[Suggestion] Two things that should be removed

Hi everyone!

Lately, we've been thinking with my guildies about two things that made the WvW experience quite problematic.

1. Miniatures:Some people (especially PU) tend to keep their miniatures up all the time, even if you ask them nicely to hide them. Most of the time, with all the effets on the ground you can't see them, but during certain events (guild raids, all-mesmer runs, etc.) having miniatures prevents people from anything furtivity related. Why not removethem altogether in WvW?

2. AFKers:That's the most problematic point: why allow queues on maps when there are like 30 people afking at spawn for hours? Why not simply allow people to stay at spawn for like 10 minutes before being kicked out (even if they are afk-circling)? That would either make room for people waiting to participate in WvW, or force the AFKers to participate even if their full roster isn't on the map yet.

mini disappears if in zerg.

afk gets kicked if they dont move.

problem is for ppl who does nothing and is not afk. or pip farmers. get max participation, then youtube. moving there toons when timer shows. not much u can do against them except encourage active game play.

therefore getting pips must be by result and not time. like, taking 5 sentries equals to pip. 3 camps to 1 tower and bonus if tower or keep.

also for fights.hue

They disappear in zergs, but some times we are not enough to allow minis removal, which is quite problematic (even when I'm fighting against roamers, they have their minis... Too bad for them but they are easy to spot, no challenge...).

People shouldn't be allowed to take place on the map without being active, aka contributing to WvW, not active as they are now: circling, or selling things left and right. There should be a time-limit for spawn activitie before people being kicked.

The worst part is 20+ guilds waiting for the last 2 of them to arrive, they should at least start their run in WvW, because they are preventing 20 active players from participating.

@VergilDeZaniah.3295 said:They disappear in zergs, but some times we are not enough to allow minis removal, which is quite problematic (even when I'm fighting against roamers, they have their minis... Too bad for them but they are easy to spot, no challenge...).

People shouldn't be allowed to take place on the map without being active, aka contributing to WvW, not active as they are now: circling, or selling things left and right. There should be a time-limit for spawn activitie before people being kicked.

The worst part is 20+ guilds waiting for the last 2 of them to arrive, they should at least start their run in WvW, because they are preventing 20 active players from participating.

So, you have 4 queued maps?

@Strider Pj.2193 said:

@VergilDeZaniah.3295 said:They disappear in zergs, but some times we are not enough to allow minis removal, which is quite problematic (even when I'm fighting against roamers, they have their minis... Too bad for them but they are easy to spot, no challenge...).

People shouldn't be allowed to take place on the map without being active, aka contributing to WvW, not active as they are now: circling, or selling things left and right. There should be a time-limit for spawn activitie before people being kicked.

The worst part is 20+ guilds waiting for the last 2 of them to arrive, they should at least start their run in WvW, because they are preventing 20 active players from participating.

Some people take WvW so seriously that if everyone isn't putting forth maximum effort the team will lose.

I still would like to know how people can tell for certain that so many others are afk if they themselves are not in essence afk also determining who and how many precisely of the above mentioned are afk. One could say that certain individuals port to spawn frequently and look around to see who is there, but one would have to question why these individuals are porting to spawn frequently and how if that indIvidual is so actively engaged in battle they have time to take note of more than 3 of their comrades that have been sitting at spawn for the last however many minutes. Are these individuals keeping a log of afk names? If so, isn't that taking time away from their active gameplay? Whose to say the afkers aren't doing the same as the watchers? Have they considered that these afkers may not actually be playing for their team, but spying chat and commander tags? In which case, this is very much actively playing in a sense.

Minis....I have alot, I play wvw most of my time, I've been playing mesmer for the last year and went without a mini, I've recently switched back to other professions and will use a mini if I want to. The game hides mins if there are so many people on the map and if not I rarely zerg, so if an entire group of "roamers" want to chase me and my mini, more power to them, I hope they get his bag. Minion masters have minions that to this day don't necessarily "stack" right away, ranger pets don't stack right away either, runes that produce rock hounds, golems and other cretures that cause scratches also have a problem with stacking, disabling minis will not disable all the other followers that aren't in comms!

@Swamurabi.7890 said:

@Strider Pj.2193 said:

@VergilDeZaniah.3295 said:They disappear in zergs, but some times we are not enough to allow minis removal, which is quite problematic (even when I'm fighting against roamers, they have their minis... Too bad for them but they are easy to spot, no challenge...).

People shouldn't be allowed to take place on the map without being active, aka contributing to WvW, not active as they are now: circling, or selling things left and right. There should be a time-limit for spawn activitie before people being kicked.

