The main takeaway message from these 25-30k dps auto attack builds

[Obtena.7952]

22 minutes ago, Karagee.6830 said:

The problem is, you haven't said anything other than Anet is pushing LI builds to further inclusivity

Strike two ... I never said Anet is pushing LI builds. LI builds are not new. 

Edited July 11, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Karagee.6830]

6 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Strike two ... I never said Anet is pushing LI builds. LI builds are not new. 

You gonna stop trolling at strike 3? I mean you said you didn't want to engage about 20 messages ago.

20 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Sure it's relevant to the thread. The fact that we have these LI builds exist and being PROMOTED is Anet's way of saying "Hey guys, you need to acknowledge this is how the game works so there isn't a reason to be exclusive in teaming' and players saying 

You never ever ever ever said that. whoopsies

Edited July 11, 2022 by Karagee.6830

[Obtena.7952]

9 minutes ago, Karagee.6830 said:

You never ever ever ever said that. whoopsies

I didn't say Anet was promoting them in that statement. I simply said they were being promoted. Obviously that's by players; there are tons of LI build videos released recently.

I think at this point, you need a break because attacking these little wordings doesn't invalidate my point. It's pretty clear what my point is but since you keep falling of the path, here it is again:

Players are promoting LI builds because they realize it's healthy for the game endgame content. LI builds aren't new. 

Frankly, I don't even understand how the build you are complaining about affects you personally. Don't play it if you don't like it. Don't team with people that play it. Obviously you don't have a problem with exclusivity in the first place. 

Edited July 11, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Karagee.6830]

Just now, Obtena.7952 said:

I didn't say Anet was promoting them in that statement. I think at this point, you need a break. It's pretty clear what my point is. 

You are commenting on a thread post balance that is discussing AFK AUTOATTACK  builds, not LI, literally 0 APM and you say LI builds exist and being promoted, but no it's clear you never said anything about anyone promoting anything. The English in that sentence is bad, I can give you that, but 'being promoted' can only refer to 'the fact' that LI builds exist or to 'LI builds'. In the end whether it's one or the other is immaterial, you absolutely cannot claim you never said Anet is pushing for this or that I'm misrepresenting what you said.

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

18 minutes ago, Karagee.6830 said:

I mean I suppose you could pay me the equivalent in gold for the rewards: gold, relics, karma, spirit shards etc (including the bonuses from fractal god) and I would be indifferent. You happy to do that to protect the cesspit of toxicity that is often T3?

If i don't have to interact with elite players demandind me to use non-subbar builds , then yeah

[Karagee.6830]

1 minute ago, Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

If i don't have to interact with elite players demandind me to use non-subbar builds , then yeah

I don't demand you do anything. You can go make yourself a coffee or a sandwich for all I care. I don't have requirements for your role or build: it's T3, it's pointless for me to demand anything from others. It's bad T3 players that demand stuff from others while everyone is failing at mechanics etc.

Edited July 11, 2022 by Karagee.6830

[Obtena.7952]

8 minutes ago, Karagee.6830 said:

You are commenting on a thread post balance that is discussing AFK AUTOATTACK  builds, not LI, literally 0 APM and you say LI builds exist and being promoted, but no it's clear you never said anything about anyone promoting anything. The English in that sentence is bad, I can give you that, but 'being promoted' can only refer to 'the fact' that LI builds exist or to 'LI builds'. In the end whether it's one or the other is immaterial, you absolutely cannot claim you never said Anet is pushing for this or that I'm misrepresenting what you said.

OK ...maybe that gets you an A+ in English class but my point still stands so ... again, why you are replying to me in the first place if you think I'm off topic? Or not reporting my off topic post? Here is a hint ... I don't have a problem replying to you if you are going to quote me because I think it's important people realize these builds are VALID in the game and allow them to be included in endgame content. If they weren't, they wouldn't exist. If they aren't valid, they will be removed. I don't have a problem debating that point, especially if you continue to misinterpret what I'm saying in my posts 

I mean, if the thread is just a complaint about AFK Autoattack builds, they don't affect you ... because they never did because guess what, they aren't new either. 

