The Real Reason Why Celestial Builds Are Broken.

[Sahne.6950]

18 hours ago, Clownmug.8357 said:

So, some skill/trait that gave something like 5 seconds of might now does 7 seconds with the extra concentration, and people think that's why they lose fights to celestial builds?

nope, but with aristocracy rune, which alot of celebuilds use, 5 seconds of might turn into 9,5 seconds. (you have 96% mightduration) Simply running a sigil of battle will generate 15 constant might, if you have any other mightgenerating mechanic, or simply run sigil of might aswell.... you can enjoy your free 1500 extra stats.   Some professions dont even need to invest into gear to achieve this... Celerenegade will literally fire of 2 skills and sit at 25 might =1500 extra stats, without having to invest anything, besides running cele.

 

Just for example: Full ascended marauder gear gives you exactly 1172 power.....    WELL...... having 25 might results in 1500 offensive stats......     having 25 might IS NO JOKE!

With 25 might, Celebuild EXCEED marauderbuild is terms of power, and they exceed trailblazer builds in terms of conditionpower.. all of that while having the same ferocity as marauder, same conditionduration as trailblazer, same concentration as minstrels.... yada yada.... 

 

let that sink in.... a Celebuild with 25 might, has more conditiondamage than a fulltrailblazerbuild...  While also having more powerdamage than a fullmarauderbuild...     THAT CANT BE RIGHT!

[Jugglemonkey.8741]

3 hours ago, Sahne.6950 said:

let that sink in.... a Celebuild with 25 might, has more conditiondamage than a fulltrailblazerbuild...  While also having more powerdamage than a fullmarauderbuild...     THAT CANT BE RIGHT!

Well, that's mostly because it isn't right. With 25 might a celestial build is going to be sitting on roughly 2.5k power and 1.5k condi damage, which is roughly where a marauder or trailblazer build respectively would start with no might at all. Dedicated builds will always deal more of their damage type than a celestial build can, but a celestial build will sometimes deal more total damage between power and condi, and that's the real issue.

For instance, my trailblazer specter can get 7k total condi ticks and my cele build only gets 4k ticks, but when you factor in the skill that applies condi hitting for 3k power damage per use the cele build will out DPS the trailblazer. 

[Zepoolpe.9217]

On 9/16/2022 at 5:33 PM, SleepyBat.9034 said:

Celestial stats are only part of the issue, the damage is a little too low to really be broken. Celestial builds only become an issue when you take into account Might, Might gives 30 power and condition damage per stack and you can reach a max of 25 which gives you +750 power and condition damage which pushes Celestial gear close to full dps stat like Berserker. So long as your build has good Might generation you can have a broken build because Celestial stats now have concentration.

The real problem is not so much might as all boons.. the boon generation is insanely broken and accentuated by the nerf on boon rip/corruption.

As long as the boon generation is not fixed, you won't see balance.

As for celestial stats, i do not mind that they added expertise and concentration (after all, it is supposed to be the set that gives you all stats), but adding 2 new stats while keeping the same individual stat budget was stupid af. it should have been implemented by keeping the overall stat budget.

Celestial was ok before because it was a jack of all trades but master of none: Power based builds were the most effective dmg dealers and condi based builds were here to put pressure on the healers and control the enemy through the soft CCs like chill, immo, cripple, etc.. Celestial did not really entered in this because it was not good enough at direct dmg and its condi dmg as not enough to make for the difference.

Celestial was only effective with a few niche builds like the chilling reaper, which shined because it was keeping your target in a near permanent chill, so you could take your time to kill it (who needs burst when you can permanently lock your enemy with -66% movement and +66% skill CD, right?)

But then Anet started the arm race between condi and boons generation at the expense of most power builds: power has been nerfed, condi has been buffed and on top of that you fart boons like there is no tomorrows. So if you mix the boon amd condi generation, your direct dmg does not suck anymore and condi more than make up for the loss compare to power. Sure you don't have the same burst as power but who cares because your overall dmg is higher and you are less fragile thanks to your vitality, toughness and various survival boons like protection or regen.

 

PS. sry for the wall of text 😄

Edited September 25, 2022 by Zepoolpe.9217

[Avion Blade.4869]

Arcane Thievery 🙂

Your might is my might.
Your stab is my stab.
Your Aegis is my Aegis.
Your Protection is my Protection.

My cripple is your cripple.
My chill is your chill.
My poison is your posion.
My burn is your burn.

>:D I see boon builders lose HP fast and run away when they become arcaned! 

 

Example, a Spellbreaker bursted into a group while i stole his boons and he died so quick thinking he still had them >:D.

 

---

Other than usefully using the skills at the opportune moment, might is only a problem if they land a hit. It doesn't matter how much dps you have, your damage is 0 if you cannot land a hit. 

I used to be afraid of booners, but remember they are on a timer! But yes it is dangerous with high might.

What you really should pay attention to, is stability. That is the only boon you need to observe because booners lose momentum without stab.

 

[Xenesis.6389]

On 9/16/2022 at 10:06 PM, patton the great.7126 said:

Personally I think mirage has 1 too many dodges....I'd like to live in a world where if mirage trys to dodge they get an auto -70% armor debuff. It is my scientific opinion that this would solve the celestial debate. Thank you for your time, #deletemirageplz

In a perfect world when an engineer tries dodging it would automatically delete the character.

Thank you for your time, #deletecarrymeclassplz

[SleepyBat.9034]

50 minutes ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

In a perfect world when an engineer tries dodging it would automatically delete the character.

Thank you for your time, #deletecarrymeclassplz

Every class is a carry me class to a certain extent.

Edited September 27, 2022 by SleepyBat.9034

[Xenesis.6389]

Just now, SleepyBat.9034 said:

Every class is a carry me class to a certain extent, no reason to slander engineer.

Engineer has two, slander will continue.

[SleepyBat.9034]

1 minute ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

Engineer has two, slander will continue.

Mechanist and?

[Xenesis.6389]

1 minute ago, SleepyBat.9034 said:

Mechanist and?

You're in the wvw section, take a wild guess.

[SleepyBat.9034]

Just now, Xenesis.6389 said:

You're in the wvw section, take a wild guess.

Core.

 

[Xenesis.6389]

2 minutes ago, SleepyBat.9034 said:

Core.

 

Oh so you're implying they have 3 carry me specs to nerf then.

Edited September 27, 2022 by Xenesis.6389

[SleepyBat.9034]

2 minutes ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

Oh so you're implying they have 3 carry me specs to nerf then.

I'm going to assume you meant Scrapper, I don't really play it.

[MementoMortis.4258]

On 9/16/2022 at 11:25 AM, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Obviously the answer is to remove might from Aristocracy Runes.

Hilarious.