Anet Murders The Melee Thief. Don't change Things You Don't Understand Guys.

[Jitters.9401]

I am Straight Melee.

Weapon sets are D/D  D/D because it is the most fun for me. 

Stealth On Steal Was Very important. 

Stealth on Heal Was very Important.

 

Cloak And Dagger: (stealth) costs 5 initiative points. I have fights where it fails every attempt.

It is subject to evades, blocks, blind.. range glitches.  Just had a fight with a harbinger where it failed twice in a row. It looked like I was on him but something glitched. That is 10 initiative points wasted and I get stuck with auto attacks most times.

 

Shadow Refuge:  Half the people out there have "reveal skills/Traits." Others throw reveal traps. People place reveal traps in camps as well. Then there are sentries and towers traited to mark/reveal. I just fought a necro who had multiple fears. Made my shadow refuge useless. 

 

Deadeyes have NIGH stealth.  D/P thieves have nigh stealth.

Pure Melee Thieves have minimal stealth. We got screwed with this ridiculous patch made by people who have zero clue about playing a pure melee thief. 

 

I got in a fight with a d/p thief. He spent 90% of his time in stealth. I spent 90%  of my time visible. The 2nd time shadow refuge was ready, I used it to leave the fight. Totally ridiculous how anet buffed thief classes who do not need buffs and destroyed the one thief build that was not already over powered. Remember.. I don't spam stealth because I cannot. He can now stealth more and move more due to the initiative gain anet gave his already overpowered build.

 

 

I can play my scrapper engineer who does so much more damage, kills more, and has more maneuverability but I prefer my d/d  d/d thief. And fun note... my engineer was buffed with the new rifle auto attack. Too funny.

 

But I know through experience anet does not listen to reality. 

 

I quit once before and can do it again. No loss to me. no loss to anet. I do not spend real currency on transactions anyway. I would actually love to do it as there are things I would want to have... but anet keeps reminding me why I quit the first time so I do not.

 

I am a firm believe that stealth was overly used by certain classes and those are the exact same classes anet buffed. Now they get more initiative gain and super speed while pure melee thieves get nerfed.

 

Good Job anet. you really earned you money on this screw up.

 

 

 

EDIT "Oh Yah My Point"   Learn the classes you make changes. You literally buffed deadeye and d/p thieves while ruining the one thief build (d/d  d/d) that was unable to abuse the stealth mechanic. It is truly frustrating investing so much time into what I like to have it ruined by those who probably have never tried it in the first place.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 2, 2022 by Jitters.9401
forgot something

[Mincsk.6028]

No the point of the change was to nerf stealth. There was some leaked information that confirms the goal was nerfing stealth. I shelved my thieves because I feel they don't have a place in wvw when everything does it better and they are unwelcome in group play.

[Jugglemonkey.8741]

One of three things will happen. 

1) You'll do what everyone else does, and learn to adapt. 

2) You'll quit thief and main engi.

3) You'll quit the game. 

 

Permastealth DE basically shouldn't have been a thing to begin with, although it was fun while it lasted. If this change means they actually get around to buffing specs that aren't D/P without making D/P insanely OP along the way, I'm all for it. 

[itspomf.9523]

Imagine treating the symptoms and not the disease.

 

(Or, put more simply:  rather than removing the mechanics which permitted permastealth via exploitation of smoke fields, and left well enough alone, ANet decides to all but gut one of the more iconic trait lines and severely handicap an already deteriorated class.  Don't be surprised if later "balance" patches involve increasing initiative costs and forcing Thief further into its new role of single-target healbot and alacrity minion).

[Ian.8340]

It really sucks that anet has decided to remove the enjoyment that the players find in their game. The people who complain don't play the class and feel like they have the right to kill any thief they see. This balance patch won't even affect any of those people who complain that much, but this patch does hurt those people who loved to play with a stealth playstyle. I really wish they would revert these Shadow Arts changes. 

[Quaiv.7538]

Pretty much this. Played around a lot today trying to find a good build that benefits most from the new traits and ended up with rifle d/p deadeye.

[Jitters.9401]

10 hours ago, Jugglemonkey.8741 said:

3) You'll quit the game.

 

I'm looking at this option.

 

I've tried deadeye. Not fun at all. I do not like all that stealth. I just want what should be the basics. 

 

Ironic though.  They would rather I change to a build that abuses stealth than play something that uses a fraction of the stealth the Rifle and Dagger Pistol builds use. Very Amusing.

 

 

I'm too poor to try different builds anyway. WvW does not allow us to make any real gold and anet seems to like it that way. So yeah. Option 3 looks better each time I log in.

 

Ah well. My two friends I brought to the game have already left. Maybe I will be #3 unless anet fixes their stupidity.

 

Instead of a blanket nerf they should have just made changes to those abilities that abuse the stealth mechanic. I never abused it and I still get punished. My guess is laziness.

 

Edited July 3, 2022 by Jitters.9401
Forgot info

[EEB.7082]

i wanted to do a new post but its just what i was about to say, they butchered my favorite class, it was not even op, thief are ment to be in stealth its the core mechanic in all mmos, why arenante ???? why always nerf thief, its like they dont like their own creationg, 1 second stealth its a joke, thief whit out stealth is thief dead, or go back to hit and run and try to survive because of course thiefs are not tanks, there is tank builds of course but i think i speak for all main thiefs we like to do what a thief is suppous to do, stealth kill hide and scape, some people like it some people dont, but at the end of the day that is what a thief assasin do, im so sad, not even angry, after 7 or 8 years playing holding nerf after nerf, this is to much, im dont even want to play anymore, i use to go wvw all the time having fun, like i said stalth build is not even op, people with skill can give you hard time, even kill you, there is more op classes and they never, never get this kind of nerfs if i can call it like that, because they just destroyed the thief now....sad

[EEB.7082]

15 hours ago, Jugglemonkey.8741 said:

One of three things will happen. 

