Am I the only one dissapointed?

[Aomine.5012]

Saying Holosmith is squishy when they have a 25 seconds aoe protection skill, as well as lots of CC..

I wonder how people trait themselves. Do they even grab alchemy?

[coglin.1496]

@Nubu.6148 said:In love with my Holo static discharge build ! Sure holo is squishy but in my opinion its not a proffesion for everyone ....The only thing i would love to see , that rifle scales with heat level .

So I first read this post and almost asked if "static discharge" actually worked when swapping in or out of holosmith because it is in line with the other tool belt skills. Then I thought, why ask, when I can log in and test it myself. I can confirm that it sends out a static discharge bolt BOTH when ENTERING as well as EXITING holosmith mode. So holosmith does at least do a good job of utilizing the "static discharge" trait.

[ibkillin.9610]

I enjoy Holosmith but I feel the sword is lackluster and it would be nice if the shield offered resistance and the heat mechanic work for pistols and rifles. We'll see what happens next balance path, I hope they improve firearms and inventions cause those need some updating to go with all the new mechanics introduced since HoT and beyond.

[Aldath.1275]

@Aomine.5012 said:Saying Holosmith is squishy when they have a 25 seconds aoe protection skill, as well as lots of CC..

I wonder how people trait themselves. Do they even grab alchemy?

That's the thing. The meta as it stands right now isn't friendly to non-DPS roles, unless they bring lots of CC and buffs, that's why Druid, PS Warr and Chrono can get away with hitting like a noodle.

High DPS and squishy classes like Thief and Guardian have forms of damage mitigation, like Aegis or life drain or evades. Elementalist hits like a truck and has few survivability options with the perk that he gives wide areas while being ranged, and having immense DPS.

Holo is melee, deals less damage than Staff DD, his buffs and utility are all personal oriented, and he lacks damage mitigation unless you slot a trait line like alchemy or inventions, which is a severe DPS loss, sacrificing either explosives, firearms or tools, in order to avoid being mauled, when Thief and Guardian don't even have to sacrifice trait lines. Don't pretend his barrier or blocks are even close to good.

This class is the Reaper all over again, hyped because of the thematic, but in the end it's selfish with only damage as time, and even then his damage is pretty much the same as power engi, with less utility and survivability.

[Rikou.4720]

I'm disappointed in that holosmith feels too weak, it would've been nice if the heat mechanic was added to engi's other weapons. I had hoped it would be the power engi buff I needed but it just doesn't feel much stronger. :(

[Bossun.2046]

I am disappointed in the utilities and F skills. Lackluster...

[Andred.1087]

Guess I'm in the minority here but I was literally never going to touch my Engi again until this. As someone who is accustomed to a glass-cannon melee style, I love Holosmith so far.

[Aomine.5012]

@Aldath.1275 said:

@Aomine.5012 said:Saying Holosmith is squishy when they have a 25 seconds aoe protection skill, as well as lots of CC..

I wonder how people trait themselves. Do they even grab alchemy?

That's the thing. The meta as it stands right now isn't friendly to non-DPS roles, unless they bring lots of CC and buffs, that's why Druid, PS Warr and Chrono can get away with hitting like a noodle.

High DPS and squishy classes like Thief and Guardian have forms of damage mitigation, like Aegis or life drain or evades. Elementalist hits like a truck and has few survivability options with the perk that he gives wide areas while being ranged, and having immense DPS.

Holo is melee, deals less damage than Staff DD, his buffs and utility are all personal oriented, and he lacks damage mitigation unless you slot a trait line like alchemy or inventions, which is a severe DPS loss, sacrificing either explosives, firearms or tools, in order to avoid being mauled, when Thief and Guardian don't even have to sacrifice trait lines. Don't pretend his barrier or blocks are even close to good.

This class is the Reaper all over again, hyped because of the thematic, but in the end it's selfish with only damage as time, and even then his damage is pretty much the same as power engi, with less utility and survivability.

I highly doubt it's only damage selfish build though.

If people stop caring too much about that little number difference, maybe they'd start appreciating a 25 seconds group wide protection in a casual t4 fractal run.It's not like 30k~ something damage is low or anything in HoT standard.

It's not like Engi doesn't have unique buff in terms of +150 group wide condi damage.

For example Reaper, even though they're not top dps, they're just super tanky, does massive break bar damage, lots of weakness and chill application as control, so even though they don't do top tier dps, they are still highly desirable in fractal , as well as super powerful in open world.

