I waited almost a decade for concrete changes on scepter..and finally Anet delivers

[Exzen.2976]

Oh good lord. This is juicy. Maybe a little too juicy. Ngl, I think these changes are going to make a lot of people very upset in pvp/wvw lol

[Esufer.8762]

12 minutes ago, Exzen.2976 said:

Oh good lord. This is juicy. Maybe a little too juicy. Ngl, I think these changes are going to make a lot of people very upset in pvp/wvw lol

i for one am looking forward to all the insane FA montages

[Arheundel.6451]

2 hours ago, Exzen.2976 said:

Oh good lord. This is juicy. Maybe a little too juicy. Ngl, I think these changes are going to make a lot of people very upset in pvp/wvw lol

It will still be far less faceroll than pressing 3 on a shortbow with a renegade or running ahead with superspeed while throwing grenades behind you without looking. You won't be able to go celestial and still do absurd dmg while being tanky AF. And even if it will be possible....who cares? Eles had to deal with faceroll builds for years and we stilk have things like cele harbinger in wvw, I am hardly concerned about fairness at this point, bring back the FA killers and let the salty tears flow!

[Exzen.2976]

1 hour ago, Arheundel.6451 said:

It will still be far less faceroll than pressing 3 on a shortbow with a renegade or running ahead with superspeed while throwing grenades behind you without looking. You won't be able to go celestial and still do absurd dmg while being tanky AF. And even if it will be possible....who cares? Eles had to deal with faceroll builds for years and we stilk have things like cele harbinger in wvw, I am hardly concerned about fairness at this point, bring back the FA killers and let the salty tears flow!

Ah don't get me wrong, this was long overdue and it will still take skill to pull off. I'm not complaining, just think it may be a little too insane in the right hands... 

[Markus.6415]

On 11/15/2022 at 2:48 PM, Sahne.6950 said:

you deal 10% more damage to chilled foes;effectiveness is increased to 15% while attuned to water" pairing this with "flow like water" could make for some potent core scepter builds with water. The burst from the trident could be pretty juicy if they go down that route. If they want to juice up the scepter a littlebit and turn water into something more agressive... this could be the way to go.

I'm actually using the water traitline for my power or quickness catalyst build right now (was nice to share auras to other catalysts too, wich will get useless next patch. Thx Anet for destroying the elementalist synergy there). I get your idea though, chill related traits make much more sense in the water traitline. On the other hand if you think about group PvE content you might actually end up as the only source of chill uptime. And what dps ele specs are utilizing water that often? But then again... this "PvE Balance Patch" turned out as a complete PvP/WvW Patch again so... It's a bit frustrating when they fixate on a small number of specs or weapons or traitlines in the balanace patches every 3 months and neglect everything else in the meantime.

Also the increased effictiveness should definately be at least at 20%, since that's how it is with vulnerability right now. And the time in water attunement will be low anyways.

Edited November 18, 2022 by Markus.6415

[Markus.6415]

On 11/14/2022 at 10:48 AM, SponTen.1267 said:

Not really? Both main hand Dagger and Staff get vuln from Water, not Air.

Yeah i know. Those are the relics from the core game. If you look at Elementalists elite specs, you'll find vulnerability in warhorn Air 5, Air-Overload, Sword Air 3, Hammer Air 2. For some reason they put vuln instead of chill in the water orb from hammer, but that's like 1 stack every 2 seconds or something?

[zeyeti.8347]

On 11/16/2022 at 2:09 AM, draxynnic.3719 said:

It's there. You could set up a build that doesn't use it, of course, but it's still there if your trait priorities change. Your claim was that without water trident healing, the options for a support mainhand weapon was "I guess nothing", and, well, you guess wrong, I guess? Dagger still exists and has supportive aspects. Cone of Cold doesn't currently generate the healing per second that Water Trident does, but with a numbers tweak, maybe add regen to the final pulse, and you're pretty much back to where you were, apart from losing out on a bit of range.

In the long run, I think elementalist will benefit from having one of the core weapons dedicated to dealing damage, and scepter probably was the most logical choice.

Thats the point if they remove all support abiltys from scepter (1 skill ...) then they have to tweek the support change on another weapon . It's there , yes ofc ... Weaver sword is there too , useless , but still there . 

Only goal of auras are damage reduction (from 1 aura) and proc regen , vigor , and fury if air is played , choosing to share auras as master trait to make this and this and this other trait proc. is underwhelkming . I dont deny auras are pretty strong in pvp , but in general (not only for ele) auras are useless in pve , alac heal was already in a bad spot , and somehow they've choosen to inderictly nerf it ... think this wasnt intented , but still it's a nerf on healtemp. water puke on dagger 2 is freaking weak...

