Suggestions for strikes — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Suggestions for strikes

zealex.9410zealex.9410 Member ✭✭✭✭
edited September 27, 2019 in Fractals, Dungeons, and Raids

n1, dificulty: public and squad should be two seperate dificulties public scaled to be around t4 fractal for a 5 man group (easier than t4 for a 10man group). After a public group is done they will get a popup to stay in squad so they can immidiately look to jump in the squad version (or maybe recruit a couple more ppl through other means if they arent at the 10man mark.

Squad would be around the t4cm dificulty for 5 man groups. 10man groups would have a much easier time and 5 man groups would have a more challenging time (think of it like fractals that you can bring 5 more friends to make it easier).

This does 2 things: One, it brings up the dificulty, its by all means not harder than a raid or even as hard but harder than what strikes are now which imo fails to accomplish its goal. Two, it automatically forms groups and gives the options to said groups to stick together for the harder version which is closer to raids.

n2, the way strikes are done: As WP said strikes are basically dungeon paths to lw's story mode, they change alot from the way you get to the boss to even the setting and dialogue. Anet heard us when we asked for bosses and instances to be reused as repeatable content but imo they could have just taken the lw instamce and cut out some lore parts and roadblocks to and after the boss and make whats left repeatable. FF14 does the same thing with trials and it works.

Thats a niche complain but it comes from the pov that this takes more resources than it would potentially need and as cool as it might be it certainly drains more resources and we might end up getting less and less of them over time because of it.

Comments

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Keep dreaming if you think they'll make Strikes T4 difficulty. They are at pre-T1 now, that would be a giant leap that I'm not sure Arenanet is willing to do.

  • zealex.9410zealex.9410 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:
    Keep dreaming if you think they'll make Strikes T4 difficulty. They are at pre-T1 now, that would be a giant leap that I'm not sure Arenanet is willing to do.

    Newer strikes will be for sure harder, tjat much they have said iirc tho idk how much harder.

    This is merely a suggestion for a baseline dificulty they should have imo.

  • Patty.3268Patty.3268 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 28, 2019

    I agree the first strike mission is a bit too easy and could use a bit higher difficulty, but T4 is way over the top. Why then create them in the first place instead of creating a new fractal? Sure, with only one boss strike missions at T4 difficulty would be faster than a fractal, but the difficulty would be so high that most players that don't bother with raids wouldn't bother with strike missions either.

    Besides that, players who want to play something with T4 fractal difficulty can go and exactly do that: do fractals at T4 difficulty. Players who want to play something easier will do strike missions. Fractals and strike missions are meant for different types of players. No need to force one of these two things to become the other.

  • Tyson.5160Tyson.5160 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 28, 2019

    Didn’t That Shaman data mine a challenge mode option with strike missions?

  • zealex.9410zealex.9410 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Patty.3268 said:
    I agree the first strike mission is a bit too easy and could use a bit higher difficulty, but T4 is way over the top. Why then create them in the first place instead of creating a new fractal? Sure, with only one boss strike missions at T4 difficulty would be faster than a fractal, but the difficulty would be so high that most players that don't bother with raids wouldn't bother with strike missions either.

    We are talking about t4 dificulty in a 5 to 10 man space, something that would be t4 hard for 5 ppl but easier for 10 ppl. Lets bot forget what the purpose of strikes are and how hard compaired to a raid t4 actually is (without instabs)

    No need to force one of these two things to become the other.

    Im not, theres alot of unique things in fractals specific to fractals that wouldnt apply to strikes. For example fractals are 5 man content while strikes are 5 to 10 man, doubling the ppl would make it easier than a t4 and somce it has a public mm it would be relatively easy to get >5 groups.

    Strikes afaik dont also have daily instabs, that alone makes them far more accessible.

  • Patty.3268Patty.3268 Member ✭✭✭

    It's true that strike mission are more accessible than fractals. But as I wrote before, if the difficulty of strike missions is too high, the accessibility won't be enough to get the players strike missions were made for to actually do them. Not even the skins that might drop, since those can eventually be bought at the TP.

    @zealex.9410 said:
    We are talking about t4 dificulty in a 5 to 10 man space, something that would be t4 hard for 5 ppl but easier for 10 ppl. Lets bot forget what the purpose of strikes are and how hard compaired to a raid t4 actually is (without instabs)

    I don't think strike missions are aimed at people who run T4 fractals because those people probably don't need a stepping stone between fractals and raids. If you can reliably clear T4 fractals and learn the mechanics of the raid bosses, chances are high you're suited to start raiding. Sure, you still need some practice, but still shouldn't have a super hard time in raids. That's why I think strike mission are aimed at those who don't run fractals or raids, but would like to start raiding. And in my opinion, the first strike mission gives those players a first impression of what to expect from a raid boss. You have a few mechanics, different attacks, safe zones, ... It's just that not paying attention to these things will not hurt as much as it would in an actual raid. And that's why I think the difficulty should be increased just a bit. Just enough to have at least one mechanic or attack that makes a player think "Woah, next time I come here I better avoid THAT!".

    However, having some kind of challenge mote that let's you choose the difficulty of the mission would probably a good idea.You could gradually increase difficulty and improve yourself in doing so.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 1, 2019

    @Patty.3268 said:
    That's why I think strike mission are aimed at those who don't run fractals or raids, but would like to start raiding.

    You are saying it's for players that don't want to run 5-man instanced content but for some inexplicable reason want to run 10-man instanced content? Honestly these players are a problem not worth looking into nor catered to. There is a stepping stone for Raids, and that's 5-man instanced content, skipping that directly to Raids is one of the reasons players have such a problem with Raid difficulty in the first place. This is like saying someone wants to go F1 racing, but skip the basic driving lessons.

