A big "Thank you" to the balancing team for the latest patches (at least for PvE)

[MathiasXII.7240]

Please note : There are PLENTY of topics on these forums that have been open to criticize each and every balance patch for each and every class. If you need to express your anger about something, just a heads up, this is probably not the best topic to do so.

 

Please note 2 : This is coming from a mainly PvE player. I seldomly play WvW or PvP so I don't know at what point this topic has any value to those who exclusively play these game modes. 

 

When I read balance patches, I have to think it probably isn't easy for the team to read all the messages following the patch. Instead of focusing on the "Oh nice, I like this change", it often starts with a waterfall of complaints about things that has not been considered or anger against changes. When I scroll through these comments, I find myself having a very unpopular opinion about this.

 

I think the balances patch got out of hand in the latest years of GW2, but the latest changes has been fun! Of course, I do not agree with all changes that has been made, but I do notice a huge improvement in build diversity. I do try out and keep using traits I haven't used for years. I use weapon attacks that have been long forgotten in the past. 

 

For my case, I found interesting the idea of the chrono wells giving alacrity at the beginning of the well and healing at the end. I'm also pretty excited in the upcoming change for berserker that it's toughness will not take a hit while in berserk mode. I'm pretty excited about the Mesmer having it's distortion skill available in all specs. The core specs still needs a little love IMO, but we're slowly getting there!

 

Before April, I dreaded any balance patches and joined the criticizing of others since it seems to me like it was mindless nerfs that completely destroyed some of my builds without giving me anything to counterbalance the loss of DPS/Boons/Condi/etc. Let's face it, the first balance patch was a disaster as well but for many reasons we won't cover here, but let's say expansion launch + balance patch wasn't the best idea. However, the whole process and result has improved immensely! Now I see it as a fun opportunity to try it out and decide how it makes my build better or worse, and how to adjust. I had to adjust since April, but I honestly did not feel I had the need to craft a new set of equipment because "Well now this <type of build1> is kitten, I'll have to gear toward stats for <type of build 2>". 

 

So I just wanted to say a very sincere thank you to the balancing team for your work in the recent patches. I am very pleased with the changes even if I had to do some mourning here and there about awesome skill/traits/runes in the past. 

 

So, did any of you also saw a positive change in balance patches? And then anything that still needs improvement? What would you like to say?

Edited September 29, 2022 by MathiasXII.7240

[Serephen.3420]

There have been some good changes, overall feeling more positive about things, but still a way to go. I especially would like to see elementalist balanced more in line with other proffessions, make the reward worth the risk. Because that is an area it still has been left behind largely for a pong while now. 

 

Catalyst as much as I enjoyed it, does need some work done on it. Not just with hammer skills but the jade sphere and how it works, rethinking the energy bar, is it really needed, is it fun? Is it just unnecessary clutter?  Among other things.

 

Tempest, alacrity access needs to be reconsidered, waiting for the overload to be ready and then casting the overload takes considerably more time and punished far more than any other alac spec when interrupted. Mech and renegade or example have an instant cast skill which provides alac and mech additionally applies it through barrier application which can be gained simply through mace auto attack. 

 

Weaver has no viable power dps option anymore and it does need a bit more oomph. But honestly I think they need to bring sword up to par again. 

 

Don't have time to go into more detail but these are my thoughts at least.

[Mell.4873]

I feel like post HoT the design philosophy around balance was to nerf what was either was over preforming and over played. The worst of this was with the one dodge Mirage which honestly to their credit did fix the problem but it alienated their whole player base.

Then 1-2 years before EoD they switched to a hands-off approach which probably made most people very happy but it was by the far the most toxic time for Gw2.

Most parties demanded those Trinity picks Firebrand Healers, Renegade Alacrity, Condition Scourge and there was not much choice outside these Elites. 

Now for the first time ever we are starting to other Classes being able to fill these roles. First with Engineer next with Ranger and potentially Warrior too. 

Edited September 30, 2022 by Mell.4873

[the krytan assassin.9235]

I'd say the biggest improvement to the balance changes is that they are starting to make sense. Most of the balancing is now actually done by the devs to improve the gameplay instead of dev profession favouritism  or completely senseless random changes. Doesn't mean you have to agree with it, but for most updates atleast i understand why they did it. 

 

There is still plenty of room for improvement: the volume of balance changes is still way to low, some professions are still pretty much left untouched, the devs are still lacking in communication, the profession & all gamemodes as a whole is often still not taken into account when balancing, bugged traits/skills that do not get fixed. 

