Madisonlee.9641

7.2k True Shot This was on marauders with trapper runes btw. Like I said before, damage that high shouldn't be possible. Also, I've never seen numbers that high running "meta DH" in 2v2 or 5v5 post patch. Lastly, I have no idea under what conditions that occured (such as, the damage modifiers you're running). If the full trap DH build you're running has the sustain & disengage of a Ranger on top of having very high burst damage, it should be nerfed. Showing me that screenshot won't make me say that Ranger is okay in its current state... I don't want to keep going and forth on this over the forums at this point (wouldn't mind speaking ingame or over discord though). Everyone's posts are started to irk me a little. I would like to think if DH was extremely strong I'd be willing to see how we can correct it so it's more balanced. I've been in several GW2 twitch streams recently and I've seen notable members of our community pointing out the blatant strength of Ranger at the moment... I'm not trying to take away from your skill level or any other Rangers. It's just really strong right now. It is what it is. Let's see what anet does I'm still down to duel, although it won't recreate the 2v2 or 5v5 experience... I don't mind having a convo over discord is well. All positive vibes hereLike I said before I appreciate OP's positive attitude, he's definitely trying to have a serious convo about it as opposed to the forum sheep who just want things nerfed that kill them. However to OP I simply think this is going to end up as an agree to disagree situation, because there are obviously a large group of people who think huge power spikes (one shots and oppressive multishots) should not exists, and another group (myself included) who think that min/maxing is fun and makes the game less boring so it should be possible. We won't ever agree to anything tbh.

7.2k True Shot This was on marauders with trapper runes btw. That's literal trash bro you can do better XD My trapper zerker Rachel hits 10k+ constantly on other glass bro get ur act together.

This. Do you really think ANET has the resources or motivation to completely rework classes with stealth access to compensate for a change/removal of stealth? Not gonna happen lol. We can argue that it SHOULD happen, but it's not going to.

I literally brain-farted on this when I previously said that Eddo's 15 sec CD suggestion could be acceptable for maul, I was in pre-patch mode where my counterkick did 10k+ XD Yeah no friggin way to a maul CD increase, we'd literally have no damage on GS in that case.

That's fair, since hilt bash resets maul a 15 sec cd would def be a fair nerf in terms of sustained DPS, but it wouldn't help you not be one shot by them though, and so people would still cry. People will ALWAYS find something to cry about, even if it's not remotely being used in high tier play.

Maul: Reduced power coefficient from 1.75 to 1.5.14,3% nerf :) Should have been 30%. It needs to be 1.25 Don't pretend you wouldn't be here making the same exact post if that maul had been 12k instead of 16k XD We got peeps in other threads complaining about sub-10k numbers from WI and Maul, so basically anything you die to should be nerfed and people won't stop crying until no one ever dies. Oh wait we got that post HoT bunker meta, and then people cried that no one died and game was slow and boring so devs wanted to make things "feel dangerous" again and up crept the power since. It's like a friggin yo-yo man XD Yeah i think that too. I wish ppl would make some simple tests with maul, for example, to end once for all these types of thread. Like zerk vs zerk, zerk vs bunker and then bunker vs bunker.To me high numbers are acceptable in a zerk vs zerk situation. A 16k dmg agasint a bunker(ish) with high toughness is not, tho. I do not feel in zerk v. zerk hitting 16k with a single ability is acceptable unless it's on a long cooldown and setup. With 6s of stealth access, it's an outlier for sure. Go from zerk Soulbeast to Engi, Guardian, Revenant, Ele, you'll notice you are doing 33%-66% of the damage output. Agree. 16k for a single ability shouldn't happen when the ranger/thief can stealth first. That is how people quit gw2. Stuff like that with 0 counter play needs to end. It is way better after the patch but still not acceptable at all.Then why not argue to balance stealth rather than nerf damage and shift toward bunker meta?

