UNOwen.7132

Yeah, I'd agree with that. Do that and buff gunsaber massively, because rn its kitten.

Its a decap sidenoder in PvP. You dont win fights by killing the enemy, you just get them off the point repeatedly and cap them. Thats not useful in WvW, so neither is mechanist.

I'd say it wouldnt need to be gotten rid off, just make it only reload weapon skills, dragon trigger skills and armament skills. Oh and make armament skills not trash.

I mean, wrong subforum, but Spellbreaker got no buff for WvW either.

Read the first sentence again. I said that the ones that did try to 1v1 in the MAT finals and in the showmatch universally lost their 1v1s. Not that they all lost 1v1s everywhere. I cant make that claim. And yeah, I said that they cant stay longer than 15 seconds on a node. That is still correct. The example you gave did see the theif go off-node constantly, because thats the point of that mechanist build. The mechanist just kittened in doing the second half of that gameplan, staying on the node.

Funny theory, but wrong for 2 reasons. 1 if you have good arguments, you definitely can convince me. Multiple people here have done so before. You just need good arguments. Bit hard to get those when youre just wrong. The other is, they were all too happy to respond all the time ... until I completely dismantled their argument and they had no response left. Funny how it *always* lines up that they "think it doesnt matter" right when they have no arguments left. No, they didnt respond because they had no response. But also were too stubborn to admit that they were just wrong. Thief only had 1 build in the meta for *ages*. Decap and +1 bot. Thats literally the only playable build. Although Specter now seems to be decent at teamfights too. But no, thats not quite accurate. Its not as good as core necro, but it doesnt have to be. Also healing is ironicalyl the thing Specter is terrible at.

Actually, it was a 3v3, then a 3v2, then a 2v1. You can tell the herald had fought there just a moment ago and just rotated around. Anyway, point is, this was a 2v1 victory, not a 1v1 victory. Cleaning up after an enemy had to expend all their resources in a 2v1 is not winning a 1v1.

Yeah they did. And then I pointed out every mistake they made and why their entire long argumentation is wrong. Strangely enough, they never had a response for that. Turns out they were just wrong. And yeah, other roamer builds would have similar difficulty, but as you said, theyre not as mobile. So theres no point to playing them. Tbh, Im sure people complained that thief was bad incorrectly, but for most thief players the problem is how little variety thief has. Its all decap and +1. A lot of people want thief to be a "deadly duelist" like the official class blurb describes them at. Instead, thief is the *worst* duelist. That sucks. And it sucks that no matter what you play, thief is terrible at 1v1s. But such is the price of shortbow 5.

What I love is that they say that "With the big nerf to Winds of Disenchantment, we also wanted to include some effects to support the spellbreaker build.", and then ... they dont.

This is not winning a 1v1. Thief was just 2v1ing the Weaver with a Guardian, and while the Guardian moves away, this is just thief cleaning up after a 2v1. Not an example. I think you mistook it because of what Teapot was saying, seemingly he did not spot the Guardian either. This appears to be a Druid style Mechanist sidenoder, who does not have the kill pressure to kill anyone, but instead wins sidenode battles by constantly pushing off the enemy while continously capturing the point. A classic bunker. Except, this Engineer appears to not know how to play it. He keeps going off the node. This isnt thief holding a node against Engineer, this is an Engineer not knowing how to play his class. This is the first and only time so far I have seen this actually happen. Sure, this is an example of a specter winning a 1v1. Uh, the blue specter does not beat red herald. You can tell by the lifebars that the red herald is literally at *full* hp. He just disengages for some reason without fighting. As for the blue vindicator, yeah he loses, but he also clearly misplays. Shackling wave into nothing, not going for sword 3, just weird. I mean, we did see in the EU vs NA showmatch that Specter lost every 1v1, including against a necro. It certainly isnt good at 1v1s. It might be able to win some though, admitively I didnt see any Rev vs Specter 1v1s in that showmatch. However, losing to most classes instead of all classes does not make it less bad. Oh it'll be gutted. Lets not kid ourselves, its just a matter of time. Anet guts every thief build that allows them to do more than decap and +1 while doing noodle damage. And yeah I dont know why people would claim its bad. I was just unconvinced its teamfight power was good enough initially.

You do know that thats just ... boonbeast, except bad, right? Its boonbeast with an autoattack that does about half as much DPS, and none of the things that make boonbeast good. You lack the tankiness, you lack the sustain, you lack the damage and you lack the condipressure. I would also point out that DP DD has had that sigil for ages back when PI was still a thing. And it wasnt very good. Even with Headshot being as good as it is. Specter is also ... not a class adept at spamming CCs. In fact, it has 4. Steal (or Siphon I guess). Shroud 3. Shroud 4. And the Elite well. Of these, only Siphon is actually fast enough to get an interrupt. Sigil of Draining only drains if theyre interrupted, so if they dont use a skill when youre in Shadowfall, or when the enemy Specter is using the very slow shroud 3 or shroud 4 ... you dont get drained. And besides the shadow shroud skills, the cooldowns are all quite long. Its simply not good. Its a bad Boonbeast.

Yeah, if the enemy is below 25% hp. Wow. When theyre at full health? Your Heartseekers are gonna be doing 2k damage. Thats pretty trash. And yeah, doing damage on thief is not difficult. Its a good thing that damage is the least important thing on thief since thats the thing thief is terrible at. Meanwhile rotation, map awareness, optimal macro, those are quite very hard, and oh it turns out, those are key to thief. Uh, a lot of builds can do that? Maybe not thief builds, but thats not the point. And even then, this is not what I understand under "hold a sidenode". Being able to stand on it for 15 seconds instead of 5-10 is not exactly impressive. I dont really see much of anything thats Willbender like here. Nothing really that majorly focuses on mobility like Willbender does. Which makes sense, because mobility is the one thing Warrior is already good at. You could, if you had convincing arguments. Its just that, for some reason, you never do. I wonder why.

