Can't use Warclaw's Lance Ability

[Atraleos.5849]

Some reason the keybind for warclaw's lance ability isn't working for me. I failed a couple different warclaw races because I couldn't hit the targets. Turns out I have to click the ability to get it to activate. I've rebound 4th weapons skill to 'R' and "Mount Ability 2" also to 'R'. Utility skill 3 is Ctrl + R. This configuration has worked on all mounts for a very long time and only broke with this expansion.

Edit - TLDR for anyone else with this problem: Make sure Weapon Skill 4 and Mount Ability 2 do not have the same keybind. Hopefully an ArenaNet dev sees my later post in this thread where I give more diagnostic details.

Edited August 25 by Atraleos.5849
Adding Answer

[Parasite.5389]

try keeping the keybind in the first column as default, and rebinding the Mount Ability 2 to R in the second column.

https://i.imgur.com/ZnMnqh8.png these are my current keybinds, and everything works fine with no conflicts (fyi, the F2 binding for mount abilty 1 is a custom bind on my mouse)

Edited August 23 by Parasite.5389

[Shuzuru.3651]

You already stated the reason, you keybinded 2 different actions (weapon skill 4 and mount ability 2) to the same key, so it's causing problem.

[Zok.4956]

1 hour ago, Shuzuru.3651 said:

You already stated the reason, you keybinded 2 different actions (weapon skill 4 and mount ability 2) to the same key, so it's causing problem.

This is what triggered the error, but the actual cause of the error lies in the client code, which is why weapon skill 4 and mount ability 2 can get in each other's way because both seem to be queried in the client at the same time, even though this doesn't make sense and isn't even fundamentally necessary in the game.

[Shuzuru.3651]

56 minutes ago, Zok.4956 said:

This is what triggered the error, but the actual cause of the error lies in the client code, which is why weapon skill 4 and mount ability 2 can get in each other's way because both seem to be queried in the client at the same time, even though this doesn't make sense and isn't even fundamentally necessary in the game.

That not an error, more like a missing security, the one you put to prevent user errors.

[Darkvulpine.5720]

3 hours ago, Shuzuru.3651 said:

That not an error, more like a missing security, the one you put to prevent user errors.

An issue that the devs decided to make the Warclaw mount abilities as weapon skills, and thus use weapon skill keybinds but only up to the 4th skill, while 5th remains to be Mount ability 1, and placement on the hotbar is 5th, where mounts such as Skyscale and Griffon, have the 1st skill in slot 4 and 2nd in slot 5 (visual, yes)  you have these skills being overwritten by mount abilities.  Some of us have used these for years and have gotten used to having the same button for mount abilities, as we have not needed to find some arbitrary key.  GW2 already uses up a ton of key space, forcing to use modifiers (shift, ctrl, alt)  instead of having a built in radial menu for things like... mounts.  Have since used an addon for Radial Menu, but it still requires keys assigned.

What would be ideal is if the mount ability that overwrites NOT be the basic jump/etc, because that can already be activated via Dodge roll keybind.

Another option would be to just simply only have THREE be a "weaponskill" buttons and 4 and 5 be the actual "mount" abilities.

Yet another option would be to also add 3 more mount buttons, and make the warclaw use these as mount abilities instead.

 

The game already overrides your main hotbar, so why not simply be "mount abilities?"

"Why not just make it completely override weaponskills?" you ask?  So that players can at least customize their keybinds separately from weaponskills, should they desire.

Edited August 23 by Darkvulpine.5720

[Atraleos.5849]

Thanks for the additional details Darkvulpine!

I unbound mount ability 2. That fixed the Warclaw but it broke the Skyscale (and probably other mounts). Their input implementation is all kinds of messy and they've really coded themselves into a corner with this one.

At this point they need to fully commit to 5 mount abilities. Mixing weapon and mount abilities on the same bar is confusing to the player and will never work cleanly. Eliminating mount abilities altogether will cause problems for those of us that have bound mount abilities to the dodge button (or other buttons that are disabled only while you are mounted).

I would love if they allowed us to rearrange the default position of weapon and / or mount abilities on the action bar. I would put Roller Beetle's Drift ability in the engage slot. I've been juggling my keybinds since my mouse died (I lost button count with my new mouse!) and I need to get the drift ability off the fingers I use for movement.

[ywhl.8592]

Gonna drop this in this thread as well as others I see, if only-

God Tier, Even Microsofts xbox controller peripherals for disabled peoples quakes in their boots

[Darkvulpine.5720]

1 hour ago, ywhl.8592 said:

Gonna drop this in this thread as well as others I see, if only-

God Tier, Even Microsofts xbox controller peripherals for disabled peoples quakes in their boots

What am I looking at?

