Hello new engi player

Hello. New engi player here. Crystal configuration storm should have 900 range. That's all.

Edit: thats the one that makes your holo autos ranged

Players should l2p before suggesting changes. That's all.

That's not nice. Seriously though. Crystal configuration storm should have 900 range

ellesee.8297New engi player here

I don't believe you.

:) :) :)

I main a holo, and no, I wouldn't agree to that change. Holosmith is a specialization that is short ranged in most of it's abilities. It is meant, and it is more efficient up close. If the enemy is too far, you get close with Holo Leap, but it's not even useful for you to strike with only the range attack of Crystal config. You want to be up close so that Both the slash and projectile hits, which is when you Actually deal damage. Most of Holo's utility skills and toolbelt skills are better used in the midst of your enemies, not far away.

If you think it's better to be up close, then use crystal configuration eclipse, which is what everyone uses anyway. That way a 900 range crystal configuration storm can open up new avenues of playstyles. And if it's not even useful to hit things at range with storm, then adding 300 range shouldn't hurt at all. Diversity!

@ellesee.8297 said:That's not nice. Seriously though. Crystal configuration storm should have 900 range

May not be nice but it isn't far off. Holosmith is meant to be a close-range melee fighter. If you want range you carry a rifle, which is better anyway. There is no real point on the sword being able to do a 900 range attack. You're never going to need it. Additionally, a 900 range attack on your sword chain would mean the first attack from your sword has better range than your dedicated range attack from Photon Forge. You're not really creating a new playstyle either as you still have to get close to use your sword attacks. If it were opening a new playstyle up that would mean that you'd actually have a useful follow-up attack that you can execute at 900 as opposed to still needing to close the gap. You increase the range and odds are strong that either the Heat cost for it increase or it does even less damage, possibly both.

Never mind the fact that it would just increase the cries that Holosmith is OP. Adding a bad mechanic is not diversity.

If holosmith was meant to be a close range fighter, why does the trait make a melee attack a ranged attack? Why is the range on it so short, too short to be of any use? And why does nobody take this trait in pvp? Do people take this outside pvp? Maybe these questions are related.

Never going to need a ranged attack? What if you want to generate heat while still being offensive and you dont want to die to scourge aoe or any kind of cleave?

Why would it make holosmith op? Making a strong build stronger makes things op. making a trait nobody takes stronger adds diversity. For example, you mash storm autos, you get fury from short fuse, apply bleeding with shrapnel which will let you gain might with that firearms trait. Already new synergistic possibilities are opening up! If meta holo builds took this trait, it would probably make them weaker! They lose that sweet sweet stability from eclipse.

@"ellesee.8297" said:If holosmith was meant to be a close range fighter, why does the trait make a melee attack a ranged attack? Why is the range on it so short, too short to be of any use? And why does nobody take this trait in pvp? Do people take this outside pvp? Maybe these questions are related.

Never going to need a ranged attack? What if you want to generate heat while still being offensive and you dont want to die to scourge aoe or any kind of cleave?

Why would it make holosmith op? Making a strong build stronger makes things op. making a trait nobody takes stronger adds diversity. For example, you mash storm autos, you get fury from short fuse, apply bleeding with shrapnel which will let you gain might with that firearms trait. Already new synergistic possibilities are opening up! If meta holo builds took this trait, it would probably make them weaker! They lose that sweet sweet stability from eclipse.

I dont think you understand that holosmith is generally considered to be one, if not the strongest profession right now :p ?Any form of buff to the holosmith while they are regarded "a tad too strong" would upset the non-holo community.

Also i love my holo and ofc it would be fun for some variation with traits and stuff, but its really really really not needed. Already having all the tools needed to conquer most situations would only be shamed on if it got "more" quality of life changes and/or buffs.

@ellesee.8297 said:If holosmith was meant to be a close range fighter, why does the trait make a melee attack a ranged attack? Why is the range on it so short, too short to be of any use? And why does nobody take this trait in pvp? Do people take this outside pvp? Maybe these questions are related.

Never going to need a ranged attack? What if you want to generate heat while still being offensive and you dont want to die to scourge aoe or any kind of cleave?

Why would it make holosmith op? Making a strong build stronger makes things op. making a trait nobody takes stronger adds diversity. For example, you mash storm autos, you get fury from short fuse, apply bleeding with shrapnel which will let you gain might with that firearms trait. Already new synergistic possibilities are opening up! If meta holo builds took this trait, it would probably make them weaker! They lose that sweet sweet stability from eclipse.

