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Why is reaching legendary so hard? Why the rating goes to 2100 when nobody ever got to 1900/2000?


Panda.3620

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Last season only 3 players got to legendary and the 3 only got to legendary because of 1 match on NA.

Their respective ratings:181418121809

If the rating last season to reach legendary was 1750, only 8 players would be legendary.

I don't know about EU, I don't play there.Discuss.

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Not enough players playing/ trying properly to climb the leaderboard, so ratings generally have a cap.Say if you reached 1900, then one loss to the rest of the population at circa 1750/1800 would be a loss of around 30-40 each time. You get dragged towards the mean rating.

If more people cared about having a high rating, then it would be easier for all to climb together.

As it is, there is no incentive to try. So all are lower.

PS. this is a call for something to increase the pvp population e.g. game modes/ rewards, not a call to lower the cap for legendary rating.

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@Meteor.3720 said:Not enough players playing/ trying properly to climb the leaderboard, so ratings generally have a cap.Say if you reached 1900, then one loss to the rest of the population at circa 1750/1800 would be a loss of around 30-40 each time. You get dragged towards the mean rating.

If more people cared about having a high rating, then it would be easier for all to climb together.

As it is, there is no incentive to try. So all are lower.

PS. this is a call for something to increase the pvp population e.g. game modes/ rewards, not a call to lower the cap for legendary rating.

Good point, when I queue off hours it takes alot of time to find a match and when I queue on normal hours mostly of the time I get the same players. Not many people playing this season.

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It’s the population as @Meteor.3720 nicely explained. And for the population to increase here are a few things that can help:

  1. The on demand torunaments so people feel they have a place to competitive 5v5 all the time (ranked staying solo/duo is important aswell).

  2. New gamemodes, for unranked only, and let people have fun with em in costums aswell. Keeping the competitive stuff as conquest only with special ATs for alternative modes.

  3. Most importantly, we can’t have things like scourge and mesmer being as broken for so long. We need good balance and for the good classes to not be an extreme pain to play against (scourge, mesmer, even the p/p conplaints have some merit in this regard).This is SO IMPORTANT. The reason is, that once the game is genuinely fun to play and doesn’t have these frustrating factors, people can actually go talk to their friends and say something like “Dude I’m playing this game its called gw2 and it has one of the most fun pvps to play”.Also this brings more PvErs to maybe like the game mode.This is achieved via more frequent balance to avoid leaving things that are broken for long, and also looking at some skills design to make them less oppressive and frustrating (elusive mind, full counter, all of scourge)

  4. As a side note on 3 (balance related) reducing the power level gap between the meta builds and suboptimal builds will go a long way to make people want to stick to the game.I feel this got worse with hot then especially pof. If you try to take a niche build now and stack it vs a current meta build its just uncomparable.Not everythibg needs to be viable but more for sure, and things that ARE viable need to not be miles from meta in power but just versatility.

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Partly population but mostly because anet keeps changing the matchmaking algo without adjusting the mmr system.

Reducing the average rating difference between teams reduces overall rating deviation and as a result the mmr range shrinks lower. This mostly happens because the matchmaker lowers win rates at the high end, while the mmr system still punishes players harshly for losses.

The system isn't well thought out. Take a simple case of a 1500 player duo queued with a 1000 player. Eventually if they play every match together they will end at the same rating, even though their actual skill is very different.

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@BeLZedaR.4790 said:It’s the population as @Meteor.3720 nicely explained. And for the population to increase here are a few things that can help:

  1. The on demand torunaments so people feel they have a place to competitive 5v5 all the time (ranked staying solo/duo is important aswell).

  2. New gamemodes, for unranked only, and let people have fun with em in costums aswell. Keeping the competitive stuff as conquest only with special ATs for alternative modes.

  3. Most importantly, we can’t have things like scourge and mesmer being as broken for so long. We need good balance and for the good classes to not be an extreme pain to play against (scourge, mesmer, even the p/p conplaints have some merit in this regard).This is SO IMPORTANT. The reason is, that once the game is genuinely fun to play and doesn’t have these frustrating factors, people can actually go talk to their friends and say something like “Dude I’m playing this game its called gw2 and it has one of the most fun pvps to play”.Also this brings more PvErs to maybe like the game mode.This is achieved via more frequent balance to avoid leaving things that are broken for long, and also looking at some skills design to make them less oppressive and frustrating (elusive mind, full counter, all of scourge)

  4. As a side note on 3 (balance related) reducing the power level gap between the meta builds and suboptimal builds will go a long way to make people want to stick to the game.I feel this got worse with hot then especially pof. If you try to take a niche build now and stack it vs a current meta build its just uncomparable.Not everythibg needs to be viable but more for sure, and things that ARE viable need to not be miles from meta in power but just versatility.

Exactly! Balance patches each 2/3 months are absolutely outrageous, to maintain pvp competivity they should be at least 1 big balance patch each month and 1 minor each 2 weeks, taking mirage for exemple since it's the most complained class of all and the most spammed on pvp, we have to bear it until the next balance patch that will be in a month probably.

This is very frustraiting for pvp players, it's a lottery for who doesn't play those OP classes, who gets them on their team.

