alternative solution to the whole thing, but since my idea isn't likely to see the light of day then the Mirage is your best bet. Happy hunting.

[Mell.4873]

Clone managed is literally Mesmers class mechanic which is why Mesmer mains didn't like Virtuoso. 

The whole point is to pick a target that will not die right away and stack clones on them to get off your burst. This all takes practice with the most damaging Chronomancer build being very difficult to do. 

I even fell out of practice, I can't even do the 40k DPS build any more, so I normally play Virtuoso.