Change Request Series: Spellbreaker QOL

[Broxxgar.6801]

1 hour ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

There are core builds being used in sPvP. Some of them are even on Metabattle. Core guardian is currently the dominant sPvP support build.

 

Healbreaker is healbreaker because spellbreaker ultimately provides more survivability than core. Sure, you can do it with core, or even with berserker, but it works better with spellbreaker. In competitive modes, you want the supports to be tough so they can survive. In cooperative, if you're going to have a tank at all, it's usually a support because they give up less to achieve that tankiness.

 

You're arguing that spellbreaker couldn't be given more of a supporting focus because it doesn't have any now, but that doesn't mean it couldn't. Again, scrapper is the example here. Scrapper was pretty selfish apart from a couple of gyros - now it makes a real contribution to support builds. Spellbreaker, now... meditations pretty much only ever get used for zergs, and even then, they're only using Winds of Disenchantment and Break Enchantments. There's potential to rework some of the others, particularly Featherfoot which is generally eschewed over Berserker Stance.

Metabattle Core War builds:
Conquest:
Core Axe 😒
WvW Roammer:
Core Tactics Roamer 😒

Almost the same build nothing new, just tatic trait there. Since there is a lot of builds that you can do with core.

If people  cant provide  themselves survivability with core, they really need to train more. Its almost the same survivability the only diference its MMR and Adrenal health, which core can have both and SB have to choose between STR trait or DEF trait to use with Mage tether.  If you are going for the boons there is the Tatics trait  which again SB still loose for MMR in STR and Adrenal health on DEF. Since dicipline is a most have. Core has the best flexibility to use Tatics traits with STR trait or DEF trait.


Featherfoot is a most have on a Zerg, its make the Spellbreaker free walking inside the fights and help you to escape. I don't have problems with adrenaline on my build.

Edited September 13, 2021 by Broxxgar.6801

[draxynnic.3719]

Healbreaker generally didn't take Magebane, since that's more of a DPS trait, but they generally took the Full Counter-related grandmaster instead.

 

In terms of going core for support, there's really two problems there. The first is that Defence is kinda bad at the moment. it mostly relied on Defy Pain and Last Stand for survivability and, well, 300s cooldown. Having a block - that also interrupts all enemies within a radius - which can also be used fairly regularly and which recharges your burst skill - is more useful than what's left of what Defence offers. MMR doesn't really add much to the healbreaker build since it relies on frequent crits, if not wielding a greatsword specifically, to really work and healbreaker has its offhands boiled in (maybe if you replaced dagger with axe, but even then you don't really want to rely on frequent hits for sustain with a support build). Perhaps more importantly, Spellbreaker lets you burst more often and more reliably, such that you're more likely to get Soldier's Focus to go off right after it renews. Which is probably why the actual support-oriented build used spellbreaker, while the core builds you cite, even if using similar skills and traits, aren't support - they run DPS stats (quite aggressive ones, in fact) and any support they do provide to their team is incidental to keeping themselves alive.

 

Now, if your argument is "I'm actually using that stuff, please don't change it" - that I can respect, I play mesmer, so I know how much it sucks to have your build deleted even if it's supposed to be a buff for the profession in general. But up to now your argument has been "it doesn't fit the concept", and there's not really any reason why it wouldn't fit the concept.  

[Broxxgar.6801]

3 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

Healbreaker generally didn't take Magebane, since that's more of a DPS trait, but they generally took the Full Counter-related grandmaster instead.

