Plaguedoctor Mirage Build — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Plaguedoctor Mirage Build

Crackmonster.2790Crackmonster.2790 Member ✭✭✭
edited January 25, 2019 in Mesmer

Hey guys,
I've been wanting to build some really annoying super hard to kill mesmer for a while and i've thought of this build below. Sadly i don't have the opportunity to try it right now.

It is Chaos/Inspiration/Mirage with the thought of just being near impossible to kill while wearing down foes(players) with low-medium dps, outlasting them.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAW7dn0nBlphdoBWoBMMjFijyMAClFyf6v+u/sCugOD-j1xHQBgV5HX19QrnAAv2fwrq/EWlgA4iAEAIB4mupsp2UwNdT30NdT3UbnNdT30NdT30NdT30NVKgq0pB-w

What do you think of it? Any weaknesses or problems you foresee while playing it? Ideas to optimize it?

Support skills and elite can all be swapped to whatever you want, aoe cleanse/stability for example for group, but the build i linked is focused on just yourself. It uses mirage and seeks to get a lot of evades, distortions, protections, regens, heals and cleanses(heal mantra protected in cast by dodge) together with staff to slowly wear them down.

As it looks to me, it will pretty much nullify any condition build and be very hard to kill for power builds.

So you think this is good, or gonna suck?

Comments

  • Hey CrackMonster,

    These are two builds that I am going to test out in WvW and PvE.
    Basically try to build and maintain might with the staff to increase Condi damage.
    Have to test out both to see which is more viable to me and my play style.
    Builds are very similar. Just swapping between illusions and Dueling.
    Check them out let me know what you think.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAW7fnELDVLjNoBWoBMMjlXDDNAkTOCmdghTNxv/FAPgA-j1xHQBcV3AteCAeV9Hwq8zM7PAgLCQYVCGAIB4mupsp2UwNdT30NdT3UXnNdT30NdT30NdT30NVKgq0pB-w

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAW7fnELDVLjNoBWoBMMjlZjysC2tWyv+z//vMAutkB-j1xHQBcV3AAuIAgV5HteCAeV9Hzs/QYVCGAIB4mupsp2UwNdT30NdT3UXnNdT30NdT30NdT30NVKgq0pB-w

    Adamsap

  • whoknocks.4935whoknocks.4935 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Your build can definitely work in wvw, over 1400 condi damage.
    You should swap to axe/torch or scepter/torch

    Focus is a power based weapon and doesn't make much sense in this build.

    In the chaos traitline i would pic the trait which lowers staff skills and chaos armor gives protection, in inspiration i would pic the signet trait since you double signet.

    You will have to kite with this build, hit and run because your regen will be pretty high due to that healing power, and staff ambushes will be pretty strong to sustain damage, and axe/torch will be the main burst set but at melee range, so watch out.

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 27, 2019

    @whoknocks.4935 said:
    Your build can definitely work in wvw, over 1400 condi damage.
    You should swap to axe/torch or scepter/torch

    I read the OP and was about to say torch as well... This build is really starved for damage and I dont see how it can match any decent power build with cleanse or hybrids. The problem with healing is that the mesmer really cant become effective at at it. I mean yeah it does add something, but in comparison that build with full gear is 3657 + 685 + 2403 when popping the mantra charge, with each charge being 1831 + 685 (2925 at 50%). With zero gear its 3340 + 558 + 1770 with each charge being 1673 + 558 (2672 at 50%). Fighting 1v1 against a good player, that extra healing is not going to help an iota.

    The main issue that follows is that while the healing is better for the group, a condi mirage is generally awfull in group combat. Power dps will steamroll you, especially with no toughness at all. That hp will drop fast.

    It's not going to be bad with that much condition damage but honestly... If this is WvW, I could even see dual scepters being more effective instead of use the slowkitten staff and going for illusions instead of chaos - at least then you can leverage that torment, get torment on shatter and trait torch. But hey run what you want, test if it's effective. You'll be the one to know. I've seen some pretty off the wall builds thats effective.

