The balance is...

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

2 minutes ago, Flowki.7194 said:

 

Like hell it is.. Ive played many specs, and its absolutely obvious there is steep curves, and shallow curves. Game sense is a general, universal skill that should not be conflated with spec difficulty. But thats what people do.

I got a theoretical question for you.

A condi engie with no kits is fighting a condi firebrand.

Which spec is harder?

Follow up question, which player deserves to win that matchup?

Edited December 28, 2023 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Kuma.1503]

On 12/27/2023 at 4:34 PM, Flowki.7194 said:

I played Cata tonight, it is nion unplayable in mid elo now. Its just not worth the effort anymore, between all the block spam, LB-SB rangers jumping from range to melee with 0 effort, which takes a kitten lot more reaction in auras (at-least power untamed took skill), scourges face tanking 30k bursts, virts jumping from stealth and doing decent fking damage for a spec that has moa and invuln spam. And then warrior.

 

Take this for example. In one of the games, an enemy CORE dps gaurd teleported onto mid, was surrounded by our entire team, which inlcuded 2x DH's with traps (what a suprise). Despite all that, the core gaurd downed our necro. Now sure, the necro was probably new or lower skill.. but can we just have a moment of silence to apreciate the BS front loaded face tanking mechanics that allowed that to take place. And then im suppose to go up against a half decent WB on cata, which takes god knows how much more skill that I just don't have. 0 isnentive.

 

Please fix your game Anet.

Pro Tip from one ele to another. 

Engi isn't the class that can throw ranged skills 180 degrees behind them while kiting with superspeed. Scepter cata still has that going for it after the nerfs. Sure, they can't do it on auto attacks, but their bursts of superspeed have zero CD unlike scrapper's, and the cooldown on these skills is low enough that you can continuously pump pressure into your target while staying safe. 

You've also still got very good projectile block uptime between mag aura, magnetic wave, and siwrling winds, so ranged specs like virt have to count on bursting you before you can react, otherwise they have a lot of CDs to bait out before they can actually pressure you. 

Hammer still has insane pressure... but I've found it unplayable without fresh air and speed relic. It's squishier that way because you don't have space for smothering auras, but at least you can actually pressure people who try to kite. When it does land its damage, I'm pretty sure they have the highest consistent DPS in the game. 25 might, vuln, quickness, hard hitting skills in every attunement. Imagine if it didn't need to invest heavily into fixing its mobility issues in order to catch you... This thing would be a balance monstrosity. 

Anyway... Cata is still good from my experience. 

Edited December 28, 2023 by Kuma.1503

[Psycoprophet.8107]

Let's give every class 5 more skills over all than ele and its specs making them more complex and simultaneously giving them more options to deal with situations offensively and defensively than ele and nerf bat ele to uselessness to balance out the fact it doesn't have as many buttons to mechanically press for its rotations.... lmao yeah good plan if u ask me, prime balancing philosophy right there.

[Flowki.7194]

2 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

 

Correct.

But given that Anet seems to be unable to reward that properly....

Is that correct though? becuase I think what he is talking about there is limitation, not difficulty.

 

Take this for example. cZerker or condi mech are not hard to play, hopefully we can all agree on this? So imagine those specs now only have 10k HP, are they suddenly really hard to play? or just super punishing from the limitation of low hp? Thats exactly how DD thief is to me, super punishing, but actually not that hard to play mechanically. Most of the damage is on 2 abilitys, and there are no universal or hard counters to stealth, which would require more skill to avoid.

[Flowki.7194]

10 minutes ago, Kuma.1503 said:

Pro Tip from one ele to another. 

Engi isn't the class that can throw ranged skills 180 degrees behind them while kiting with superspeed. Scepter cata still has that going for it after the nerfs. Sure, they can't do it on auto attacks, but their bursts of superspeed have zero CD unlike scrapper's, and the cooldown on these skills is low enough that you can continuously pump pressure into your target while staying safe. 

You've also still got very good projectile block uptime between mag aura, magnetic inversion, and siwrling winds, so ranged specs like virt have to count on bursting you before you can react, otherwise they have a lot of CDs to bait out before they can actually pressure you. 

Hammer still has insane pressure... but I've found it unplayable without fresh air and speed relic. It's squishier that way because you don't have space for smothering auras, but at least you can actually pressure people who try to kite. When it does land its damage, I'm pretty sure they have the highest consistent DPS in the game. 25 might, vuln, quickness, hard hitting skills in every attunement. Imagine if it didn't need to invest heavily into fixing its mobility issues in order to catch you... This thing would be a balance monstrosity. 