Also I have every single classes, and in order to survive in LS3 and PoF map, all of them need to run at least one , sometimes two defensive traits.Many of them are squishier than you thought. (Go try Firebrand, they're super squishy when solo)

[insanemaniac.2456]

@Andred.1087 said:Guess I'm in the minority here but I was literally never going to touch my Engi again until this. As someone who is accustomed to a glass-cannon melee style, I love Holosmith so far.

oh no, I more or less abandoned playing engi in pve content that isnt trivially easy when hot came out and was really looking forward to playing a dps oriented engi spec. and holo is fun, it's just got bad dps compared to classes not named mesmer and thief. so either they missed the mark on 6 classes and 6 classes have specs that need to be nerfed and they don't actually intend to power creep the game by another 10k dps, or they left 3 classes behind and are intentionally doing again exactly what they said they wouldn't do with hot and still claim they don't believe in.

[Vagrant.7206]

@Aomine.5012 said:

@Aldath.1275 said:

@Aomine.5012 said:Saying Holosmith is squishy when they have a 25 seconds aoe protection skill, as well as lots of CC..

I wonder how people trait themselves. Do they even grab alchemy?

That's the thing. The meta as it stands right now isn't friendly to non-DPS roles, unless they bring lots of CC and buffs, that's why Druid, PS Warr and Chrono can get away with hitting like a noodle.

High DPS and squishy classes like Thief and Guardian have forms of damage mitigation, like Aegis or life drain or evades. Elementalist hits like a truck and has few survivability options with the perk that he gives wide areas while being ranged, and having immense DPS.

Holo is melee, deals less damage than Staff DD, his buffs and utility are all personal oriented, and he lacks damage mitigation unless you slot a trait line like alchemy or inventions, which is a severe DPS loss, sacrificing either explosives, firearms or tools, in order to avoid being mauled, when Thief and Guardian don't even have to sacrifice trait lines. Don't pretend his barrier or blocks are even close to good.

This class is the Reaper all over again, hyped because of the thematic, but in the end it's selfish with only damage as time, and even then his damage is pretty much the same as power engi, with less utility and survivability.

I highly doubt it's only damage selfish build though.

If people stop caring too much about that little number difference, maybe they'd start appreciating a 25 seconds group wide protection in a casual t4 fractal run.It's not like 30k~ something damage is low or anything in HoT standard.

It's not like Engi doesn't have unique buff in terms of +150 group wide condi damage.

For example Reaper, even though they're not top dps, they're just super tanky, does massive break bar damage, lots of weakness and chill application as control, so even though they don't do top tier dps, they are still highly desirable in fractal , as well as super powerful in open world.

Also I have every single classes, and in order to survive in LS3 and PoF map, all of them need to run at least one , sometimes two defensive traits.Many of them are squishier than you thought. (Go try Firebrand, they're super squishy when solo)

You realize that that extra DPS can contribute in ways more valuable than the 25s of protection, right?

If a team has another 10k+ DPS, that means the big boss goes down or phases 10k DPS faster -- which often is more valuable than that 25s of protection (which can also be stripped). Reduced time for fights also means there's a much smaller chance for mistakes to be made, and for faster progression (which is good for morale). As it stands, our DPS only reaches that 30-35k DPS on holo if we abandon all defensive traits and pick only offensive traits and skills, which is unrealistic for DPS as lackluster as this.

Condi engi, on the other hand, still does more DPS AND retains a lot of survivability and group buffing.

[Aomine.5012]

@Vagrant.7206 said:

@Aomine.5012 said:

@Aldath.1275 said:

@Aomine.5012 said:Saying Holosmith is squishy when they have a 25 seconds aoe protection skill, as well as lots of CC..

I wonder how people trait themselves. Do they even grab alchemy?

That's the thing. The meta as it stands right now isn't friendly to non-DPS roles, unless they bring lots of CC and buffs, that's why Druid, PS Warr and Chrono can get away with hitting like a noodle.

High DPS and squishy classes like Thief and Guardian have forms of damage mitigation, like Aegis or life drain or evades. Elementalist hits like a truck and has few survivability options with the perk that he gives wide areas while being ranged, and having immense DPS.

