PVP: Where Did All The Good People Go?

[dragonkain.3984]

Best answer you'll get:

It wont change, all games lately scare off competitive people because all game developers focus only on casual crowd by making games easy to learn and play, letting literally anyone do stuff the best player can do, removing difference between best and mediocre players, in turn making win/losses decided not by amount of training and work one puts into mastering the game but instead by randomness.

So ye, gw2 follows the same philosophy (example - deadeye, the most scrub friendly class which is absolutely worthless vs good players) so good players see no reason to waste their time on a game where their skill doesnt get matter, doesnt get rewarded and they are forcibly equalized to the herd so they move on to games where skill, dedication are properly rewarded and matter (for example I returned to dota once again)

[sephiroth.4217]

@FyzE.3472 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:Why play the ranked cesspool when you can enjoy unranked?

Ranked has so many issues that the Devs won't fix, there's no point bashing your head against a wall trying to make it work either.To name a few:

• Hackers
• No functionality of the reporting feature
• Bad matchmaking, Platinums shouldn't be carrying bronzes against a team of Golds, there should be division hard caps on our games, only fight people within our division so that rank matters, so you actually climb for beating people in your league and not losing rank to people 3 leagues above you.

That last point is the biggest issue.

Yeah. Fighting a team of 3+ premades alone with randoms is so much fun...

More like playing with those 3+ premades is fun :wink:

But on a serious note, premades don't really matter unless they're on voice and even then it can still go either way, have won and lost against premades and have won and lost being the premade.

[allias.1420]

@dragonkain.3984 said:Best answer you'll get:

It wont change, all games lately scare off competitive people because all game developers focus only on casual crowd by making games easy to learn and play, letting literally anyone do stuff the best player can do, removing difference between best and mediocre players, in turn making win/losses decided not by amount of training and work one puts into mastering the game but instead by randomness.

So ye, gw2 follows the same philosophy (example - deadeye, the most scrub friendly class which is absolutely worthless vs good players) so good players see no reason to waste their time on a game where their skill doesnt get matter, doesnt get rewarded and they are forcibly equalized to the herd so they move on to games where skill, dedication are properly rewarded and matter (for example I returned to dota once again)

are u drunk

[allias.1420]

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:Why play the ranked cesspool when you can enjoy unranked?

Ranked has so many issues that the Devs won't fix, there's no point bashing your head against a wall trying to make it work either.To name a few:

• Hackers
• No functionality of the reporting feature
• Bad matchmaking, Platinums shouldn't be carrying bronzes against a team of Golds, there should be division hard caps on our games, only fight people within our division so that rank matters, so you actually climb for beating people in your league and not losing rank to people 3 leagues above you.

That last point is the biggest issue.

Yeah. Fighting a team of 3+ premades alone with randoms is so much fun...

More like playing with those 3+ premades is fun :wink:

But on a serious note, premades don't really matter unless they're on voice and even then it can still go either way, have won and lost against premades and have won and lost being the premade.

Yes, premades matter. They have better communication therefore better coordination etc, etc. It's clearly an advantage over a team made up of solo players.

[tartarus.1082]

People left Cause pvp in the game sucks, and realized there are million other games with competitive aspects that are way better than gw2 ever was and will be

[dragonkain.3984]

@allias.1420 said:

@dragonkain.3984 said:

Best answer you'll get:

It wont change, all games lately scare off competitive people because all game developers focus only on casual crowd by making games easy to learn and play, letting literally anyone do stuff the best player can do, removing difference between best and mediocre players, in turn making win/losses decided not by amount of training and work one puts into mastering the game but instead by randomness.

So ye, gw2 follows the same philosophy (example - deadeye, the most scrub friendly class which is absolutely worthless vs good players) so good players see no reason to waste their time on a game where their skill doesnt get matter, doesnt get rewarded and they are forcibly equalized to the herd so they move on to games where skill, dedication are properly rewarded and matter (for example I returned to dota once again)

are u drunk

Nope, I'm just so beyond the average human intelligence level that majority has trouble understanding what I'm saying. Kinda like showing math equations to a horse.