  • whoknocks.4935whoknocks.4935 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dawdler.8521 said:

    @whoknocks.4935 said:
    Your build can definitely work in wvw, over 1400 condi damage.
    You should swap to axe/torch or scepter/torch

    I read the OP and was about to say torch as well... This build is really starved for damage and I dont see how it can match any decent power build with cleanse or hybrids. The problem with healing is that the mesmer really cant become effective at at it. I mean yeah it does add something, but in comparison that build with full gear is 3657 + 685 + 2403 when popping the mantra charge, with each charge being 1831 + 685 (2925 at 50%). With zero gear its 3340 + 558 + 1770 with each charge being 1673 + 558 (2672 at 50%). Fighting 1v1 against a good player, that extra healing is not going to help an iota.

    The main issue that follows is that while the healing is better for the group, a condi mirage is generally awfull in group combat. Power dps will steamroll you, especially with no toughness at all. That hp will drop fast.

    It's not going to be bad with that much condition damage but honestly... If this is WvW, I could even see dual scepters being more effective instead of use the slowkitten staff and going for illusions instead of chaos - at least then you can leverage that torment, get torment on shatter and trait torch. But hey run what you want, test if it's effective. You'll be the one to know. I've seen some pretty off the wall builds thats effective.

    False oasis and the inspiration trait which gives heal on illusion spawned is pretty good sustain, and you have ways to kite and don't need to facetank.

    Staff is not a bad weapon, offers pretty good utilities, I noticed placing staff5 chaos storm under your feet at melee range is 10 times more effective than casting it under the enemy feet at 1200 range or whatever.

    This being said I think is probably a suboptimal build to a full trailblazer who can faketank every power spec pretty well.
    In zone with jumping puzzles, obstacles and LoS usage you can definetely regen quite a lot, but axe/torch is needed, staff ambushes alone are not enough to condi burst, and scepter/focus can't do much, you can't pull your enemy with focus but other than scepter3 you don't have a burst combo.

    Chaos is definetely swappable for illusions or dueling for clone spam, inspiration should be taken to deal with condis and for extra healing power.

    A full trailblazer with foods i think gets 1500-1600 condi damage, this is 1400, so the condi is pretty high and definetely works.

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @whoknocks.4935 said:

    @Dawdler.8521 said:

    @whoknocks.4935 said:
    Your build can definitely work in wvw, over 1400 condi damage.
    You should swap to axe/torch or scepter/torch

    I read the OP and was about to say torch as well... This build is really starved for damage and I dont see how it can match any decent power build with cleanse or hybrids. The problem with healing is that the mesmer really cant become effective at at it. I mean yeah it does add something, but in comparison that build with full gear is 3657 + 685 + 2403 when popping the mantra charge, with each charge being 1831 + 685 (2925 at 50%). With zero gear its 3340 + 558 + 1770 with each charge being 1673 + 558 (2672 at 50%). Fighting 1v1 against a good player, that extra healing is not going to help an iota.

    The main issue that follows is that while the healing is better for the group, a condi mirage is generally awfull in group combat. Power dps will steamroll you, especially with no toughness at all. That hp will drop fast.

    It's not going to be bad with that much condition damage but honestly... If this is WvW, I could even see dual scepters being more effective instead of use the slowkitten staff and going for illusions instead of chaos - at least then you can leverage that torment, get torment on shatter and trait torch. But hey run what you want, test if it's effective. You'll be the one to know. I've seen some pretty off the wall builds thats effective.

    False oasis and the inspiration trait which gives heal on illusion spawned is pretty good sustain, and you have ways to kite and don't need to facetank.

    Staff is not a bad weapon, offers pretty good utilities, I noticed placing staff5 chaos storm under your feet at melee range is 10 times more effective than casting it under the enemy feet at 1200 range or whatever.

    This being said I think is probably a suboptimal build to a full trailblazer who can faketank every power spec pretty well.
    In zone with jumping puzzles, obstacles and LoS usage you can definetely regen quite a lot, but axe/torch is needed, staff ambushes alone are not enough to condi burst, and scepter/focus can't do much, you can't pull your enemy with focus but other than scepter3 you don't have a burst combo.

