Firebeard.1746

I enjoy dungeons. I wouldn't be opposed to them adding some. I doubt we'd get the fully voice-acted ones from previously but I like the overall feel of most. The puzzle parts not so much. I think DRMs were an experiment on a new dungeon system. I really want them to merge the different systems into larger systems that work together, I just feel like it'd expand the breadth of the game, especially if they used dailies to cover the all the content, basically funneling you into a variety of things instead of just new stuff.

I'm not sure why your first point is relevant, it's just more spamming, it's a 1-time startup cost and you never have to pay it again, like gearing up for raids (you can't just step into those either, you need exotics with the appropriate stats). Yes and they do. I mean most people not trying at least auto attack. I actually do try, but I have been in teams of all auto-attackers, not sure if they're bots or trolls. In terms of raw materials, yes, but raiding requires collections, which makes them even more prohibitive. It's also astounding to me there's no raid locks in this game with those collections (I have to do the previous bosses AGAIN in order to finish my collection?!). I'd wager people would raid more often if those collections weren't an issue, because once you learn the fight, you're actually earning materials that much faster. But if you're attacking my painstakingly slow statement about WvW, in terms of raw hours, in order to reach those benchmarks, I think you need 20hrs/week of sPVP at 50% win rate and 40hrs/week of WvW if you're completely new. WvW gets better over time, but after you play ALOT, like you'd already have earned everything ALOT.

Nobody in the community asking has nothing to do with their reasoning, so yes, it was an intended PVE change: Sorry.

You get PVP leggie armor mats for losses from ranked if you consistently spam and doing ranked is just a matter of pressing a button. You're bending the truth acting like it's a big deal to do ranked on any level, it's just more toxicity really. there's no need for winning. Wings and neck are the only ones that actually require wins. EVEN SO, you can force people to play with you and occaisionally they'll carry because of the matchmaker. You can't do that for raids. WvW participation on a level that requires legendaries isn't that bad either, but can take some learning of the game mode. You'll get it eventually either way. The only issue WvW has is that it's painstakingly slow. Going further, if we're just focused on legendary reward, it's not just LI from raids, you need the collections too, otherwise the LI is worthless, so that means killing all the bosses (sometimes multiple times in the case of envoy IIRC). Twin largos has sub-second level reaction times to one of their dodge mechanics. There are probably people on this earth who do not have the ability to respond to that. I'm sure I could pull a mechanic here or there from the harder bosses that is actually restrictive. Coalescence is probably the more forgiving of the collections, but as it requires the final boss kill, if you're doing the instances on your own progress, you still need to kill everything. While we're talking about the collections, I also want to say it's SUPER annoying that they can require things in a particular order (coalescence) and usually you have to do some special thing to get credit for the kill. I've downed Matt TWICE, which people have claimed is a harder boss, but don't have the vial because I didn't stand in the fountain and do the thing. So no, it's not equivalent, you still can get some leggies from these other game modes more casually, and you can force people to play with you and sometimes they'll carry you. That's nothing like raiding. I think you make valid points on raw profit, but raw profit isn't the only thing people will be going for.

I think the devs also figured many condi PVE classes would benefit from the inversion. I believe competitive was the goal, but they also saw and opportunity and used a bandaid they thought would nerf necro pretty hard but also fix another issue. 100% on the scapegoating each other thing though.

I'm 100% sure this is going to be the new trolling for people with not enough energy to actually respond, but still want to downvote you in some way.

So what I think needs to happen is that they form the bridge between KP and actually doing the real thing, kind of like T1 fractals to t4, making training runs unnecessary. If a new player jumps in the game and doesn't happen to find the communities, all they'll see in NA is a bunch of people asking for KP and them being sold, that's unacceptable. I think people insisting there's no legendary payoff are not helpful because there's already content that doesn't even require 10 players that will reward them. I don't think they should be a single player experience. Though after discussions with trolls in my thread that was supposed to originally be about this, I think there also needs to be more active systems encouraging grouping between experienced and inexperienced players. Because GW2 content tends to be static, people tend to not want to be responsible for teaching it to other people. This becomes problematic when those other people are trying to build groups but can't find them when they can play that content. It basically creates cliques new people will smash into if they don't find that bright happy discord somewhere, and even then, I don't think Anet should build games reliant on the health of discord communities. It's fine if people use them as a resource, but the game should stand on its own.