Edited July 11, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

21 minutes ago, Karagee.6830 said:

nope that is the other guy's opinion, which I was actively disputing. I said let's do a poll about reasons why people get kicked (which included both) and he said no.

Ding, ding, ding. Bingo! Yeah and you don't need 1 build to do 32k afk for people not to be kicked from raids. This is just bs of the highest order and always has been. People get carried in GREEN gear in raids.

The difference is this was doing more damage than many high intensity builds while being literally 0 APM. And the fact that this is not part of Anet vision is that it's been nerfed after 2 days. Nobody has any problems with LI builds doing 20k+ dps, but 32k is another story and this was not a LI build this was literally 0 APM, which does not qualify as LI, it's an afk build. 

I have to agree with Obtena on this .

People dont join instance group because they dont have expiriance , and the expirianced ones are locked behind KP walls .

If they join with fake KP and they die  or not doing dps , they will be kicked  .

 

There are already builds that can do 0amp and this high damage...its called LI-(low intensity builts) that was created 3 months ago bghy the community (and now they are digging their grave once again)

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

4 minutes ago, Karagee.6830 said:

I don't demand you do anything. You can go make yourself a coffee or a sandwich for all I care. I don't have requirements for your role or build: it's T3, it's pointless for me to demand anything from others. It's bad T3 players that demand stuff from others while everyone is failing at mechanics etc.

Stay on T4 plz .

If you belive its a ceasppol .

 While the majority will use the T3 to avoid the LI-KP walls + needed to do most dps + bring specific classes

Edited July 11, 2022 by Killthehealersffs.8940

[Karagee.6830]

Just now, Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

If they join with fake KP and they die  or not doing dps , they will be kicked  .

Then you'd be kicked for lying and don't know the mechanics of the encounter not because you play a subpar spec.

1 minute ago, Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

its called LI-(low intensity builts) that was created 3 months ago bghy the community (and now they are digging their grave once again)

This builds existed before Eod, you just didn't have content creators giving them a lot of visibility. So it's not a 3 months thing. The fact they realised they buffed this too much, they squeezed the gap between skill floor and skill ceiling too much and then nerfed it in a hurry is a good thing, that may keep (a part of the) more experience players on the fence rather than having them quit altogether, as many others have already done.

[Karagee.6830]

5 minutes ago, Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

Stay on T4 plz .

If you belive its a ceasppol .

 While the majority will use the T3 to avoid the LI-KP walls + needed to do most dps + bring specific classes

not sure what you're even talking about. No kp are required for T4. No kp are sometimes asked even for CMs. Nobody in T4 LFG asks for specific classes except...hfb. Normally you would have people asking for alac, hfb and dps (or cdps/pdps) or if they have a ham, then quick and dps, sometimes people will go without 100% quickness or alacrity. CMs lfg is....the same!!!!! other than people asking for kps. 

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

7 minutes ago, Karagee.6830 said:

Then you'd be kicked for lying and don't know the mechanics of the encounter not because you play a subpar spec.

This builds existed before Eod, you just didn't have content creators giving them a lot of visibility. So it's not a 3 months thing. The fact they realised they buffed this too much, they squeezed the gap between skill floor and skill ceiling too much and then nerfed it in a hurry is a good thing, that may keep (a part of the) more experience players on the fence rather than having them quit altogether, as many others have already done.

The idea of "easy" builds existed since the 2/3 of HoT with "Kitty" (10k dps builds crafter-Golem named after her), while the raiders argued with her about promoting wortless-non SC builds .

People already 3 months ago offered LI builds with the same results to kill Soo won. So don't tell me , the "company" reduce the skill cealing . You raider ares just mad , because Teapot is using one + ranged is a valid tactic , than boonstack+necro spamm Barrier , like every Raid 😛

 

Edited July 11, 2022 by Killthehealersffs.8940

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

1 minute ago, Karagee.6830 said:

not sure what you're even talking about. No kp are required for T4. No kp are sometimes asked even for CMs. Nobody in T4 LFG asks for specific classes except...hfb. Normally you would have people asking for alac, hfb and dps (or cdps/pdps) or if they have a ham, then quick and dps, sometimes people will go without 100% quickness or alacrity. CMs lfg is....the same!!!!! other than people asking for kps. 

