If you want to end the toxicity between try-hards and casuals, incorporate a tier system like fractals in strikes and raids.

[Jedrik.3109]

2 hours ago, Holmindeboks.3490 said:

They just have to add decent addons like world of warcraft. Deadly boss mods or other usefull addons. For me raiding right now was to boring and zero interest. Ofc i cleared some raids. My dps was fine.  But i learned the tactics from mistakes. I also had no interest because there is no reward. The chance of getting something nice is so small. Not worth the effort at all. And many runs where fine. I also created a firebrand with meta stats. But i didnt know that healers often get the extra roles. If i hate something in a game then it are extra tasks. So wasted gold on the gear. 
 

but guildwars 2 is made for sweats who doesnt need addons. Ppl who likes challanges. I am a casual player in mmo and dont like challanges. And even more hating it if it doesnt come with a reward. Why so much effort just for the feeling? Sure its awesome to see those pro players killing a fractal boss on cm withour red marks on the ground because they know where to stand. But thats not me. And without addons i dont want to raid. 

Honestly there are so very few raid mechanics that matter, I feel that what few markers blishhud have for raids is more than enough for even myself the most casual of players.

And to rewards, they are not great but this has been the modus operandi of anets reward structure since the beginning. There is no content that is overwhelmingly rewarding and when there has been (old octovine, etc.) Anet has nerfed it down sometimes more than once. 

[Dibit.6259]

On 12/8/2023 at 12:05 AM, Jedrik.3109 said:

Honestly there are so very few raid mechanics that matter, I feel that what few markers blishhud have for raids is more than enough for even myself the most casual of players.

I'm not sure what your experience is within raids but I don't agree with this statement. I know you're probably trying to encourage the guy you quoted to give raids a chance but at the same time don't want to mislead people into thinking its a walk in the park. Markers can only tell you where to go, they don't tell you why, what to do when you get there, nor about the mechanics not specified by markers. And a lot of raid mechanics matter, most of the time they can be the difference between make or break.

Take Vale Guardian for example, though an easy raid boss that's only when you know what the mechanics do and what you need to do in order not to struggle and fail. Greens for example are ignored during when Vale Guardian is whole (especially for first and thrid phase) and its the responsibility of healers to out heal the damage, but when split its important to do them as to not kill the condi players doing red Guardian.

Raids are about cooperation and people performing their roles. Depending on people's experience, understanding and performance determines how easy or successful the run is. There are great tools and add-ons that help with some mechanics but they only go so far.

Also since you mentioned blish it has a module called something like "raid timers" that are also very helpful for raids. (Not 100% sure about the name since I'm not at home atm 😄 )

Edited December 12, 2023 by Dibit.6259
Typos

[Jedrik.3109]

6 hours ago, Dibit.6259 said:

I'm not sure what your experience is within raids but I don't agree with this statement. I know you're probably trying to encourage the guy you quoted to give raids a chance but at the same time don't want to mislead people into thinking its a walk in the park. Markers can only tell you where to go, they don't tell you why, what to do when you get there, nor about the mechanics not specified by markers. And a lot of raid mechanics matter, most of the time they can be the difference between make or break.

Take Vale Guardian for example, though an easy raid boss that's only when you know what the mechanics do and what you need to do in order not to struggle and fail. Greens for example are ignored during when Vale Guardian is whole (especially for first and thrid phase) and its the responsibility of healers to out heal the damage, but when split its important to do them as to not kill the condi players doing red Guardian.

Raids are about cooperation and people performing their roles. Depending on people's experience, understanding and performance determines how easy or successful the run is. There are great tools and add-ons that help with some mechanics but they only go so far.

Also since you mentioned blish it has a module called something like "raid timers" that are also very helpful for raids. (Not 100% sure about the name since I'm not at home atm 😄 )

No experience in raids or any group content. 

I was trying to encourage. 

Oh.

 

[Passerbye.6291]

On 12/8/2023 at 3:05 AM, Jedrik.3109 said:

Honestly there are so very few raid mechanics that matter, I feel that what few markers blishhud have for raids is more than enough for even myself the most casual of players.