    Chaos is definetely swappable for illusions or dueling for clone spam, inspiration should be taken to deal with condis and for extra healing power.

    A full trailblazer with foods i think gets 1500-1600 condi damage, this is 1400, so the condi is pretty high and definetely works.

    Well I dont disagree with anything. As I said, as is this build seems niched into outsustaining sluggish solo targets. Only the OP can decide whether that is enough.

  • fost.9167fost.9167 Member ✭✭
    edited January 29, 2019

    I tried to make plaguedoctor work, in the end i put it on an ele (one minstrel, one plaguedoc) for fun

    For mesmer I run a mix of shaman and apo gear and tormenting runes on sword/pistol scepter/torch. Its not perfect but its a fun build i think

    1330 condi and 1.1k healing and 25k health. I dont run inspiration but when you do sustain is nice.

  • I saw this build, or something really similar to it on EBG today. Pretty much doesn't do anything in team fights other than a bit of condi damage and spamming clones to scare the enemy with false numbers but it's almost impossible to kill with all the perma regen/swiftness/protection and tons of blinks. More or less similar to troll ranger builds. Only weakness like any other troll tank sustain builds is if you get too cocky and get bursted by ranger/deadeye pewpew. Against melee classes you're pretty much unkillable though. For roaming I imagine it's a lot more viable but still nothing amazing. If you don't wanna die often I would recommend running this though.

  • Crackmonster.2790Crackmonster.2790 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 29, 2019

    Morning,
    I've been reading your replies and so i've readjusted this build. I agree with what others are saying, i can't really kill anyone, maybe in a longer drawn out fight, and eventually in the longer run i will get bursted down if i try to go to kill stuff, but i will be near unkillable if i play my position right.

    So, instead, i've made this here to be a full on immortal supporter build. The purpose of this one now is both to have one build i can use for all content when i just don't want to die so i can for example run around slack farming things never bothering to fight stuff and that i can safely kill risky content that takes longer to kill where too likely to die on glass cannon, but mainly serves the purpose of supporting groups in WvW zergs. It is a build that can survive inside the WvW zerg forever while improving the group. Now, it is not a regular supporter as you know it through boons, but rather let me first show you the build and then i will explain. My main build is a max version damage build, so damage isn't something that bothers me if i want to go on a damage build i have my main build, but playing a glass cannon sometimes leaves you desiring an immortal build so this is my attempt at that.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAW7dn0nBlphtqBmqBMMjFijyf6v+u3MAClF6sCegOD-jFyHQB8a/Bwq8LfXBAAcQA8q6P06BAEWlgcV3TAgEgZamSmKTBz0MNTz0MNTtdy0MNTz0MNTz0MNTzUpAqSnG-w

    This is a support build in the sense that you can draw fire with it, it brings tons of reflect skills, gives limited boons/conditions, removes conditions from allies, and still has a slot for another support skill like veil, portal, null field or illusion of life for example, depending on situational requirement. Also heals group a tiny bit. The way i see it both feedback and Temporal Curtain has the power to break a fight in one spot to your advantage, or just turn the tide when used right.

    Let me reiterate, i wanted this build to be unkillable, this is why mirage(survival) over chrono(support), that is the main purpose. However, there is no point in playing unkillable if i can't at least do something, so that's why i started with the slow dps version thinking maybe i could roam with it, but with your replies i instead thought i would make it a build for zergs/supporting, and i can always swap in some dps support skills when soloing stuff.

    Now let's look at what this build can do to survive and to support, ignoring its fail dps. But it does actually have some dps given it's high uptime on dodge.

    Stuff to avoid taking damage:
    Distortion + traited for cooldown reset(double distortion)
    Every illusion shattered by Distortion leaves behind Mirage Mirror
    Roughly Permanent Protection
    Mirage dodges(+high uptime vigor + dodge food, endurance when swapping to scepter(oh kitten set weapon set))
    Block with short cooldown on Scepter
    4x skills with reflection (Blink, Feedback, Phantasmal Warden, Temportal Curtain)
    Lets just say huge reductions against conditions and tons of condition cleanse.

