We need to review Dev decision making.

[Metaljaw.6437]

Let me see if I get this straight. New achievement group Revenge of the Marionette - check.

Includes new achievement Watchwork Wrecker - check.

Watchwork Wrecker requires completion to complete Master of the Marionette - check.

Watchwork Wrecker requires 10 completions of Marionette to complete - check.

Event last 6 days and the chest is awarded once per day per account. - WTF?

If you are going to require us to complete an event multiple times per day for an event at least make sure you are rewarding people for the completions you are REQUIRING!

 

And yes, I understand the private version is going to stay, but you lose about 30% of your dps in a private instance from the squad 50 person limit. Every instance I have tried in private has failed even when a detailed explanation was done at the beginning.  Normally because it only takes 1 person out of the 50 to DC or mess up fail an entire phase. More than one and you are fubar.

[Abies.8754]

Stop complaining. The difficulty is nice and I would consider it a proper 50 man content.
With proper squad you can do it EASILY if people know what to dodge and how to use skills other than skill 1.
If you do not like it that way then enter public instances only and it is still easy

[Metaljaw.6437]

For those confused - reduced rewards are fine to preclude excessive farming. However, when you specifically design an event to require more than one completion per day, don't nerf the rewards such that people are required to do the event beyond the point where your anti-farming mechanic kicks in. 

"We don't want them doing this more than daily, but we want them to do it 10 times in six days" is not a coherent design.

[Abies.8754]

1 minute ago, Metaljaw.6437 said:

For those confused - reduced rewards are fine to preclude excessive farming. However, when you specifically design an event to require more than one completion per day, don't nerf the rewards such that people are required to do the event beyond the point where your anti-farming mechanic kicks in. 

"We don't want them doing this more than daily, but we want them to do it 10 times in six days" is not a coherent design.

The private mode will stay for ever. and the achievements will  stay for ever too.
I can't understand  where is the issue. the only issue is that the public version is limited time. Other than that, everything can be made  even after bonus event ends

[SexyMofo.8923]

I agree. This is mental. 

[Metaljaw.6437]

So people have to show their legendary insight to get into those squads like on T4 fractals or strikes? IMO It will be few and far between pugs that are going to be doing it after the public option is gone. People in this game don't tolerate fails so they over correct for guaranteed success. And my main point is the conflicting messaging "farm/don't farm."

[Abies.8754]

3 minutes ago, Metaljaw.6437 said:

So people have to show their legendary insight to get into those squads like on T4 fractals or strikes? IMO It will be few and far between pugs that are going to be doing it after the public option is gone. People in this game don't tolerate fails so they over correct for guaranteed success. And my main point is the conflicting messaging "farm/don't farm."

Content should not be "press one button , get kill and achievements+ rewards". That is just ... lame for the quality of the game. New players will get bored easily and will skip big part of the game by boredom alone.
 

[Dante.1763]

16 minutes ago, Owatatsumi.5038 said:

Content should not be "press one button , get kill and achievements+ rewards". That is just ... lame for the quality of the game. New players will get bored easily and will skip big part of the game by boredom alone.
 

or they can please both the casuals and the hardcore players.

Leave the squad version alone, never nerf it AND make the public version permanent, and if adjustments are needed do so.

[Abies.8754]

3 minutes ago, Dante.1763 said:

or they can please both the casuals and the hardcore players.

Leave the squad version alone, never nerf it AND make the public version permanent, and if adjustments are needed do so.

I believe the only thing that should be changed is making the public version permanent.
No nerft at all  on both private and public. Difficulty is fine on both.

[Dante.1763]

Just now, Owatatsumi.5038 said:

I believe the only thing that should be changed is making the public version permanent.
No nerft at all  on both private and public. Difficulty is fine on both.

I tend to agree nerfs arent needed for either, especially if they fix the bugs that do exist.

 

None of the public groups i or my guild mates have joined have failed. Some have come close though, which is good. Means its a decent difficulty. If they make it permanent *poof* my concerns about the difficulty remaining go away.