 

In terms of going core for support, there's really two problems there. The first is that Defence is kinda bad at the moment. it mostly relied on Defy Pain and Last Stand for survivability and, well, 300s cooldown. Having a block - that also interrupts all enemies within a radius - which can also be used fairly regularly and which recharges your burst skill - is more useful than what's left of what Defence offers. MMR doesn't really add much to the healbreaker build since it relies on frequent crits, if not wielding a greatsword specifically, to really work and healbreaker has its offhands boiled in (maybe if you replaced dagger with axe, but even then you don't really want to rely on frequent hits for sustain with a support build). Perhaps more importantly, Spellbreaker lets you burst more often and more reliably, such that you're more likely to get Soldier's Focus to go off right after it renews. Which is probably why the actual support-oriented build used spellbreaker, while the core builds you cite, even if using similar skills and traits, aren't support - they run DPS stats (quite aggressive ones, in fact) and any support they do provide to their team is incidental to keeping themselves alive.

 

Now, if your argument is "I'm actually using that stuff, please don't change it" - that I can respect, I play mesmer, so I know how much it sucks to have your build deleted even if it's supposed to be a buff for the profession in general. But up to now your argument has been "it doesn't fit the concept", and there's not really any reason why it wouldn't fit the concept.  

I just put Mage Thether if for somehow you wanna put a GS on your equipments and get the MMR with Forceful GreatSword Trait, you don't need to use this for healbreaker. Was just to point out how much more survivability you can achieve. About Defy Pain and Last Stand is up to you to choose or not. Just take note of Warrior Core Healing Capacity and Sustain against Healbreaker :

Warrior Core (Using PvP)
 

 

Healbreaker Build From Metabattle


As you can see on Miscellaneous you gonna have all that SB has and  STR, DEF trait together. That can even increase more your healing and support capacity. The healbreaker is a Core War with the SB tag... just that 😒. People won't accept but is the truth. That isn't even a skill  on that build that is from SB, just the Dagger chain skill and FC. And their difference is minium is almost the same... I just want point out that War core has more flexibility than  SB.


I'm not talking about to change or not. Every profession and Elite spec has a concept. And probably Arena net developers follow this very careful. This concepts open a new style of play. But if you want to play the same style that you played with a Core Warrior... them you can play. Although you aren't using the full capacity of that Elite Spec.

When I first played SB, I was barely  using a similar build that core has and after some match, studies and theorycrafting I started to found how medidations works and how I should use it. So the style of play is different from  a basic Core War GS/AxeShield.

Edited September 13, 2021 by Broxxgar.6801

[draxynnic.3719]

4 hours ago, Broxxgar.6801 said:

I just put Mage Thether if for somehow you wanna put a GS on your equipments and get the MMR with Forceful GreatSword Trait, you don't need to use this for healbreaker. Was just to point out how much more survivability you can achieve. About Defy Pain and Last Stand is up to you to choose or not. Just take note of Warrior Core Healing Capacity and Sustain against Healbreaker :

Warrior Core (Using PvP)
 

 

Healbreaker Build From Metabattle


As you can see on Miscellaneous you gonna have all that SB has and  STR, DEF trait together. That can even increase more your healing and support capacity. The healbreaker is a Core War with the SB tag... just that 😒. People won't accept but is the truth. That isn't even a skill  on that build that is from SB, just the Dagger chain skill and FC. And their difference is minium is almost the same... I just want point out that War core has more flexibility than  SB.


I'm not talking about to change or not. Every profession and Elite spec has a concept. And probably Arena net developers follow this very careful. This concepts open a new style of play. But if you want to play the same style that you played with a Core Warrior... them you can play. Although you aren't using the full capacity of that Elite Spec.

When I first played SB, I was barely  using a similar build that core has and after some match, studies and theorycrafting I started to found how medidations works and how I should use it. So the style of play is different from  a basic Core War GS/AxeShield.

There may be similarities in the design of the core GS/Axe build and healbreaker, but the differences mean they get played very differently. The core warrior build you're talking about isn't intended for support beyond supporting itself - it has no healing power (the builds in question run either berserker or marauder). Warhorn, On My Mark, and Battle Standard support a different approach than greatsword, Bull's Charge, and Rampage - it's entirely valid for a healbreaker to hang back a little providing support, while a greatsword build is pretty much expected to be in the enemy's face the whole time unless they need to disengage entirely. The core warrior builds you're looking at are actually going to play more like the classic GS+D/S brawling spellbreaker than healbreaker.