    As for the strike boss, it has no mechanics, it's a giant sack of health. It's attacks deal next to no damage, take way too long to strike and aren't threatening at all. As I said in another thread, the first boss you meet in dungeons, the Spider Queen in AC, teaches more about mechanics than the Strike. And it's more challenging. The only thing the Strike teaches is that anyone unable to finish it should go get better at playing the game because their skill level is still at the tutorial level.

  • sokeenoppa.5384sokeenoppa.5384 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:

    @Patty.3268 said:
    That's why I think strike mission are aimed at those who don't run fractals or raids, but would like to start raiding.

    You are saying it's for players that don't want to run 5-man instanced content but for some inexplicable reason want to run 10-man instanced content? Honestly these players are a problem not worth looking into nor catered to. There is a stepping stone for Raids, and that's 5-man instanced content, skipping that directly to Raids is one of the reasons players have such a problem with Raid difficulty in the first place. This is like saying someone wants to go F1 racing, but skip the basic driving lessons.

    As for the strike boss, it has no mechanics, it's a giant sack of health. It's attacks deal next to no damage, take way too long to strike and aren't threatening at all. As I said in another thread, the first boss you meet in dungeons, the Spider Queen in AC, teaches more about mechanics than the Strike. And it's more challenging. The only thing the Strike teaches is that anyone unable to finish it should go get better at playing the game because their skill level is still at the tutorial level.

    About spider queen, or any other dungeon boss. Those would make great endgame bosses if they got ALOT more health. Atm its just stack and kill in less than 5 seconds. However their attacks are pretty deadly and some of them has intresting mechanics.
    Just an off topic

    I'll have two number 9s, a number 9 large, a number 6 with extra dip, a number 7, two number 45s, one with cheese, and a large soda.

  • Patty.3268Patty.3268 Member ✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:

    @Patty.3268 said:
    That's why I think strike mission are aimed at those who don't run fractals or raids, but would like to start raiding.

    You are saying it's for players that don't want to run 5-man instanced content but for some inexplicable reason want to run 10-man instanced content? Honestly these players are a problem not worth looking into nor catered to. There is a stepping stone for Raids, and that's 5-man instanced content, skipping that directly to Raids is one of the reasons players have such a problem with Raid difficulty in the first place. This is like saying someone wants to go F1 racing, but skip the basic driving lessons.

    I don't see that as inexplicable. Fractals and Raids offer different rewards, for example. There's enough people out there who would like to get the legendary armor but never did fractals because they don't offer the armor. There's also players that got into GW2 after the introduction of raids and starting doing them before doing fractals. In fact, although I've been playing since release, I also only started with fractals above T1 after raiding. And still I was able to pull my weight in Raids after some tries (sometimes more, sometimes less), just like those who regularly ran fractals before starting to raid. So saying that all the players who didn't run 5-man instanced content before raiding aren't worth looking into, is a bit condescending, don't you think?

    @maddoctor.2738 said:

    @Patty.3268 said:
    That's why I think strike mission are aimed at those who don't run fractals or raids, but would like to start raiding.

    As for the strike boss, it has no mechanics, it's a giant sack of health. It's attacks deal next to no damage, take way too long to strike and aren't threatening at all. As I said in another thread, the first boss you meet in dungeons, the Spider Queen in AC, teaches more about mechanics than the Strike. And it's more challenging. The only thing the Strike teaches is that anyone unable to finish it should go get better at playing the game because their skill level is still at the tutorial level.

    This is why I said the difficulty should be increased. The mechanics and attacks aren't threatening enough to be noticed, but they are still there. Take the emerging platforms shooting projectiles, for example. That's a mechanic you could also find on a raid boss. But there, you couldn't just ignore it like you can in the strike mission. As I said, it's a question of difficulty, not a lack of mechanics or different attacks.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2, 2019

    @Patty.3268 said:
    So saying that all the players who didn't run 5-man instanced content before raiding aren't worth looking into, is a bit condescending, don't you think?

    Nope. Those players that want to go directly to Raids (and then complain about their difficulty) are a problem and not worth catered to at all. If you can manage Raids without first playing the previous instanced content in the game, that's absolutely fine, go for it. But when I see people coming to train for Raids that haven't even run a dungeon and complain about wipes in Raids, sorry, I don't feel any kind of sympathy. And I shouldn't.

    You can't complain that the 10-man instanced content is hard for you, when you haven't finished/mastered the 5-man content first. We run the serious issue of content that is supposed to be challenging (10-man Raids) to be much easier than content that is supposed to be more accessible (5-man dungeons/low tier Fractals). As in the Strike Mission, which is supposed to be an "easy Raid" but is easier than all 5-man content in the game. It's like going to Orr at level 5 and complain that "it's too hard".

    As I said, it's a question of difficulty, not a lack of mechanics or different attacks.

    Increasing the damage and frequency of the attacks would make it more like an easy fractal but honestly, although it would be good, it's still lazy, and I hope the "supposed" challenge mote isn't only that. That was how higher tier fractals used to be, giant damage sponges that deal loads of damage, not fun and certainly not challenging in a good way. What Strike Missions need is mechanics that require team work and cooperation, mechanics that reward proper composition and build choices.

    Just look at Freezie for an example. The Icy Snowball and the Aurora Beam mechanics were true team focused mechanics. Both required the player targeted to be awake and able to move away of the group in a way that caused minimum interference with the rest of the squad. That's what a mechanic for a party/squad is. Rings and circles that deal damage are solo mechanics and frankly Balthazar has more of them than the Strike Mission boss. In fact, Balthazar is a far better training experience for damaging mechanics than the Strike Mission.

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