mesmer is weak but unfun to play against and that's how it was designed

[emblack.3754]

@BlackBeard.2873 said:Finally someone who gets it! Mesmers are not to supposed to be fun for their opponents, only for the player using.

Well ain't you a rain of sunshine... So basically I paid good money so someone like yourself than can play only one class, the easiest one, to have fun on my financial and emotional expense.Sorry to necro this comment but it`s just priceless!

[apharma.3741]

@emblack.3754 said:

@BlackBeard.2873 said:Finally someone who gets it! Mesmers are not to supposed to be fun for their opponents, only for the player using.

Well ain't you a rain of sunshine... So basically I paid good money so someone like yourself than can play only one class, the easiest one, to have fun on my financial and emotional expense.Sorry to necro this comment but it`s just priceless!

OK you may need to take your sarcasm meter back to the shop, it's clearly faulty.

He's an ele player and was easily top 200 back when we had truly amazing players going try hard on the leaderboard. If you think people at the top of the leaderboard now are skilled you should have seen it back in season 5 and the calibre of players back when pro league made them care about being good.

[emblack.3754]

@apharma.3741 said:

@emblack.3754 said:

@"BlackBeard.2873" said:Finally someone who gets it! Mesmers are not to supposed to be fun for their opponents, only for the player using.

Well ain't you a rain of sunshine... So basically I paid good money so someone like yourself than can play only one class, the easiest one, to have fun on my financial and emotional expense.Sorry to necro this comment but it`s just priceless!

OK you may need to take your sarcasm meter back to the shop, it's clearly faulty.

He's an ele player and was easily top 200 back when we had truly amazing players going try hard on the leaderboard. If you think people at the top of the leaderboard now are skilled you should have seen it back in season 5 and the calibre of players back when pro league made them care about being good.

So good players can't surf the meta, or what? Ele was the tip of the spear way back when, you're not making his case. Besides, let him explain what he meant by defending the class that most people hate, and for good reason. Or maybe I've misread something...If I were the powers that be I would make a balance worthy of the name just to see how pvp would fare. I certainly wouldn't lay all my chips on a few "hip" professions that ironically "good" players go back and forth on.

[BlackBeard.2873]

@emblack.3754 said:

@apharma.3741 said:OK you may need to take your sarcasm meter back to the shop, it's clearly faulty.

Or maybe I've misread something...

This!! I think it might be this!!! Maybe it would be more clear if I had suggested mes get 12 clones instead of just 9?

[apharma.3741]

@emblack.3754 said:

@apharma.3741 said:

@emblack.3754 said:

@"BlackBeard.2873" said:Finally someone who gets it! Mesmers are not to supposed to be fun for their opponents, only for the player using.

Well ain't you a rain of sunshine... So basically I paid good money so someone like yourself than can play only one class, the easiest one, to have fun on my financial and emotional expense.Sorry to necro this comment but it`s just priceless!

OK you may need to take your sarcasm meter back to the shop, it's clearly faulty.

He's an ele player and was easily top 200 back when we had truly amazing players going try hard on the leaderboard. If you think people at the top of the leaderboard now are skilled you should have seen it back in season 5 and the calibre of players back when pro league made them care about being good.

So good players can't surf the meta, or what? Ele was the tip of the spear way back when, you're not making his case. Besides, let him explain what he meant by defending the class that most people hate, and for good reason. Or maybe I've misread something...If I were the powers that be I would make a balance worthy of the name just to see how pvp would fare. I certainly wouldn't lay all my chips on a few "hip" professions that ironically "good" players go back and forth on.

He doesn't really go back and forth on ele as far as I know, he plays ele and ele pretty much only. If you look at a lot of the really good players they might play different classes to get a feel but they're only exceptional at 1 or 2.

Also yes, considering how obvious what you missed was I think you should retract any notion of being on a balance team.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

@Jeknar.6184 said:

@XECOR.2814 said:Mesmer mains cry mesmer mains cry.

I main mesmer and I wish Mirage never existed.

You aren't the only one I am absolutely positive, but yet here we are, with mesmer players reasoning that PVP shouldn't be fun for the people not playing mesmer and seeing nothing wrong with their rationale.

[apharma.3741]

@Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

@Jeknar.6184 said:

@"XECOR.2814" said:Mesmer mains cry mesmer mains cry.

