Anet its time to lock MMR, best single change you could ever make

[Flowki.7194]

Cmon its just not fun. Another complete landslide 500-10, and I even sat afk from 200, so they won that 4v5. Who on earth can even say they are plat with a straight face when MMR is throwing games like this?

 

+1 this kitten please, its not competitive, or fun on either end of this kitten poor mmr.

[Mne Malo Tebya.2965]

What would you suggest to change?

[arazoth.7290]

2 minutes ago, Mne Malo Tebya.2965 said:

What would you suggest to change?

It's written in the big letters of the title what he suggested

[Mne Malo Tebya.2965]

13 minutes ago, arazoth.7290 said:

It's written in the big letters of the title what he suggested

care to explain what he means?

[Flowki.7194]

28 minutes ago, Mne Malo Tebya.2965 said:

What would you suggest to change?

Lets say you are S3, you que up, the game will only try to match you with S3. That should last 5 min. After 5 min, it will then widen the search so that S2 and G1 can be recruited to join the S3 game. Thats it.. no wider.

 

Slowly but surely this is what happens. People who play the game with team work have a much higher chance of climbing. Those who do not work as a team, more chance of falling. Currently, the system is so wide that a few "true plat" skilled players can carry games, and those types of players who don't work as a team can stay at higher rankgs (g2/3) becuase of the 50/50 carries. In this current system, that means you get absolutely penalised for playing anything other than a roam spec, which is least impacted by the complete lack of team work. Not suprisingly, roam specs are highly over represented now, which further reduces team work, and any group fight ability, which alienates all support/group fight specs.

 

Ontop of that, plat duos then capitalise on the chaos and 0 team work vs solo plats, and get to duo farm the rest of the players who have half their skill.

 

Locking MMr allows supports, group fighters, teamworkers, and solo que plats to ALL be more viable, while competition overall would increase 10 fold. Selfish players would eventually plumet in rating, and duo plats would be far less effective when the enemy team is mostly p2/1.. who will all have a far better understanding of the game and team work. More players from g2/3 on specs like full support, now have a much better chance of climbing into p1 as solo que, the plat population would gradually increase at p1, and p2/3 would reduce, since those players are now no logner benefiting from duo off peaking.. we get to finally see who the real best players are.

Edited July 28 by Flowki.7194

[Mne Malo Tebya.2965]

18 minutes ago, Flowki.7194 said:

Lets say you are S3, you que up, the game will only try to match you with S3. That should last 5 min. After 5 min, it will then widen the search so that S2 and G1 can be recruited to join the S3 game. Thats it.. no wider.

There's a reason why g3,2,1 even silver players get matched vs plat players. And its not because the matchmaking is broken. Its because the algorithm expands the rating radius at intervals to reduce q times. There are simply not enough plat or gold players at a time to fill a match. If you lock that so that cant happen, it would lead to insane or literally infinite q times for everything above plat. Who would you think would waste their time to wait that long? Even now when people hit 10 mins q time mark, they just stop playing ranked. People would either quit ranked or go on low gold smurfs to avoid these long q's. 

[Flowki.7194]

11 minutes ago, Mne Malo Tebya.2965 said:

There's a reason why g3,2,1 even silver players get matched vs plat players. And its not because the matchmaking is broken. Its because the algorithm expands the rating radius at intervals to reduce q times. There are simply not enough plat or gold players at a time to fill a match. If you lock that so that cant happen, it would lead to insane or literally infinite q times for everything above plat. Who would you think would waste their time to wait that long? Even now when people hit 10 mins q time mark, they just stop playing ranked. People would either quit ranked or go on low gold smurfs to avoid these long q's. 

That isn't true at all, becuase you don't consider how many people have been turned away from sPVP due to the wide skill gap games, p2 duo farmers, and that most supports are simply not viable solo que with mixed skill DPS. A lot of group fight specs are also not viable, on account of so few people playing support. Not everybody likes to play roam, no support likes having g1 dps vs p1 dps.. and NOBODY likes vsing p2 duos when your team is a P1, and the rest <g3.

Edited July 28 by Flowki.7194

[Mne Malo Tebya.2965]

1 minute ago, Flowki.7194 said:

That isn't true at all, becuase you don't consider how many people have been turned away from sPVP

surely they will come back if you would offer them a plat only game combine with a 1hr q 🙂

[Flowki.7194]

Just now, Mne Malo Tebya.2965 said:

surely they will come back if you would offer them a plat only game combine with a 1hr q 🙂

P1 would que with g3, there are plenty of g3, and the p1 pop would increase fast. The only people who stand to wait longer, are p3, since they are only going up against other p3 and p2. Those at true p3 skill level (as in not duo off peak farming) are what, 10 people?

