Flori.2194

Well, I guess he was trolling. I play Fire Weaver high gold, low platinum in sPvP and I am level 1500 in WvW and I roam a lot so I know a little bit of what I am doing. I played it with Lightning Rod, Fresh Air, Fire/Arcane, with a focus on power, condi or hybrid, D/D, D/F, Sc/F, Hammer... it really lacks condi cleanse and mobility. Condi cleanse and mobility come from core trait lines. The augments are all worse traited cantrips or stances. The elite is yet again a joke. I was helplessly dying against classes I don't have a problem with normally (condi Scourges, power Revs, pew pew Soulbeasts, burst Dragonhunters, some weird celestial Scrappers). It was Core Ele because in the end I have to take Cantrips, Lightning Flash is just needed, Diamond Skin/Mist Form are better stun breaks, even Glyph of Elemental Power is better than the fire augment... the elite augment is an elaborate joke, sure it offers some burst potential, but that's already there without it if you know what you are doing... So without the new utilities, with old weapons and traits that are very hard to notice in a 1 vs 1 scenario it was really like playing Core Ele, I don't have this feeling when I play D/D FA Tempest or LR Weaver or Fire Weaver or FA Weaver. I was expecting something new, something fresh to make it more different than Core Ele especially in pvp scenarios. That and that it has no theme, no concept makes me think it's trash. (And don't let me start how useless it is with staff in zerg fights...)

That's... basically a rework combined with proper balance patches... And we don't get either, so why should we, as a player base, get both at the same time? #unrealisticanetstandards

well, I'm not so sure about that

CMC straight up said: "So somehow we decided to give ele a hammer." It has no theme, concept or vision, it's core ele 2.0 with some leftover ideas for tempest (the aura thing) and for weaver (the celestial traitline, the force of swapping attunements with hammer 3) and even for core ele, remember fury on arcane?

He doesn't really have a reason to white knight it either and yet here we are... 🤷‍♂️

Because he sucked with Catalyst in those matches against the French Worms, and it was EoD specs only... Maybe he is good with Ele in general, but that doesn't make D/x Ele any better, at this point it's a gimmicky Core Ele. D/D Tempest or Catalyst? Same thing, you change one or two utilities and press one more button from time to time and that's it...

Well, I play a lot of Weaver in Open World, PvP, Roaming, Zerging, Fractals (not that much anymore) with many different builds and I never use all of the 26 weapon skills. I maybe use, depending on the situation, like up to 5, 10 or 15 max, some are pretty useless, some are just filler I use for example for Signet of Restoration, I won't expect much from those skills... and 10, well, where have I seen this number of weapon skills before?

Some people really love that meme of an elite, even CMC himself. Instead of just switching attunements and cast a few other skills we can now cast a few of the same skills again... once... every 90 seconds... instead of having Tornado for PvP, FGS for WvW or some other kittening good elite skill that ele doesn't even have in the first place besides those two... Well, maybe it's not that bad under those circumstances...

I love everything you said. Not only is Catalyst a weird mix of leftovers from Tempest and Weaver in its trais and overall playstyle but it lacks any concept or vision. What even does it try to empower? Its stats with a weird celestial trait? Being an auramancer - like Tempest? Some wannabe stances with yet another useless elite? Hammer that feels like Sword/Dagger with it's weird melee/600 range? If you can use all of them correctly then maybe you are a true Catalyst which means you are a bit better than Core Ele? I don't really care about gameplay now (spoiler: It's dead in pvp and wvw, I don't care about raids), but the concept, themes, lore and overall feeling of this spec are a complete fail in my opinion. Nearly every fanmade e-spec is better and more original and MORE CANTHAN THEMED. Anet can delete Ele and the game wouldn't change at all, all metas of all the game modes would still be the same... And Catalyst after the inevitable damage nerf won't change that...

Don't forget dagger, dagger has up to 600 range as well, it's really annoying...

I have seen Grimjack play in the games yesterday (french worms against team usa) and even in an all eod specs meta catalyst sucked hard. And when the games after a worm played catalyst they were feeding as well. Even Teapot admitted that Catalyst might not be best suited for pvp...

Energy would act like mana, I like it... at least it would give Catalyst some form of concept^^

Dude talks like there are only the lackluster new e-specs in spvp or wvw lel... Holo, Necro, Ranger and Weaver rip this thing apart but yeah, those ain't eod specs so that doesn't count...

That's exactly my experience. If I really need a lot of might I can go firework or pack rune or sigil of battle with my weaver. And most FB and some scrapper already kitten out a lot of quickness, so in the end you are like a core ele or a tempest without overloads... And those two are already way worse than weaver damage-wise. The double meteor shower with the new elite is a nice little gimmick, but losing FGS is too much of a DPS loss to justify to meteor showers every 90 seconds that you have to nail perfectly.