Holo is melee, deals less damage than Staff DD, his buffs and utility are all personal oriented, and he lacks damage mitigation unless you slot a trait line like alchemy or inventions, which is a severe DPS loss, sacrificing either explosives, firearms or tools, in order to avoid being mauled, when Thief and Guardian don't even have to sacrifice trait lines. Don't pretend his barrier or blocks are even close to good.

This class is the Reaper all over again, hyped because of the thematic, but in the end it's selfish with only damage as time, and even then his damage is pretty much the same as power engi, with less utility and survivability.

I highly doubt it's only damage selfish build though.

If people stop caring too much about that little number difference, maybe they'd start appreciating a 25 seconds group wide protection in a casual t4 fractal run.It's not like 30k~ something damage is low or anything in HoT standard.

It's not like Engi doesn't have unique buff in terms of +150 group wide condi damage.

For example Reaper, even though they're not top dps, they're just super tanky, does massive break bar damage, lots of weakness and chill application as control, so even though they don't do top tier dps, they are still highly desirable in fractal , as well as super powerful in open world.

Also I have every single classes, and in order to survive in LS3 and PoF map, all of them need to run at least one , sometimes two defensive traits.Many of them are squishier than you thought. (Go try Firebrand, they're super squishy when solo)

You realize that that extra DPS can contribute in ways more valuable than the 25s of protection, right?

If a team has another 10k+ DPS, that means the big boss goes down or phases 10k DPS faster -- which often is more valuable than that 25s of protection (which can also be stripped). Reduced time for fights also means there's a much smaller chance for mistakes to be made, and for faster progression (which is good for morale). As it stands, our DPS only reaches that 30-35k DPS on holo if we abandon all defensive traits and pick only offensive traits and skills, which is unrealistic for DPS as lackluster as this.

Condi engi, on the other hand, still does more DPS

AND

retains a lot of survivability and group buffing.

I'd take massive protection over 5k more dps in fractal any days because many encounter are either hordes or just mechanic boss that stall for awhile.If people gonna die , they're gonna die anyway even though they do like 5k more damage. It's the same why I like Reaper more than other condi spec with similar dps.

I'm talking about 25 sec GROUP PROTECTION, benefiting the whole party, not just yourself. You don't have to grab any defensive trait, just one utility skill.This skill is even more powerful than Tempest's Earth Overload pre-nerf because you don't need to channel it like Ele did. (One cast 1/2 sec)

PS: condi engi is the more selfish build lolz.. The rotation is too hard for just doing the same damage as every other dps build.They don't even have 600 range big CC skill that're super useful against tough trash hordes in certain stages.

PS2: Just because you didn't do as much damage as that OP Firebrand build doesn't mean 30~35k dps is weak.Firebrand is going to get nerfed anyway. 50K dps is the outlier here.

[Lighter.5631]

yea its too warrior, which is what i like, had to make a engi for this.anyway, i so wish warrior had this lol..

[insanemaniac.2456]

@Aomine.5012 said:

I'd take massive protection over 5k more dps in fractal any days because many encounter are either hordes or just mechanic boss that stall for awhile.If people gonna die , they're gonna die anyway even though they do like 5k more damage. It's the same why I like Reaper more than other condi spec with similar dps.

I'm talking about 25 sec GROUP PROTECTION, benefiting the whole party, not just yourself. You don't have to grab any defensive trait, just one utility skill.This skill is even more powerful than Tempest's Earth Overload pre-nerf because you don't need to channel it like Ele did. (One cast 1/2 sec)

PS: condi engi is the more selfish build lolz.. The rotation is too hard for just doing the same damage as every other dps build.They don't even have 600 range big CC skill that're super useful against tough trash hordes in certain stages.

why not both

if you have a friend you "always" go with, the 2 of you could split between ps warrior and druid/healer ele. would be faster than you playing necro and your friend playing whatever, even though with you on necro you can guarantee your own survival and prolly make the whole run easy... but as a healer + buffer combo youll cut your time by 1/3 and retain your survivability. engi cant do that any more, not since pre hot =/

[Soon.5240]

I haven't seen anything in Holo that will convince me to reforge all my Dire Ascended armor and weapons to a power-based build. My P/P Engi is doing just fine in the maps....

[Vagrant.7206]

@Aomine.5012 said:

@Vagrant.7206 said:

@Aomine.5012 said:

@Aldath.1275 said:

@Aomine.5012 said:Saying Holosmith is squishy when they have a 25 seconds aoe protection skill, as well as lots of CC..