Sure .

Stay out of T3 plz.

Dont destroy them , like other part of the games ,plz

[Karagee.6830]

12 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

OK ...maybe that gets you an A+ in English class but my point still stands so ... again, why you are replying to me in the first place ... big ?

I mean, if the thread is just a complaint about AFK Autoattack builds, they don't affect you ... because they never did because guess what, they aren't new either. 

It affects everybody when people leave because they are dissatisfied that 1 specialisation does more damage afk than 20 others while masching buttons. This is why I'm here.

It was better when the discussion was with people denying Mechanist was doing that much dmg to be honest, at least we could talk about something concrete, even though we disagreed, and not inconsequential faff.

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

6 minutes ago, Karagee.6830 said:

It affects everybody when people leave because they are dissatisfied that 1 specialisation does more damage afk than 20 others while masching buttons. This is why I'm here.

It was better when the discussion was with people denying Mechanist was doing that much dmg to be honest, at least we could talk about something concrete, even though we disagreed, and not inconsequential faff.

People leave PvE , because Eng in PvE is doing more damage , with less effort ?

 

Teapot.... my love... what have you done ?

(when other people uses cheese tactics to win a race is great..its called competition...but when a casual Raiders like Teapot is doing , is blasphemy)

Edited July 11, 2022 by Killthehealersffs.8940

[Karagee.6830]

2 minutes ago, Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

The idea of "easy" builds existed since the 2/3 of HoT with "Kitty" (10k dps builds crafter), while the raiders argued with her about promoting wortless-non SC builds .

 

Their argument is valid to this day and it is...that there is no incentive for these people to learn anything else if these builds are too strong. Because someone able to play a difficult rotation on one class is likely to be able to get into a different class and still play it at a decent to good level. Someone that requires him to do nothing or very little, will not have the same flexibility, will not learn, it will be carried if not forever at least for a much longer time and part of the desirable in raid groups is flexibility in covering multiple roles depending on who's available.

7 minutes ago, Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

People already 3 months ago offered LI builds with the same results to kill Soo won. So don't tell me , the "company" reduce the skill cealing . You raider ares just mad , because Teapot is using one + ranged is a valid tactic , than boonstack+necro spamm Barrier , from every Raid 😛

 

I couldn't give a kitten about what MightyTeapot does. He thinks this patch was dogshit, literally the worst ever by Anet and Mechanist was way overbuffed, so I'm not sure what's your brilliant idea calling his opinions into this debate.

[Obtena.7952]

12 minutes ago, Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

People leave PvE , because Eng in PvE is doing more damage , with less effort ?

Yeah ... that's absurd when you think about it right? because it's not the first time we have builds like that right? In fact, it's unavoidable.

The truth is that some people will fearmonger the death of the game because people leaving as a reason for needing class balance. It's nonsense. It's been like that forever. It's been 10 years ... we are still here. The game is not on it's death's bed and if it is ... balance can't be the reason. 

Edited July 11, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Karagee.6830]

4 minutes ago, Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

People leave PvE , because Eng in PvE is doing more damage , with less effort ?

 

Teapot.... my love... what have you done ?

No people leave pve because THEIR class does less damage than 0 APM mechanist, despite challenging gameplay and they have no interest in being pigeonholed into playing boring classes that require no skill.

You might have missed that while they were buffing Mechanist 0 skill builds, they also nerfed all power builds, completely obliterating soulbeast (then patched in the most boring way possible that also require no skill) and warrior and nerfing or not fixing the majority of other classes and specs with problems.

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

1 minute ago, Karagee.6830 said:

Their argument is valid to this day and it is...that there is no incentive for these people to learn anything else if these builds are too strong. Because someone able to play a difficult rotation on one class is likely to be able to get into a different class and still play it at a decent to good level. Someone that requires him to do nothing or very little, will not have the same flexibility, will not learn, it will be carried if not forever at least for a much longer time and part of the desirable in raid groups is flexibility in covering multiple roles depending on who's available.