[Cassandra Aeneid.2854]

@dragonkain.3984 said:Nope, I'm just so beyond the average human intelligence level that majority has trouble understanding what I'm saying. Kinda like showing math equations to a horse.this is probably the cringiest thing I have ever seen on this forum, and that's quite the achievement

[Rym.1469]

@WARIORSCHARGEING.2637 said:

@Xar.1387 said:Its simple. No esport = No PvP these days.Even WoW (PvE game) got their e-sport tournaments and stuff

you must be new to the game . back when anet tried to force e-sports down the player base mouth . well that went over really so well the player base then stopped playing the game altogether every time they seen coming across the log in and in game play screens the hey come watch our esl e-sports pvp event going on .

anet tries to do that again well it be more worse than the last time they tired it you can take that to the bank :# :# :#

Correction: they tried to aim for big boy esport and that didn't work out.The weight of this failure wasn't even on PvP itself, it was mostly the ridiculous imbalance that struck the gamemode at time. Initially, Pro League had a decent interest and viewerbase, but despite decent production and casters trying their best, that initial hype was quickly lost due to balance issues. Nobody wanted to watch everlasting fights or stuff like entire team quitting game three minutes in because they've lost a cap and knew they couldn't bring it back because of immortal enemy comps. After all this, the esports hate began and Pro League was lost in many players' eyes with no chance for ressurection, despite getting better balance and production as it went on.

However, GW2 had regular PvP events before that were decently popular and with smaller scope - monthly ESL Go4s and qualifiers for them. A lot of people you know from PvP started from those. I think bringing back those in some quarterly format, with Monthly ATs being qualifiers for them would be a great idea and could help in rebuilding the pvp scene.

[sephiroth.4217]

@allias.1420 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:Why play the ranked cesspool when you can enjoy unranked?

Ranked has so many issues that the Devs won't fix, there's no point bashing your head against a wall trying to make it work either.To name a few:

• Hackers
• No functionality of the reporting feature
• Bad matchmaking, Platinums shouldn't be carrying bronzes against a team of Golds, there should be division hard caps on our games, only fight people within our division so that rank matters, so you actually climb for beating people in your league and not losing rank to people 3 leagues above you.

That last point is the biggest issue.

Yeah. Fighting a team of 3+ premades alone with randoms is so much fun...

More like playing with those 3+ premades is fun :wink:

But on a serious note, premades don't really matter unless they're on voice and even then it can still go either way, have won and lost against premades and have won and lost being the premade.

Yes, premades matter. They have better communication therefore better coordination etc, etc. It's clearly an advantage over a team made up of solo players.

Which is what I said?

[allias.1420]

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@allias.1420 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:Why play the ranked cesspool when you can enjoy unranked?

Ranked has so many issues that the Devs won't fix, there's no point bashing your head against a wall trying to make it work either.To name a few:

• Hackers
• No functionality of the reporting feature
• Bad matchmaking, Platinums shouldn't be carrying bronzes against a team of Golds, there should be division hard caps on our games, only fight people within our division so that rank matters, so you actually climb for beating people in your league and not losing rank to people 3 leagues above you.

That last point is the biggest issue.

Yeah. Fighting a team of 3+ premades alone with randoms is so much fun...

More like playing with those 3+ premades is fun :wink:

But on a serious note, premades don't really matter unless they're on voice and even then it can still go either way, have won and lost against premades and have won and lost being the premade.

Yes, premades matter. They have better communication therefore better coordination etc, etc. It's clearly an advantage over a team made up of solo players.

Which is what I said?

well, you said premades don't matter unless they communicate by voice, I disagree. It matters because two players who are top tier can queue together which would increase their chances of winning and they don't have to communicate by voice

[dragonkain.3984]

@Cassandra Aeneid.2854 said:

@dragonkain.3984 said:Nope, I'm just so beyond the average human intelligence level that majority has trouble understanding what I'm saying. Kinda like showing math equations to a horse.this is probably the cringiest thing I have ever seen on this forum, and that's quite the achievement

No doubt, humans are known to have irrational reactions when faced with superior intelligence and/or truths they cant accept. ^^

[allias.1420]

@dragonkain.3984 said:

@allias.1420 said:

@dragonkain.3984 said:

Best answer you'll get:

It wont change, all games lately scare off competitive people because all game developers focus only on casual crowd by making games easy to learn and play, letting literally anyone do stuff the best player can do, removing difference between best and mediocre players, in turn making win/losses decided not by amount of training and work one puts into mastering the game but instead by randomness.

So ye, gw2 follows the same philosophy (example - deadeye, the most scrub friendly class which is absolutely worthless vs good players) so good players see no reason to waste their time on a game where their skill doesnt get matter, doesnt get rewarded and they are forcibly equalized to the herd so they move on to games where skill, dedication are properly rewarded and matter (for example I returned to dota once again)

are u drunk

Nope, I'm just so beyond the average human intelligence level that majority has trouble understanding what I'm saying. Kinda like showing math equations to a horse.

if skill doesn't matter in this game, show me. Let's have a duel. Show me that this game is sooo easy to play.