I wonder how people trait themselves. Do they even grab alchemy?

That's the thing. The meta as it stands right now isn't friendly to non-DPS roles, unless they bring lots of CC and buffs, that's why Druid, PS Warr and Chrono can get away with hitting like a noodle.

High DPS and squishy classes like Thief and Guardian have forms of damage mitigation, like Aegis or life drain or evades. Elementalist hits like a truck and has few survivability options with the perk that he gives wide areas while being ranged, and having immense DPS.

Holo is melee, deals less damage than Staff DD, his buffs and utility are all personal oriented, and he lacks damage mitigation unless you slot a trait line like alchemy or inventions, which is a severe DPS loss, sacrificing either explosives, firearms or tools, in order to avoid being mauled, when Thief and Guardian don't even have to sacrifice trait lines. Don't pretend his barrier or blocks are even close to good.

This class is the Reaper all over again, hyped because of the thematic, but in the end it's selfish with only damage as time, and even then his damage is pretty much the same as power engi, with less utility and survivability.

I highly doubt it's only damage selfish build though.

If people stop caring too much about that little number difference, maybe they'd start appreciating a 25 seconds group wide protection in a casual t4 fractal run.It's not like 30k~ something damage is low or anything in HoT standard.

It's not like Engi doesn't have unique buff in terms of +150 group wide condi damage.

For example Reaper, even though they're not top dps, they're just super tanky, does massive break bar damage, lots of weakness and chill application as control, so even though they don't do top tier dps, they are still highly desirable in fractal , as well as super powerful in open world.

Also I have every single classes, and in order to survive in LS3 and PoF map, all of them need to run at least one , sometimes two defensive traits.Many of them are squishier than you thought. (Go try Firebrand, they're super squishy when solo)

You realize that that extra DPS can contribute in ways more valuable than the 25s of protection, right?

If a team has another 10k+ DPS, that means the big boss goes down or phases 10k DPS faster -- which often is more valuable than that 25s of protection (which can also be stripped). Reduced time for fights also means there's a much smaller chance for mistakes to be made, and for faster progression (which is good for morale). As it stands, our DPS only reaches that 30-35k DPS on holo if we abandon all defensive traits and pick only offensive traits and skills, which is unrealistic for DPS as lackluster as this.

Condi engi, on the other hand, still does more DPS

AND

retains a lot of survivability and group buffing.

I'd take massive protection over 5k more dps in fractal any days because many encounter are either hordes or just mechanic boss that stall for awhile.If people gonna die , they're gonna die anyway even though they do like 5k more damage. It's the same why I like Reaper more than other condi spec with similar dps.

I'm talking about 25 sec GROUP PROTECTION, benefiting the whole party, not just yourself. You don't have to grab any defensive trait, just one utility skill.This skill is even more powerful than Tempest's Earth Overload pre-nerf because you don't need to channel it like Ele did. (One cast 1/2 sec)

PS: condi engi is the more selfish build lolz.. The rotation is too hard for just doing the same damage as every other dps build.They don't even have 600 range big CC skill that're super useful against tough trash hordes in certain stages.

PS2: Just because you didn't do as much damage as that OP Firebrand build doesn't mean 30~35k dps is weak.Firebrand is going to get nerfed anyway. 50K dps is the outlier here.

I think you missed my point:

That 5-10k DPS could theoretically let you skip a mechanic altogether. Imagine not having to worry about the Archdiviner teleporting people into cages because he's getting DPS'd that hard. Or imagine the girl with the ball in the new fractal (name escapes me) not tossing the ball as many times because your team was able to hit harder. DPS absolutely matters, regardless of what class or build you're playing. And yes, the group protection is good! I'm not diminishing its role. But in context, that extra DPS can be just as important, or even more important. However, as I mentioned, to even reach that 30k DPS, you have to abandon a lot of those skills and traits that are defensively oriented (like HLA), making you prone to being exceedingly glass.

The condi engi isn't more selfish. On top of the HT (which every engineer build ever takes, including holosmith), it also can do AoE blinds, pinpoint precision, might stacking, stealth stacking, weakness stacking, AoE cripple, etc. It also has a much stronger soft and hard CC potential. And this all on top of the higher damage (even with a simplified rotation, mind you), and it's obvious that condi engi is the clear winner. I'm also not comparing to other classes in this case, because I don't need to. We already have a better build than whatever holosmith can provide. Which in my opinion is just sad.