Anyway... Cata is still good from my experience. 

At no point did I say cata is bad in the hands of a very good player. Im saying its simply not worth the effort in the hands of anything less. 9/10 catas (in the rare games you see them) explode on contact... which coincidently explains why you rarely see them. Unless you have a better explination? but ive played cata a while, and vs a lot of them. They are rarely past the learning curve point of being able to do what your average WB/SB/power necro etc does. Thats the result of hard punishing high skill floor specs by bloating the fk out of the sustain of low skill floor specs, you just don't see high skill floor specs often. Hollow, power vindi and herald are exactly the same, when you see them, 9/10 melt in seconds, the 1/10 are pro.. and nion godlike.

Edited December 28, 2023 by Flowki.7194

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

11 minutes ago, Flowki.7194 said:

Is that correct though? becuase I think what he is talking about there is limitation, not difficulty.

 

Take this for example. cZerker or condi mech are not hard to play, hopefully we can all agree on this? So imagine those specs now only have 10k HP, are they suddenly really hard to play? or just super punishing from the limitation of low hp?

Good question.

That depends. a Condi Zerker with 10k HP might play very differently from the condi zerkers we have now. Being able to line up a skullgrinder when anything that touches you causes you to explode may require some soft skills not reflected in button diversity, do you not agree?

Better question though, how would you differentiate difficulty of play and difficulty through limitation through balance? Is the solution to make Condi zerker, for example, weaker, to make power zerker stronger (if so how), both, or neither?

Part of your argument is correct. However, I still disagree with it (hence the steelman) because there are...obvious holes that seem to stem from not considering figuring out how to make limited builds work in a meta of complexity as skillful or as a valid form of difficulty. Your rationale for the argument is fine. 

Edited December 28, 2023 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Psycoprophet.8107]

6 minutes ago, Flowki.7194 said:

Is that correct though? becuase I think what he is talking about there is limitation, not difficulty.

 

Take this for example. cZerker or condi mech are not hard to play, hopefully we can all agree on this? So imagine those specs now only have 10k HP, are they suddenly really hard to play? or just super punishing from the limitation of low hp? Thats exactly how DD thief is to me, super punishing, but actually not that hard to play mechanically. Most of the damage is on 2 abilitys, and there are no universal or hard counters to stealth, which would require more skill to avoid.

No I'm talking about how hard a class is to be effective and viable with in general, taking in accou t many parameters......not just literally how hard mechanically it is to play. Having to press a few more buttons doesn't translate to very much added difficulty when taking the game and its classes into account fully. Ur stating that because ur class has more skills/buttons to press which allows for more dynamic rotations, more ways to deal with situations while often needing more key presses that ur class is inherently harder ro play, which is completely incorrect. There's far more to it than that and u believing ur class should be balanced to be superior than others with less skills or less dynamic rotations available is very flawed. Thats all I'm saying.

Edited December 28, 2023 by Psycoprophet.8107

[Kuma.1503]

Y'know what. It just occured to me that I'm shooting myself in the foot by trying to force Arcane into my Hammer cata build. 

I'm going to test something like this for a bit and see how it goes. Might swap eagle for dolyak if I feel like being a degenerate, but I like the big funny numbers. 

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PGgAIJlpyaZjMX2LOULpxPA-D6IWGZmA9WAmcVAAA

 

Edited December 28, 2023 by Kuma.1503

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

5 minutes ago, Burnfall.9573 said:

I have updated news. There is an upcoming MMO game that has Perfected Guild Wars 2 combat system with encorperating WvW and PvP. Guild Wars 2 right now does not need balancing, it needs reworking or removal.

Continuing, word in the Industry that Anet played a role in helping design that game server infrastructure with the help of NNSOFT. 

In other word, 2012-2023 was the last chance for any chance of Balance for Guild Wars 2. 

4 remaining days before the clock start ticking for Guild Wars 2 hard decline commences or if Anet can surprise PvP and WvW Community with releasing the most Powerful Balance patch yet that will shake up the game modes, the meta including the Professions mechanics and their designs forever and ever.

Stay tuned

I enjoyed reading this but probably not in the way you intended. 

[Burnfall.9573]

Just now, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

I enjoyed reading this but probably not in the way you intended. 

 

Thank You 🙂

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

11 minutes ago, Kuma.1503 said:

Y'know what. It just occured to me that I'm shooting myself in the foot by trying to force Arcane into my Hammer cata build. 