 

You're hyper-focusing on the similarities and ignoring that it's the things that are different that define how the builds are played. In the process, you're not just comparing apples to oranges, you're holding up an apple and claiming it IS an orange because it has skin and contains seeds.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

Brox, the builds do play very different, so take what daxynnic says to heart. Daxynnic, cut Brox some slack, they are still exploring all that warrior has to offer. Also, please make use of this thread to discuss the items from the original post. Namely, the QOL items that Cal can touch in his balance purview. It's all well and good to discuss the virtues of how one build is different from another, but this thread isn't the place for it, though I do thank you for elucidating a few things and your interest.

Edited September 14, 2021 by Lan Deathrider.5910

[Broxxgar.6801]

4 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

There may be similarities in the design of the core GS/Axe build and healbreaker, but the differences mean they get played very differently. The core warrior build you're talking about isn't intended for support beyond supporting itself - it has no healing power (the builds in question run either berserker or marauder). Warhorn, On My Mark, and Battle Standard support a different approach than greatsword, Bull's Charge, and Rampage - it's entirely valid for a healbreaker to hang back a little providing support, while a greatsword build is pretty much expected to be in the enemy's face the whole time unless they need to disengage entirely. The core warrior builds you're looking at are actually going to play more like the classic GS+D/S brawling spellbreaker than healbreaker.

 

You're hyper-focusing on the similarities and ignoring that it's the things that are different that define how the builds are played. In the process, you're not just comparing apples to oranges, you're holding up an apple and claiming it IS an orange because it has skin and contains seeds.

 

3 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Brox, the builds do play very different, so take what daxynnic says to heart. Daxynnic, cut Brox some slack, they are still exploring all that warrior has to offer. Also, please make use of this thread to discuss the items from the original post. Namely, the QOL items that Cal can touch in his balance purview. It's all well and good to discuss the virtues of how one build is different from another, but this thread isn't the place for it, though I do thank you for elucidating a few things and your interest.

I think neither of 2 take a moment to click on the link  build that I provide. I just put Core War PvP just to ensure that  was using PvP Gear to simplify our calculations and analise. The 2 Links use the same Gear and Runes. There no even a GS on it and not even a Axe on it. What are you guys talking about ?


Sorry @Lan Deathrider.5910 but @draxynnic.3719 not even cut a slack of me. He just put his words without the enforts to look on the link. This is like trying to mislead you and the other about what I'm talking about that the Healbreaker are a just Core War with a tag of Spellbreaker. The builds are there and the healing are there. Just take a look. There is nothing different.

And again this not goes against the topic. Because when you goes to talk with a Dev, what you think he gonna do to change the dynamic of a trait if you isn't even using the spec skills on it.


Sorry but this is a shame for you two on the forum and on the thread here.

Edited September 14, 2021 by Broxxgar.6801

[Lucentfir.7430]

Spellbreaker's theme has always been a boon breaker/hate spec, even the heal has to do with boon hate, as your remove your own boons as well. I've never seen it as a design fit for a support spec, more of a de-booner/disruptor if you look at the spellbreaker line and mechanics there's absolutely nothing points to it being a support E-spec, there's no traits that provide team benefits or provide a boost for team benefit, it's all selfish and offensive.

Spellbreaker needs refinement and more focus on its design theme. 
Loss Aversion- Damage should go up in WvW at least, 400-500 damage range.
Revenge Counter- Should go back to transferring conditions instead of copying them
Sight Beyond Sight - Make it so the next hit is immune to Blind, removing blind doesn't do anything for pulsing blinds or jkust being reapplied a instant after it gets removed. 
Featherfoot's Grace- Lower the CD to 35s

-Ideas -   
Rework  Enchantment Collapse - Spell Counter - Burst Skills/ or just Full counter now applies 3s of Disenchantment to foes you hit. 