To clearly illustrate what I meant: if you aren't doing swords and shields in CA, mechanically, there's far less for you to do than in WoJ, but when you say : When I had just previously stated: It sounds like you're talking ALL RAIDS, not just the particular ones with specialized roles I'm talking about, so it feels like you're trying to bait/trick me into saying all raids are easier, when I never did, or skew what I'm saying to apply to all raids. I'm just merely pointing out that there is more coordination involved in some SM encounters outside those specialized roles (when you asked me to give examples on how you can create more cooperation). There is far less to explain on CA without swords and shields than WoJ. And the swords and shields really don't mean much to the 6 other players. and yes, there is more cooperation in WoJ between these 2 fights, because the 6 other people can't clothesline others, but this can happen in WoJ, so there are more opportunities to screw up in WoJ In fact between the two fights, you could argue there's more carrying happening on the part of the specialized roles in CA. And if they weren't supposed to be specialized, then why do the shield/sword buffs stack? I feel that's a pretty strong indicator the devs 100% intended these specialized roles. This is me clearly illustrating you twisting my words between 2 posts, not 4. I tend to focus between just the more recent ones, and bring in context later when it's totally lost, AND IN THIS CASE THERE IS DEFINITELY TWISTING WITH YOU LEAVING OUT THE NUANCE I ADDED. The only thing I can give you is I haven't been super good at framing what exactly harder 10-man content means to me in the context of raids. But I've given examples later in the discussion, after all those posts you're quoting to make it more clear, so you still are ignoring. I made it sound like I want to solo carry, but if I go back to this particular example to explain further, what I mean is players who KNOW THEIR CLASS on a high level can have a huge impact. There are in-game mechanics some classes can apply to make the chains not do as much damage. Can they still kill? Yes. Are the players in my groups still required to do more than if they aren't swords/shields in CA? yes. Do people exploit class in raids? Yes. But said specialized roles like swords shields get in the way of people doing stuff like this (i.e. there's no class mechanics around swords/shields). It's satisfying to use your knowledge of your class to have a large impact. That's something I like to do and didn't clearly communicate. Can I solo kill WoJ? No. Do I still need the 10 other people? Yes. So it gives me a valid reason to work with them and explain mechanics. PS when are you going to explain how strikes should be less valuable than sPVP and why people still do t4s even though they can earn all fractal specific rewards (particularly gear/fractal buffs) with just t1s? but still, just contempt on your end.

No, and there's a large section of this thread where I didn't even post, I've only been more active in it the last few days for a while now. If you'd actually read the conversation, you'd know this is false and that I have no intention of static atm.

You're twisting my words. I said the dedicated roles, not all raid mechanics. You just hate me.

Mechanics like WoJ and boneskinner that are punishing enough people need to know them and explain them. There's more mechanic pressure in both those fights than some raids if you're not doing a specialized role.

The dedicated roles aren't testing ability to cooperate with others, they're testing your patience with others . Other games keep roles consistent in and outside of raids. These roles are a major failing of the system. WoJ you have to explain mechanics to people, and I do often. There is still cooperation involved, it's just not putting the end result entirely on 3 different people in addition to the slew of roles already in the game.

And yet you still keep dancing around my T4s vs T1s example, just like you still keep dancing around why strikes aren't rewarding me as well as sPVP. Obviously not everyone is stuck in T1 easy mode for integrated fractal matrices. You're still stuck on proof, I want proof out of the equation for people who don't want to engage with that system. I guess you're concerned about my easy mode not giving you a good tell for KP. So you can't weed people doing easy mode out. So we're back to square 1. I'm fine with them stripping those decoration tokens out and you can use those instead of LI.

Except I believe that putting groups together and showing them they succeed will encourage them to do the extra raid as it will only be a few minutes extra after they do the strike encounter with the right tells.. This is a core piece of my argument you keep glossing over. It's like how T1s are the bridge into T4s and it works in fractals. You get the same rewards, but in different quantities. T1s don't stop people from doing T4s because T4s give more.

It's clear you use KP and I don't so I'm not sure you can keep asserting this. You're missing the barrier to entry. The LI is the carrot on the stick. If you succeed your training run, you'd do an extra raid for the extra LI if you haven't that week, or help someone in group who hasn't. You need KP to get the LI in your circumstance. Basically this all comes down to KP. If you believe the KP system is fine, then it is, to you. The numbers on participation will tell the devs as this is the status quo. I gave a natural way for people to party up without having to lock each other out and still get something out of it. I don't believe KP keeps people engaged enough. Yes because you clearly can't see that I don't think KP is healthy yet you think it is. I think I can summarize your argument as L2KP noob. Anet would know the effectiveness of that approach and there's really no argument to be had. ANd I don't have to answer to you. I don't agree with anything you're saying, but for my sanity I don't have to reply to everything you say. Because I'm not an infinite resource.