I main mesmer and I wish Mirage never existed.

You aren't the only one I am absolutely positive, but yet here we are, with mesmer players reasoning that PVP shouldn't be fun for the people not playing mesmer and seeing nothing wrong with their rationale.

I think the real problem as I alluded to in my first post is that fun is subjective. There's a lot of things that are fun to use but not fun to be on the receiving end of like holo CC chains, infinite sustain FBs who your class literally can't kill 1 on 1, scourge pressing 1 button and putting 4 unique conditions on you. Yet the last 2 are "balanced" within the meta yet objectively overpowered and not fun to fight.

Which brings us to do you balance around fun to fight or representation and actual issues?

If you believe the people that don't like fighting mirages then mirage would be a hilariously terrible spec where you have a dodge that's exactly like a normal dodge but you'd have the option to fire off an ambush skill at some point. No casting of other skills and you'd likely not move any distance either.

If you believe the mirage is fun to play and couldn't hurt a fly crowd you'd end up with scourge 2.0, bigger, badder and even more unfun to fight than scourge was on PoF release. Remember, scourge was so busted that it's repressed nearly a whole PvP community that have somehow forgotten that 5 scourge comps were a thing and were really face rolling anything that wasn't an equal number of scourges.

There's room for improvement on both sides but I for one am sick of the most competitive build being a condition build for the last 2 years or so and that the power build keeps slipping further and further behind other classes.

[Aza.2105]

@"incisorr.9502" said:"break target " = unfun for the victim/enemystealth = unfun for the victim/enemyblinking away or behind you or on elevations and terrain with a skill(class based) and not walking up to it (control/person based) = unfun for the victim/enemy

blind = unfun for the victim/enemy

confusion = unfun for the victim/enemy , especially if they have high apm and skill chaining and want to press a lot of buttons and play on high speedhitting a target that doesn't take damage cause of distortion or just standing still and having projectiles and swords pass through it = unfun for the victim/enemy -triggering to watch even, it's almost as if they're laughing at you

it's literally a trickster/trigger mage which by concept is annoying and invokes hate but in terms of actual power in the current meta condi mirage is really good at punishing greedy builds (with no condi removal, like holomancers with 16k hp) or bad players who don't know what to expect but vs evenly matched or counter classes at high elo it's meh w/e

the only way people won't hate mesmer is if it doesn't exist

GW2 combat in general is unfun for people. A lot of the problems with memsers is just a byproduct of how poorly system mechanics were designed for pvp.

• Aoe every where
• AI clutter
• Stealth

GW2 takes many ok ideas and dials them up 100x. GW1 had AI, but no one really considered it obnoxious. There was aoe but it wasn't abundant. And stealth didn't exist. Stealth on isn't op on its own but it is when a character can potentially 100 - 0 you within a second or so. At this point in time, I do not expect GW2 to improve on anything though. I'd say the game reached its peak (pvp wise) maybe in 2013 -2015 ish.

[FaboBabo.3581]

How many people of u have fun by getting one shotted from any profession?

There is no fun in war but hypocrisy

[buzzle.9347]

the title of this thread can also apply to weaver.. nobody likes to play against that snoozefest

[Farkon.2170]

Mirage and Chrono are awesome concepts, but are poorly executed since it just feels like mesmer with a few abilities tacked on.

GW2's Chrono also make no sense lorewise since a Chronomancer's concept of clones(rather, fuguing in Chronomancery basics 101) is from spliting the timeline and bringing in alternative versions or versions of yourself from the past and/or future. But GW2's Chronomancer, it's a concept of an Echo, however an Echo has a predetermined set of actions based on previous actions that can be applied in various, sometimes destructive ways. Yet the only real instance of a Chronomancer's clone is the GW2's Continuum Split ability, which isn't even a true fugue, but an echo applied in a invalid way, it's just a recall point to a past version of yourself that preserves your cooldowns and state of health yet keeping boons and whatnot, and therefor not calling in actual versions of yourself or spliting the timeline since you're still in the same timeline.

Mirage isn't executed well either since a vast amount of abilities require targeting, and the constant target breaking abilities combined with making CC virtually worthless due to their innate evade makes it massively frustrating to play against and feels cheap when you play as one. Not to mention the level of burst they have, even too classes with condition cleanse or those that follow the rules of conditions and minimize damage.