Merge Loss Aversion's Damage with Dispelling Force - New Major Trait to replace loss Aversion - "Centered" - gives you adrenaline when you remove boons, and you also heal when you gain adrenaline this way (250 hp per.) 
Current Enchantment Collapse - Improve Dispelling Force's effects removes 1 additional boon and increase the the damage done by 20%

Magebane Tether - In addition to what it does now your strikes remove boons from your tethered foe.  
 

[draxynnic.3719]

8 hours ago, Broxxgar.6801 said:

 

I think neither of 2 take a moment to click on the link  build that I provide. I just put Core War PvP just to ensure that  was using PvP Gear to simplify our calculations and analise. The 2 Links use the same Gear and Runes. There no even a GS on it and not even a Axe on it. What are you guys talking about ?


Sorry @Lan Deathrider.5910 but @draxynnic.3719 not even cut a slack of me. He just put his words without the enforts to look on the link. This is like trying to mislead you and the other about what I'm talking about that the Healbreaker are a just Core War with a tag of Spellbreaker. The builds are there and the healing are there. Just take a look. There is nothing different.

And again this not goes against the topic. Because when you goes to talk with a Dev, what you think he gonna do to change the dynamic of a trait if you isn't even using the spec skills on it.


Sorry but this is a shame for you two on the forum and on the thread here.

I had a quick look at it.

 

You can do it, but I've already acknowledged that at present healbreaker, like scrapper before the buff, doesn't get much support out of the elite spec - you're getting the elite spec for the extra survivability it offers.

 

So if you're proposing Strength and Defence as substitutes for Spellbreaker and Discipline, then those substitutions need to be at least as good in support and survivability. I don't think that's the case. Discipline gives you more adrenaline (which means more bursts, which means you're more likely to have Soldier's Focus trigger quickly, as well as being more likely to Full Counter when you need to), faster weapon swap (so you're more likely to have access to the weapon skill you need, when you need it - it also potentially contributes to more burst skills), mobility, extra condition removal, and the ability to break immobilise on mobility skills (this is very important for survivability, since an immobilise you can't break is usually a death sentence). Spellbreaker brings Full Counter, more frequent regular bursts, a spot of resistance, and let's not forget the ability to dish out hindering conditions and boon removal: while this is technically control, on a support build it's usually better to build for control than damage, since you don't have the stats for damage, but you can still contribute to scoring a kill by stripping boons and applying debilitating conditions.

 

Running Strength/Defence, you get a bit of extra toughness and you get MMR, but that doesn't compensate for Full Counter, the extra control you can get out of Spellbreaker, being able to use adrenaline one bar at a time rather than all in one go, or the utility you get out of Discipline. While MMR certainly provides some extra sustain, it doesn't compensate for everything you give up.

 

Hopefully this lays out why spellbreaker was used for the support build rather than a full-core setup.

 

Regarding cutting you some slack - you were coming across in your earlier posts as if you were saying "I know better than you, and I know better than people who use Metabattle". So that was the context I was using to guide my responses.

 

But yeah, like Lan said - and I said myself previously - this would probably be something to be discussed in a separate thread. For now, though, I'm inclined to drop it altogether, especially since the new warrior elite specialisation is due to be unveiled within the week, and that might completely change the context.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

4 hours ago, Lucentfir.7430 said:

Spellbreaker's theme has always been a boon breaker/hate spec, even the heal has to do with boon hate, as your remove your own boons as well. I've never seen it as a design fit for a support spec, more of a de-booner/disruptor if you look at the spellbreaker line and mechanics there's absolutely nothing points to it being a support E-spec, there's no traits that provide team benefits or provide a boost for team benefit, it's all selfish and offensive.