[Squee Squashington.5189]

I liked the Photon Forge abilities and Prime Light Beam, but the Exceed utilities are kind of meh and the tool belt skills for them are pretty trash. I'd probably use anything else over Coolant for a heal as well. Despite having the 15% dmg reduction trait I feel squishier than Scrapper or any core build. A lot of risk for very little reward overall.

[Snafoo.2869]

I like the theme, a lot and many of the skills look awesome. It's a real change of pace for the engineer and that's the point of specializations imo.That said I'm also rather disappointed with the exceeds, HLA is nice enough (although no offensive pressure and a 45 sec CD, it's not awesome), but the biggest problem overall to me is it doesn't do 'high risk-high reward' well enough.There's certainly a high risk; blowing up PF is something I'm very keen to avoid, the reward however isn't ... well it's not just that it isn't big enough, there's little tactic to it.

I was hoping as the risk ramped up, so would the reward; so for instance instead of Laser's Edge just being a flat 15% bonus over 50 heat, it would increase incrementally, up to a maximum of 20% or even 25% ideally (on an exponential curve, so it would only reach high burst above 75 heat, creating a real sense of 'give it all you got right now!', instead of just using all your skills off CD asap).The fact there's no reward for the heat-risk whatsoever on any of our 'old' weapons is an extra letdown (especially seeing weaver get exactly that for their new mechanic).

[hoeppy.4567]

Add me to the list of disappointed players. PvE perspective here, haven't played much PvP since PoF.

The biggest reason I love new expansions is new Elite Specializations, new skills and mechanics to shake up my playstyle. Scrapper was kinda meh, but I could look past it because the condition damage/cap revamp wasn't that long ago at that time and I enjoyed my condi engineer a lot.When ANet announced PoF and showed off the Holosmith I was excited, it was clear to me that it had to offer some offensive traits and abilities, some that could benefit condition damage. I didn't think it would be hard to replace the Tools traitline in the condition build. So when the demo weekend with the new specializations came I spent a lot of time tinkering with a condi Holosmith build and which rotations could work.

I found a build and rotation that felt good and was eagerly waiting to see how much damage it actually deals when we finally got to test them in the Special Forces Training Area. So that was the very first thing I did when the PoF patch hit the servers. I maxed Holosmith and jumped right into the training area (pre-PoF realistic buffs per QT benchmark rules). To my surprise I couldn't get better sustained dps than base condi engineer. I don't claim to be the best player and I still have some headroom to the QT condi Engineer benchmark. But I'm also not that far off. Condi Holosmith seems to have better cleave and burst, but both are still nothing to write home about. It removes the hidden cooldown of Streamlined Kits and the rotation I use is way more forgiving than condi Engineer.

Holosmith seems to have a power focus, I won't deny that, but it also adds a couple neat sources for burning. And I think it can be a very good choice over tools with slight changes to:

• Photon Blitz: Burning duration increased to 2 seconds.
• Solar Focusing Lens: Burning duration increased to 3 seconds.
• Photonic Blasting Module: Burning duration increased to 5 seconds. Does 3 stacks of Burning. (It's a grandmaster trait, it should have a some oomph behind it)
• Laser's Edge: Additionally grants 5% Condition Damage.

Obviously that only addresses the condition damage part of Holosmith, but I was also excited to have a potential and fun, maybe even kit less power spec with the new Specialization. But we're far from it. Until Episode 6 released I only played very casually and haven't paid any attention to the state of Power Engineer. I can't deny I was shocked when I learned how bad it is at the moment. Back when I fell in love with Engineer we were rocking Rifle, Elixir Gun, Grenades and Bomb Kit to deal damage (that was before HoT) and were considered to be on the higher end of the DPS specs.

Unfortunatly, I feel like power Holosmith needs a lot of work and I don't really know where I'd start to fix it. I guess a good first step would be to increase power scaling of both the Photon Forge AA chain as well as the sword AA chain (maybe different heat bonus). I also expected Laser Disk to be closer to Procession of Blades from Dragonhunter. But the coefficient on it seems to be lower and should be upped a bit, too, at least in PvE.Overall it's a little cheap that only the sword skills and Prismatic Converter get any benefit from Enhanced Capacity Storage Unit and being over 100% heat. Every skill with heat mechanic should get an additional stage above 100%. I really found it odd that that's not the case and I've been wondering if that's a bug or a feature...

