That is the barrier of entry i am speaking about. This is far too much time spent. I'd guess the players in your group didn't care about proper builds and role assignments. It is the only way I can imagine it taking that long. My first VG clear took two sessions, one week apart of each other and maybe about 3-4 hrs. True, we did get a more experienced player to tank for us, but it got it via the LFG, so you could have done the same. And none of the other players were a raider back then. When did you start raiding? The guild I'm in got the first VG kill on januray 10th 2016 (raid release was ca. mid november 2015). I think we had a break over the holidays. We had ca. 6 poeple who where there on nearly every attempt and the other members were changing and they have been there maybe every second or third week. So Astralporings experience is not that unique. Keep in mind that at the early raid time, there weren't many guides and no meta benchmarks. It took some time before the chrono/rev group composition was established. Poeple were also busy to farm the new HoT masteries and had something else to do than to get the new meta gear. Rev was completly new for everyone and poeple also didn't have experience with special roles like druid and chrono. The same guild that needed weeks for VG and again weeks for Gorseval (we failed countless times a ca. 1%) killed Matthias in 1,5 hours (5 of us have seen him before once or twice with pugs) and Xera in ca. 3 hours (also 5 have seen her maybe once or twice with pugs).People adapted to the harder content, got decent builds, rotations and gear... Guilds that did dungeon speed runs already had that, but the casual pve guild that started raiding had a high learning curve to get to a similar level. Therefore I've asked "when you started". Raiding was so much more difficult at the beginning. Nowadays you can join e.g. a training run for w4 and kill 3 bosses on the first evening (with experienced leaders).