Maul: Reduced power coefficient from 1.75 to 1.5.14,3% nerf :) Should have been 30%. It needs to be 1.25 Don't pretend you wouldn't be here making the same exact post if that maul had been 12k instead of 16k XD We got peeps in other threads complaining about sub-10k numbers from WI and Maul, so basically anything you die to should be nerfed and people won't stop crying until no one ever dies. Oh wait we got that post HoT bunker meta, and then people cried that no one died and game was slow and boring so devs wanted to make things "feel dangerous" again and up crept the power since. It's like a friggin yo-yo man XD Yeah i think that too. I wish ppl would make some simple tests with maul, for example, to end once for all these types of thread. Like zerk vs zerk, zerk vs bunker and then bunker vs bunker.To me high numbers are acceptable in a zerk vs zerk situation. A 16k dmg agasint a bunker(ish) with high toughness is not, tho. I do not feel in zerk v. zerk hitting 16k with a single ability is acceptable unless it's on a long cooldown and setup. With 6s of stealth access, it's an outlier for sure. Go from zerk Soulbeast to Engi, Guardian, Revenant, Ele, you'll notice you are doing 33%-66% of the damage output.Carefully chosen class arguments I see, as you probably know full well that thief and mes can burst from stealth and one shot other glass as well (though it's a LOT harder on thief now), and DH can do it too from stealth with trapper runes (I run one that gets 10K+ tests of faith and true shots on other glass, hitting the traps is a death sentence) I am not good with my zerk ele, but check out cellofrag's one shot ele video (pre-patch but still works post patch to the same degree that one shot Slb does in terms of the damage) Though I don't play them, I have seen wars and necros that hit like absolute trucks vs glass. The only two classes that your argument might stand for in my opinion (in terms of damage, I'm not talking about active defense because we all know stealth is a giant help) is Rev and Engi, because I play neither so can't personally confirm nor have I seen one shot variants running around post-patch. (pre-patch I saw one particular Holo build ran by one holo only that would consistently one shot from stealth. I can't remember his name but me and him would always joke that we would just be trading stealth one shots @ eachother the entire match) All of this being said, we can shave off WI or Maul even more so that it hits for a bit lower on glass if you feel it hits too hard for a single ability, or perhaps increase CDs, or change modifiers etc, just don't push it too far. You are definitely a top tier player and probably should be listened to by devs more than me but, the one thing I'm freaked out about is reverting to a bunker meta, and all of these posts about power damage on forums are really peeving me off since power was shaved so drastically this patch. My thought process is this: ok, people have a problem with being one shot for 16k on glass. Let's get that nerfed to 10k on glass. What that does is make ranger's hardest hitting ability, perhaps THE hardest hitting single ability in the game (WI), do maybe what. . . .sub-5k on a bunker? I can't do the math but probably something around there, meaning full blown bunker meta where nothing ever dies, or perhaps a condo meta, the likes of both I argue are ALREADY starting to emerge. Point is be careful what you ask for.

Maul: Reduced power coefficient from 1.75 to 1.5.14,3% nerf :) Should have been 30%. It needs to be 1.25Don't pretend you wouldn't be here making the same exact post if that maul had been 12k instead of 16k XD We got peeps in other threads complaining about sub-10k numbers from WI and Maul, so basically anything you die to should be nerfed and people won't stop crying until no one ever dies. Oh wait we got that post HoT bunker meta, and then people cried that no one died and game was slow and boring so devs wanted to make things "feel dangerous" again and up crept the power since. It's like a friggin yo-yo man XD

Like I said before, the logic of these forums is "I died to something. I died because that something is OP and needs nerfs." Assuming what was said on the prior page was true, OP had hard fought 2v2s against literally one of the best rangers in this game who made it to world championships etc, and barely lost, and therefore ranger is OP. Ya ok. OP seems like a cool headed guy who is trying to have a serious discussion about it so I'm not gonna tell him to L2P or anything b/c obviously he's good enough to be competing with a top tier ranger, but when you are calling for nerfs of ranger citing a 7.1k maul of all things and. . . .smoke assault animation. . .I question things. You do realize a FULLY glass ranger (2-3 offense uts and all damage traits + zerker etc) can do like 15k on other glass with maul still, right? You were even shown proof that the class you were playing (DH) can do the exact same thing with full glass. Every class can do it because zerker amulet and damage modifiers exist. I predict that's the next thing people are going to call to be removed, because apparently dying is not fun? You cite ranger having more active defense than other glass builds so it needs a nerf? Bullkitten, glass power core mesmer has much better active defense IMO when traited fully glass for example, and the way these rangers melt like butter when I catch them is appropriate for the way they make you melt like butter when they catch you. It just sounds like you, and the other people complaining about this, like slower-paced "strategic" combat, where as a number of the rest of us like faster based twitch combat.