[Anthony.7630]

I am going to voice for the majority of the engineer community -

WE DONT CARE ABOUT LIVING STORY OR EVENT FARMING OR SOLO PVE

People say that holosmith is fine and fun.

I am going to be a stink rat and say - i want engineer to be viable(broken and overpowered if it has to be) in fractals raids spvp and wvw.

The moment we become too strong (viable) we are nerfed into a useless spec.

Engineer never gets to be useful for anything. Holosmith is fine if you do event farming and map dallies....

But we want engineer to be good in game modes that matter like spvp fractals wvw raids.

I know people think we are cry babies but engineer has been an outliner underclass profession for group content / team play. I geuss we could be good at spvp and wvw if we selfishly play by soloing but thief does it better.

Engineer brings some boons and some fields but mesmerd guards eles bring better than us.

We can be somewhat useful for 5 man groups but a guardian can do better. Same with an elementalist

I told you engineer holosmith would be nerfed. Anet doesn't want engineer to be viable or wants to send a message or something.

[tigirius.9014]

I haven't had that issue my engi survives better because he's a healer but I can easily use the signet or the trait on my deadeye to survive well with the damage I'm doing. I have noticed however that there does seem to be a broken system with fierocity, it just simply does nothing in PVE anymore so I plan on changing her gear to power condi prec soon because of the problems with it. It's not as bad with power condi from what I've heard.

[stone cold.8609]

Unfortunately, count me as one that is disappointed as well (comments for PvE only). I really liked it when I first started playing it, and found the visuals and the theme were outstanding. I leveled up an Engi just to play it. But now that I've got more time on I'm finding some things that it is lacking. Not nearly enough damage in the photon forge skills to justify the self damaging mechanic tied to it. Not nearly enough damage with the sword AA and many of the holo utility skills. Not nearly enough sustain. No synergy with forge and any other weapon than sword. No synergy with forge and the other non-holo utilities/elite skills.

[Hvaran.6327]

@Anthony.7630 said:I am going to voice for the majority of the engineer community -

WE DONT CARE ABOUT LIVING STORY OR EVENT FARMING OR SOLO PVE

People say that holosmith is fine and fun.

I am going to be a stink rat and say - i want engineer to be viable(broken and overpowered if it has to be) in fractals raids spvp and wvw.

The moment we become too strong (viable) we are nerfed into a useless spec.

Engineer never gets to be useful for anything. Holosmith is fine if you do event farming and map dallies....

But we want engineer to be good in game modes that matter like spvp fractals wvw raids.

I know people think we are cry babies but engineer has been an outliner underclass profession for group content / team play. I geuss we could be good at spvp and wvw if we selfishly play by soloing but thief does it better.

Engineer brings some boons and some fields but mesmerd guards eles bring better than us.

We can be somewhat useful for 5 man groups but a guardian can do better. Same with an elementalist

I told you engineer holosmith would be nerfed. Anet doesn't want engineer to be viable or wants to send a message or something.

100% agreed on all points.

[Arimas.3492]

So, I've been reading up on a lot of other posts/specs and stuff, and after testing some myself more in-depth my opinions have definitely changed. This review will be based solely around WvW, and my review will also contain some core engineer review as well.

I've most notably been playing a lot of Firebrand more because I wanted to try more support, and I've noticed that Firebrand is EXTREMELY good at support (even if you spec nothing into it, the amount of cleansing/actually helpful boons is off the chain) and they can also do good damage during fights because of the increased conditions available to them. And after playing Firebrand in WvW as well as some other classes Holosmith really brings nothing to the table, absolutely nothing.

I was pretty smitten with Holosmith at first because it looked cool/flashy (and still does, animation/effects all around are good) and is good for bringing some damage, but not enough to warrant bringing Holosmith when you can bring another Firebrand/Scourge/Reaper even Spellbreaker has more utility that's really good and can still out damage the Holosmith. Holosmith doesn't have any group support (which is okay for a DPS focused spec in theory) but the damage isn't enough to warrant the complete lack of support.

• First off we have the "bug" of Holosmith transform not taking the player's weapon into account, and only taking a stat from level 78 weapon, which severely hurts damage
• Secondly after playing quite a bit of Holosmith and comparing it to other Elite specs and measuring its drawbacks, the Heat mechanic is too debilitating. I'm pretty much now in the party where there should be zero drawbacks to using Forge mode. There should be no CD entering forge, there should be no damage taken from overheating, there should be no delay in losing heat and heat lost should start immediately at 10 stacks instead of 5, and even in this case we'd still be outclassed.