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Trying to climb anymore is RNG. Sometimes you get players who don't have a clue what they are doing that somehow got into plat. Seriously, how the hell do you get to plat when you sit on treb all game or abandon points to spawn camp beast? Meanwhile I sit in silver with teammates that I seriously doubt could solo a random level 80 mob.

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@"Panda.3620" said:Last season only 3 players got to legendary and the 3 only got to legendary because of 1 match on NA.

Their respective ratings:181418121809

If the rating last season to reach legendary was 1750, only 8 players would be legendary.

I don't know about EU, I don't play there.Discuss.

Statistically, it's near impossible to deviate too far from the average. If the average is gradually getting lower (IE top tier players leaving, or a sudden influx of low level players lowering average value of individual matches), then the top tier players will feel the pull downwards. In all likelihood, this is the result of top tier players gradually leaving, resulting in a slow pull downwards.

In short: Rating is a statistical measurement of "skill." If the average changes, then even the top tier will feel the effects reflected in their ratings.

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@Vagrant.7206 said:

@"Panda.3620" said:Last season only 3 players got to legendary and the 3 only got to legendary because of 1 match on NA.

Their respective ratings:181418121809

If the rating last season to reach legendary was 1750, only 8 players would be legendary.

I don't know about EU, I don't play there.Discuss.

Statistically, it's near impossible to deviate too far from the average. If the average is gradually getting lower (IE top tier players leaving, or a sudden influx of low level players lowering average value of individual matches), then the top tier players will feel the pull downwards. In all likelihood, this is the result of top tier players gradually leaving, resulting in a slow pull downwards.

In short: Rating is a statistical measurement of "skill." If the average changes, then even the top tier will feel the effects reflected in their ratings.

But, if there is more players shouldnt be easier to get to legendary since we would have a bigger pool? Making it easier to have high raiting even though the quality of matches because of new players would be lower? Skill from players on top staying the same in this case?

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@Aktium.9506 said:If you were to visualize it on a graph you would see that the average ratings in PvP sunk like a rock when ranked became Duo Queue only. And then it shrank even further when it became Solo Queue only.

That indicates that the system has created fairer matches overall, this is a good thing

Why does anyone even care if they're legendary? Is an 1801 player vastly more skilled than a 1799 player? No, the difference in bracket is mostly arbitrary

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@Legatus.3608 said:

@Aktium.9506 said:If you were to visualize it on a graph you would see that the average ratings in PvP sunk like a rock when ranked became Duo Queue only. And then it shrank even further when it became Solo Queue only.

That indicates that the system has created fairer matches overall, this is a good thing

Why does anyone even care if they're legendary? Is an 1801 player vastly more skilled than a 1799 player? No, the difference in bracket is mostly arbitrary

The icon is cool

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@Panda.3620 said:

@Panda.3620 said:Last season only 3 players got to legendary and the 3 only got to legendary because of 1 match on NA.

Their respective ratings:181418121809

If the rating last season to reach legendary was 1750, only 8 players would be legendary.

I don't know about EU, I don't play there.Discuss.

Statistically, it's near impossible to deviate too far from the average. If the average is gradually getting lower (IE top tier players leaving, or a sudden influx of low level players lowering average value of individual matches), then the top tier players will feel the pull downwards. In all likelihood, this is the result of top tier players gradually leaving, resulting in a slow pull downwards.

In short: Rating is a statistical measurement of "skill." If the average changes, then even the top tier will feel the effects reflected in their ratings.

But, if there is more players shouldnt be easier to get to legendary since we would have a bigger pool? Making it easier to have high raiting even though the quality of matches because of new players would be lower? Skill from players on top staying the same in this case?

Over time, as a sudden influx of new players evened out into the rest of the playerbase, yes, what you say would come true. However, a sudden influx of low-tier players would drag a bunch of ranked matches down and have knock-on effects. They'd be temporary, for sure, but they'd be observable.

Like I said though, this is a case of the higher tier population leaving, which has a substantially more permanent effect.

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Because nobody wants to play a game as busted as this one is in PvP.

There's approximately 500-750 people above 1500 rating TOTAL IN ALL OF NA SERVERS. Anet does NOTHING to encourage people to actually play sPvP, so nobody plays it. Hell, good players play a few weeks and then quit to go play something actually enjoyable. Anet has outright neglected sPvP for 6 years, is it really a surprise that nobody plays it anymore?

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@Panda.3620 said:

@Aktium.9506 said:If you were to visualize it on a graph you would see that the average ratings in PvP sunk like a rock when ranked became Duo Queue only. And then it shrank even further when it became Solo Queue only.

That indicates that the system has created fairer matches overall, this is a good thing

Why does anyone even care if they're legendary? Is an 1801 player vastly more skilled than a 1799 player? No, the difference in bracket is mostly arbitrary

The icon is cool

Lol, fair enough, but I think we would all be better served if they just deleted the brackets. Honestly they serve no useful purpose

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@Legatus.3608 said:That indicates that the system has created fairer matches overall, this is a good thingI never said anything else. I've always been for Solo Queue only.

Unranked and AT are enough to satisfy any urges to play with a team. The former for messing around with friends and the latter for actual serious competitive playing.

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@"Malediktus.9250" said:What does it matter? It is just a value used for matchmaking. Lower is actually better because you have shorter queues.

"First person to reach 35,000 and 36,000 AP."

Why do you care? It's just a value that doesn't matter.

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