Let them have fun against a predictable PvE boss that does nothing new or surprising and stays always the same... We all know Catalyst won't be played with hammer in sPvP or WvW and even with something else it will be a meme. D/x for sPvP will be a gimmicky core ele or a worse weaver and staff for WvW will be nothing more than another Tempest or again core ele... Catalyst for competitve game modes will be dead on arrival, it will be a meme just like Holo or Deadeye for Zerging for example...

Too much nope, you don't know much about weaver, you can double attune to any attunement to proc elements of rage, so let's say first attunement earth for earth 2, second fire, you cast fire 5, double attune to earth AND proc elements of rage WHILE still casting meteor shower, fire off earth 3 and 4, back to fire for fire 2 and so on, there are a lot of ways to never miss a fire 2 and 5 BUT ALSO use a lot of cc and damage spells in the other 3 attunements... And holy kitten, if you only use FGS for cleaving you are using it wrong...

Thank you! I think they just don't know how to utilise weaver correctly...

Well, then you don't play Weaver very well, you can double attune to air or earth while casting meteor shower and cc with air or earth after, go back to fire and cast fire 2 again, you have much more tools you can use outside of fire 2 and 5, the double attunement allows you to fire 2 and earth 4/air 5 and follow up with a double attuned meteor shower... Weaver is complex and can do a lot more damage and cc than Catalyst... And excuse me? FGS only for cleaving? As soon as you notice that they have sustain problems or your zerg prepares a bomb you go ham with it and out dps everybody else. It's THE dps weapon for ele, FGS makes staff weaver a bit more than a meme, it grants you 10k+ dps and you can down a lot of enemies if you use it wisely. Double meteor shower every 90 seconds won't do that consistently...

Pretty bold statement, you have to choose your words more precisely please. You mean you CAN play it with D/x in spvp and staff in wvw, it's not good. Fire Weaver or LR Weaver are good-ish, not really meta but viable. Staff Weaver in WvW isn't meta but nice damage-wise and a cute number farm. What you mean is that you can kittening play this kitten in every kittening way you want, which doesn't make it good, only playable for you. D/x Catalyst is too close to core ele to even be considered "good" reagrding spvp and Staff Cata for WvW is a weird mix of core ele and a bit of Weaver and Tempest which are also not good, but at least a bit viable...

So you basically player weaver without rotating because the attunement cd is too high (hello tempest and core ele) so in order to fire 2 all the time you have to camp fire but you also play without FGS which is a gigantic damage and dps loss... Wow, catalyst with staff feels so different to core ele especially in zergs where fb and scrapper give quickness for fun and might is never a problem...

That's it, close the thread... Everyone who says Catalyst is trash - and I think it is, it has no concept, no vision, no lore, no theme - means for unpredictable pvp scenarios, where you have to improvise, where a fight against a rev is completely different to a fight against a rev you had last week. Lupi always does the same, the Sloth always does the same. But fighting against a a real player or real players in zergs is different every time. And Catalyst can't adapt to that, it has no sustain, no distinct features that make it different to weaver damage-wise or tempest aurasupport-wise. That's why we all think it's trash, not because it works against some stupid AI that's always the same each and every day...

The big problem catalyst has is that it's seemingly broken in predictable PvE scenarios and unplayable in anything unpredictable (aka pvp, wvw) where it is either competing for a damage role with weaver as a glorified core ele or with tempest as some kind of aura support... It has no identity, no niche to fit into, no role to play in any competitive game mode... oh and it lacks sustain to be even borderline useful in pvp as a sidenoder/duelist or wvw as a roamer, so here it loses against weaver...

I think he meant "Golem Benchmark", "Auric Basin Bauble Farm" and "Daily T3 Fractals"

Well, after the first survey where a majority rated it bad or terrible and less than 20% rated it mediocre, good or better and a big amount of participants said they should redo the whole thing or at least fix a lot I think anet doesn't care at all. This survey is nice and I feel confirmed with my concerns and complaints about this crappy e-spec, but overall it's pointless because there are too many white knights and I don't think they listen to anything else but the feedback in the feedback thread, even if 100% said they should redo it, they won't because it's another pointless thread where ele mains cry. And we have a lot of them and it seems like anet doesn't care. 🤷‍♂️

I know, but he then went on and said that Spellbreaker is a pure pvp spec... Right now Ele has no pvp spec, it's outshined in every aspect it could be good at by other classes (and the same is true for PvE, there is a thread here which states you could delete ele and nothing would change in the game and that's very true).