On 11/15/2022 at 12:25 PM, soulknight.9620 said:

So the question is QoL, not what tempest can actually do atm. You can get 25 stacks of might on ur group, but the group must be willing to get that might by standing in ur OL. If ur group is running around like headless chickens you need to bring additional tools to support them. Im all for making it easier to provide boons, but scepter is not "a must have" to get the job done. Ive been doing some HAT runs with dagger for a few months now. Have no problems with stacking 25 stacks of might especially considering that a lot of dps classes pump out might/fury by accident. That actually adds some slack to the support. 

 

 

 

thats another problem , if you take warhorn , yes it's pretty easy to maintain might 25 , but i still say other support have all their might generators on a 360 range , and some on a 600 range ... thats the double of an ele .

I've run my alachealtemp on the new strike , was doing fine , when the group splitted up at some point , i couldnt neither get the range for boons neither apply them , because i stayed in water to maintain as much healing as i could , other support heals and at the same time give boons. Then i runned my druid cause i know i needed long range healing , piece of cake , i could even kite the 'boomerang blast' and heal my group from afar ...

The changes gonna occurs anyway , and alachealtemp is always gonna be the less picked healer (for a good reason) till the 'support' patch comes out , but it needs a lot of Qol , first thing making somehow alacrity les cluncky to apply , then giving us the access to elemental bastion , this is in my point of view the way making healtemp at same level as other healers .

Edited November 18, 2022 by zeyeti.8347

[soulknight.9620]

27 minutes ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

thats another problem , if you take warhorn , yes it's pretty easy to maintain might 25 , but i still say other support have all their might generators on a 360 range , and some on a 600 range ... thats the double of an ele .

Same goes for other supports. Druid for example has to take warhorn to maintain buffs too, and to get 25 might it needs to burn its celestial avatar off cd. 

27 minutes ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

I've run my alachealtemp on the new strike , was doing fine , when the group splitted up at some point , i couldnt neither get the range for boons neither apply them , because i stayed in water to maintain as much healing as i could , other support heals and at the same time give boons. Then i runned my druid cause i know i needed long range healing , piece of cake , i could even kite the 'boomerang blast' and heal my group from afar ...

Tbh its a l2p issue of ur group. In OLC strike group doesnt need to spread that much. Its usually 1 tanking offboss, and the rest stay together. When the 3 aoe beam attacks strike you run out, booom, run back in. When i support its always "if you want heal/boons come at me, im not going to run around trying to save you all" attitude. Supports life is always way more valuable than yolo dps. 

Although i agree that in certain situations (like dhuum kiting) you need a long range support and you can actually play staff at this point. There is a tradeoff (and it should be), but it is doable. Besides might/fury is usually provided by quick supports or dps (like mech). 

 

27 minutes ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

The changes gonna occurs anyway , and alachealtemp is always gonna be the less picked healer (for a good reason) till the 'support' patch comes out , but it needs a lot of Qol , first thing making somehow alacrity les cluncky to apply , then giving us the access to elemental bastion , this is in my point of view the way making healtemp at same level as other healers .

On contrary. I think HAT will see some more play after the FB rework. Although im sure the rework would benefit skilled HFB, but the average pepega HFB will be far worse to play. And we might see more HAT/HAM gameplay. 

Edited November 18, 2022 by soulknight.9620

[zeyeti.8347]

with frost spirit and 2x warhorn (quick draw) you barely can play without the master trait giving you might under avatar skills , it's a 21  stacks of might on a very large range , 900 for warhorn and 600 for spirits (compare that to the tiny 180 overload of the tempest ...) . And at least healtemp lack heal accessibilty , ice bow is the worst , a staff water AA but with a horrific cooldown ... , and other heal are cluncky or lack accessibilty , warhorn is close range and has a moving bubble so slow your allies far away are not gonna wait for it , dagger has the worst healing skill of the game , it is narrow range and weak , and overlaod water is indeed one of the strongest healing skill of the game but you don't want to overlaod water , cause you may pay it after having your passiv healing (soothing water) away cause overlaod recharge longer than the passiv duration ... I really want the healtemp get the same attention druid had few weeks ago .. staff erwork is amazing and you have pulsing heal and cleaning condis so fast and on a 1200 range in avatar ,  having also the full boon package . The only good thing left for healtemp is his boon extension , who is pretty strong .

And for the fb i agree with you , but i think that as hfb having access to his f2 heals , everytime he wants , will turn it in a crazy healer , spamming 3x skill 1 , getting one page back , waiting 15 secs for two pages to come back (and still dont know how the -15% cd on virtues will work on pages atm), then redoing it ... as ofc more constant aegis and stab. 

Edited November 18, 2022 by zeyeti.8347

[Arheundel.6451]

Yes....scepter ele is now in the right place, so many builds idea come to mind and for the first time since ever...I feel like investing into a legendary scepter...never thought I'd see the day......ty CMC