Spellbreaker needs refinement and more focus on its design theme. 
Loss Aversion- Damage should go up in WvW at least, 400-500 damage range.
Revenge Counter- Should go back to transferring conditions instead of copying them
Sight Beyond Sight - Make it so the next hit is immune to Blind, removing blind doesn't do anything for pulsing blinds or jkust being reapplied a instant after it gets removed. 
Featherfoot's Grace- Lower the CD to 35s

-Ideas -   
Rework  Enchantment Collapse - Spell Counter - Burst Skills/ or just Full counter now applies 3s of Disenchantment to foes you hit. 

Merge Loss Aversion's Damage with Dispelling Force - New Major Trait to replace loss Aversion - "Centered" - gives you adrenaline when you remove boons, and you also heal when you gain adrenaline this way (250 hp per.) 
Current Enchantment Collapse - Improve Dispelling Force's effects removes 1 additional boon and increase the the damage done by 20%

Magebane Tether - In addition to what it does now your strikes remove boons from your tethered foe.  
 

Its because the boon ripping and CC helps with the support, both in you surviving longer to provide that support and in controlling the enemy. You are right in that Spellbreaker itself offers no support.

Adding in Disenchantment on more than just WoD would be a major improvement to Spellbreaker by all means, but is not something Cal can do at this moment. Perhaps post EoD release that will happen though. Your ideas are all pretty good btw.

[Hotride.2187]

5 hours ago, Lucentfir.7430 said:

Loss Aversion- Damage should go up in WvW at least, 400-500 damage range.

Merge Loss Aversion's Damage with Dispelling Force - New Major Trait to replace loss Aversion - "Centered" - gives you adrenaline when you remove boons, and you also heal when you gain adrenaline this way (250 hp per.)

400-500 damage would be massive against boon spamming classes... You can literally rip 9-10 boons in a few seconds if your opponent is not careful. I'm not sure doing 5k damage in the process would be OK. Though half as much doesn't sound too bad. Definitely better than doing next to 0 dmg as is right now...

Gaining a meaningful amount of health on boon remove would actually be very nice. Especially in group fights it would help a lot to stay alive and stick to your target, as opposed to having to constantly put distance between you and the enemy group (and so losing all the damage you can do)...

[Lucentfir.7430]

57 minutes ago, Hotride.2187 said:

400-500 damage would be massive against boon spamming classes... You can literally rip 9-10 boons in a few seconds if your opponent is not careful. I'm not sure doing 5k damage in the process would be OK. Though half as much doesn't sound too bad. Definitely better than doing next to 0 dmg as is right now...

Gaining a meaningful amount of health on boon remove would actually be very nice. Especially in group fights it would help a lot to stay alive and stick to your target, as opposed to having to constantly put distance between you and the enemy group (and so losing all the damage you can do)...

Ripping more than 4+ boons off a single person is already hard to do assuming they're not target golems,  let alone 9-10 boons in a few seconds. If we're talking groups for all Spellbreaker is supposed to be in removing boons, most of the boon ripping itself  gets countered by Stability since Dispelling Force requires you to actually cc someone and not just hit them with cc, and the only way to get rid of stability is hitting dagger burst (if you're running dagger and spending adrenaline), WoD, and Break Enchantments. CCs already do only 7 damage, and WoD lasts 5s with 1s interval pulse compared to its previous iteration of 10s.  When compared to something like a necro who just converts all your boons into negative conditions is it really not okay to be able to do some damage through boon ripping?

Yeah I mean most warrior specs and setups are all double melee weapon setups, so they always have to be in someone's face more reason to have some healing for actively being offensive. 
 

[Lucentfir.7430]

2 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Its because the boon ripping and CC helps with the support, both in you surviving longer to provide that support and in controlling the enemy. You are right in that Spellbreaker itself offers no support.

Adding in Disenchantment on more than just WoD would be a major improvement to Spellbreaker by all means, but is not something Cal can do at this moment. Perhaps post EoD release that will happen though. Your ideas are all pretty good btw.

