New Mesmer doing some theory craft with almost no knowledge of the class.

[mikexg.7329]

See title - long time ranger and necro player, coming back to the game after a couple years off and looking to make a Mesmer, specifically a virtuoso.  I really like "bard" type classes so thematically it fits.  I've been looking at some entry condi builds while I learn the ins and outs of the class and found a few that use dagger and various traits / items to apply bleed.  I am curious why Im not seeing any Virtuoso builds that use the Axe since it applies bleed innately.  I'm sure the dagger builds are better and obviously synergize well with Virt due to the "blade" flag - but is there a reason why I don't see any Axe builds?  Was theory crafting a Virtuoso tank build using trailblazer.  I don't know much about this class and have not done testing or anything, just messing around on build sites.  But am I on to something at all with this or can someone tell me I'm wasting time?

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PiwAc6ZllyYZeMF2Ie8XtxaA-DSJYkRH/Z0hEIEFgCPGAAA-e

[Geronmy.3298]

Mainly because Mirage already does better with axe and you have access to clones on it.

The easiest way i can describe condi virt to you is that it matters the most on two things, how many hits you do and getting the 100% crit cap so every crit applies bleed. Axe is slower than dagger, is melee and jagged mind does not apply bleed to its attacks so you will be handicapping your virtuoso if you opt for axe.

[mikexg.7329]

12 minutes ago, Geronmy.3298 said:

Mainly because Mirage already does better with axe and you have access to clones on it.

The easiest way i can describe condi virt to you is that it matters the most on two things, how many hits you do and getting the 100% crit cap so every crit applies bleed. Axe is slower than dagger, is melee and jagged mind does not apply bleed to its attacks so you will be handicapping your virtuoso if you opt for axe.

Appreciate the considerate reply - my reasoning was more so that you wouldn't have to take that trait, didn't need to spec for crit chance, and still get the benefit of healing from condition dmg and generating blades through bleeds.  Everything else being equal, are the clones and shatters that much better than the bladesong?

[Roadkizzle.2157]

Axe is slower, only provides 2 stacks of Bleeding and Torment with a full auto attack chain.

Axe 3 really is about clone management giving Confusion based on the number of Axe clones but the Virtuoso doesn't have any clones.

It is melee with forced movement so it puts you in dangerous situations while the Dagger is very safe.

The Dagger is slightly faster and provides more Bleeding than the axe does. Dagger 2 and Dagger 3 do multiple hits giving multiple stacks of Bleeding.

Dagger is ranged so you can control fights better.

 

The dagger is just much better in my opinion than the Axe for Virtuoso.

[Roadkizzle.2157]

7 minutes ago, mikexg.7329 said:

Appreciate the considerate reply - my reasoning was more so that you wouldn't have to take that trait, didn't need to spec for crit chance, and still get the benefit of healing from condition dmg and generating blades through bleeds.  Everything else being equal, are the clones and shatters that much better than the bladesong?

Note the Axe Bleeding is only 2s. You can't stack up enough bleeding with the axe to stock blades with the trait because the conditions fall off to quickly.

 

Virtuoso is the best DPS class for the Virtuoso. The Bladesongs work well. It's just that axe really doesn't work with the spec design. It doesn't stock blades quickly enough to use the Bladesongs as much.

Edited December 14, 2023 by Roadkizzle.2157

[dead.7638]

Power go brrrrrrrr

[Mell.4873]

You have the right idea but honestly anything outside the Meta specs really drop off in terms of damage. 

I play a half Celestial Virtuoso in open world and supplement my build with precision Sigils and Chaos with a lots of Regeneration sources. It does okay numbers wise but it is no where near the 30-40k you get from pure Condition Virtuoso.

Edited December 20, 2023 by Mell.4873