[The Grandfather.9836]

1. guild wars 2 literally eliminated the competitive formats that existed in gw1 and made guild wars' biggest joke random arena the premier format. tombs, gvg, and team arenas all took more skill and coordination.
2. conquest is really bad
3. not having monks is really bad
4. its just a low skill game, people who are top rated will beg to differ as you have seen in this thread to defend their time investment, but the fact is nobody watches it nobody plays it and there's no money in it so nobody good plays it.
5. they had a bad grasp of esports and a terrible vision for skill balance in gw1 doing things like removing victory or death instead of just programming better NPC ai / new maps/ or making the flag stand give better buffs. GW1 was too good of a game they had to drive it into the ground and when they drove it into the ground as well as they could they decided to abandon it entirely and create gw2 so people could have a REALLY degenerate pvp experience.

Anet, congrats - you have made both the best and the worst game both with the same title.

Signed,Salty ex-gw1 player

[dragonkain.3984]

@allias.1420 said:

@dragonkain.3984 said:

@allias.1420 said:

@dragonkain.3984 said:

Best answer you'll get:

It wont change, all games lately scare off competitive people because all game developers focus only on casual crowd by making games easy to learn and play, letting literally anyone do stuff the best player can do, removing difference between best and mediocre players, in turn making win/losses decided not by amount of training and work one puts into mastering the game but instead by randomness.

So ye, gw2 follows the same philosophy (example - deadeye, the most scrub friendly class which is absolutely worthless vs good players) so good players see no reason to waste their time on a game where their skill doesnt get matter, doesnt get rewarded and they are forcibly equalized to the herd so they move on to games where skill, dedication are properly rewarded and matter (for example I returned to dota once again)

are u drunk

Nope, I'm just so beyond the average human intelligence level that majority has trouble understanding what I'm saying. Kinda like showing math equations to a horse.

if skill doesn't matter in this game, show me. Let's have a duel. Show me that this game is sooo easy to play.

I've already stated that I'm more interested in playing dota than proving something to random nobody over the internet. If I'd waste my time on proving every human that they are wrong on this planet I'd be spending whole life doing nothing but that, but obviously, I won't, cos your opinions don't matter, only facts matter, and that's just another fact for you to enjoy.

[allias.1420]

@dragonkain.3984 said:

@allias.1420 said:

@dragonkain.3984 said:

@allias.1420 said:

@dragonkain.3984 said:

Best answer you'll get:

It wont change, all games lately scare off competitive people because all game developers focus only on casual crowd by making games easy to learn and play, letting literally anyone do stuff the best player can do, removing difference between best and mediocre players, in turn making win/losses decided not by amount of training and work one puts into mastering the game but instead by randomness.

So ye, gw2 follows the same philosophy (example - deadeye, the most scrub friendly class which is absolutely worthless vs good players) so good players see no reason to waste their time on a game where their skill doesnt get matter, doesnt get rewarded and they are forcibly equalized to the herd so they move on to games where skill, dedication are properly rewarded and matter (for example I returned to dota once again)

are u drunk

Nope, I'm just so beyond the average human intelligence level that majority has trouble understanding what I'm saying. Kinda like showing math equations to a horse.

if skill doesn't matter in this game, show me. Let's have a duel. Show me that this game is sooo easy to play.

I've already stated that I'm more interested in playing dota than proving something to random nobody over the internet. If I'd waste my time on proving every human that they are wrong on this planet I'd be spending whole life doing nothing but that, but obviously, I won't, cos your opinions doesnt matter, only facts matter, and that's just another fact for you to enjoy.

You seem to be wasting your own time posting your comments on this forum. ave a good day

[dragonkain.3984]

@allias.1420 said:

@dragonkain.3984 said:

@allias.1420 said:

@dragonkain.3984 said:

@allias.1420 said:

@dragonkain.3984 said:

Best answer you'll get:

It wont change, all games lately scare off competitive people because all game developers focus only on casual crowd by making games easy to learn and play, letting literally anyone do stuff the best player can do, removing difference between best and mediocre players, in turn making win/losses decided not by amount of training and work one puts into mastering the game but instead by randomness.