[Shuzuru.3651]

6 hours ago, Darkvulpine.5720 said:

An issue that the devs decided to make the Warclaw mount abilities as weapon skills, and thus use weapon skill keybinds but only up to the 4th skill, while 5th remains to be Mount ability 1, and placement on the hotbar is 5th, where mounts such as Skyscale and Griffon, have the 1st skill in slot 4 and 2nd in slot 5 (visual, yes)  you have these skills being overwritten by mount abilities.  Some of us have used these for years and have gotten used to having the same button for mount abilities, as we have not needed to find some arbitrary key.  GW2 already uses up a ton of key space, forcing to use modifiers (shift, ctrl, alt)  instead of having a built in radial menu for things like... mounts.  Have since used an addon for Radial Menu, but it still requires keys assigned.

What would be ideal is if the mount ability that overwrites NOT be the basic jump/etc, because that can already be activated via Dodge roll keybind.

Another option would be to just simply only have THREE be a "weaponskill" buttons and 4 and 5 be the actual "mount" abilities.

Yet another option would be to also add 3 more mount buttons, and make the warclaw use these as mount abilities instead.

 

The game already overrides your main hotbar, so why not simply be "mount abilities?"

"Why not just make it completely override weaponskills?" you ask?  So that players can at least customize their keybinds separately from weaponskills, should they desire.

I never said it was completely an user error, the missing safeguard is an dev errors by itself, the fact they added mount abilities at the place belonging to weapon skill is another. For your information, originaly, mount worked like everything, with engage bound to weapon skill 1 and Warclaw first 4 skill bound to weapon 1-4), other buttons didn't existed (on the left side, I mean)

In a second time, maybe like 2 years ago? Even less, but it's recent. They decided to added bouton to the mount abilities, who worked like jump or dodge ( = with a keybind, but no icon). For some obscure reason, they added them to the space reserved to weapon skill. For most mount, it's fine, but for Warclaw, it can lead to confusion.

So yeah, that's probably an oversight from the devs, but doesn't change the fact it then lead to user errors.

[Maienstern.2154]

I've had that issue twice now. I am trying to learn griffon stunt flying and it's incredibly annoying that I have to change my keybinds every few months, especially since the original was very comfortable for me. By default the griffon's dive is bound to v and 2 and the climb is bound to c and 3. I was using 2 and 3 on my gaming mouse a lot for my griffon and had just gotten used to the weird feeling of pressing 2 for the ability in the 5th slot. It was very comfortable to reach for me. Then I got into SotO and started to train the skyscale masteries and dash and fireball were now overlapping, preventing me from using the fireball. I really wanted to prioritize the griffon and rebind the fireball, but I couldn't, which was really confusing to me. Why is that not a mount skill? Anyway, after searching in vain for a solution I finally, very reluctantly, rebound dive and climb to 5 and 4. It's not the most comfortable to reach for me, but at least it's inline with the UI. And now that I have finally gotten used to the new setup, I run into the same issue with the warclaw. And this time I am out of keys, that I can comfortably reach. I would just ignore the warclaw's lance, but it's so nicely integrated, that it really hampers my game play and takes a lot of fun out of it. I want to be able to do the warclaw race adventure and stunt flying is hard enough without having to complety relearn how you control your character. And this time around I really don't get why this happened. It's not like the warclaw had a different ability in that slot. I don't know the first thing about programming, so I can't make a constructive suggestion about how to fix this, but it's a serious blemish on an otherwise really excellent mount system.

I would have started my own thread, but since this issue is already being discussed, I figured it's better to just join in here. I really hope this is just one of the new expansion growing pains and will be fixed soon. 

[Atraleos.5849]

Yes it is very frustrating that they have broken the mount functionality a couple times now. I ended putting mount ability 2 on shift, but it isn't ideal.

You might consider moving the movent skills to ESDF instead of WASD. Doing this means abilities can be on AQWRT.

[Maienstern.2154]

@Atraleos.5849 I did consider doing something like that, but that means I would have to completely relearn how to use the controls. I have a g 600, ALL my weapon/mount ability are on my mouse. My hands are very small (I wear children's gloves), so I can't reach all that many keys. I do use shift for profession skills, because I can't reach the F keys. I thought about putting lance on shift+4 but that would mess up my regular weapon skills. Alternatively I could put climb on shift+4 but I really don't want to make the griffon any harder than it already is. I enjoy flying it, but I don't think I can handle any increase in difficulty. Currently I have a feeling, like this might turn into a quitting moment. Which is a bloody shame, since I am loving the expansion so far. However it really sucks that one of the features I have initially been enjoying most, is so messed up right now. I'll keep trying different things for now, while hoping that the devs are going to fix the hot mess that is mount ability keybinds. Or at the very least give us an explanation of why it is the way it is. They set the mounts up to be something players had to put effort into learning how to handle, which makes them so great, but I wish they would stop "deleting" my progress. 