    Healing:
    Around up to 10500-12500 self healing per 12 sec through heal mantra
    Roughly Permanent Regen
    around 3k heal to a few allies per 12 sec + random regen for a few

    Other stuff:
    27k unbuffed life to sponge
    The linked version has Chaos field + null field(With staff + Jaunt that can actually lead to 4 uses of chaos armor of 5s when all cooldowns ready)
    Temporal Curtain has multitude of uses, i can have almost permanent swiftness with it, i can place it in fights to make a wall of reflection and cripple enemies/swiftness allies, and finally it can pull enemies to mess with them. This is why i wanted focus offhand over torch.
    Condition cleanses(up to 30* from heal mantra, up to 50* from null field)
    Few allies get aegis when i use distortion
    Every Shatter is a CC break
    When i evade i can send a lesser phantasmal defender to troll a few enemies
    Random buffs from various skills, ethereal fields for combos.

    *Not sure how rune of antitoxin works, if it has cooldown, applies to all skills, here i assume no cd applies to all skills).

  • Crackmonster.2790Crackmonster.2790 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 29, 2019

    Now, i noticed that healing power sucks balls. As a minor stat here it gives 14-15% more healing to mantra, much more to regen. That's not very big at all.
    So, i against my good will i started looking at other stat combinations and while there is only plaguedoctor that has both concentration and condition damage i kept looking and ended up at the classical Trailblazer as was suggested.

    So made a new build again...

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAW7dn0nBlphtqBmqBMMjFijyf6v+u/sCegOzMAClFC-jFyHQB57JAwr9Ho1FAIc6ein6PUUJYAV+BgDCQAgEgZamSmKTBz0MNTz0MNTtdy0MNTz0MNTz0MNTzUpAqS5G-w

    I calculated some of the things. Here i use Concentration food(which can be swapped at any time ofc for condition food when solo etc), using Trailblazer.

    Against power builds, it would take 28% more damage to burst me down from full if i never healed. I do 31%+dps. Healing effectiveness is slightly increased vs power builds in the sense that while i heal less each life point counts for more due armour. Didn't calculate i'd estimate some 10-20%. Probably can also counnt on minor heals/shields from group which is in favor of higher armour.

    The price for that, is losing some 20% boon duration, which primarily effects my ability to have good uptime on regen, protection and vigor, and ofc vs condition builds i will be a lot weaker but i already have great defenses against those i thought so maybe that will be okay, worst case i can trait into condition cleanse on shatter. But i think with the amount of chaos armor i have available that regen/protection will be fine, most heavily impacted will be vigor and then so be it. Most of the support from this build is not tied into condition duration anyway.

    GG on Trailblazer, healing power is just too bad scaling with heal mantra.

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Crackmonster.2790 said:
    Now, i noticed that healing power sucks balls.

    Everyone figure it out sooner or later, lol. It works for many other classes (guard, ele, ranger, rev and engie make healers) but for the mesmer its IMO really lackluster regardless of how you spec. I mean you can support, but not truly heal. In theory you can just pump mantra healing but that kind of gameplay requires constant cycling of all skills which I find terribly boring.

    That's pretty much your average condi mirage build, though built for zerging (you're still gonna be starved for damage without the torch and shatter torment with heal mantra/feedback/null field being dead weight in roamer combat).

  • Crackmonster.2790Crackmonster.2790 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 29, 2019

    I don't think torch is gonna make much of a difference to what i want to apply this for, it's little attractive and with that 30sec cooldown you better pray it lands or its just worthless. My normal build is vipers mirage but mirage/duelling/illusions with axe/torch, scepter/sword(or pistol in pvp) and thats the full shatter splatterer (only topped if i went chaos but that build is much worse in my opinion), and that's best shatter pressure build in my opinion, by far.