Yeah I'm already expecting no changes to happen until after EoD launch, but just tossing ideas out that with some hope they'll do something, and not leave the spec itself in the bin, like last time they did with Berserker right before PoF. ☹️ 

[Hotride.2187]

49 minutes ago, Lucentfir.7430 said:

Ripping more than 4+ boons off a single person is already hard to do assuming they're not target golems,  let alone 9-10 boons in a few seconds.

Just 1 interrupt with sigil of absorption is 4 boons stripped; ele, ranger and engi usually have at least 5 to strip and reapply them very frequently. You can of course argue that a good player will avoid getting interrupted/CCed by a SB like its the plague but even good players slip if you fight long enough. I don't know how even 1 FC would feel if it dealt 1.5k dmg (if it doesn't get evaded).

[Broxxgar.6801]

5 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

I had a quick look at it.

 

You can do it, but I've already acknowledged that at present healbreaker, like scrapper before the buff, doesn't get much support out of the elite spec - you're getting the elite spec for the extra survivability it offers.

 

So if you're proposing Strength and Defence as substitutes for Spellbreaker and Discipline, then those substitutions need to be at least as good in support and survivability. I don't think that's the case. Discipline gives you more adrenaline (which means more bursts, which means you're more likely to have Soldier's Focus trigger quickly, as well as being more likely to Full Counter when you need to), faster weapon swap (so you're more likely to have access to the weapon skill you need, when you need it - it also potentially contributes to more burst skills), mobility, extra condition removal, and the ability to break immobilise on mobility skills (this is very important for survivability, since an immobilise you can't break is usually a death sentence). Spellbreaker brings Full Counter, more frequent regular bursts, a spot of resistance, and let's not forget the ability to dish out hindering conditions and boon removal: while this is technically control, on a support build it's usually better to build for control than damage, since you don't have the stats for damage, but you can still contribute to scoring a kill by stripping boons and applying debilitating conditions.

 

Running Strength/Defence, you get a bit of extra toughness and you get MMR, but that doesn't compensate for Full Counter, the extra control you can get out of Spellbreaker, being able to use adrenaline one bar at a time rather than all in one go, or the utility you get out of Discipline. While MMR certainly provides some extra sustain, it doesn't compensate for everything you give up.

 

Hopefully this lays out why spellbreaker was used for the support build rather than a full-core setup.

 

Regarding cutting you some slack - you were coming across in your earlier posts as if you were saying "I know better than you, and I know better than people who use Metabattle". So that was the context I was using to guide my responses.

 

But yeah, like Lan said - and I said myself previously - this would probably be something to be discussed in a separate thread. For now, though, I'm inclined to drop it altogether, especially since the new warrior elite specialisation is due to be unveiled within the week, and that might completely change the context.

Feel free to believe what ever you want about my words. But its what @Lucentfir.7430 said: 'The Spellbreaker theme has nothing to do with Support.'. You again says that the boon rips of Healbreaker offer better things than Core War Healer because offers CC and boon rips. From the build that I provide you just gonna remove boons with FC, Dagger burst and Shield Bash, (just to take note that a stability still will be there on the fight, so your shield bash won't do nothing and  in the end you gonna remove 4 boons, if the enemy not evade). Things that a Full Spellbreaker can achieve even better and bring dmg to the table. So in otherwords is that what I'm saying is a thrash build and metabattle are wrong. Why I can't say that? Its because that this build are on the metabattle that I can't say that ? I have to accept that every build on Metabattle is the right way or better way to play ? They have good builds there and  some  of them are very good but others don't even get a chance. You can even do a Healzerk and achieve a high dmg with burning stacks.

You and @Lan Deathrider.5910 finally admits that Spellbreaker doesn't have a single trait for support. This healbreaker is 90% Warrior Core and 10% Spellbreaker.  