The worst part is 20+ guilds waiting for the last 2 of them to arrive, they should at least start their run in WvW, because they are preventing 20 active players from participating.

To be fair, some guilds do seem to spend more time rallying in spawn than they do raiding. But MMO's are a social experience and gw2 is a casual one at that..What exactly Anet is to do about loiterers though? The bean counters would tell you people logging in for any reason is good.

@Strider Pj.2193 said:So, you have 4 queued maps?

Yup, unfortunately most of the time (aka prime time), we have queues on the 4 maps, 20 being the average on Bordelands and 30 on EBG.

@HazyDaisy.4107 said:I still would like to know how people can tell for certain that so many others are afk if they themselves are not in essence afk also determining who and how many precisely of the above mentioned are afk. One could say that certain individuals port to spawn frequently and look around to see who is there, but one would have to question why these individuals are porting to spawn frequently and how if that indIvidual is so actively engaged in battle they have time to take note of more than 3 of their comrades that have been sitting at spawn for the last however many minutes. Are these individuals keeping a log of afk names? If so, isn't that taking time away from their active gameplay? Whose to say the afkers aren't doing the same as the watchers? Have they considered that these afkers may not actually be playing for their team, but spying chat and commander tags? In which case, this is very much actively playing in a sense.

Spies are another topic, what I'm talking about is guilds stacking at spawn, with their guild master/lead popping a tag and waiting for the rest of their zerg to arrive. It happens that we get wiped, wp and see that the commander and his peeps are sitting there and will stay there for another hour instead of simply doing something useful.

@VergilDeZaniah.3295 said:

@Strider Pj.2193 said:So, you have 4 queued maps?

@HazyDaisy.4107 said:I still would like to know how people can tell for certain that so many others are afk if they themselves are not in essence afk also determining who and how many precisely of the above mentioned are afk. One could say that certain individuals port to spawn frequently and look around to see who is there, but one would have to question why these individuals are porting to spawn frequently and how if that indIvidual is so actively engaged in battle they have time to take note of more than 3 of their comrades that have been sitting at spawn for the last however many minutes. Are these individuals keeping a log of afk names? If so, isn't that taking time away from their active gameplay? Whose to say the afkers aren't doing the same as the watchers? Have they considered that these afkers may not actually be playing for their team, but spying chat and commander tags? In which case, this is very much actively playing in a sense.

@"VergilDeZaniah.3295" said:

1. Miniatures:Some people (especially PU) tend to keep their miniatures up all the time, even if you ask them nicely to hide them. Most of the time, with all the effets on the ground you can't see them, but during certain events (guild raids, all-mesmer runs, etc.) having miniatures prevents people from anything furtivity related. Why not removethem altogether in WvW?

This is in — my strong opinion — a learn to play issue. I have no sympathy for a PU/mesmer or shadow/thief who doesn't stop to hide their mini. I have great sympathy for all commanders (it's a lousy job and the pay is poor to boot), but it really is something that they should mention if they plan on using veils or mass invis strategically. (With the smartest move being to have everyone hide minis except for a couple of decoys, who expose their minis and go the wrong way.)

2. AFKers:That's the most problematic point: why allow queues on maps when there are like 30 people afking at spawn for hours? Why not simply allow people to stay at spawn for like 10 minutes before being kicked out (even if they are afk-circling)? That would either make room for people waiting to participate in WvW, or force the AFKers to participate even if their full roster isn't on the map yet.People cannot "AFK for hours" on a map.

And there are many reasons that people might AFK for a while, including the fact that there are 15 minutes worth of rewards ticking in. Not to mention RL emergencies and so on. There's probably also no specific mechanic (yet) that distinguishes "just running at spawn" from "just running to an objective, without generating any WXP" due to bad luck or whatever.

The more common scenario is that, if there's a spawn, there's some group that's AFK for some minutes and another group AFK for some, but it's not the same people "for hours". (In fact, the only way you could be sure the people just sit there for hours is by sitting there for hours to see if they do or do not leave the area.)

The system definite could be improved: there should be a way to tick participation down without impacting queues and it would be great if it were more difficult to game the system to maintain tick without actively contributing (e.g. people who just use a treb every so often). But I prefer this system to what we had before (poor rewards, no way to reward scouts and sentries, etc).

I wonder if it would make sense to allow people who have already earned participation and are just ticking out so they don't miss out on pips to move to EotM for that purpose? No one could earn any participation in EotM, but if you moved there from a standard BL with participation remaining, it would continue to tick just as it currently does if you sit at spawn for 10 minutes or whatever.

I'd vote for tactivators and DBL as the two things that need to be removed.