I'm going to test something like this for a bit and see how it goes. Might swap eagle for dolyak if I feel like being a degenerate, but I like the big funny numbers. 

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PGgAIJlpyaZjMX2LOULpxPA-D6IWGZmA9WAmcVAAA

 

Give in to degeneracy, "hehe funny number" is endgame, it's just taking everyone else a billion years to figure it out. 

[Flowki.7194]

4 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Good question.

That depends. a Condi Zerker with 10k HP might play very differently from the condi zerkers we have now. Being able to line up a skullgrinder when anything that touches you causes you to explode may require some soft skills not reflected in button diversity, do you not agree?

Better question though, how would you differentiate difficulty of play and difficulty through limitation through balance? Is the solution to make Condi zerker, for example, weaker, to make power zerker stronger (if so how), both, or neither?

Part of your argument is correct. However, I still disagree with it (hence the steelman) because there are...obvious holes. Your rationale for the argument is fine. 

 

What Im getting at is there are different constructs at play here, which are always conflated into difficulty. Like for example, when cata was meta, becuase it was so effective, people always said "cata is easy", only becuase it was effective. In my experiance, as I posted above.. 9/10 catas I ever meet litterally explode in under 10 seconds, while for the likes of necros, virts etc, that is the opposite in my experiance of both playing all those specs, and against them. The reason the likes of cata/vindi/herald explode in the hands of lower skilled players is very simple, the mechanics are spread out across multiple "stances", and the abilitys are all specific to differing encounters, which is the mechanical or "skill aspect" that makes a higher skill floor. Then, the power virsions of the specs have lower built in sustain, and lower HP than condi counter parts.. or even some power counter parts, which is where some "limitation" now starts creeeping into the equation. So what you have with those specs, is a mechanically high skill floor, and a limitation on sustain/hp. I hope that makes sense.

 

Czerker I will use for the problem example. Its application of damage and mitigation is very easy, which leads to a low skill floor. The problem then, is that it also has a very high health pool, which in combination with easy access to blind spam and 0 0 0 blocks while building zerk, ensures you will not kill this spec at all.. until its had the chance to pop off 3 condi bomb attempts. The zerker does ofc have a limitation in that all eggs are in 1 basket, so if it is dodged (3 times mind you), well there it is. The problem here is the low skill floor build up which is also too effective, which means you cannot push mistakes and punish the warrior in the first 10 seconds, mistakes that would put a cata/vindi/herald completely on the back foot.. if not leaving the fight/dead. That is my problem, not the easy damage on 1 button (which has a clear limitation as noted), its not even the low skill floor of how it builds upto doing that damage. Its the effectiveness of that low effort buildup that stops you punishing the zerker. Thats what I want to change. For example, a new stance where the zerker has immunity untied from stunbreak. The warrior then has to choose between offense or defense. If he chooses wrong, he dies in under 10 seconds. Good.

[Kuma.1503]

5 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Give in to degeneracy, "hehe funny number" is endgame, it's just taking everyone else a billion years to figure it out. 

Yknow... hammer's pressure is so nuts eagle is overkill. 

Degeneracy it is <3

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

39 minutes ago, Flowki.7194 said:

What Im getting at is there are different constructs at play here, which are always conflated into difficulty. Like for example, when cata was meta, becuase it was so effective, people always said "cata is easy", only becuase it was effective.

That's not true though. It was easy because staunch auras made it impossible to interrupt anyone that knew how to combo a field for an aura. It became a simple build to play that offered a benefit in playstyle most builds could not compete with. There's record of this.

Quote

In my experiance, as I posted above.. 9/10 catas I ever meet litterally explode in under 10 seconds, while for the likes of necros, virts etc, that is the opposite in my experiance of both playing all those specs, and against them.

The bolded above may be true, but before the patch that fixed everyone was concerned about, all you had to know was how field interactions worked to be permanently stable. 

It was in a comparable position to current-day virtuoso (which has obvious issues as well), except you couldn't walk away from it because it also had swiftness. 

Quote

The reason the likes of cata/vindi/herald explode in the hands of lower skilled players is very simple, the mechanics are spread out across multiple "stances", and the abilitys are all specific to differing encounters, which is the mechanical or "skill aspect" that makes a higher skill floor. Then, the power virsions of the specs have lower built in sustain, and lower HP than condi counter parts.. or even some power counter parts, which is where some "limitation" now starts creeeping into the equation. So what you have with those specs, is a mechanically high skill floor, and a limitation on sustain/hp. I hope that makes sense.