Now take a look on What @Lucentfir.7430 said. He easily propose changes on the Spellbreaker skills/traits, things that I'm feeling that can be done, reduce the CD of some skills...try to merge some traits and open other new ideias. I really don't have problem with adenaline with my SB so 'Loss aversion' offer nothing to me.

The lack of synergi between SB trait and medidations are still things that could be improve, like a trait:
'Any new trait name':
Reduce in 20% the cool down of your meditations and give you super speed and resistance  for 2s when activate them.

Edited September 14, 2021 by Broxxgar.6801

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

7 minutes ago, Broxxgar.6801 said:

Feel free to believe what ever you want about my words. But its what @Lucentfir.7430 said: 'The Spellbreaker theme has nothing to do with Support.'. You again says that the boon rips of Healbreaker offer better things than Core War Healer because offers CC and boon rips. From the build that I provide you just gonna remove boons with FC, Dagger burst and Shield Bash, (just to take note that a stability still will be there on the fight, so your shield bash won't do nothing and  in the end you gonna remove 4 boons, if the enemy not evade). Things that a Full Spellbreaker can achieve even better and bring dmg to the table. So in otherwords is that what I'm saying is a thrash build and metabattle are wrong. Why I can't say that? Its because that this build are on the metabattle that I can't say that ? I have to accept that every build on Metabattle is the right way or better way to play ? They have good builds there and  some  of them are very good but others don't even get a chance. You can even do a Healzerk and achieve a high dmg with burning stacks.

You and @Lan Deathrider.5910 finally admits that Spellbreaker doesn't have a single trait for support. This healbreaker is 90% Warrior Core and 10% Spellbreaker.  

Now take a look on What @Lucentfir.7430 said. He easily propose changes on the Spellbreaker skills/traits, things that I'm feeling that can be done, reduce the CD of some skills...try to merge some traits and open other new ideias. I really don't have problem with adenaline with my SB so 'Loss aversion' offer nothing to me.

The lack of synergi between SB trait and medidations are still things that could be improve, like a trait:
'Any new trait name':
Reduce in 20% the cool down of your meditations and give you super speed and resistance  for 2s when activate them.

Brox, core shout healer and healbreaker are going to play differently, If you play Spellbreaker, or Berserker for that matter, the same way you play core, then you are going to have performance issues. You may be able to get away with it occasionally, but as you play the two of them you will see why they are indeed played differently. 

Yes, as far as 'support' goes, all of it comes from Tactics and core skills, but the control and boon ripping from Spellbreaker pushes it up a level while providing the self sustain needed in order to do the job in ways that Defense cannot do at the moment. Take wisdom from more seasoned players to heart mate and don't take it personally.

I at least am not trying to rile you up. Some good advice I've heard in the past, and is something that all of us on the forums should take to heart in our discussions is: "always assume noble intent." At least until someone proves blatantly otherwise.

[Broxxgar.6801]

I already said what spellbreaker would bring to the table as healer... just a cc and boons rips. Which is not 'really playing different' is just using the skill that are provides. What I'm saying now is probably that the enemy will denie you and will denie you hard.

Core War healer have access to defense because 'it can', isn't because are mandatory trait. You can even put arms on there if you want...and sorry this talk of  'seasoned players' won't take me, the 'sessoned dev' already made many response to them. If in months and years Arena Dev don't answer about many complains or they are doing something wrong or the complains has some problems.

And I personally won't think that they will take note for build called healbreaker or  for whatever that  has with healing and spellbreaker together. As freedom of choices are there, they won't even bother about what is this.

As a response to this.. just role Guardian, you gonna be a better Support... and put a hammer will do the samething for Control.

[Broxxgar.6801]

@draxynnic.3719 seem that you support ideia worked. Bladesworn has a increadible capacity of support by the video lauched. Maybe the utily espec skills can improve his support capacity. 😜