Oh theyre not great at that either. They can stay a bit longer (like, 15 seconds instead of 10), but they still kinda just die if they dont run away. "Unkillable" roamers are a dime a dozen. Thats nothing special. And theyre usually not very good, because they also cant kill the enemy, and can in fact sometimes be killed. Specter in particular does not have great active defenses against your bogstandard oneshot Soulbeast (itself not a very good build). The only exception to this is is like boonbeast. That one is actually good. Specter is nothing special here, and not even particularly good. In zergs, its useless for obvious reasons, and in small scale skirmishes its about as good as condi thief is. Which isnt very.

It really cannot 1v1. There is a reason we see Spectres barely going for 1v1s in the MAT and the EU NA showmatch, and why the handful of them that did try to 1v1 against non-Spectre classes *universally* lost their 1v1s. It is really good on everything else though. Its basically a decap and +1 bot that is also really good in teamfights apparently. I doubt it'll last though, Anet does not like when thief is good at anything but decapping and +1ing. I expect their teamfight capabilities to be reduced to nothing. Not really true in WvW (and only conditionally true in PvE, status pending). In WvW, the only reason to pick thief is to hunt noobs in duels. Spectre isnt good at 1v1s, and its less mobile. Why pick it over DD?

Do you mean when backstab, the highest burst skill thief has, on a purely OFFENSIVE build (no, shadow arts is not defensive, its offensive) did 4k, while bruiser builds like Prot Holo were regularly bursting for over 5k? Where the only reason thief was played was because its a decap and +1 bot (Which is pretty much always the reason), where the fact that you do noodle damage does not matter? Because in that case, boy did you misrepresent the entire situation. Also thief was not considered "OP". It was considered a mandatory 1of in Conquest, because it does something no other class does. Also, isnt thief universally considered to be pretty high skill? Also, why are you claiming Spectre "can hold a sidenode", when it literally cant? Its clearly a teamfight and +1 build, but it still loses every 1v1. We saw that in the EU vs NA showmatch, where the one and only time a spectre didnt lose a 1v1 was vs another spectre. What exactly do you mean by this? Nothing about Willbender sounds like it'd be warrior.

2 Specters? Thats surprising. We havent had 2 thief teams since 2019. Are they actually that good in teamfights? I mean it would make sense they'd be good at that with wells, but it still kinda shocks me. No chance Specter will be left as it is though, they do not want thief to be good at anything but decapping and +1ing.

Eh, I'd give some changes to bladesworn. Right now its carried by tactical reload + shouts, while having the gunsaber be a worthless weapon. That really isnt how the class should be. I'd cut the synergy between the class and shouts (because otherwise you will only use shouts), and buff gunsaber instead.

I saw people try that against me. They lost. Every time. Its really not good at 1v1s. Scepter 2 is weaker than Unload. And Scepters auto is worse than Pistols auto. If youre going power, anyway. No shadowforce though, a fair bit of damage taken, and the mechanist had everything up. Sure, the guard was getting ready to move earlier. But thats because the spectre was losing the 1v1 (obviously), and he had to cover tranquility. IF he didnt come, the spectre gets killed, and tranquility gets taken.

No, he was going to lose and die or run away no matter what he did. Actually, he was going to lose it. He was about to be bursted down quite hard, and he didnt really have the resources to survive it. He was always gonna run. Not much to say other than "spectre is just terrible at 1v1ing because thief is". Nah. He lost the 1v1. You can watch his health on the left, he was about to die. The guardian saved him, but he had to run because he lost the 1v1 badly.

Then you simply did not pay attention. You see it constantly. Spectre is the only enemy against which spectre wins, otherwise they lose the 1v1. At 2:55:50, you see a spectre lose a 1v1 to mechanist in the bottom point. 3:18:50 a theif run away from a 1v1 they lost despite a +1 incoming. 3:34:00, a thief loses a 1v1 to mechanist and runs. 3:54:15, loses 1v1 to mechanist around tranquility and runs. Couple more 1v1s that thief was losing before a +1 came, but theyre less clean examples, so Ill not list them here.

The point is that necro is good at teamfighting and bad at 1v1ing, and specter lost to it.

There is no magical build that turns Spectre into a better duelist. If you want to duel with Spectre, youd use that same build. Thats as good as it gets. It just turns out, "as good as it gets" is "about as good as thief". Thief is the worst 1v1 class, so spectre is too. Thats not why you dont take spectre as a duelist. The reason you dont take spectre as a duelist is because it loses 1v1 against literally every other class. Remember, it didnt just lose to sidenoders in the tournament, it lost to *Necro*. A teamfighter that cant 1v1. Its that bad.

Yes, just like we saw in the EU vs NA showmatch, where Spectre kept 1v1ing other classes on point and ... lost every single 1v1 without it being even close. Wait what? Yeah no, it cant. You lose every 1v1.

Its not "really good". Its bad. Its about as bad as regular thief. It cant even manage a 1v1 against literally any class. Which is fine, its not supposed to be a 1v1 class, thief isnt supposed to be a class that fights evenly in general, but its important to point that out.

The one where you kept seeing Spectre die in 1v1s because they didnt run away, and the only 1v1s spectre was winning was vs another spectre (by definition)? I literally checked back through the whole VOD, and every single 1v1 spectre was in that wasnt against another spectre ended in one of two ways. 1, the spectre died. 2, the spectre ran away. They never beat literally ANY class in a 1v1. Not even kittening necro.