ICD for elite-spec mechanic. What?!

[Ovark.2514]

Untamed is a mess and people have said so for a while. I have held off trying to "learn" it until it was reworked but that seems to be taking even longer. kitten Catylist is still not reworked...

Issues:

1: Even though you can Unleash yourself and your pet at will, you don't get access to the Unleashed Ambush abilities except every 9s (barring the quickness trait). This means a player needs to always have an internal timer for when they last used their Unleashed Ambush (UA).

2: You have only a 4s window to use your UA when each time you are Unleashed

3: The UI displaying the vital information of if you or your pet are Unleashed is too small and unassuming to be helpful. Even if you go by whether your pet skills are normal or unleashed, if those skills are on CD its very hard to tell which is which.

4: The UI is ugly and lazy on both the pet side as well as the Unleash button (the later being a square icon slapped over the darkened Soulbeast icon)

5: Hammer bucks the trend of the other weapons and adds unnecessary confusion. This wouldn't be a problem if all weapons had an Unleashed side and normal side, but anet doesn't want to put in that work so here we are.

 

Ideas for some solutions:

1A: Since anet seems to want to have UAs be only useable on a cooldown without actually putting a CD on Unleashing yourself or your pet. My best solution to this problem is to leave unleash self/pet a toggle as it is, but move the  UAs to the Weapon Skill #2 slot. The way this would work is that the Untamed has access to the core version of the #2 weapon skill when not Unleashed and the Ambush version when Unleashed. The UA shares the same CD as the skill that it shares a slot with. The other benefit to this solution is that you can leave the Cantrip functionality where you gain different boons/effects when activating a cantrip depending on if you are unleashed or not, as is.

1B: Solution B: Replace the Unleash toggle button with the UA skill based on your current weapon. This would have a 5-sec CD. This one has the benefit of having a very clear indication of whether you are going into or leaving Unleash Mode. When unleashing the pet, https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Venomous_Outburst should probably be chosen as the "Activate" skill while the rest can be used at will while the pet is unleashed. With this solution, cantrips would lose a little of their reactiveness since you can't always rely on being in the proper form to get boons

1C: Embrace the duality of each weapon by giving each weapon an unleashed form. Get rid of UA attacks. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Natural_Fortitude  can now apply to all weapon skills, at a lower effectiveness.

2: This can be solved with either the 1A, 1B, or 1C solutions.

3A: The Ranger should get a sort of effect around their skillbar similar to what Berserker gets when he is in berserk mode.

3B: All the skills on the player's skillbar (except pet) gain a different color when Unleashed.

4: Anet can pay an artist or UI designer for this.

5A: Choose the most appropriate effects of the two versions of each hammer skill to combine into one. The weapon needs but one form.

5B: Same as 1C

 

This is a WIP thread since I'll surely find more issues. How do you guys think anet should handle these issues?

[Mell.4873]

First the ship has sailed for any of this to changed. We are stuck with Ambushes the way they are. 

In terms of UI, things could be more clear since it can be hard to tell like you said who is Unleashed. I also agree the hammer is a big mess, they just need to remove the unleashed version and just leave it selectable like with Druid and Soulbeast. 

Saying all this Untamed from my perspective is very well received. The real problem is people don't like Pets and Soulbeast removes that mechanic. If you like Pets then both Druid and Untamed are great additions. 

[Gotejjeken.1267]

Easy fix, just remove them off leash/unleash and put as default on weapon swap.  Then change the GM trait to something else.  Maybe something fun like reducing CDs of your cantrip skills only if the ambushes actually hit.  

That way no icon, no ICD, and no unintended double ambush to worry about in PvE (where you use ambush, wait for ICD use again, then swap to use right away a third time).  

Would also be helpful if they moved them off the AA key but supposedly they are fixing that in the next patch so the ambush won't get consumed immediately if you have AA on.  Being able to select what key it goes on (most likely 1-5 only) would also be great.  

Edited March 17 by Gotejjeken.1267

[Ovark.2514]

1 hour ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

Easy fix, just remove them off leash/unleash and put as default on weapon swap.  Then change the GM trait to something else.  Maybe something fun like reducing CDs of your cantrip skills only if the ambushes actually hit.  

That way no icon, no ICD, and no unintended double ambush to worry about in PvE (where you use ambush, wait for ICD use again, then swap to use right away a third time).  

Would also be helpful if they moved them off the AA key but supposedly they are fixing that in the next patch so the ambush won't get consumed immediately if you have AA on.  Being able to select what key it goes on (most likely 1-5 only) would also be great.  

That is a good suggestion.

[Remus Darkblight.1673]

On 3/17/2024 at 1:34 AM, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

Easy fix, just remove them off leash/unleash and put as default on weapon swap.  Then change the GM trait to something else.  Maybe something fun like reducing CDs of your cantrip skills only if the ambushes actually hit.  

That way no icon, no ICD, and no unintended double ambush to worry about in PvE (where you use ambush, wait for ICD use again, then swap to use right away a third time).  

Would also be helpful if they moved them off the AA key but supposedly they are fixing that in the next patch so the ambush won't get consumed immediately if you have AA on.  Being able to select what key it goes on (most likely 1-5 only) would also be great.  

But you don't always want to only ambush on weapon swap. This would stop you from doing back-to-back ambushes for burst potential i.e. unleash > ambush > weapon swap > ambush.

The single smallest change they could make that would have the biggest positive impact, would be to have a dedicated UI element for the cooldown of your ambush that isn't just a small buff icon that sits on the already overflowing buff bar only when the ambush is actually available.

This goes for various other profession mechanics, traits, relics, etc. too. The problem isn't necessarily the class design but the over reliance on the buff bar for literally everything.

[Shaogin.2679]

I dunno, I haven't had any issues with this at all. It has the same cooldown as weapon swap. Whenever weapon swap comes off cooldown, I unleash then weapon swap and unleash again.

[Iustitian.9176]

Or just give a energy bar to the untamed: 

• Bar color shows if you or your pet is unleashed (yellow = you / green = your pet)
• Energy state shows when you can use your next unleashed attack (Full energy = Weapon skill 1 switch to unleashed attack)

Additional anet could add that cantrip skills add unleash energy (instead of simply giving boons) and unleashed pet skills could be a bit stronger but need unleash energy. 

Problems with the 2 unnecessary buff symbols solved 😉