Started this game w/ a group of 15 friends. None of us play anymore. Here's why...

[Torolan.5816]

@Miroe.2054 said:

@"Astralporing.1957" said:That's not true. It's relevant to people outside those subgroups as well. And i have already explained why. Also, while it may be

a long shot from the "data-driven, rotation-locked, mmorpg experience"

, but it's still much closer to it than it was before. For many, it may be

too

close.

You have argued that there was a shift in player mentality. But a competitive mentality has already existed within PvP. And you can still choose the players you are playing with. You don't have to put up with any elitist behaviour if you aren't reliant on PuGs.

The second thing you have argued is that there is developer support for those parts of the game, which means that raids are replacing or delaying other priorities. It takes some kind of entitlement to demand a dev team can never do something different to keep its game fresh just so all ressources are flowing into the things oneself cares about. But I understand the thought process.

Is there anything specific I have missed?

Maybe you could also see it in another way. Competitive mentality has indeed always existed in PvP. Competitive pvp players are the group of people I couldn´t then and can´t sympathize much with today, notable exceptions exist of course. I find continuous complains, know it alls, bad losers, meta bandwaggoners and bad winners tiresome and unpleasant to deal with on a regular basis, so I only do pvp sometimes in seasons.

If I now assume that Anet targeted these types of people as income sources and did not cater with the same fervor to the kind of people I find more pleasant, my personal pool of players I want to associate with has shrunk. So it will affect me. Not in a manner that dictates the continuation of me playing GW2, but in a manner that I will play less in general and for different reasons.

[Ardenwolfe.8590]

Yes, the game is not the same as it was when it first started. But here's the kicker part: No game ever is. Patches, expansions, and updates are part of the MMO world. Are those changes killing ANet's bottom line? So far? The answer is a solid no given recent reports.

While I completely agree that what attracted me originally to the game is gone, it hasn't stop me from playing and enjoying the game overall. And when that happens, I'll move on too. No posting about. No rants. No rage. I got my money's worth of entertainment. I don't expect any game, much less an MMO, to keep me enthralled forever.

That's also the reality of any MMO.

[Lonewolf Kai.3682]

@Jarvis.9540 said:DPS meters, raid-mentality, and meta-obsession were all things that were against the original design philosophy of this game. As soon as ANET caved and started giving into that crowd, they immediately lost sight of their own vision for the game. This is the reason my friends and I no longer play it. If we wanted a data-driven, rotation-locked, mmorpg experience, there are plenty of other games to choose from.

Can I have your stuff?

I haven’t set foot in a single raid myself.

[Astralporing.1957]

@Miroe.2054 said:

@"Astralporing.1957" said:That's not true. It's relevant to people outside those subgroups as well. And i have already explained why. Also, while it may be

a long shot from the "data-driven, rotation-locked, mmorpg experience"

, but it's still much closer to it than it was before. For many, it may be

too

close.

You have argued that there was a shift in player mentality. But a competitive mentality has already existed within PvP.It was not a problem there (hard to pvp without that mentality) - and it was

limited

to that mode. Raid mentality is not limited to Raids only. It spills to the whole PvE.

And you can still choose the players you are playing with. You don't have to put up with any elitist behaviour if you aren't reliant on PuGs.If only. As i said, it's a shift in game direction. I can't exactly choose

devs

i'd want to work on this game, right?

The second thing you have argued is that there is developer support for those parts of the game, which means that raids are replacing or delaying other priorities.No. I mean that the ways in which devs act and speak suggest they agree that the raid content is

the

endgame. The only one that counts. They do not act as if raids were a completely separate mode only for those that like it. They act as if raids were a natural endgame for

all

pve players. Compare that behaviour with dev support for WvW, for example, and with how that gamemode is being seen.That dev attitude obviously influences player behaviour. It also influences game design.

It takes some kind of entitlement to demand a dev team can never do something different to keep its game fresh just so all ressources are flowing into the things oneself cares about.I don't do that. Notice how i don't speak that way about WvW, even though i don't generally play that mode (outside of some casual reward track farming). That's because WvW is truly treated as something separate and i can really treat it as not exiting. I do object when those "different" things start to impact the other content.

Is there anything specific I have missed?

Not really. You didn't "miss" anything, you simply attributed to me things i didn't say and then continued to argue with yourself.

[Kal Spiro.9745]

I don't understand the problem. You have a small guild worth of people. You can play the game however you like. There is zero reason you should ever need to succumb to the "mentality" you're describing. If you don't like raids, don't do them. If you don't like DPS Meters, don't use them. You don't have to worry about being forced to because you have enough people to work exclusively with your own and ensure it never comes up. Don't like Meta, don't use it. Again, you can fully control your experience, there were plenty of you for that purpose.