[Atraleos.5849]

@Maienstern.2154 Sounds like we are similar, I also have fairly small hands. I went from the G604 (RIP double click) to the G502. I've put Ctrl on one of the mouse thumb buttons and use that as a modifier for all skills so AQWRT covers weapon skills, utility, healing , and ult. It was a transition learning to use ctrl on the right thumb, but it works well. My profession F skills were moved down to the numbers and the F buttons are now for each of the mounts.

[Kelly.7019]

On 8/23/2024 at 1:10 AM, Atraleos.5849 said:

Some reason the keybind for warclaw's lance ability isn't working for me. I failed a couple different warclaw races because I couldn't hit the targets. Turns out I have to click the ability to get it to activate. I've rebound 4th weapons skill to 'R' and "Mount Ability 2" also to 'R'. Utility skill 3 is Ctrl + R. This configuration has worked on all mounts for a very long time and only broke with this expansion.

click with yer mouse you mean- fun times ! i've been doing that since skyscale during PoF!!

I think it has something to do with Priority and not including all their mount skills on the ui bar. then new code comes in and messes it up or it was coded the old way which causes priority issues.

Edited August 24 by Kelly.7019

[Kelly.7019]

12 hours ago, Shuzuru.3651 said:

18 hours ago, Darkvulpine.5720 said:

An issue that the devs decided to make the Warclaw mount abilities as weapon skills, and thus use weapon skill keybinds but only up to the 4th skill, while 5th remains to be Mount ability 1, and placement on the hotbar is 5th, where mounts such as Skyscale and Griffon, have the 1st skill in slot 4 and 2nd in slot 5 (visual, yes)  you have these skills being overwritten by mount abilities.  Some of us have used these for years and have gotten used to having the same button for mount abilities, as we have not needed to find some arbitrary key.  GW2 already uses up a ton of key space, forcing to use modifiers (shift, ctrl, alt)  instead of having a built in radial menu for things like... mounts.  Have since used an addon for Radial Menu, but it still requires keys assigned.

What would be ideal is if the mount ability that overwrites NOT be the basic jump/etc, because that can already be activated via Dodge roll keybind.

Another option would be to just simply only have THREE be a "weaponskill" buttons and 4 and 5 be the actual "mount" abilities.

Yet another option would be to also add 3 more mount buttons, and make the warclaw use these as mount abilities instead.

 

The game already overrides your main hotbar, so why not simply be "mount abilities?"

"Why not just make it completely override weaponskills?" you ask?  So that players can at least customize their keybinds separately from weaponskills, should they desire.

 

YES DO NOT MAKE MOUNT SKILLS WEAPON SKILLS THIS CAUSES MAD PROBLEMS! they should have known this since Skyscales Fireball!

1) I think the key here is priority. if mounted mount skills should override weapon skills.

2) all mount skills should be listed on the ui . I know originally they weren't but since they've added more, and they added the special mount ability 1 and 2 to the ui bar as well, it's messed up, but its been like that for a while, it's just more people get to discover their wonderful coding style. It would have made more sense to begin with to have the special mount ability 1 and 2 just be normal mount skills specific to the mounts and be on the ui bar as skill 2 and 3.

3) make the  mount skills rebindable. much like you can keybind your weapon skills , allow us to rebind mount skills. (this is important because probably people might like their binds they've been using since Pof*) 4 slots currently being used  let us rebind those to whatever we want then make mount skills the priority when we are mounted.

* this is the problem for me, there is something off in their coding since Skyscale was introduced.(warclaw and skiff also has these problems and skimmer dive- all introduced after skyscale fireball!) it's probably the priority issue and  mount skills are coded as weapon skills. Since PoF I have had to accept buttons just will not work and i have to click on them with my mouse to get them to activate. The Gods told me a long time ago unless a lot of people have an issue with it, they won't bother fixing it.

 

edit: I highly suggest you guys keep this page active or tell others to come and comment on it, since its only 1 page long that doesn't look good for them fixing it.