 

Sure, lets keep a toxic system in place just for 10 people, youre a true visionary.

[Mne Malo Tebya.2965]

12 minutes ago, Flowki.7194 said:

The only people who stand to wait longer

Everyone would wait longer and people will start quitting

12 minutes ago, Flowki.7194 said:

Sure, lets keep a toxic system in place just for 10 people, youre a true visionary.

I dont disagree with the fact it sucks, but your change will just be the death of ranked

Edit: On top you say there are plenty of g3. Have a look at NA leaderboard. Top 250 is 1430, which is almost g2. How come there are plenty g3 when top 250 is almost down to g2.

Edited July 28 by Mne Malo Tebya.2965

[Saiyan.1704]

8 minutes ago, Flowki.7194 said:

That isn't true at all

What he stated is literally how it works.

I was around when the devs first started to incorporate the PiP, division, and algorithm system we currently have. They nearly made instant queue pops, that didn't work for obvious reasons. Then they made the queue be 7minutes or longer and the devs themselves said that it did not change match quality much, at all.

If you are asking golds to play with only golds, silver with silvers and plats with plats then you're going to have some astronomical queue times. I'm talking about 10m or even 15m queues at the Bronze to Plat bell curve. Not only will you have these extremes, but matchmaking quality is not going to change as much as you hope it would.

[maxwelgm.4315]

As much as it'd be funny to see the top duos queueing for hours and as nice as it would be to never match to them, there's a cascade of changes not considered here, such as: having to make sure the MMR is locked by the highest rated player in a duo, changing the class matchmaking system to allow for classes to overlap (or not allowing swaps at least) otherwise with the low amount of players, matchmaking would become entirely controllable and predictable by p3/p2 players on their side of things, and also (maybe not even possible?) controlling for multiboxing with alts as it also means you can potentially and utterly control the matchmaking if your pool of competitors is a group of ~25 people at most. And there's probably other things that would make this change not really have the impact you'd expect.

[Flowki.7194]

37 minutes ago, Saiyan.1704 said:

What he stated is literally how it works.

I was around when the devs first started to incorporate the PiP, division, and algorithm system we currently have. They nearly made instant queue pops, that didn't work for obvious reasons. Then they made the queue be 7minutes or longer and the devs themselves said that it did not change match quality much, at all.

If you are asking golds to play with only golds, silver with silvers and plats with plats then you're going to have some astronomical queue times. I'm talking about 10m or even 15m queues at the Bronze to Plat bell curve. Not only will you have these extremes, but matchmaking quality is not going to change as much as you hope it would.

You havent read what I said, becase it wasn't that.

 

P1 would start off only looking for P1, in which it might find 10 players, if not, then after 5 min it will widen the search to include g3 and p2. Nobody on this forum will ever be able to come up with a good enough reason for p2 players to be put in the same game is g2.. ive even gotten games with p2s when I was g1, it is a fking joke.

 

The thing people are not considering here is why plat games might be taking so long as is, or why the MMR is so wide now. Becuase of the wide MMr, any plat players wanting to take it serious, has to duo Q to increase their chance of winning. If p1 games are locked to the range of g3/p2.. then all platers in those games are a lot closer in skill level. That means duo Q dodgin at p2 to get games with g1s etc is no longer viable, on peak games will become more commong becuase you will get similar players in skill no matter what time you que. I know a lot of player names and alot of g3s are very decent players, but solo Q in a wide MMr, they would easily hold their own vs a mixed game of p1/2. Many g3 would not ofc.. but I would far rather have all g3 on my team vs a few plats, than 1 plat and a few g1s.

 

There are more than enough g2/3/p1 players at current, and the spvp population will only increase if A: games are more fair and B: solo que on specs like full support are more viable, since dps on both teams are closer in skill level <which atracks more support/team fight players> The current mode heavily favours roamers.

 

If the playerbase does not increase on account of that, then its a content problem, Anet need to pull their finger out their kitten and give some new maps/modes @ the same time as locking MMR to attract old/new alike. Again, long que times IS NOT AN EXCUSE for putting p2 players in the same game as g2/1.. that simply should never happen.. becuase it 100% is going to turn players of all levels away from sPVP, it clearly already has, many people have posted it over the years.

 

I am only around g3, maybe p1 at best, I don't actually care about my rank. But what I do care about is quality of games. There is nothing at all fun or competitive about being put in games with s3/2s, clear fresh installs, who I can kill just auto attacking, and getting K/ds like 20-0. I would like to think p2 players feel the same way about fighting g3/2s?.. but it seems they care more about rank, by any means.

Edited July 28 by Flowki.7194

[Mne Malo Tebya.2965]

9 minutes ago, Flowki.7194 said:

You havent read what I said, becase it wasn't that.