I couldn't give a kitten about what MightyTeapot does. He thinks this patch was dogshit, literally the worst ever by Anet and Mechanist was way overbuffed, so I'm not sure what's your brilliant idea calling his opinions into this debate.

 

Who told you , that majority enjoy rotations ?. For 10 years now the majority pushed anything off the cd . And the raiders where to blame them for using subpar builds and not watching a SC guide

 

 

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

5 minutes ago, Karagee.6830 said:

No people leave pve because THEIR class does less damage than 0 APM mechanist, despite challenging gameplay and they have no interest in being pigeonholed into playing boring classes that require no skill.

You might have missed that while they were buffing Mechanist 0 skill builds, they also nerfed all power builds, completely obliterating soulbeast (then patched in the most boring way possible that also require no skill) and warrior and nerfing or not fixing the majority of other classes and specs with problems.

Who left ? Can you name some people ?

Because after the nerfs the majority happinlly watched Teapot....i mean the CM Temple race

 

About the soulbeast , they rightfully did what they did . They removed the aoe-boost (cheese tactics for max damage) and personally buff him

Edited July 11, 2022 by Killthehealersffs.8940

[Karagee.6830]

27 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

 if you continue to misinterpret what I'm saying in my posts 

I mean I thought we clearly established I quoted you correctly or you wrote something you didnt mean, which you never said you did. So...

28 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

I mean, if the thread is just a complaint about AFK Autoattack builds, they don't affect you ... because they never did because guess what, they aren't new either. 

Now who's misrepresenting? Are you going to say that a build doing 32k dps on autoattack while a large portion of other specs achieve similar or worse results isn't a new situation? Hahaha. Ok please do tell us which build has previously benched 31,953k dps without pressing any button.

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

1 minute ago, Karagee.6830 said:

I mean I thought we clearly established I quoted you correctly or you wrote something you didnt mean, which you never said you did. So...

Now who's misrepresenting? Are you going to say that a build doing 32k dps on autoattack while a large portion of other specs achieve similar or worse results isn't a new situation? Hahaha. Ok please do tell us which build has previously benched 31,953k dps without pressing any button.

LI builds created by the community , did the same results .

We have the condition mesmer for example or the bombkit eng

Edited July 11, 2022 by Killthehealersffs.8940

[Obtena.7952]

6 minutes ago, Karagee.6830 said:

Now who's misrepresenting? Are you going to say that a build doing 32k dps on autoattack while a large portion of other specs achieve similar or worse results isn't a new situation? Hahaha. Ok please do tell us which build has previously benched 31,953k dps without pressing any button.

The situation where easy to play builds doing high performance is not new. The specifics of how much DPS or how many buttons to push are irrelevant. If that results in people leaving, then it's ALWAYS resulted in people leaving. That wouldn't be new either. Obviously that's not a problem after 10 years. If 32K is too much, Anet will tune it to something more reasonable. 

In otherwords, this SPECIFIC instance doesn't need to be changed because 'people leaving and game dying' like you seem to imply. It's just fearmongering. 

Edited July 11, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Karagee.6830]

6 minutes ago, Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

Who left ? Can you name some people ?

Because after the nerfs the majority happinlly watched Teapot....i mean the CM Temple race

 

About the soulbeast , they rightfully did what they did . They removed the aoe-boost (cheese tactics for max damage) and personally buff him

Aoe-boost? What? Do you even play the game?

I already told you one of my guilds (which included players with fastest times on some of fractal CMs) has decided to play other stuff instead of indulging Anet following the patch. What more do you want?

MightyTeapot makes a living off the content he creates. MightyTeapot is fearing for his income and rightfully criticises the patch and design decisions at every opportunity (from what I know, not that I'm a subscriber or watch his content so...).

[Karagee.6830]

6 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

The specifics are irrelevant.

lmfao is that Ben Carson or Boris Johnson speaking? I mean yeah the details don't matter lol. Firecracker, nuclear-bomb, fundamentally the same thing: all explosive devices.

Edited July 11, 2022 by Karagee.6830