Edited August 24 by Kelly.7019

[Kelly.7019]

 

On 8/23/2024 at 4:22 AM, Shuzuru.3651 said:

You already stated the reason, you keybinded 2 different actions (weapon skill 4 and mount ability 2) to the same key, so it's causing problem.

weapons skills and mount skills shouldn't conflict with each other. mount skills should override weapon skills when mounted. (anet doesn't do this, but that's what logically should happen)

23 hours ago, Zok.4956 said:

This is what triggered the error, but the actual cause of the error lies in the client code, which is why weapon skill 4 and mount ability 2 can get in each other's way because both seem to be queried in the client at the same time, even though this doesn't make sense and isn't even fundamentally necessary in the game.

interesting

Edited August 24 by Kelly.7019

[Shuzuru.3651]

4 hours ago, Maienstern.2154 said:

@Atraleos.5849 I did consider doing something like that, but that means I would have to completely relearn how to use the controls. I have a g 600, ALL my weapon/mount ability are on my mouse. My hands are very small (I wear children's gloves), so I can't reach all that many keys. I do use shift for profession skills, because I can't reach the F keys. I thought about putting lance on shift+4 but that would mess up my regular weapon skills. Alternatively I could put climb on shift+4 but I really don't want to make the griffon any harder than it already is. I enjoy flying it, but I don't think I can handle any increase in difficulty. Currently I have a feeling, like this might turn into a quitting moment. Which is a bloody shame, since I am loving the expansion so far. However it really sucks that one of the features I have initially been enjoying most, is so messed up right now. I'll keep trying different things for now, while hoping that the devs are going to fix the hot mess that is mount ability keybinds. Or at the very least give us an explanation of why it is the way it is. They set the mounts up to be something players had to put effort into learning how to handle, which makes them so great, but I wish they would stop "deleting" my progress. 

Hum, maybe use the keybind you use for weapons swap? Like the dodge keybind, that one should be accessible easily, idealy.

[Maienstern.2154]

@Shuzuru.3651 that would be easily accessible, yes. However it's in reach of my pinky finger. Works fine for weapon swap, but for stunt flying you have to hold down climb for prolonged periods of time, so that would feel super awkward. As I said, I'll keep trying stuff. I'll figure something out. But the much bigger issues for me is, that this happens with every expansions now. Am I going to have to rebind and relearn my mount controls every year? Getting progressively more awkward?  It truly does feel like they keep resetting my learning progress, which is just no fun. 

[Zok.4956]

13 hours ago, Shuzuru.3651 said:

I never said it was completely an user error, the missing safeguard is an dev errors by itself, the fact they added mount abilities at the place belonging to weapon skill is another.
(...)
So yeah, that's probably an oversight from the devs, but doesn't change the fact it then lead to user errors.

It is not even partly a user error, but 100% a software (design) error.  It's not a forgotten safeguard. If the skills/keybindings had been programmed differently (it has been written many times that this is basically possible) these current user keybindings would have worked without any problems. As it is now, it is a software (design) bug. Why do you blame the user (even if only partially) and defend bad software (design)? 

[Bowdidly.7401]

21 minutes ago, Zok.4956 said:

It is not even partly a user error, but 100% a software (design) error.  It's not a forgotten safeguard. If the skills/keybindings had been programmed differently (it has been written many times that this is basically possible) these current user keybindings would have worked without any problems. As it is now, it is a software (design) bug. Why do you blame the user (even if only partially) and defend bad software (design)? 

Definatly a game issue since Janthir patch last week and it is only with the Warclaw mount keybinds,  I have yesterday rebound every key to DEFAULT, { which is default C and  V still does not work, deleted "data" file in app data, repaired game files etc , done everything and still when on Warclaw AND ONLY WARCLAW mount action button is bugged, if I bind it to a key were it does finally work it messes up with the Skiff and fishing binds

 Since patch and Warclaw was added to PVE game with its Lance ability the ONLY way I can get it to work were it is Playable and NOT affecting other mount/fishing binds is to MANUALY mouse click button 3 when on my Warclaw, defiantly a software issue since Janthir wilds patch

Edited August 24 by Bowdidly.7401
update

[Shuzuru.3651]

50 minutes ago, Zok.4956 said:

It is not even partly a user error, but 100% a software (design) error.  It's not a forgotten safeguard. If the skills/keybindings had been programmed differently (it has been written many times that this is basically possible) these current user keybindings would have worked without any problems. As it is now, it is a software (design) bug. Why do you blame the user (even if only partially) and defend bad software (design)? 

Because if you add the missing safeguard and fix the ui (which is a software issue, so I never said there is no problem there), you litterally solve the problem and don't break the original design that no one complaint about for 12 years, because it's GOOD.