    For solo/roaming yea i can drop null field/feedback naturally, if i wanted to do that. Disagree about heal mantra i think i could make it work especially protecting it with Dodges/Shatters/Teleports/Distortion while casting. Definitely can reach more healing using that than false oasis, with false oasis it's just super limited how much healing you'll ever be able to put out. It has way too long cd it takes like 50 seconds to heal up using it. Rofl, it takes over a minute to heal 100% health with that skill on this build. Heal mantra can do that in around 30 sec or less and comes with manyfold more cleanses, like 5-6 times more.

    Sure, it's much less unique than what i had hoped for but ow well, still gotta be pretty kitten good to survive on in zergs so i can stay farming them and let others be my respawn corpse run bots! :D

  • Crackmonster.2790Crackmonster.2790 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 5, 2019

    So i've kept developing the build after testing it and finding it less than ideal. I found that against good players, they could heal up all i did to them and they could get me low constantly and i couldnt run so it was just a losing situation. Like no matter how good you heal, your hps will just also be lower than they could dps so if i couldn't even kill them i would just keep playing a losing game. So instead i have gone all in on movement speed so i can at least just run away if a fight doesn't please me, and a bit more damage in scepter/torch/shatter combos with illusion, . I think movement speed will also be a big help against my only real enemies, the melee who can stick to me. I had these kitten fights with people chasing me for areas upon areas... It's just no fun when you can't outrun them, can't kill them with your lousy dps.

    Now i have made a rune of speed version, using mixed about 2/3 plaguedoctor and 1/3 trailblazer. This build when using food reaches 50% boon duration and ive put as much trailblazer in there as i can fit within that limit. This gives 100% uptime on swiftness from sigil of inspiration, for that nice 66% movement speed constant increase(at least in combat). Good for running around wvw map with also.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhEQNAW7fnsnBlphFoBupBMMjlXDzv/FAPgoBgcyRwcFMcqJA-jlyHQBeVlGA8AAy3FBAsKto1RAIeqLEQlJtY/BKqEkr6eCAkAMTzUyUZKYmmpZammpZqtTmmpZammpZammpZamKFQVK3A-w

    Note for self.
    Ring -Difluorite, Nalar(Laurels)
    Accessory, Winterberry

    Plaguedoctor stats - Inscribed shards (225)

  • Erinah.6782Erinah.6782 Member
    edited February 2, 2019

    What I'm about to say is a little offtopic since it's not about either mirage or plague doctor, but you mentioned your goal is being unkillable....

    Have you considered a chronomancer with full Wanderer's (++Power, ++Vitality, +Toughness, +Concentration) paired with Superior Rune of the Defender? It heals you for 5% of your max hp when you block on a 1s internal cooldown.

    With this setup (and possibly vitality food) you can reach about ~30-32k hp, that's a ~1500 heal whenever you block and with mesmer you can get a lot of blocks.

    For example:
    -Traited scepter (~6s cooldown)
    -Sword offhand (~12s cooldown)
    -Shield 4 (~30s cooldown, and this would probably hit the rune's internal cooldown since it blocks all attacks)
    -Chaos storm and lesser chaos storm
    -Protected Phantasms and Persistence of Memory combo - phantasms spawn with aegis and transfer boons to you when they become clones (this theoretically has a potential of being insane aegis uptime with Chronophantasma, but I didn't test)
    -Mantra of Concentration on charge
    -Well of Precognition (ok, this one isn't serious B) )

    You can also achieve about 60% boon duration with it quite easy and Confusing Images would hit pretty decent numbers with all this power.

    I always wanted something like that with Condi, but sadly it doesn't look to be anywhere near possible at the moment.
    ++Vitality, ++Condition damage, +Toughness, +Concentration stats is the dream for me ( :'( pls Anet)

  • Crackmonster.2790Crackmonster.2790 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 11, 2019

    Hey, thanks for your inputs and about the power/block/defender version, well i just can't seem to make it come out how i like it. Plus i really dreamed of condition damage weapons.