I'd like to point out that a lower skilled player downing immediately on a build is not something special or intrinsic to them picking up a build too complicated for them. I will talk about Vindicator later, because it's a good example of how complicated weapon sets doesnt exactly translate cleanly to skillful play. 

Quote

Czerker I will use for the problem example. Its application of damage and mitigation is very easy, which leads to a low skill floor.

Okay. Agreed,

Quote

The problem then, is that it also has a very high health pool, which in combination with easy access to blind spam and 0 0 0 blocks while building zerk, ensures you will not kill this spec at all.. until its had the chance to pop off 3 condi bomb attempts.

blind spam being one skill on one weapon set?

Quote

The zerker does ofc have a limitation in that all eggs are in 1 basket, so if it is dodged (3 times mind you), well there it is.

Okay. Agreed,

Quote

The problem here is the low skill floor build up which is also too effective, which means you cannot push mistakes and punish the warrior in the first 10 seconds, mistakes that would put a cata/vindi/herald completely on the back foot.. if not leaving the fight/dead.

Why not? The zerker can't burst you until its adrenaline is full. The first ten seconds are free. If we assume that

Quote

0,0,0 blocks

happens during this time, the warrior is also down a stunbreak. 

Quote

That is my problem, not the easy damage on 1 button (which has a clear limitation as noted), its not even the low skill floor of how it builds upto doing that damage. Its the effectiveness of that low effort buildup that stops you punishing the zerker.

This comes off as you considering a condi zerker surviving long enough to get access to its burst skills (which is where all the damage is to begin with) as the main obstacle to it being a skillful build. 

In hindsight, it sounds like builds not collapsing to damage in the first 10 seconds is your main hangup. Which don't get me wrong, I can get behind. One argument at a time though.

Is the zerker living until it's allowed to use its mechanic the part you have a problem with? I agree condi zerker is problematic, but it's not for this reason. If you have a problem with this, you have a problem with most warrior interactions.

Quote

Thats what I want to change. For example, a new stance where the zerker has immunity untied from stunbreak. The warrior then has to choose between offense or defense. If he chooses wrong, he dies in under 10 seconds. Good.

Lets say he chooses right, what happens? he then gets to continue building adrenaline to perhaps telegraph a burst to you later?

Forgive the bristling, of course. I am genuinely curious. You understand that if your solution is "it should be easier for the warrior to down in the first 10 seconds", there's a bunch of sliding factors that involve adrenaline gain and the like that will need to change as well? If you adjust the part you point out above, it is no longer on the table to require warrior continue stacking adrenaline by landing hits on you or camping signet of rage until their bar is full. The fact that the warrior is tanky or campy during the first 10 seconds is not some kind of indication of a low skill floor (though, the build is indeed easy to play), but a necessity that was imposed on them for them to play at all (adrenaline needs to be built to do damage). 

Same thing for necro. (life force needs to be built to do damage.).

If you want to make that more punishing, fine. But if you remove tools that allow that generation to happen, you should be willing to adjust tools that make that generation easier, no? I guarantee that if that is the solution we roll with, though, you will no longer have the pleasure of initiating the fight/having 10 seconds at all. There's a whole lot of reapers and warriors wishing we could get the drop on people instead of dancing around until our bars were full. 

 

Edited December 28, 2023 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[choovanski.5462]

why are people pretending ele is bad?

cata was in the December AT finals, and guess what condi zerk wasn't. I mean yeah it was played in the AT, it's a good build- but cata was played too. why are people acting like it's bad. go whine about firebrand or core engi being bad smh

🙃

Edited December 28, 2023 by choovanski.5462

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

Just now, choovanski.5462 said:

why are people pretending ele is bad?

cata was in the December AT finals, and guess what condi zerk wasn't. I mean yeah it was played in the AT, it's a good build- but cata was played too. why are people acting like it's bad

🙃

That's an excellent question we probably won't see an answer to

[Shagie.7612]

5 minutes ago, choovanski.5462 said:

why are people pretending ele is bad?

just curious, have you seen ele players

[Bunbury.8472]

9 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

 an excellent question we probably won't see an answer to

I'm watching someone with fortified earth and obsidian flesh qq about blocks and invuns like wut even... 🙃

this a wild one even for floki, like why can't the other guy block kekeke  🙃

Edited December 28, 2023 by Bunbury.8472

[Kuma.1503]

1 minute ago, Bunbury.8472 said:

I'm watching someone with fortified earth and obsidian flesh qq about blocks and invuns like wut 🙃

Dont forget conjure earth shield, mag aura, shocking aura, swirling winds, magnetic wave, 2 instant cast aoe blinds with 180 degree targeting...