Every other suggestions I saw there was basically both breaking the design, and inpractical, don't you think if they wanted mount mouvement skill to be classic skill, they would have simply bind them by default on weapons skill 4-5 and not on special action which one of them is both fonctionnaly similar to the dodge (cost endurance, create a mouvement, make you dodge with the right mastery) but also is binded by default on the same key as the dodge?

[Darkvulpine.5720]

3 hours ago, Kelly.7019 said:

YES DO NOT MAKE MOUNT SKILLS WEAPON SKILLS THIS CAUSES MAD PROBLEMS! they should have known this since Skyscales Fireball!

1) I think the key here is priority. if mounted mount skills should override weapon skills.

2) all mount skills should be listed on the ui . I know originally they weren't but since they've added more, and they added the special mount ability 1 and 2 to the ui bar as well, it's messed up, but its been like that for a while, it's just more people get to discover their wonderful coding style. It would have made more sense to begin with to have the special mount ability 1 and 2 just be normal mount skills specific to the mounts and be on the ui bar as skill 2 and 3.

3) make the  mount skills rebindable. much like you can keybind your weapon skills , allow us to rebind mount skills. (this is important because probably people might like their binds they've been using since Pof*) 4 slots currently being used  let us rebind those to whatever we want then make mount skills the priority when we are mounted.

* this is the problem for me, there is something off in their coding since Skyscale was introduced.(warclaw and skiff also has these problems and skimmer dive- all introduced after skyscale fireball!) it's probably the priority issue and  mount skills are coded as weapon skills. Since PoF I have had to accept buttons just will not work and i have to click on them with my mouse to get them to activate. The Gods told me a long time ago unless a lot of people have an issue with it, they won't bother fixing it.

 

edit: I highly suggest you guys keep this page active or tell others to come and comment on it, since its only 1 page long that doesn't look good for them fixing it.

One thing they will need to make sure if they were to do this going forward, not just with mount skills but most systems for keybinds.  Consistency.  A hotkey should always be similar. 

For the most part the mount skills are in fact similar.  I would say one inconsistency that comes to mind would be Skyscale and Griffon. 

Mount skill 1 for griffon that descends, the same button is the dash for the Skyscale. 

Mount skill 2:  Griffon -Ascend,  Skyscale -Descend

These abilities I assigned to both 4 and 5 on my keyboard, but more importantly: my side buttons on mouse.  bottom mouse for griffon descend, top mouse for ascend.

[Bowdidly.7401]

12 minutes ago, Darkvulpine.5720 said:

One thing they will need to make sure if they were to do this going forward, not just with mount skills but most systems for keybinds.  Consistency.  A hotkey should always be similar. 

For the most part the mount skills are in fact similar.  I would say one inconsistency that comes to mind would be Skyscale and Griffon. 

Mount skill 1 for griffon that descends, the same button is the dash for the Skyscale. 

Mount skill 2:  Griffon -Ascend,  Skyscale -Descend

These abilities I assigned to both 4 and 5 on my keyboard, but more importantly: my side buttons on mouse.  bottom mouse for griffon descend, top mouse for ascend.

 agree, also IMO one other HUGE option concerning skill bars which would be "up to date" with 90% of other MMO's would be to have the actual skills movable on the skill bars, you can already do it with the profession and race skills, they are "customizable" why not mount and also weapon skills ? that would be a absolute massive QOL leap forward

  They could also have a "tick" option box to either use "default" bind options or "customizable binds" so to make it easy for people who are happy how things are.

Edited August 24 by Bowdidly.7401

[Zok.4956]

3 hours ago, Shuzuru.3651 said:

Because if you add the missing safeguard and fix the ui (which is a software issue, so I never said there is no problem there), you litterally solve the problem and don't break the original design that no one complaint about for 12 years, because it's GOOD.

What you are suggesting is a workaround, but not a fix for the underlying bug. Again: Why are you defending those software bugs? 

It doesn't matter if a software perfectly met the requirements 12 years ago. If software requirements change over a period of 12 years, you can try to adapt it with minimal changes/fixes (because there is no time, no money, etc. for a good solution) but in the end you build up a "technical debt" which eventually leads to errors later on that can only be fixed with great effort (if they are not ignored).

And it's not true that the errors are only now occurring. There were already such mapping errors in the IBS (the story mission with the tank), then later in EoD (Skiff). So there have been error messages (ignored/unanswered by Anet) in the bug forum for many years. But these were just marginal phenomena for some users, which could then be ignored. But now that the Warclaw and its functions are the focus in PvE in the JW expansion, more and more users are noticing these errors.

 

Edited August 24 by Zok.4956