You need to understand that your solution is not a solution that will improve the game, it will make it worse. 

[Flowki.7194]

2 minutes ago, Mne Malo Tebya.2965 said:

You need to understand that your solution is not a solution that will improve the game, it will make it worse. 

You need to tell me why "potentially" longer que times is worse than p2s farming g1s.

 

Anet tried a more narrow MMr in the past as somebody said, and aparently it didn't work. Did it ever cross your mind that they didn't do a good job of it? And could do it again, but properly. I mean kitten.. I would settle for a toggle option to "only que within X range", I'd personally rather wait 10 min for a qaulity game, than a kitten game from an instant pop.

[Mne Malo Tebya.2965]

Just now, Flowki.7194 said:

You need to tell me why "potentially" longer que times is worse than p2s farming g1s.

potentially 

It will be longer, and I can guarantee you players will not play ranked if theres a 10+ min Q. (Not including that higher plats wouldnt be able to find a match at all)

[Flowki.7194]

1 minute ago, Mne Malo Tebya.2965 said:

potentially 

It will be longer, and I can guarantee you players will not play ranked if theres a 10+ min Q. (Not including that higher plats wouldnt be able to find a match at all)

And I can garuntee you plats in the same game as low golds, and high golds in the same games as low silvers, is a sure way of killing off a dwindling playerbase, which is clearly shown by the fact the MMR has widened so much

[Mne Malo Tebya.2965]

3 minutes ago, Flowki.7194 said:

And I can garuntee you plats in the same game as low golds, and high golds in the same games as low silvers, is a sure way of killing off a dwindling playerbase, which is clearly shown by the fact the MMR has widened so much

I dont disagree with that.

But again your "solution" would be the final death to ranked. 

[Flowki.7194]

2 minutes ago, Mne Malo Tebya.2965 said:

I dont disagree with that.

But again your "solution" would be the final death to ranked. 

I flat out disagree, most of the sPVP playerbase is silver/gold, those elos, and p1 would be fine. The only real people standing to suffer are p2+, who are mostly duo off peakers anyway, farming solo <p1...

[Mne Malo Tebya.2965]

1 minute ago, Flowki.7194 said:

I flat out disagree, most of the sPVP playerbase is silver/gold, those elos, and p1 would be fine. The only real people standing to suffer are p2+, who are mostly duo off peakers anyway, farming solo <p1...

Ok, not gonna continue this any further

[Flowki.7194]

1 minute ago, Mne Malo Tebya.2965 said:

Ok, not gonna continue this any further

So you disagree that around 80% of the playerbase is gold/silver?

[Mne Malo Tebya.2965]

Just now, Flowki.7194 said:

So you disagree that around 80% of the playerbase is gold/silver?

No that seems about right.

But such a change would increase q time across all ratings, not just plat 2 or 3. People will quit if these q times get too long and they are already long.

Also as @Saiyan.1704 mentioned, matchquality wont necessarily become better.

[Flowki.7194]

6 minutes ago, Mne Malo Tebya.2965 said:

No that seems about right.

But such a change would increase q time across all ratings, not just plat 2 or 3. People will quit if these q times get too long and they are already long.

Also as @Saiyan.1704 mentioned, matchquality wont necessarily become better.

No it wouldnt 😜 If 80% of the playerbase is s/g, those elos would be fine.

 

Now tell me, how many people in G3 do you think are held there by the RNG of the wide MMR, on specs like full support, that can't carry a team of g2 dps vs a p1/2 duo? I would personally estimate that around 20% of G3s could hold there own in a p1 game, with similar level team mates to play off. Do you agree?

 

(Btw im writing this while afk in another land slide, we are still winning 4v5, currently 400-50)

Edited July 28 by Flowki.7194

[Mne Malo Tebya.2965]

5 minutes ago, Flowki.7194 said:

I would personally estimate that around 20% of G3s could hold there own in a p1 game, with similar level team mates to play off. Do you agree?

No, I saw gold3 teams in daily AT's and it was always a 500-0, even with complete meme specs by us.

[Flowki.7194]

5 minutes ago, Mne Malo Tebya.2965 said:

No, I saw gold3 teams in daily AT's and it was always a 500-0, even with complete meme specs by us.

Premade AT has nothing to do with this, I know a lot of decent players who are in and out of g3/p1, and a lot of players who clearly solo-q on/off peak, are only gold, but are true plat skill level, I know that just from dueling plats and them. You also do not seem to accept that specs like full support, or any spec that leans into its team, is at a massive disadvantedge, suffering to the wider MMr. You really think giving a good full support player a steady flow of g3/p1 dps over an rng g1 to p1 flow is not going to make a difference on that support players rank?

Edited July 28 by Flowki.7194