It just extends the reach. If the trait was meant to turn Holosmith into a range fighter it wouldn't have dropped the damage of the sword 1 attack. People don't take it in PvP because there are better abilities that support Holosmith. People don't take it because it increases heat for very little gain. People don't take it because it causes a 10% drop in damage output. You could take that ability and gain a bit of distance or you can take an ability that grants you Stability. Stability is hands down better than having a small increase to your range.

You automatically generate heat while being offensive, speeding that up isn't always in your best interest. Additionally, rifle is hands down a better answer to Scourge. Even if you increased it to 900 rifle would still be better. Being able to take out the Scourge from 1200 is infinitely better than waiting till he gets to 900. Rifle also offers a straight up stopping move that prevents the Scrouge from running up on you, giving you more time to blast him. Blunderbuss is way better than what you talk about and if push comes to shove Overcharge Shot is your ace in the hole to get all of that AOE spam away from you. If things go poorly rifle can get me away from that Scourge when your suggestion just traps me too close to him with no swift avenue of escape. Hands down the Holosmith's answer to Scourge is the rifle. Your suggestion would get a Holosmith killed against a Scourge.

Also, I didn't say it would make Holosmith OP, I said it would increase the cries that it is. You're still not adding diversity. No one is going to take that ability over the far superior rifle. Rifle hits longer and harder and doesn't generate Heat thus granting you more Heat time doing something useful.

Your suggestion is not creating build diversity. You're just suggesting a suboptimal ability and then call it diversity and that's just silly. Hands down Holosmith will do better with rifle in any situation you can come up with for your change, if for no other reason than because I can stop you from getting close enough to make use of it with a rifle.

An attack that generates more heat and does less damage does not create build diversity unless people just like playing suboptimal builds.

Ah it extends the reach. To useless levels making it a useless trait. So buffing it to extend it some more is a problem because...? You don't want the holo to be a ranged fighter? Did you not just say to mash hip shot vs scourges? What is that if not range fighting?

Yes there is a better trait in eclipse and buffing it to 900 range would still make it an inferior pick to stability sooooo... the harm is what exactly? And yes buffing underpowered traits does increase build diversity. Why would you say otherwise? Saying nobody would take 900 range storm is false. I would take it in some builds. I'm sure others would too. You don't speak for everyone.

I can give you an example in how this would increase build diversity. You generate heat from a reasonably safe distance with 900 range storm auto. Go in for the 3 4 5 burst cc, then overheat explode for 6k with the grandmaster. Then with the extra 15-25% damage from laser's edge and free burn stacks, maybe you apply massive burn with ft/bomb. Maybe you net shot and hit a 10k nade barrage. Is kit holo not build diversity? Optimal? Probably not. But maybe people want to run something else other than meta rifle. Diversity.

I also really dont care if people have the false assumption that buffing a trait nobody uses makes holo op. Completely a nonfactor.

Didn't chaith recommended the same thing in his build diversity suggestion thread? Except he wants the damage nerf removed and wants it to be a beam attack to bypass projectile hate. Funny that. For my own selfish reasons I'd prefer if storm autos remain an explosion but i mean I'll just take the 900 range.

@ellesee.8297 said:Hello. New engi player here. Crystal configuration storm should have 900 range. That's all.New :) ahahha welcome back :)

I think that would be pretty cool. I like using this trait on a zerk sd build sometimes. would be nice if it didn't generate extra heat! that can really get ya over time. don't mind the damage loss tho.

edityou didn't even call any of us frands. many of the sads.imposter!

@ellesee.8297 said:Ah it extends the reach. To useless levels making it a useless trait. So buffing it to extend it some more is a problem because...? You don't want the holo to be a ranged fighter? Did you not just say to mash hip shot vs scourges? What is that if not range fighting?

Because I don't support pointless changes to mechanics. Mechanical changes should be for balance issues. Also, in the grand scope of things Engineer has SO MANY more needed changes than this. You're also not turning Holosmith into a ranged fighter with this suggestion. If you want to make Holosmith into a ranged fighter you take rifle. Photon Forge is a melee fighter with small ranged support, through Photon Blitz.

Yes there is a better trait in eclipse and buffing it to 900 range would still make it an inferior pick to stability sooooo... the harm is what exactly? And yes buffing underpowered traits does increase build diversity. Why would you say otherwise? Saying nobody would take 900 range storm is false. I would take it in some builds. I'm sure others would too. You don't speak for everyone.