Ele is fine. If an ape like me can play it, anyone can. Just read your tooltips lol. 

[Bunbury.8472]

 

4 minutes ago, Kuma.1503 said:

Dont forget conjure earth shield, mag aura, shocking aura, swirling winds, magnetic wave, 2 instant cast aoe blinds with 180 degree targeting...

Ele is fine. If an ape like me can play it, anyone can. Just read your tooltips lol. 

but I guess core warrior with shield block and endure pain is less skilled right? because you know... few buttons??? 🤣🤣🤣

Edited December 28, 2023 by Bunbury.8472

[Bunbury.8472]

goodness

if floki gets on the balance team I'm done for...

I like to play core zerk amulet hambow... not only do I even have less buttons than berserker, but I just spam hammer cc and bow AoEs... I probably only deserve to win a single game each year 🤣🤣🤣

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

19 minutes ago, Bunbury.8472 said:

goodness

if floki gets on the balance team I'm done for...

I like to play core zerk amulet hambow... not only do I even have less buttons than berserker, but I just spam hammer cc and bow AoEs... I probably only deserve to win a single game each year 🤣🤣🤣

While this is basically my internal monologue regarding this, I also am of the opinion that if playing with 10 to 15 more buttons makes it less prone to noise, I'm all for it. 

I will gladly put the Hammer down for 5 seconds if I had a kit with usable buttons on it that make the rotation less one-note.

Granted I don't think anyone would like me having more buttons, but that is the tax you need to pay for your argument to not be "these specific classes deserve to be better"

Tl;dr warrior with more buttons is just vindicator. Which, I mean, fine? Weird that this is what makes the whine go away. 

 

Edited December 28, 2023 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Flowki.7194]

1 hour ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

That's not true though. It was easy because staunch auras made it impossible to interrupt anyone that knew how to combo a field for an aura. It became a simple build to play that offered a benefit in playstyle most builds could not compete with. There's record of this.

For as long as Ive played this game, (1.5-2 year maybe) cata was never highly represented apart from the condi-signet bs. I remember playing multiple specs back then, and cata was one of the most difficult to become useful to the team, and that was after playing core ele and tempest for a fair few months before hand. Im simply saying, that spec on a mechanical level is not easy, even if it did have bloated sustain. Combos into other attunements, and auras for specific enemy is a big learning curve, vets take that for granted, especially on a spec that has <14k hp full zerk, which leaves no room at all for error. Power cata isnt even my favorite spec, it never was, im not bias toward it or hold some love thing for it, but it truly was one of the most difficult specs to get good at that ive played. When SB was meta for example, it only took me a few hours to start topping damage nion every game (I litterally had never even played the class up til that point), no average player is going to be doing that on scepter or hammer cata after a few hours. I did the same on scrapper, and I also won so many 1v2s on blade, after <10 hours in both, again, first time playing those specs. Then I go on something like hollow, kitten handed to me over and over, same with shiro vindi/herald, they are just so much more difficult to manedge dps/mitigation.

 

1 hour ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

The bolded above may be true, but before the patch that fixed everyone was concerned about, all you had to know was how field interactions worked to be permanently stable. 

It was in a comparable position to current-day virtuoso (which has obvious issues as well), except you couldn't walk away from it because it also had swiftness. 

 

Yes, but you can't now frame cata entirely into that box, and frame present day arguments with it. If it was that busted back then, ill take your word for it, I wouldnt defend it, jsut like I never defened condi-cata. If I was playing cata at that time, then I garuntee you I was still way down on that learning curve.. to the point I was still more threat on core ele than scepter cata.

 

1 hour ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

I'd like to point out that a lower skilled player downing immediately on a build is not something special or intrinsic to them picking up a build too complicated for them. I will talk about Vindicator later, because it's a good example of how complicated weapon sets doesnt exactly translate cleanly to skillful play. 

 

There are specs that are more forgiving to face tanking, or have enough blocks/invulns/shield spam to ensure they will survive 10+ seconds, despite making catastrophic errors. Ive played those specs, its black and white.