DIdn't you say you were running a marauder DH? One true shot should one shot the bird o.O And if the ranger is sharp enough to see you true shotting his baby and switches in time, that bird deserves to live gosh darnit! Anyways like I said I get your frustration. Back in the day I would complain about a ton of things in this game. Then I realized I was just getting salty about things that killed me. Now when I die to something I realize I was just outplayed, outskilled, snuck up on and rekt, etc. Very few things in this game are OP to the point of breaking the high tier play, and I'll let the high tier players make those balance calls and I think that devs should listen to those players rather than forum randos like us.

We can have a genuine discussion about random attacks from pets doing crazy damage or CC, that is surely an issue. However do not complain about an F2, as the ranger is controlling that. That bird will literally die in a fraction of a single second. Now, if you were fighting an SlB, that's an issue because the SlB can just res the bird by merging so we can have a discussion about that if you want. However I'm going to assume that the ranger was core, as core rangers typically are running with birds and cats. I'm going to be real with you. I don't want to come across as condescending because I'm sure you're a great player, however, I play -nothing- but glass builds on multiple classes and have never in my entire life in recent memory on this game been killed by a pet. With one exception, I have been rando-charged by deer on a few occasions which dazed and killed me for a billion damage. I have mentioned on forums why deer's wonky AI and unpredictability with huge damage and CC is a problem on such a tanky pet, so I'm not ranger-stanning, I point out problems I see. But dying to a bird? Really? Birds literally just circle and whiff the air 50% of the time they are out lol. I totally get your frustration though and if you want to have ANET do a complete overhaul of pets to make their non-F2s do nothing substantial in terms of damage or CC since they are passive, I could go for that change as long as you fix pet AI and survivability. I doubt this will ever happen as people have been complaining about Crazy Pet damage vs bad AI since the day this game was released.

The funny thing is, that glass cannon soulbeast build everyone seems to be dying to only has ONE condi clear in the form of Bear Stance. In other words, you can literally apply some weakness on them and their pet and they're rendered useless unless they blow their heal to get rid of it (which has a 30 second cooldown btw). Not only that, but the glass sic' em soulbeasters usually run 2-3 utilities just to get the damage off; Sic'em for damage, perhaps zepher for quickness, perhaps signet of hunt for unblockable, etc. Compare that to my one shot mes that only needs ONE utility for the burst, mantra of pain. I've seen countless full glass soulbeasts running around and my god do they friggin melt.

That's what people complaining about ranger are too bad/new to realize. Every class has the capability to play glass cannon memes. Complaints on this forum are simple: I died to something, something must be horribly OP about it. It's not that people care about being hit with big power numbers more so than giant condi stacks or being cancer-ed down slowly by perma CC or whatever it is, it's that they don't like being killed, and god forbid they die 1v1. Get over it people, or stick to PvE.

That's an F2 ability. The ranger controlled it. Why shouldn't it "hit for four digits" ? You could have: Killed the cat. It's a cat. Cats and Birds die in literal seconds. Even less than a second in a team fight. Kited the terrible pet AI. The only pet in game currently that deserves a complaint is deer because it does random CC, random big numbers, it's tanky AF, and completely unpredictable. The smokescale also has a rando CC that should be looked at. And yes yes ranger stans, I know they aren't technically random because the pets use their CC skills as soon as they are summoned, but comon it's essentially random in actual fights don't deny it. So anyways to the OP: No offense, but if you're complaining about anything other than the deer you might need to check yourself before posting on forums. And before you scream bias, I do run ranger but anyone who knows me will tell you that I have never run a Tiger nor a bird in my life (precisely because they instantly die and are useless pets.)