Just because it would still be inferior does not mean it should be buffed. Again, buffing should occur when there is a problem. There isn't a problem here. Use the tools you are already given. You're still not increasing build diversity. Saying it over and over again doesn't make it so. The fact that you would take it doesn't mean anything. You're making a bad mechanical suggestion so what you would and would not take isn't exactly a stellar assessment of something. Increased Heat and lower damage just aren't better than Stability in an environment when another Holosmith (among other professions and Elites) can send you to the ground easily.

I can give you an example in how this would increase build diversity. You generate heat from a reasonably safe distance with 900 range storm auto. Go in for the 3 4 5 burst cc, then overheat explode for 6k with the grandmaster. Then with the extra 15-25% damage from laser's edge and free burn stacks, maybe you apply massive burn with ft/bomb. Maybe you net shot and hit a 10k nade barrage. Is kit holo not build diversity? Optimal? Probably not. But maybe people want to run something else other than meta rifle. Diversity.

Making up a scenario that suits your current needs is not really an example of increasing build diversity. Generating Heat from a safe distance is a moot consideration. The extra Heat generation for less damage makes you a suboptimal fighter. 900 is not that far away for most builds right now. A Holosmith can be on you in two moves (or just blast you silly from 1200), a Mirage has a lot of moves that will close that gap, Deadeye will pick you off from well beyond 900, Ranger will rain down death upon you from more than 900, Dragonhunter will spear you from 1200 and just inflict burning damage while peppering you with arrows, Spellbreaker will soak it up and close that gap easy, and a Scourge can either close the gap easy or drop a Sand Shade on you from 900 and just radiate death. 900 is not a safe distance. If you want safe distance you want the 1200 of the rifle. There is too much in the game right now that 900 is an easy gap to close in on. Most of the meta right now can easily fight from 900. So you're basically generating more Heat, doing less damaging, and most of the other meta builds are still on top of you, at full strength.

Still not diversity.

I also really dont care if people have the false assumption that buffing a trait nobody uses makes holo op. Completely a nonfactor.

You say that but it isn't.

Didn't chaith recommended the same thing in his build diversity suggestion thread? Except he wants the damage nerf removed and wants it to be a beam attack to bypass projectile hate. Funny that. For my own selfish reasons I'd prefer if storm autos remain an explosion but i mean I'll just take the 900 range.

Wouldn't know, I didn't see that comment (or thread). I'd of argued against that too.

Not a made up scenario. It's just part of my burst combo rotation. You keep trying to claim it's not build diversity but I'm already doing it. However as there's only one viable trait in that tier, that's the one I have to use. Ideally we'd have 3 viable traits in that tier but it would be so lovely to have 2 and adding 300 range would make it not so terrible.

In teamfights I'd rather not be anywhere near the point. So many people make that mistake and get cleaved down. If I were to try and bombard the point with storm and its 600 range I'd get cleaved down too, but if I could start generating heat for an overheat explosion from an actual safe distance (as in safe in a teamfight and not safe in a 1v1 which I don't care about), well again: diversity. So no it's not a pointless change, it's a buff to an absolutely garbage trait. You say buffing should occur when there are problems. Are garbage traits not problems? Do you support just one legitimate choice in that trait tier? You say mechanical changes are supposed to be for balance issues. Is a poorly performing trait not unbalanced?

And yes people crying is absolutely a non factor. I'd love to know why you rate whiners who are wrong so highly.

What I'm trying to do is to suggest buffing a useless trait to make it useable. Maybe it still won't be used in meta builds, but it'll be useful in SOME builds. I don't understand the negative reaction.

"No don't ever buff something that's useless into a useable form. Why? Obviously because people will falsely claim it will make holo OP and that we should listen to them! Or that holo is not a ranged fighter and if you want to be a ranged fighter use rifle!! (what?) And even though some other non meta builds could make use of that, it still won't promote build diversity! (what?)"

Did I steelman you correctly?

@"ellesee.8297" said:Not a made up scenario. It's just part of my burst combo rotation. You keep trying to claim it's not build diversity but I'm already doing it. However as there's only one viable trait in that tier, that's the one I have to use. Ideally we'd have 3 viable traits in that tier but it would be so lovely to have 2 and adding 300 range would make it not so terrible.