[Ardenwolfe.8590]

Though you won't get the reward, you can still complete the event twenty-four times a day. Given that there are six days, I believe that's one-hundred and forty-four opportunities to get the achievements done before  the public option disappears.

 

Am I missing something?

[Firebeard.1746]

46 minutes ago, Owatatsumi.5038 said:

Stop complaining. The difficulty is nice and I would consider it a proper 50 man content.
With proper squad you can do it EASILY if people know what to dodge and how to use skills other than skill 1.
If you do not like it that way then enter public instances only and it is still easy

That's funny because I saw tons of dodging and people using more than 1 in what was supposed to be an easy comp (all scourge) but for some reason we died. Please stop under-exaggerating. It's okay to want more difficult content, but it's tone deaf to repeat platitudes like this. It's also puzzling that the devs didn't initiate some form of difficulty tuning for people who don't appreciate this level of difficulty.

[Firebeard.1746]

4 minutes ago, Ardenwolfe.8590 said:

Though you won't get the reward, you can still complete the event twenty-four times a day. Given that there are six days, I believe that's one-hundred and forty-four opportunities to get the achievements done before  the public option disappears.

 

Am I missing something?

it's 12 times. it's once every 2 hours. And do you have a job? because that alone would remove 4 of the 12. If you sleep that's another 4 of the 12, so you're left with 4 attempts/day assuming no other obligations.

Edited July 14, 2021 by Firebeard.1746

[Ardenwolfe.8590]

My mistake. It's every two hours? So half? Seventy-two chances to get it done.

 

Your snarky comment aside, it's still more than enough time to get it done, I believe. Regardless, it's achievements not linked to the legendary item. We're not going for a Nobel Prize.

 

As much as I like achievement hunting, it's still a game.

Edited July 14, 2021 by Ardenwolfe.8590

[Metaljaw.6437]

3 minutes ago, Ardenwolfe.8590 said:

Though you won't get the reward, you can still complete the event twenty-four times a day. Given that there are six days, I believe that's one-hundred and forty-four opportunities to get the achievements done before  the public option disappears.

 

Am I missing something?

Well 12 times a day actually (it's every other hour). But my point is that after your first completion for the day the rewards are MASSIVELY nerfed. At least give the 3 chests of goods. But 50 sprockets. Pfah! I have too many of those in my bank already. They aren't really useful for anything considering permanent position rewinder is in game now, and the backpacks are easier to get elsewhere. Don't need any more taking up space.

[Ardenwolfe.8590]

So you're complaining about the rewards and not the actual event chances? I just want to be clear.

Edited July 14, 2021 by Ardenwolfe.8590

[Abies.8754]

The rewards could be reworked I could agree on that.
Currency to buy LWS1 Miniatures/skins/Tonics would be extremely appreciated ( for me)

[Metaljaw.6437]

Just now, Ardenwolfe.8590 said:

So we're complaining about the rewards and not the actual event chances?

Basically I'm saying don't insert anti-farming mechanics (like only getting rewards 1/day) on an event you are requiring people complete more than 1 per day to complete the underlying achievement. I'm fine if they use anti-farming mechanics, but then they need to reduce the number of completions for Watchwork Wrecker to a maximum of 6 (number of days of event). OR they can provide a substantial reward after a first daily completion and require the 10 completions for Watchwork Wrecker. The way it is is just asinine.

[Abies.8754]

1 minute ago, Metaljaw.6437 said:

Basically I'm saying don't insert anti-farming mechanics (like only getting rewards 1/day) on an event you are requiring people complete more than 1 per day to complete the underlying achievement. I'm fine if they use anti-farming mechanics, but then they need to reduce the number of completions for Watchwork Wrecker to a maximum of 6 (number of days of event). OR they can provide a substantial reward after a first daily completion and require the 10 completions for Watchwork Wrecker. The way it is is just asinine.