One of the correlations with core engineer is the Explosion mechanic on engi abilties and traits. In the last balance patch they took away/merged quite a few of the traits affecting explosions, and while the additions were good, the neutering of Explosion effect has partially nerfed Holosmith before it even got here. The increased damage traits and stuff would very much help Holosmith out considering one trait changes the auto attack to forge to be explosive 100% of the time.

This is just a short review TBH and there's probably some other things I can talk about but I can't think of a good way to put them. And a lot of the other issues are with Core engineer so not relevant to this thread. While I still think Holosmith is cool and fun to play for what I normally do (WvW small group/roaming) its certainly not at all what it needs to be in terms of pretty much everything else IMO. Its basically another way to play an already hemorrhaged class with the same drawbacks. I almost don't want to play Engineer anymore but I don't want to give it up either, because if I do I'll probably not want to play anymore.

Honestly if the next balance patch doesn't hit every single engineer trait and skill and tones it up I'm afraid in the future engineer will always be the last option for every mode in the game when it comes to groups.

[akhilesh.9147]

@Ardid.7203 said:Holo is fun, but is not very engie, and is TOO warrior for my tastes. I'm not disappointed of Holo itself... but I'm disappointed with Anet being unable or unwilling to help core engie or to create new gameplay without ditching the more essential aspects of the profession in the process.

I actually like this playstyle more...core engi felt I had to work 3x to get the same dps as a warrior. Though they still need to buff the dps on holo.

[Vagrant.7206]

@Arimas.3492 said:So, I've been reading up on a lot of other posts/specs and stuff, and after testing some myself more in-depth my opinions have definitely changed. This review will be based solely around WvW, and my review will also contain some core engineer review as well.

I've most notably been playing a lot of Firebrand more because I wanted to try more support, and I've noticed that Firebrand is EXTREMELY good at support (even if you spec nothing into it, the amount of cleansing/actually helpful boons is off the chain) and they can also do good damage during fights because of the increased conditions available to them. And after playing Firebrand in WvW as well as some other classes Holosmith really brings nothing to the table, absolutely nothing.

I was pretty smitten with Holosmith at first because it looked cool/flashy (and still does, animation/effects all around are good) and is good for bringing some damage, but not enough to warrant bringing Holosmith when you can bring another Firebrand/Scourge/Reaper even Spellbreaker has more utility that's really good and can still out damage the Holosmith. Holosmith doesn't have any group support (which is okay for a DPS focused spec in theory) but the damage isn't enough to warrant the complete lack of support.

• First off we have the "bug" of Holosmith transform not taking the player's weapon into account, and only taking a stat from level 78 weapon, which severely hurts damage
• Secondly after playing quite a bit of Holosmith and comparing it to other Elite specs and measuring its drawbacks, the Heat mechanic is too debilitating. I'm pretty much now in the party where there should be zero drawbacks to using Forge mode. There should be no CD entering forge, there should be no damage taken from overheating, there should be no delay in losing heat and heat lost should start immediately at 10 stacks instead of 5, and even in this case we'd still be outclassed.

One of the correlations with core engineer is the Explosion mechanic on engi abilties and traits. In the last balance patch they took away/merged quite a few of the traits affecting explosions, and while the additions were good, the neutering of Explosion effect has partially nerfed Holosmith before it even got here. The increased damage traits and stuff would very much help Holosmith out considering one trait changes the auto attack to forge to be explosive 100% of the time.

This is just a short review TBH and there's probably some other things I can talk about but I can't think of a good way to put them. And a lot of the other issues are with Core engineer so not relevant to this thread. While I still think Holosmith is cool and fun to play for what I normally do (WvW small group/roaming) its certainly not at all what it needs to be in terms of pretty much everything else IMO. Its basically another way to play an already hemorrhaged class with the same drawbacks. I almost don't want to play Engineer anymore but I don't want to give it up either, because if I do I'll probably not want to play anymore.

Honestly if the next balance patch doesn't hit every single engineer trait and skill and tones it up I'm afraid in the future engineer will always be the last option for every mode in the game when it comes to groups.

Agreed on basically every point.