So ye, gw2 follows the same philosophy (example - deadeye, the most scrub friendly class which is absolutely worthless vs good players) so good players see no reason to waste their time on a game where their skill doesnt get matter, doesnt get rewarded and they are forcibly equalized to the herd so they move on to games where skill, dedication are properly rewarded and matter (for example I returned to dota once again)

are u drunk

Nope, I'm just so beyond the average human intelligence level that majority has trouble understanding what I'm saying. Kinda like showing math equations to a horse.

if skill doesn't matter in this game, show me. Let's have a duel. Show me that this game is sooo easy to play.

I've already stated that I'm more interested in playing dota than proving something to random nobody over the internet. If I'd waste my time on proving every human that they are wrong on this planet I'd be spending whole life doing nothing but that, but obviously, I won't, cos your opinions doesnt matter, only facts matter, and that's just another fact for you to enjoy.

You seem to be wasting your own time posting your comments on this forum. ave a good day

It's not wasting my time, it's entertaining myself with something fun, like educating people.

[Cougre.6543]

I'm still here

[BlackBeard.2873]

Where did all the good players go?

To play other games that are actually well balanced and more fun, or course! GW2 really dropped a #2 in the bed in regards to capitalizing on a great combat system. It was too weighed down by visual clutter, poor mechanics that lack counterplay, and poor balance over its history. Expansions and power-creep then came and drove a stake right through the heart by exacerbating these issues and driving away many who still remained. Finally, the money disappeared b/c nobody cared to watch a game that was impossible to follow and actually very boring due to builds being imbalanced.

[sephiroth.4217]

@allias.1420 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@allias.1420 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:Why play the ranked cesspool when you can enjoy unranked?

Ranked has so many issues that the Devs won't fix, there's no point bashing your head against a wall trying to make it work either.To name a few:

• Hackers
• No functionality of the reporting feature
• Bad matchmaking, Platinums shouldn't be carrying bronzes against a team of Golds, there should be division hard caps on our games, only fight people within our division so that rank matters, so you actually climb for beating people in your league and not losing rank to people 3 leagues above you.

That last point is the biggest issue.

Yeah. Fighting a team of 3+ premades alone with randoms is so much fun...

More like playing with those 3+ premades is fun :wink:

But on a serious note, premades don't really matter unless they're on voice and even then it can still go either way, have won and lost against premades and have won and lost being the premade.

Yes, premades matter. They have better communication therefore better coordination etc, etc. It's clearly an advantage over a team made up of solo players.

Which is what I said?

well, you said premades don't matter unless they communicate by voice, I disagree. It matters because two players who are top tier can queue together which would increase their chances of winning and they don't have to communicate by voice

What exactly are you trying to argue by the way? I gave the realistic truth, premades win and premades lose, you accidently agreed with me and now suddenly you double back on yourself?

I'd probably stop if I were you aye, just noticed you are being like this with everyone in the thread so it's hard to take you seriously.

[Ziggityzog.7389]

@sephiroth.4217 said:Why play the ranked cesspool when you can enjoy unranked?

Ranked has so many issues that the Devs won't fix, there's no point bashing your head against a wall trying to make it work either.To name a few:

• Hackers
• No functionality of the reporting feature
• Bad matchmaking, Platinums shouldn't be carrying bronzes against a team of Golds, there should be division hard caps on our games, only fight people within our division so that rank matters, so you actually climb for beating people in your league and not losing rank to people 3 leagues above you.

That last point is the biggest issue.

Couldn't have been said better

Then i saw> @"The Grandfather.9836" said:

1. guild wars 2 literally eliminated the competitive formats that existed in gw1 and made guild wars' biggest joke random arena the premier format. tombs, gvg, and team arenas all took more skill and coordination.
2. conquest is really bad
3. not having monks is really bad
4. its just a low skill game, people who are top rated will beg to differ as you have seen in this thread to defend their time investment, but the fact is nobody watches it nobody plays it and there's no money in it so nobody good plays it.
5. they had a bad grasp of esports and a terrible vision for skill balance in gw1 doing things like removing victory or death instead of just programming better NPC ai / new maps/ or making the flag stand give better buffs. GW1 was too good of a game they had to drive it into the ground and when they drove it into the ground as well as they could they decided to abandon it entirely and create gw2 so people could have a REALLY degenerate pvp experience.

Anet, congrats - you have made both the best and the worst game both with the same title.