7 hours ago, Jedrik.3109 said:

No experience in raids or any group content. 

I was trying to encourage. 

Oh.

Might want to try the content before making such remarks mate.

[IAmNotMatthew.1058]

13 hours ago, Jedrik.3109 said:

No experience in raids or any group content. 

I was trying to encourage. 

Oh.

 

Those kinds of encouragements yield the "I got kicked for no reason" rants where a day or two after the thread is created OP admits to joining groups expecting experience without knowing anything.

[Jedrik.3109]

13 hours ago, Passerbye.6291 said:

Might want to try the content before making such remarks mate.

No. After thinking about this for a few weeks I realized this is the toxicity that everyone is complaining about. I have easily 200 hours in open world and I am sure there is nothing more complicated or technically challenging as the open world metas. My opinion is just as valid as yours. Yes I might not have your experience. Yes I might not know that you can portal skip spirit run. Or ignore all cannons on Sabetha. Or doing Sloth with only 4 people. Or knowing how despawn all the adds on Escort. Or the SAK bug on Xera. Or how Cairn can be soloed. Or that CM on Souless Horror typically has better wall RNG than normal mode. Or that swords can be done by one person on Conjured Amalganate. Or the dialog skip for the sorting room. Or correct fire pattern so there is no path for the adds on Qadim.

But look, none of that is important. What is important is that I paid for the game as well as many others and we should be able to play without interacting with others. The game should either spell out every mechanism in a fight or automatically move me to a safe spot and press "CC" if I missed some ridiculous animation. 

8 hours ago, IAmNotMatthew.1058 said:

Those kinds of encouragements yield the "I got kicked for no reason" rants where a day or two after the thread is created OP admits to joining groups expecting experience without knowing anything.

Well I was told by a wise man, if you don't know every role and every possible mechanic overlap can you really call yourself a raider?

 

Ok ok...

If you are new to content I firmly believe you should learn on dps or a worst boon dps. And still stand by the assertion that there are only a handful, hence the word few, mechanics in all 7 wings that a dps can wipe a group with. And yes I guess an addon could write all this out for us but we already suffer from lack of communication in groups. I just wish we would treat each other with a little compassion and empathy.  And on the other side, stop asking for games to dumb themselves down till there is no reason to interact with each other. (Yes there are other reasons to interact but classicly problem solving is a major one in games).

If you are NA and want to do some group content just message me. I promise the lowest stress, best ASMR call outs and people to help or guide anyone through any build.

Lastly @Passerbye.6291  and @IAmNotMatthew.1058 I am sorry. I have had a rough few days and my defensive meme-ory got the best of me in that moment. Much like this one. Much love.

[Passerbye.6291]

1 hour ago, Jedrik.3109 said:

No. After thinking about this for a few weeks I realized this is the toxicity that everyone is complaining about. I have easily 200 hours in open world and I am sure there is nothing more complicated or technically challenging as the open world metas. My opinion is just as valid as yours. Yes I might not have your experience. Yes I might not know that you can portal skip spirit run. Or ignore all cannons on Sabetha. Or doing Sloth with only 4 people. Or knowing how despawn all the adds on Escort. Or the SAK bug on Xera. Or how Cairn can be soloed. Or that CM on Souless Horror typically has better wall RNG than normal mode. Or that swords can be done by one person on Conjured Amalganate. Or the dialog skip for the sorting room. Or correct fire pattern so there is no path for the adds on Qadim.

But look, none of that is important. What is important is that I paid for the game as well as many others and we should be able to play without interacting with others. The game should either spell out every mechanism in a fight or automatically move me to a safe spot and press "CC" if I missed some ridiculous animation. 

Well I was told by a wise man, if you don't know every role and every possible mechanic overlap can you really call yourself a raider?

 

Ok ok...