It is not required to do it more than once per day. Why do you insist on that part?
The achievements will be PERMANENT addition( only the Wrath of the Twisted Marionette will be 6 more days but it need 5 total kills... meaning 1 per day for 5 days only...).  Also the world boos will be PERMANENT too ( with private squad, which is mostly bad because public should be permanent too).

[Ardenwolfe.8590]

Interesting. While I’m not against more rewards, this is the case for all meta events. For example, if I help kill the Shadow Behemoth once that day, and then kill him again the same day, I don’t get another big reward chest.

 

Still, I believe the incentive is the achievements with their various rewards and not the event reward itself.

 

Again, perhaps I’m wrong, but the point of the returning event was to allow players who never experienced the Marionette during Season One to have that experience. I can’t imagine ArenaNet intended it to be a farming event beyond getting the achievements.

 

But maybe that’s me again.

Edited July 14, 2021 by Ardenwolfe.8590

[Metaljaw.6437]

It has been effectively shown, including in your arguments, that completing the private instance is going to be few and far between in availability to casual players. I'm fine with that. But those causal players then have to do more than one marionette per day for the paltry sum of 50 sprockets multiple times during the event if they want to complete the achievement. I'm not fine with that. You can keep all the difficulties the same. All that I am advocating is don't put in a MASSIVE anti-farming nerf to rewards when that is the position player are faced with.  I mean, at least for the duration of the bonus event.

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

15 minutes ago, Metaljaw.6437 said:

Well 12 times a day actually (it's every other hour). But my point is that after your first completion for the day the rewards are MASSIVELY nerfed. At least give the 3 chests of goods. But 50 sprockets. Pfah! I have too many of those in my bank already. They aren't really useful for anything considering permanent position rewinder is in game now, and the backpacks are easier to get elsewhere. Don't need any more taking up space.

Although, with the new accessibility, the price has gone down, why are you not selling said Watchwork Sprockets??  They are still selling, even now, over 1 Silver each. 

[Danikat.8537]

I can think of two possible explainations:

1. Anet want players to do it multiple times per day in spite of the reduced rewards on repeat attempts (like repeating story instances for the achievements, the achievement itself is the reward in this case).
2. Anet want players to have an incentive to keep playing it once the event is over.

 

55 minutes ago, Metaljaw.6437 said:

So people have to show their legendary insight to get into those squads like on T4 fractals or strikes? IMO It will be few and far between pugs that are going to be doing it after the public option is gone. People in this game don't tolerate fails so they over correct for guaranteed success. And my main point is the conflicting messaging "farm/don't farm."

On EU I've seen a few groups asking for LI or other equally arbitrary requirements, but I've also seen many more with no requirements or nothing beyond making sure you follow the instuctions (including going to the lane you're assigned to, not the one the commander is in).

[Metaljaw.6437]

 

2 minutes ago, Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:

Although, with the new accessibility, the price has gone down, why are you not selling said Watchwork Sprockets??  They are still selling, even now, over 1 Silver each. 

I did. Sold a bunch. But they build up from the home instance node and I still have a watchwork pick on one character. Just at a point that I need to dump them again.

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

4 minutes ago, Metaljaw.6437 said:

It has been effectively shown, including in your arguments, that completing the private instance is going to be few and far between in availability to casual players. I'm fine with that. But those causal players then have to do more than one marionette per day for the paltry sum of 50 sprockets multiple times during the event if they want to complete the achievement. I'm not fine with that. You can keep all the difficulties the same. All that I am advocating is don't put in a MASSIVE anti-farming nerf to rewards when that is the position player are faced with.  I mean, at least for the duration of the bonus event.

Half a Gold is paltry?  I don't mind it for the little time it takes.  Plus, we all want the extra rewards from the Community event, no? 

Also, a week is 7 days, no?  So, at the very least, 7 chances to do the event with max rewards.  (You get two chances the first day, as with any Bonus/Festival event daily.)