 

Take hammer cata vs Czerker. Zerker has to monitor zerk charge, cata has to monitor jade charge, at the start of any fight, its something for both to consider. But then, ontop of that, hammer has 2 extra attunements to manedge, various situational combos in one stance, and combos on stance swap, which is a real learning curve, becuase if you use aire/fire jade for stability, you then may starve water jade and take a huge sustain hit. But then, you also have orb timers to juggle, which can then be used for a sustain or damage/aura combo. Rev is similar, you have energy+CD which puts you in a state of constant monitoring of what you can and can't use, with every single ability used, save energy for stunbreak, etc etc. The amount of times I still die on rev for making the wrong call on energy consumption, its an ongoing learning curve. Its absolutely no coincidence to me that such specs are under represented.. becuase they are so difficult to get good enough where you are as effective as an "easier" spec. And thats now a bigger problem, becuase these easier specs are now more effective, which makes you have to be even better  on those higher skill floor specs, its too much.

 

1 hour ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

blind spam being one skill on one weapon set?

 

Its on 1 weapon, was the point, and its the weapon the zerker is going to be starting with anyway, so there is 0 choice to be made. On ele there are a number of different weapon/setups but essentially, blinds are something you have to swap for, which puts other attunements into cd, meaning you need to think about what is needed. I think thats partly why FA is such a common line, so that you are not locked out of 1 attunement at-least, crit depending. When not playing FA, you really feel it, when having to decide to swap for utility at the cost of damage or healing, depending on spec.

 

1 hour ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Why not? The zerker can't burst you until its adrenaline is full. The first ten seconds are free. If we assume that

 

Its not free though, its basically a stand off that I am not afforded on vindi/ele while building upto my burst. Its at the point now where I don't even stun warriors so that they do not inadvertantly stunbreak for an unconcious 0 0 0 0. Instead I try to force mistakes on their lack of ability to pre-empt the immunity, which can backfire on me easily, even if the guy isnt that good.. becuase warrior has more forgiving face tank than me, if I fk up.

 

1 hour ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

happens during this time, the warrior is also down a stunbreak. 

 

Not his only one though right? I would take 2 CD stunbreaks over vindis energy based 3.. becuase it either gimps your damage, or if you have just done some burst, you don't have enough energy to break. Its a difficult mechanic to manedge, and partly the reason your average vindi/herald explode so easily.

 

1 hour ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

This comes off as you considering a condi zerker surviving long enough to get access to its burst skills (which is where all the damage is to begin with) as the main obstacle to it being a skillful build. Is the zerker living until it's allowed to use its mechanic the part you have a problem with? I agree condi zerker is problematic, but it's not for this reason. If you have a problem with this, you have a problem with most warrior interactions.

I do have a problem with all warrior interactions, but it is intensified with Czerker, becuase you only need to get hit once to be in serious trouble, while the Zxerker has face tanked multiple of your hits. I am against any high damage single hits, not matter how unreliable they are, but especially on a low skill floor sustain spec. That includes some current ele and rev abilitys which hit way to hard, doesnt matter how glass you are.

 

1 hour ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Lets say he chooses right, what happens? he then gets to continue building adrenaline to perhaps telegraph a burst to you later?

Forgive the bristling, of course. I am genuinely curious. 

If he chooses right (I am not a current threat), he continues to burst on, then fine, if I get hit, I take damage. If he chooses wrong, does not mitigate a clear incoming burst (like after just getting stunned, and does  not break/dodge/swap to mitigation stance like I suggested) then he deserves to eat damage. Right now, warrior in general is like a locamotive train, you can't stop it rolling.. you just have to wait for it to build momentum, and then dodge it before it flattens you. I don't like that, you should be able to stop that train in under 10 seconds if the driver is an idiot. Virt is also like that, necro double life is just like that (bar a 2v1 gank). There needs to be a weakness in those first 5 or 10 seconds for such specs, so that blatent bad play gets them a trip back to spawn, no spec should be exempt from that.

 

 

Edited December 29, 2023 by Flowki.7194

[Flowki.7194]

1 hour ago, Bunbury.8472 said:

goodness

if floki gets on the balance team I'm done for...

I like to play core zerk amulet hambow... not only do I even have less buttons than berserker, but I just spam hammer cc and bow AoEs... I probably only deserve to win a single game each year 🤣🤣🤣

 

If you play like kitten you get sent back to spawn, 5 buttons or 50. You don't get to face tank your way through damage becuase you cba to move your fingers over more than 5 buttons.

Edited December 29, 2023 by Flowki.7194

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this is the type of person anet needs to ban from q imo
 

On 11/27/2023 at 8:00 PM, Flowki.7194 said:

I litterally just finished a game as hybrid core rev support,