do it chaith. static discharge meta!yeah... I was trying, friend... but it's so squishy a Soulbeast killed me 3 times over with 3 abilities. Ended this mans entire static discharge career :joy: . But I suspect that glass cannon Soulbeast will not survive this next adjustment patch at all, as it's head and shoulders above other glass cannon specs, easily doubling or even tripling burst and overall output. Full on glass cannon specs are a bit unhealthy, maybe we'll see incentives for Rangers to run a bit more balanced, there's no incentive right now.I'm pretty sure I got mega-trampled a ton as well that match Chaith :p (I usually do). Post patch I've lost too many 1v1s to count, and get hardcore shut down by anyone running a serious build who has more than a couple of brain cells. It no longer one shots reliably, and I need all 3 (ThReEeEe) of my utilities to pull it off with any kind of success haha. A war who was being a troll to me even commented as to how I was terribad because I kept instantly blowing all my CDs, but that's what it takes now to run this meme. It's a very bad build at this point that I only dick around with in unranked, and like I've said before my power mes bursts harder post-patch with much better active defense IMO. However I will agree that zerker ranger and mes are above other zerkers atm, (I don't play all the others but my thief definitely got trashed hardcore with the patch.) Though my solution would be buff the others up to par so that we can avoid a bunker/condi meta, rather than nerf down further the few power specs left at this point.

I literally can't believe I'm seeing someone asking for nerfs because of 7.1k What the heck happened to this community XD are we all just bunker carebears now? I feel like these posts about power damage are coming in at an increased rate POST power nerf patch. Like, what? Ya'll want power to literally be unplayable? rotfl

Bye then. . . .? Guess what's unfun for me, nobody dying. That's unfun. Does your opinion count more than someone else's? Boohoo. How dumbfounded do you have to be thinking that it's fun killing anyone with no effort. Guess you never knew what it meant to earn your kills or be good at the game somehow by being consistently doing the right thing rather than clean house with 0 interaction. My opinion is based on the factual evidence that if one thing takes way less effort than the other thing, it's not as skillful as the other therfor it's not in line with the balance thus you're being carried by bad design decisions. Factually complex consistency is what define player skill and if you aren't dealing with it, you're no better than the person you just beat that requires more effort.Any experienced player is going to wipe the floor with newer players, period. Experienced players running meme builds just do it faster. These builds are not viable in higher ranks because of their min/maxed status toward zerker stats and all it takes is 1 good enemy to keep an eye out and shut them down. If you keep trying to nerf power builds because they can be taken to the extreme, you run the risk of pushing the meta back to the HoT bunker meta which was incredibly boring. In the same way, if you keep trying to coddle newer players by nerfing anything dangerous to them, you run the same risk of a meta where nothing dies, or a shift to a condi meta which is even more cancerous than one shotting. This patch brought ranger into line. It nerfed their damage SIGNIFICANTLY. My mesmer bursts harder than my ranger now, and mes has better active defense than ranger. My thief was utterly obliterated (17k backstabs to 11k post patch). My WI went from 30k to around 14k. As it stands in competitive matches, I can run in and yeet someone for around 14k, perhaps killing them, only to have their teammate almost instantly res them and then I'm left standing there pretty much defenseless and get deleted. This is why these builds are not run competitively; they are one trick ponies. But because in noncompetitive matches I can steamroll through newer players, that justifies further nerfs? Think carefully before you ask for things due to unintended consequences.

Bye then. . . .? Guess what's unfun for me, nobody dying. That's unfun. Does your opinion count more than someone else's?

That's pre patch btw, and I find it funny that I almost never heard complaints about that damage pre-patch (probably because the build was almost never used due to being so fragile), but now that it takes two skills (maul and WI together) to reach HALF the damage that WI or maul could do on it's own pre-patch, people start to complain? I guess it's because some people were under the delusion that ANET was obliterating zerker builds post-patch and cry when they are hit for anything around 10k lol. Well look what we are getting now, bunker + condi meta, have fun~

I agree with OP (as a ranger main) I think pet damage is fine, but they should not be doing random CC (F2 is different)