    However, that said, i kept developing the mirage build, and i have arrived at a pretty good spot. I tried many many versions, and i liked a lot especially mirage/chaos/inspiration with staff - axe or scepter/focus. But again while i could survive pretty much everything i just couldn't really kill anyone really good or with a strong class, so it was ultimately kind of useless. And with staff, if they decided not to stand in the open and use los its not really any way to damage them.

    So yea now i've went for the medium after having tested both sides of the spectrum.

    I have ended up with gear mixed plaguedoctor/trailblazer, build uses Mirage/Chaos/Illusions with Staff + Axe/Torch. Using Runes of Speed + Signet of inspiration for the supreme mobility. I am still a bit conflicted about it, I had very good uptime on protection with traited staff + Mirage Mantle, but now instead i have opted to take a serious chunk of extra damage. And i still have protection a bit when i trigger regen, which only happens when i am getting whooped on, as well as randomly from 2-3 potential chaos armour durations. Also i should maybe swap in condition cleanse, i am not yet sure if i will find that too problematic or not, but that's always possible. Thinking right now inate high life + heals + few cleanses should serve against condi dmg, else ill probably swap in arcane Arcane Thievery(it's even traited!).

    All in all i am very satisfied, i found a good use for plaguedoctor, and i made a very tanky build that can use condition damage + runes of speed full uptime - with good burst also.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhEQNAW3fn0nBlphFoBGMDMMjlXDzcFMcqJoBgcyzxf/VAPgA-j1yCQBoUJYDPgABZ/B4q7hCPpAkdQAkrqOFUtA6qsCAXAhKqUJAQCwMNTJTlpy0MNTz0ZammpZammp2OZammpZammpZammpZqUAVpSD-w

    The build is for WvW mainly, should excel at roaming, but i can use it to faceroll whatever, and the item combination reaches good points for concentration to be fit for a various different types of builds: It's optimized so it can reach 50% boon duration with concentration infusions + sigil of concentration, but i skip the sigil as other sources can help you get complete uptime on swiftness even by myself. It also allows me good enough concentration to for some builds go condition damage oil thing instead, or toughness/condition damage infusions.

    The best thing about it is i can finally use the visual combination i wanted. I get to use both staff and axe. Muhaha, endgame initiated. It fights really well, and its tanky enough that i shouldn't be deleted from stealth at random.

  • Crackmonster.2790Crackmonster.2790 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 14, 2019

    Hmm, i thought i should give a little update.
    So, sadly i have got to quit computer for at least 2-3 months it's been taking over my life for too many years and it's kitten me up so i gotta get some things in order. That's why i really wanted to complete a good pvp build before i went. I got to play it for maybe half a day lol but it was great.

    I was mostly in zergs but outside of zergs like one of the first fights i ran into i killed 3v1 3 ppl and killed them and bit after i was farming like 3-4 people that came that came 1-2 at a time while i was eating their camps until they finally rolled me over with 4-5 at once haha. Point is, build is pretty kitten good. I wish someone would try it or something.

    Enjoy folks! - oh and still if you have criticism or improvements i'd love to hear.

    PS: if you run the around 40% concentration boon duration you will have full uptime on swiftness for runes of speed super easily for a long time by swapping in focus, popping temporal curtain and right away swapping back. Gives like 7min of uptime. Can also do it while waiting on some spot. You also get swiftness from various staff skill procs, so generally i just use the trick when entering new area or maybe in the rare case that i have fallen. If you just play though you will also get full uptime once you start proccing some of staff swiftness.

  • Crackmonster.2790Crackmonster.2790 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 28, 2019

    So with incoming axe nerfs i guess scepter varient seems to be better.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhEQNAW7fn0nBlphFoBWoBMMjlXDzv/NAPgmrghTNBNAkTOCA-j1yCQBI7gAgSlgVUpCAuACyVVHK8kCCy+DFUtA6qsCu6ea4BEIAQCwMNTJTlpy0MNTz0ZammpZammp2OZammpZammpZammpZqUAVpSD-w

    It's more tanky anyway, just harder to catch/stop people and has lower damage especially if not focused, definitely lower aoe. I guess also when ppl qqing they find it harder to move out of aoes, this movement build gains favor.

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