Signed,Salty ex-gw1 player

So true on top of the hackers, bad mmr, no reporting that actually works, and so forth we have a game mode that is sooo far from anything competitive that it's actually quite sad. "Hey lets make a map where nothing more then speed is required to win". Someone could go into a match and die once or 2 times but kill others 10+ times and hold off vs 2v1 or even 3v1. All that doesn't matter if you don't have a teef but the enemy does and your team doesn't know how to run from one circle to another that's it. Why do you think there are almost next to 0 deadeyes playing in "ranked". Lack of speed compared to core and daredevil.

all the good players left for other pvp or are in unranked having fun away from the cesspool that is "ranked". A real pvp player doesn't need flashy items or a title among cheaters to have a good time.

[allias.1420]

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@allias.1420 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@allias.1420 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:Why play the ranked cesspool when you can enjoy unranked?

Ranked has so many issues that the Devs won't fix, there's no point bashing your head against a wall trying to make it work either.To name a few:

• Hackers
• No functionality of the reporting feature
• Bad matchmaking, Platinums shouldn't be carrying bronzes against a team of Golds, there should be division hard caps on our games, only fight people within our division so that rank matters, so you actually climb for beating people in your league and not losing rank to people 3 leagues above you.

That last point is the biggest issue.

Yeah. Fighting a team of 3+ premades alone with randoms is so much fun...

More like playing with those 3+ premades is fun :wink:

But on a serious note, premades don't really matter unless they're on voice and even then it can still go either way, have won and lost against premades and have won and lost being the premade.

Yes, premades matter. They have better communication therefore better coordination etc, etc. It's clearly an advantage over a team made up of solo players.

Which is what I said?

well, you said premades don't matter unless they communicate by voice, I disagree. It matters because two players who are top tier can queue together which would increase their chances of winning and they don't have to communicate by voice

What exactly are you trying to argue by the way? I gave the realistic truth, premades win and premades lose, you accidently agreed with me and now suddenly you double back on yourself?

I'd probably stop if I were you aye, just noticed you are being like this with everyone in the thread so it's hard to take you seriously.

lol someone's got their knickers in a twist. must be on the blob

[sephiroth.4217]

@allias.1420 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@allias.1420 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@allias.1420 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:Why play the ranked cesspool when you can enjoy unranked?

Ranked has so many issues that the Devs won't fix, there's no point bashing your head against a wall trying to make it work either.To name a few:

• Hackers
• No functionality of the reporting feature
• Bad matchmaking, Platinums shouldn't be carrying bronzes against a team of Golds, there should be division hard caps on our games, only fight people within our division so that rank matters, so you actually climb for beating people in your league and not losing rank to people 3 leagues above you.

That last point is the biggest issue.

Yeah. Fighting a team of 3+ premades alone with randoms is so much fun...

More like playing with those 3+ premades is fun :wink:

But on a serious note, premades don't really matter unless they're on voice and even then it can still go either way, have won and lost against premades and have won and lost being the premade.

Yes, premades matter. They have better communication therefore better coordination etc, etc. It's clearly an advantage over a team made up of solo players.

Which is what I said?

well, you said premades don't matter unless they communicate by voice, I disagree. It matters because two players who are top tier can queue together which would increase their chances of winning and they don't have to communicate by voice

What exactly are you trying to argue by the way? I gave the realistic truth, premades win and premades lose, you accidently agreed with me and now suddenly you double back on yourself?

I'd probably stop if I were you aye, just noticed you are being like this with everyone in the thread so it's hard to take you seriously.

lol someone's got their knickers in a twist. must be on the blob

A - What?andB - I really didn't need to know that, that was way too much information.

[Burn.5401]

For me it was a gradual experience starting with shoving "espurts" down our throats before the game even came out. Don't get me wrong, having a healthy competitive scene is great but it should come natural as a result of people enjoying it and trying to compete. Then began the massive meta/build changes that are forcing players to relearn the game from the ground with every major balance patch/expansion. Again, shaking up the meta once in a while is a good thing but what happens here are magnitude 9 earthquakes that either make certain classes irrelevant (eg. the revenant state) or completely invalidate other builds (PoF>HoT spec). And the cherry on top being the rework of ranked play that had (not sure if it's still true since I don't play for a while) atrocious matchmaking algorithm which drove even more people out of the game mode, the introduction of PvE rewards in ranked chests/legendary gear that invited non-competitive players only interested in grinding games etc.Also A-Net never really tried to focus on team building in this game. The team leaderboards felt neglected and worthless as most people just went for the solo play experience. You can't have a proper competitive scene when the game doesn't promote it in any way and you have the same 5 teams playing for years.