Yes, even if they can't do as much as others, they can still do SOMETHING. And at this point, we're not even talking about the topic.

I'm not attacking you in any way (or asking you to change your habits, or even accept me in a run, because I'm not asking for that), I just find it weird that someone who uses KP to PuG is criticizing me for wanting a static of similarly skilled players in order to actually raid, because obviously they don't want to group with me, but they expect me to pug like them. That's how this whole conversation started. And the devs would have the best stats on who is doing what and how often people are training. I'm sure there's stats for boss boss kill counts. and how often dissimilarly skilled players are grouping.

Not being allowed wasn't the premise. Hypocrisy was. Adding nuance to that, yes they're being hypocritical. And I'm glad I work for a company that is invested in its community.

My experience is that these are disjoint groups of people in general.

You know what, I never have. Not on these forums or in-game. . Though companies DO build relationships with schools and recruit from them, so if the Pugs aren't doing the same things, then they're not like companies. Companies don't just expect the degrees in a vacuum, they generally work with boards, certification, etc. Google provides trainings on online sites. PuGs requiring KP in a vacuum aren't. The only condition under which they're equivalent is if the members of the PuG are providing training, just like companies provide it through their relationships with schools providing direction, as well as more direct ways of training. I don't believe PuGs are providing adequate training if they must still ask for KP in content this old.

Why would smoothness matter if one needs nothing from the raid's kill? And the dissimilarity is that people play games to have fun and being judged based on value in a "fun" environment isn't very good for the purpose of a game: enjoyment. Whereas the purpose of work isn't enjoyment necessarily (some people enjoy it, but most people are just surviving). So there's your dissimilarity proof, happy now? The devs should not be happy with such a system. So if I'm a sperm donor and father 10000 kids I can eat one? I'm not serious, but I'm just pointing out that there's a way to hit this edge case, but it's still socially unacceptable. I have and the ability to prove or disprove an argument is all based on which facts defined as true and untrue, and as this is based off of personal reality and we're not the same, it's very likely neither of our arguments will hold with the other. This is why you can never win an argument in the internet.

No it's still totally a valid concern, because barrier to entry is a thing. If you have to do 300 training runs and have 75 successsful ones and you'd want to get to the point of raiding regularly a year with that KP, then that's easily out of reach for many people who can't have a dedicated 600+ hours of raiding in a year. I afk a lot in this game so on paper it looks like I have a lot of /played time, but I don't have that much dedicated, uninterruptible time.

It could be that's their main source of gold, in which case it's still along the same line as legendaries : rewards. It's kind of bizarre that they wouldn't spend more time helping people if that's not the case. If you're speed running, then you'd want to be in the same group so you could coordinate better. Or maybe they just want a lot of LI to strut their stuff, still goes back to rewards, which isn't much better than legendaries. If all they want to do is raid, then the KP wouldn't matter because the intent of the KP is to try to guarantee a reward. ANd this has to do with companies and degrees how? I mean I feel like you need to prove the similarity, otherwise my crab example holds, you can literally make up anything. And using your analogy, I'd say PuGs aren't companies. Statics are the companies of raiding. Wait are you seriously saying my mom could have eaten one of use because she had 6 kids? I mean where's the cut off? XD Also what countries have that written into law? XD But in any case, you're saying that hunger in a crab and human aren't supposed to be solved in the same way, yes? So shouldn't that mean that grouping for $$ IRL vs grouping in game should work different? This conversation has taken a really bizarre turn. Am I talking to Krampus?

I'm not really sure what you're driving at here. I guess you could be saying some people who are really driven get into it faster? Mean is such a tricky number because it doesn't tell you anything -> there could be 5 people no lifing it and it hyper-inflates reality. You have no idea how many failed training runs those few people went through and if that's sane for everyone, especially given the hostage sitation bit we've mutually uncovered. And as far as KP goes, 3 is nothing. Like that gets you no where. That means you have a friend who takes you every once in a blue moon, maybe.

This is exactly what I was explaining and have explained multiple times as an issue with raids and their design, most raid encounters in other games don't have mechanics that have dedicated players, besides tank/healing (and those don't change much between encounters). That's actually why this game struggles so much in raid participation. There's not alot of room for even a good player to compensate. So raids aren't necessarily "harder" it's just less "hostage situation". Some raids are difficult, but there's others that are pretty easy too in comparison to strikes if all the pressure isn't on you. Cairn, Mursaat overseer, VG to name a few. And note the dedicated player roles (tank, healer) have many places to learn those roles in other games.