If you are new to content I firmly believe you should learn on dps or a worst boon dps. And still stand by the assertion that there are only a handful, hence the word few, mechanics in all 7 wings that a dps can wipe a group with. And yes I guess an addon could write all this out for us but we already suffer from lack of communication in groups. I just wish we would treat each other with a little compassion and empathy.  And on the other side, stop asking for games to dumb themselves down till there is no reason to interact with each other. (Yes there are other reasons to interact but classicly problem solving is a major one in games).

If you are NA and want to do some group content just message me. I promise the lowest stress, best ASMR call outs and people to help or guide anyone through any build.

Lastly @Passerbye.6291  and @IAmNotMatthew.1058 I am sorry. I have had a rough few days and my defensive meme-ory got the best of me in that moment. Much like this one. Much love.

"Oh" no, anyway, let's discuss. 

You don't fail only when you wipe a squad. Anything you do because of a lack of knowledge that results in inconveniencing others is you being a burden to the squad. The fact that there is no content that can't be 9-manned in this game doesn't mean that last person wasn't useless. At the end of the day, there is a reason for KP runs to exist, people just want to get through content as comfortably as possible and KP is the best metric we have access to for it. While I don't like running KP runs myself, I completely see the logic behind it. The fact that you can 3-man content doesn't mean you should have to, and people need to understand this. We've come to a point where someone will join a group as dps, do 3k dps, get kicked and then make a forum post about how commanders are toxic and people will unironically support that. Then people who point out the fact that said person was griefing the experience of 9 other people get confuse spammed because reality offends people these days.

It is hard to be compassionate or empathetic when you give people every tool available in the game to make endgame content accessible and then people still call for the content to be rendered easier instead. People have been called elitists for saying all you need to do is 7k average dps (not sure on the exact number but it was ridiculously low) for dragon's end meta. We have forum posts saying the game isn't accessible because rotations are hard when there are builds doing over 30k damage with very few buttons or builds with 0 input requirement doing over 20, hammer mechanist with 26k for instance. I'll help anyone who is willing to step up to a challenge as best as I can but I have no compassion for people who go "I paid for the game so give me an I win button for all content". 

All in all, I find the main issue to be entitlement, people look at LFG, see all the KP runs and immediately complain about gatekeeping. Noone has the power to gatekeep content in this game, you are always able to make your own squad with likeminded people and do progression runs to get introduced to the content. Similarly, you can also join a guild that offers training runs for more handholding. But no, people will do neither of those things, then proceed to complain about not getting accepted to experienced runs, calling it "toxicity". Noone owes you anything, people accepting you to a run that you aren't prepared for and going through the trouble of helping you is the exception, not the norm. You should be grateful when it happens, not complain when it doesn't. 

Edited December 13, 2023 by Passerbye.6291

[Jedrik.3109]

12 minutes ago, Passerbye.6291 said:

"Oh" no, anyway, let's discuss. 

You don't fail only when you wipe a squad. Anything you do because of a lack of knowledge that results in inconveniencing others is you being a burden to the squad. The fact that there is no content that can't be 9-manned in this game doesn't mean that last person wasn't useless. At the end of the day, there is a reason for KP runs to exist, people just want to get through content as comfortably as possible and KP is the best metric we have access to for it. While I don't like running KP runs myself, I completely see the logic behind it. The fact that you can 3-man content doesn't mean you should have to, and people need to understand this. We've come to a point where someone will join a group as dps, do 3k dps, get kicked and then make a forum post about how commanders are toxic and people will unironically support that. Then people who point out the fact that said person was griefing the experience of 9 other people get confuse spammed because reality offends people these days.

It is hard to be compassionate or empathetic when you give people every tool available in the game to make endgame content accessible and then people still call for the content to be rendered easier instead. People have been called elitists for saying all you need to do is 7k average dps (not sure on the exact number but it was ridiculously low) for dragon's end meta. We have forum posts saying the game isn't accessible because rotations are hard when there are builds doing over 30k damage with very few buttons or builds with 0 input requirement doing over 20, hammer mechanist with 26k for instance. I'll help anyone who is willing to step up to a challenge as best as I can but I have no compassion for people who go "I paid for the game so give me an I win button for all content". 