My core mes can hit higher numbers than that after patch, whereas before patch nothing I know of hit harder than a fully buffed WI from SlB. Thief one shots got hit the hardest IMO, as I can't find a way to do it yet without making it unplayable even in unranked. Mesmers only got a slight nerf as I easily found a build that one shots just as hard as before, and ranger got a big nerf to the one shots by killing the taunt into WI and removing taunt from protect me, as well as the flat damage reduction. As someone said before, you could do 30K+ pre patch, that number went to around 14-17k I find post patch (for a fully buffed self-mauled etc WI). For comparison my thief was doing 17k malicious backstabs prepatch, 11k post patch. Again my mesmer core burst stayed about the same when I tweaked a couple things. I can't speak to one shots (including sub-second multishots like mesmer) coming from other classes such as FA ele, necro or war, but mes seems to be most viable now with SlB nerfed to a second place. That's just my opinion on having played around with it for only a short bit though. Anyways that's beside the point. I think OP's point was "Omg I can still be one shot and nothing should be able to hit for more than 10k!" lol You're delusional; that's never going to happen, and in a game where min/maxing is possible you are always going to have builds running around that are unkillable 1v1 and builds that can one shot 1v1. Though I will say that after patch, I find it pretty impossible to one shot someone who is playing bunker, and that's kind of how it should be IMO. I can get close tho, but they usually always live. I couldn't even put a dent into some of these tanky classes running around unless they were half HP and I rupted them for moment of clarity lol. Again, I think that's how it should be and this patch was a good step forward. If you're being destroyed by a maxed out zerker power build before you can react to them, alert your team to their existence and put him on perma respawn. There is a reason you don't see these builds in higher ranked. Unranked Pugs not good enough? Tough kitten, get a team then. This is pvp, you're gonna die. Edit:Oh and I forgot to add that unless you are wearing a zerker amulet it is really hard to actually be one shot by anything now from full health(never say never tho), which I think was their intention. As can be seen in the screenshots, everything now is the quick succession multihits.

I was going crazy with this haha, wondering why the heck I was getting a barrier. I prefer the old taunt, but barrier is fine I guess. I wonder if it was intended and undocumented or an unintended mistake?

Re-posting the majority of my OP since it got deleted for apparently being too mean to someone....lol I don't know why I play this game honestly XD Filled with too many sensitive carebear PvEers. For those crying about this, as others have said: pet's have ALWAYS done that much damage, you are just noticing it because of the number of rangers who run core now to fully utilize it. So let me do you a favor and tell you how to completely nullify the people who run this build: They are CORE. They CANNOT raise their pet by merging (SlB). They run BIRDS and CATS (pets that die instantly). Take two seconds out of your day to permanently down their pets and you have successfully nullified the build. Wah wah I took 12k damage wah wah wah. Go play pve, my god. T_T The people who want bunker meta make me sick. The one exception to this is Deer, because it hits just as hard but is a lot tankier for some reason. But deer's AI is so borked that he only lands things randomly, which is probably why you are seeing the switch to Cats and Birds among core players. Just make deer equally squishy, fix it's AI, and it's fine. The only way I can see a valid complaint about this build is if someone runs a SlB variant and just repeatedly resses the tiger ( I probably shouldn't be giving them ideas lol). Then it could be an issue, but most ppl are running core. You would not be calling it out if you hadn't been wrecked by one at some point. Regardless, I AGREE with you about this build. I never said it was skillful play, I implied that it was garbage, because it IS garbage, and that is why I don't play one. I'm also implying that people who get their butts handed to them on a regular basis by this build (not just a lucky PET SURPRISE LAWL 12k, b/c any zerker class can surprise kill) need to seriously question if they should be PvPing. Sorry if my point wasn't clear: the build is a meme that can be shut down in seconds, yes it's relatively skill-less, but it's also borderline useless against competent players. So why the heck are people complaining about it? It LITERALLY takes 2 seconds to incapacitate like 50-90% of their damage. Do I want it nerfed? Absolutely not. Memes are funny and make the game interesting. Only bad players get killed consistently by memes, which is why you don't often see them in ranked. I swear to god all of you carebears want to bring the HoT Bunker meta back where literally no one ever died.

Don't assume that; nothing in this kitten game makes sense in that way lol.

The only reason I play soulbeast over druid is because melding with a dead pet resses it XD Gotta keep bambi alive CHOO CHOO CHARGE