I claim it's not build diversity because it's not. Build diversity is about how many meta builds you have, not the number of builds any given person can create. I can crank out builds that may work for me but that doesn't mean I'm creating build diversity. You already admitted that if meta Holosmith builds took the trait they would be weaker. You are creating a weaker build that may suit your purpose but wouldn't create build diversity. Revenant lacks PvP build diversity. It isn't because people don't run different, off meta builds. It's because they only have one meta build. I can create a Renegade build if I wanted to. It may even win me some games. However, if it's still subpar compared to Power Herald then I haven't actually created build diversity.

You're taking a trait that, by your own admission, makes you weaker. Making someone weaker does not create build diversity.

In teamfights I'd rather not be anywhere near the point. So many people make that mistake and get cleaved down. If I were to try and bombard the point with storm and its 600 range I'd get cleaved down too, but if I could start generating heat for an overheat explosion from an actual safe distance (as in safe in a teamfight and not safe in a 1v1 which I don't care about), well again: diversity. So no it's not a pointless change, it's a buff to an absolutely garbage trait. You say buffing should occur when there are problems. Are garbage traits not problems? Do you support just one legitimate choice in that trait tier? You say mechanical changes are supposed to be for balance issues. Is a poorly performing trait not unbalanced?

Safe distance is 1200. There is simply far too much in current meta right now that makes 900 a non-issue. A Scourge can drop AOE spam on you at 900. You don't need to be anywhere near the center of action to suffer from a Scourge. A Deadeye operates at 1500 and will take you out no matter where you are. Rangers operate at 1500 and do the same. Dragonhunter operates 1200 and can drag you all the way to him if it wants to. Safe distance, 1200. At 900 you are still in the mix of things.

Not build diversity.

Also, buffing traits you admit are garbage is a pointless change. Buffs are about balance, not making garbage traits garbage traits with longer range. It's bad game design and will most definitely create player discontent. You'll have Engineer players who are tired of Holosmith seeing all the buffs get upset because they want Core and Scrapper to get some attention, not a garbage trait on an Elite they feel is OP and in need of nerfs. You will have Elementalist players cry foul because Elementalist is in desperate need of real attention as they are currently underperforming. You'll have angry Revenant players who will point out that Holosmith has excellent build diversity already while they sit at one viable PvP build. Necromancers would raise holy hell since they have been at the bottom of the pack for six long years and here ArenaNet is taking a garbage trait and buffing an already OP Elite (I can just see the thread now, Necromancer takes a hit to Abrasive Grit over a rune but ANet is busy making Holosmith better). It is bad game design and it is bad game design when there are so many more pressing issues. It's bad game design as it gives off the appearance of favoritism. Even if you argued that it isn't the appearance of favoritism is just as bad, whether true or not. Even if you don't care what other people think, it matters to ArenaNet, more so when they have to deal with a sizeable portion of angry customers.

Also, you haven't established it is a problem. You've established a desire to make your build easier. The current meta places a higher priority on Stability, which is why it's the trait that gets picked. If the meta was different then other traits in that line might be taken.

And yes people crying is absolutely a non factor. I'd love to know why you rate whiners who are wrong so highly.

Yeah, no you're wrong on that. People crying is a factor as it impacts customer experience. Whiners create problems. They start thread after thread after thread to complain about their problems. No company 100% dismisses the people who complain as sometimes they have a valid point. I, personally, don't care about whiners. However, I do know what gaming companies tend to pay attention to and what can create negativity within a game. Elementalist players whined so loudly that it actually got a direct response from ArenaNet.

Whenever you buff something that portions of the community feel is in need of nerfs (even within that profession and sometimes even the Elite) you are going to generate extra attention that will matter to ArenaNet if it wants to maintain a satisfactory relationship with its playerbase. Whenever you buff a garbage trait in an Elite already considered OP you will need a stronger case than build diversity to satisfy your customers. Most folks would argue that if you want real build diversity they would buff Core Engineer and Scrapper so that people have something other than Holosmith to play. Are they whining? Oh, yeah. They aren't wrong though (this, incidentally, is where your build diversity argument is at its weakest).

What I'm trying to do is to suggest buffing a useless trait to make it useable. Maybe it still won't be used in meta builds, but it'll be useful in SOME builds. I don't understand the negative reaction.

You're trying to make a build you like more viable because you want to play it that way. Buffing a useless trait that isn't broken is just bad game design and a waste of time and resources in testing to make sure that your pointless buff doesn't disturb game balance somewhere.

I've already explained the negative reaction. If you don't understand it then that's because you aren't listening.