All in all, I find the main issue to be entitlement, people look at LFG, see all the KP runs and immediately complain about gatekeeping. Noone has the power to gatekeep content in this game, you are always able to make your own squad with likeminded people and do progression runs to get introduced to the content. Similarly, you can also join a guild that offers training runs for more handholding. But no, people will do neither of those things, then proceed to complain about not getting accepted to experienced runs, calling it "toxicity". Noone owes you anything, people accepting you to a run that you aren't prepared for and going through the trouble of helping you is the exception, not the norm. You should be grateful when it happens, not complain when it doesn't. 

Lol. You're arguing with the wrong guy from the wrong generation my friend. 

[Nimris.3781]

1 hour ago, Jedrik.3109 said:

No. After thinking about this for a few weeks I realized this is the toxicity that everyone is complaining about. I have easily 200 hours in open world and I am sure there is nothing more complicated or technically challenging as the open world metas. My opinion is just as valid as yours. Yes I might not have your experience. Yes I might not know that you can portal skip spirit run. Or ignore all cannons on Sabetha. Or doing Sloth with only 4 people. Or knowing how despawn all the adds on Escort. Or the SAK bug on Xera. Or how Cairn can be soloed. Or that CM on Souless Horror typically has better wall RNG than normal mode. Or that swords can be done by one person on Conjured Amalganate. Or the dialog skip for the sorting room. Or correct fire pattern so there is no path for the adds on Qadim.

But look, none of that is important. What is important is that I paid for the game as well as many others and we should be able to play without interacting with others. The game should either spell out every mechanism in a fight or automatically move me to a safe spot and press "CC" if I missed some ridiculous animation. 

i have not seen more entitled attitude in quite some time... in shorts: "I have no clue what i am talking about, but i paid for this game so i should be handed everything i want"

also i lol'ed at "... or automatically move me to a safe spot and press "CC" if I missed some ridiculous animation". 🤣

if you dont want interacting with others, than mmo is not for you. (and with this attitude mmo is definitely not for you)

[Sobx.1758]

I think he was being sarcastic.

[Passerbye.6291]

5 hours ago, Jedrik.3109 said:

Lol. You're arguing with the wrong guy from the wrong generation my friend. 

4 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

I think he was being sarcastic.

That's why I didn't say anything about the first part of the last post, just the part about failing mechanics and my overall take ^^ 

Edit: Btw I'm glad that the initial part was trolling, I'm so tired of people unironically saying those things.

Edited December 14, 2023 by Passerbye.6291

[Nimris.3781]

12 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

I think he was being sarcastic.

forum is not a place for clowning. if a person has nothing valuable to add to the discussion, he should not post at all.

there are already few people i consider a "clowns" and often i dont even bother reading past first line of their posts as its often just a waste of time.

Edited December 14, 2023 by Nimris.3781

[Jedrik.3109]

17 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

I think he was being sarcastic.

Ding ding.

5 hours ago, Nimris.3781 said:

forum is not a place for clowning. if a person has nothing valuable to add to the discussion, he should not post at all.

there are already few people i consider a "clowns" and often i dont even bother reading past first line of their posts as its often just a waste of time.

Really? Really? With the amount of unhinged stuff that gets posted on this forum. And honestly I was just posting all the things that have been said already of these forums. And on the topic of value,  i cant remember the last time anything of "value" has been discussed. All i have seen is projected emotions and a critically unaware impression that we are not in a game together. Your derogatory opinion of me is fine and i might even say warranted considering i did not make it obvious enough that im poking fun at all of us as a community. I will continue to post for my own enjoyment.  If you choose to read or not is none of my concern.

Edit:

@Nimris.3781 wait you did find value. You lol'ed at my offering and my friend if laughter isn't value at this point I don't know what is. Much love.

Edited December 14, 2023 by Jedrik.3109
Words

[Jedrik.3109]

13 hours ago, Passerbye.6291 said:

That's why I didn't say anything about the first part of the last post, just the part about failing mechanics and my overall take ^^ 

Edit: Btw I'm glad that the initial part was trolling, I'm so tired of people unironically saying those things.

Thank you. Much love.