[otto.5684]

I do not agree with the sentiment. Sure, there have been good PvE improvements over the last few patches. However, many of these issues existed for years. For how long was SB or Herald terrible in pve? How many weapons needed buffs for years? Should I be happy that Anet balance devs finally graced us with fixing these issues?

 

How about Spvp. A kittening train wreak since Feb 2020. Major poorly thought changes from someone who had surface level understanding of balance. Followed (or not really) by very limited updates to resolve the issues. Just look at the spvp population. Even with an expansion, the population is less than half it was 3 years ago. By any measure, in spvp balance has been a complete failure.

 

Again, I am happy with the changes in pve. And if Anet balance devs continue on this path, pve could be in a great place after few patches. As for spvp balance team, it needs to be scraped.

[Jski.6180]

Good to know anet still thinking about only pve in wvw / spvp balancing updates!

[Mell.4873]

There is still so much bitterness around how they have previously balanced the game. The whole thing with devs playing favourite or hating a particular class is really just conjecture. 

Again they tried to balance the game very directly then they tried to not balance the game at all. This has been the problem the whole time. 

This is essentially the life cycle of an MMO. I think the transparency and feedback are the key for this to work. I'm sure the Mirage one-dodge nerf would not have gone through (with maybe a different nerf instead) if they told us upfront that something needed to be done so expect some nerf. 

The Scrapper nerf reversal is the perfect example, they told us this needs a nerf and we said it was the a unique feature that if removed would be bad. Then they just nerf some of the problematic skills. 

Edited September 30, 2022 by Mell.4873

[wasss.1208]

I like to give credit, where credit is due:

Their new way of representing the changes, during a livestream is fun, and informative. CMC and Roy having a back and forth makes it really enjoyable. They tell the "why and how" behind everything, we get a glimplse of the tought process behind the changes, and they briefly mention upcoming changes and plans, for the future.

They release the changes ahead of time, and do listen to some of the feedback, and they are willing to reconsider bigger changes. If they keep doing this in the long run, we can avoid an another "banner fiasko" in the future.

But the big thing is: the quality of the balance patches improved a lot. In the past, most of the changes felt like "changes, for the sake of change". Now (especially since they add notes to the patches, and explain it with a livestream) the patches feel like they are working towards fixing a specific issue. Be it something being unviable for years now (Core Engineer), overloaded (Bladesworn, Catalyst), in need of a major rework (Berserker, Druid), or was smiters booned. (300 sec traits)

Overall, I'm very satisfied with the last two balance patches, and can't wait for the next review event, for the next patch. Hope they keep the communication, and the quality up. 👍

[mungozen.2379]

On 9/29/2022 at 5:56 AM, MathiasXII.7240 said:

So I just wanted to say a very sincere thank you to the balancing team for your work in the recent patches. I am very pleased with the changes even if I had to do some mourning here and there about awesome skill/traits/runes in the past. 

 

So, did any of you also saw a positive change in balance patches? And then anything that still needs improvement? What would you like to say?

The past 2 years have been a struggle for profession balancing and part of that is due to how Anet has managed the game development and balance.  Is it good that they have revamped the Profession teams and are working with (another) new philosophy?  Absolutely.  Have they done anything of real worth yet?  There are a lot of no's in that answer, but a few yes' as well.

 

I get players might be excited about some changes that affect the profession they enjoy playing.  Yet, even after tomorrow's patch there will still be professions that are not strong even in 'play what you want' OW PvE while others will be dominant not only in OW but in Meta instance groups as well.

I also like Mesmer Chrono and would like for a viable and sensible build to present itself, but at this time, it's a giant pain to play.  Meanwhile I can hop on multiple other professions and have an easier time being more successful and providing more value to the group I am in.  The things that make Chrono weak and other professions strong isn't changing in tomorrow's patch either.

Of course I could be wrong but since we only received the patch notes preview, and not the typical 'Friday before update' patch notes, we have no idea if they are just going to slap Distortion into Chrono and Virtuoso, or if they are going to take the time to update the multiple affected Traits that could/should interact with it and how other skills may be tweaked.

While I would like to agree with you, I still think we are several balance patches away from Anet realizing a proper balance between Power/Condi DPS builds and Support/Heal builds.  At this point all we have is talk about what they want to do since the change in leadership for the team.  Seeing the road map today I am going to reserve further judgement until after the Nov 29th update, as that will be the second update with the new team lead and philosophies.