"No don't ever buff something that's useless into a useable form. Why? Obviously because people will falsely claim it will make holo OP and that we should listen to them! Or that holo is not a ranged fighter and if you want to be a ranged fighter use rifle!! (what?) And even though some other non meta builds could make use of that, it still won't promote build diversity! (what?)"

Did I steelman you correctly?

Not really no. Strawman yes, steelman no.

Still not creating build diversity.

lol ellesee just give up, some people like arguing for the sake of it. your proposition is fine. let the naysayers be negative nancy's.

Just want to add that build diversity comes from the number of viable builds, not just the number of meta builds. Since gw2 is very much a skill based game, unlike its predecessor, it is entirely possible to beat meta builds with non-meta builds.

With that said, I don't see a problem with buffing underused traits if it spawns viable off-meta builds. Currently the meta is far to strong and needs to be toned down across the board, so I wouldn't want a buffed trait to create a new meta unless the existing meta gets nerfed, because that would add to the overall power creep of the game. However, I agree with Dace in that crystal configuration: storm is not a good trait for holo. Most of holos abilities require them to be up close and personal, and with projectile hate in the game you are actually hurting yourself by taking this trait. I would much rather see it synergies with specs that get underused like explosives and firearms, maybe remove the range but keep the explosions and have it apply bleeding instead.

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:lol ellesee just give up, some people like arguing for the sake of it. your proposition is fine. let the naysayers be negative nancy's.

So disagreeing with a person on the need for a mechanical change is being negative. Gotcha. I'm not wrong though, this doesn't create build diversity. More to the point if we are going to create build diversity for Engineer then it should happen within Core and Scrapper who are in desperate need of it, as opposed to Holosmith which has more than enough builds right now. You'd see greater player appreciation from Engineer players if they had a true choice in what to play in order to be competitive than you would if they just had one more way to play Holosmith.

So I guess it's negative to want to see other issues addressed and for actual build diversity and choice within the profession, as a whole, as opposed to a continued focus on one Elite.

@Zex Anthon.8673 said:Just want to add that build diversity comes from the number of viable builds, not just the number of meta builds. Since gw2 is very much a skill based game, unlike its predecessor, it is entirely possible to beat meta builds with non-meta builds.

With that said, I don't see a problem with buffing underused traits if it spawns viable off-meta builds. Currently the meta is far to strong and needs to be toned down across the board, so I wouldn't want a buffed trait to create a new meta unless the existing meta gets nerfed, because that would add to the overall power creep of the game. However, I agree with Dace in that crystal configuration: storm is not a good trait for holo. Most of holos abilities require them to be up close and personal, and with projectile hate in the game you are actually hurting yourself by taking this trait. I would much rather see it synergies with specs that get underused like explosives and firearms, maybe remove the range but keep the explosions and have it apply bleeding instead.

I would argue that if something is viable then it is more likely meta, considering how strong current meta is. If an off meta build is viable and winning it would more than likely be a result of the player's level of skill and not the strength of the build itself. Build diversity would, more or less, be based around builds that are strong enough to be competitive on their own and not 100% reliant on player skill level. I think if the power creep wasn't as high as it currently is then I would find myself in agreement with you about off-meta builds that are viable as being part of the build diversity. However, we aren't at a very low power level right now so if the build itself is viable and would be strong before we factor in player skill it would count as meta and part of the build diversity. If the build is strong because the player himself is good but wouldn't perform so well with other people then even if it is viable I wouldn't count it towards build diversity.

Otherwise, things like Revenant would have more than just Power Herald to play as I've seen Revenant players pass around some off-meta builds that are viable in the right hands but for the most part, simply do not compete with Power Herald and the current meta from others. Would be nice though if off-meta was a reliable way to win matches, kinda tired of Power Herald.

This is why i get banned from forums. Someone makes inane, contradictory arguments, "im not wrong." It's taking me a lot of willpower to resist the temptation, but I am only human.

Back to the point. Crystal configuration storm should be 900 range. 600 is useless.

@Zex Anthon.8673 said:

Most of holos abilities require them to be up close and personal

That's just not true. Only the auto is melee range. 2 3 4 5 all have some range to them. Giving storm 900 range so you can more or less safely generate heat while simultaneously keeping up pressure while outside of teamfight cleave range and then move closer for 3 4 5 damage/cc bursts combo'd with an overheat explosion would promote not just one, but two underused traits as they are highly synergistic, they being the overheat explosion and storm traits.

@"ellesee.8297" said:This is why i get banned from forums. Someone makes inane, contradictory arguments, "im not wrong." It's taking me a lot of willpower to resist the temptation, but I am only human.

Back to the point. Crystal configuration storm should be 900 range. 600 is useless.

@Zex Anthon.8673 said:

Most of holos abilities require them to be up close and personal

It's still a pointless change. You're still not safe at 900. Cleave really isn't the most dangerous thing a lot of the meta specs are doing right now. The amount of projectile hate and reflection means you really aren't going to keep as much pressure as you think. Since Deadeye can one shot folks well beyond the range of a response reflect becomes a stronger and more useful ability to carry. @Zex Anthon.8673 isn't wrong about Holosmith being up close and personal. Its strength lies in the abilities it does at closer range. It's one of the reasons why CC: Storm isn't long range. It keeps you in relative range of all your more common attacks. Hitting people with Holographic Shockwave and Corona Burts helps to set up the Light Strike chain.

Holosmith doesn't really need improvements right now. If anything, they should be focused on giving Engineer players an actual choice in what they want to play as opposed to everyone playing Holosmith because its the only one that is meta right now. The underused traits that really need to be reexamined right now really are in Scrapper. It would be nice to be like some of the other meta professions right now and actually have both Elites as viable contenders in PvP. I love Holosmith to death but PvP would be better if Scrapper was better. It would make Engineer players less predictable in PvP.

Pointless mechanical changes to an already meta Elite that supports one build type are not good design moves when there is so much that needs to be brought up to a meta-level of play. For a person that screams build diversity, it's surprising you'd rather have that diversity focused in one Elite as opposed to the profession and its other Elite which would make more Engineer players happy as opposed to just Holosmith players.

This thread is about one thing: crystal configuration storm. It's not about potential scrapper changes, core engi changes or anything else. If you want to talk about buffs to those things, make your own thread.

Since 600 range makes storm an absolutely worthless ability, even if the stab trait didnt exist, it should be buffed to 900 range, the standard distance for most ranged attacks, keeping with the theme of giving the auto more range. It has no impact on the meta. All this does is make other builds better, so no it's not a pointless change. Yes it is build diversity. It literally makes other, less used builds better, gives synergy with the overheat trait for overheat builds. Is that not the definition of build diversity? I've yet to read a legitimate argument stating otherwise. Just nitpicking nonsense like "oh b-b-b-but projectile reflect!" Yes and? What does that even mean? "This useless trait shouldnt be made less useless because deadeyes!" Jesus christ.

And yes yes we all know you agree that holo plays up close and personal even though that's just demonstrably false as everything except the auto is ranged and you yourself recommend the rife for range and the meta build is called holo rifle.

My point about Scrapper was tied to my point about CC: Storm, as in one change is unneeded when this other thing is suffering a lot more than Holosmith. It's called developing a full point as opposed to just a flippant response and just saying I don't think the change is needed. Scrapper is part of why I don't support your proposed change.

Also, there are numerous range attacks that occur at a smaller range than 900. I won't list them since you only want me to specifically just talk about CC: Storm but, they are out there. It is still a pointless change though, as Holosmith doesn't need to be better. Holosmith is already great. I'd explain why further but you know .... The only less used builds you are making better are builds that don't need to be better. That's kinda the entire point, Holosmith is already good enough. Continuing to make Holosmith better is not a good idea as it actually starts to kill build diversity, since the only viable builds are coming out of one Elite. Development of one Elite at the expense of another (which is what is occurring now anyway and something your change would do more of) stifles build diversity. So instead of Engineer players choosing between things you don't want me mentioning and Holosmith they would just be choosing one new way to play Holosmith, with a trait you already said was garbage.

You've yet to list an actual reason for the change aside from you have a build that you like for it and then pass it off as diversity. Also, how do you not understand projectile reflect? If you think the reason the useless trait should remain the same is because of Deadeye then you are still not actually listening to what's being said to you. Deadeye serves as an example of broader point that was made. As for Holo playing up close and personal, again not the reason why I disagree. You seem to read only a tiny bit of what's actually said and then extrapolate from there, such as ignoring my actual stated reason why I disagree in favor of attacking a point that doesn't actually factor into why I objected. Holosmith being a ranged or melee fighter is not as important a point as the other issues I brought up. Taking apart the least important point I made doesn't actually refute my overall point. Though, it's worth noting that there is a difference from attacks that can happen at a brief short range and then actually being a ranged fighter.