1) You'll do what everyone else does, and learn to adapt. 

2) You'll quit thief and main engi.

3) You'll quit the game. 

 

Permastealth DE basically shouldn't have been a thing to begin with, although it was fun while it lasted. If this change means they actually get around to buffing specs that aren't D/P without making D/P insanely OP along the way, I'm all for it. 

adapt...... i think all of us main thief did this so many times, nerf after nerf, because there was good builds left, acording to our play style, what arenanet did is basically change the thief to how they want us to play it or how all the rest of the people that complains about stealth want, wich is crazy, stealth was not even op to begin with, anoying to people with low skills but not op, if this dont change i will quit, i returned because i was so happy about the expansion, so i can try new things keeping the core mechanic of stealth but now that stealth last 1 second im dead and i dont want to play the hit and run thing, super boring, so yea no more adapting for me, not this time...

[Jitters.9401]

22 hours ago, EEB.7082 said:

thief whit out stealth is thief dead

This. 

And the point about players who are not skilled. No skill players should lose fights to thieves. No brainer here. 

 

If I had a $ for everytime I've been marked (sentries, towers, keeps included) revealed by traits/traps/skills, and knocked out of shadow refuge by a knock back, I'd be able to buy a brand new gaming system.

 

I've even had multiple fights where more than 1 person is throwing a reveal trap at me. 

 

So for anet to actively remove destroy certain thief builds without removing all the "traps, traits, skills, tower/keep abilities, sentry marks.....  that is just plain lazy and f'ing stupid.

 

The people who do this sort of idiocy need to play the thing they are killing before making decision the slash to the throats of certain builds.

 

In all aspects I am much more deadly against multiple opponents with my engineer but it never had the flair of the pure melee thief. 

[Svarty.8019]

On 7/2/2022 at 5:07 PM, Jitters.9401 said:

I am Straight Melee.

Weapon sets are D/D  D/D because it is the most fun for me. 

Stealth On Steal Was Very important. 

Stealth on Heal Was very Important.

 

Cloak And Dagger: (stealth) costs 5 initiative points. I have fights where it fails every attempt.

It is subject to evades, blocks, blind.. range glitches.  Just had a fight with a harbinger where it failed twice in a row. It looked like I was on him but something glitched. That is 10 initiative points wasted and I get stuck with auto attacks most times.

 

Shadow Refuge:  Half the people out there have "reveal skills/Traits." Others throw reveal traps. People place reveal traps in camps as well. Then there are sentries and towers traited to mark/reveal. I just fought a necro who had multiple fears. Made my shadow refuge useless. 

 

Deadeyes have NIGH stealth.  D/P thieves have nigh stealth.

Pure Melee Thieves have minimal stealth. We got screwed with this ridiculous patch made by people who have zero clue about playing a pure melee thief. 

 

I got in a fight with a d/p thief. He spent 90% of his time in stealth. I spent 90%  of my time visible. The 2nd time shadow refuge was ready, I used it to leave the fight. Totally ridiculous how anet buffed thief classes who do not need buffs and destroyed the one thief build that was not already over powered. Remember.. I don't spam stealth because I cannot. He can now stealth more and move more due to the initiative gain anet gave his already overpowered build.

 

 

I can play my scrapper engineer who does so much more damage, kills more, and has more maneuverability but I prefer my d/d  d/d thief. And fun note... my engineer was buffed with the new rifle auto attack. Too funny.

 

But I know through experience anet does not listen to reality. 

 

I quit once before and can do it again. No loss to me. no loss to anet. I do not spend real currency on transactions anyway. I would actually love to do it as there are things I would want to have... but anet keeps reminding me why I quit the first time so I do not.

 

I am a firm believe that stealth was overly used by certain classes and those are the exact same classes anet buffed. Now they get more initiative gain and super speed while pure melee thieves get nerfed.

 

Good Job anet. you really earned you money on this screw up.

 

 

 

EDIT "Oh Yah My Point"   Learn the classes you make changes. You literally buffed deadeye and d/p thieves while ruining the one thief build (d/d  d/d) that was unable to abuse the stealth mechanic. It is truly frustrating investing so much time into what I like to have it ruined by those who probably have never tried it in the first place.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

OMG OMG, do I get to say, "Your salty tears sustain me"?

 

Did I do it right?

[Sylvia.4870]

On 7/2/2022 at 11:07 PM, Jitters.9401 said:

I am Straight Melee.

Weapon sets are D/D  D/D because it is the most fun for me. 

Stealth On Steal Was Very important. 

Stealth on Heal Was very Important.

 

Cloak And Dagger: (stealth) costs 5 initiative points. I have fights where it fails every attempt.

It is subject to evades, blocks, blind.. range glitches.  Just had a fight with a harbinger where it failed twice in a row. It looked like I was on him but something glitched. That is 10 initiative points wasted and I get stuck with auto attacks most times.

 

Shadow Refuge:  Half the people out there have "reveal skills/Traits." Others throw reveal traps. People place reveal traps in camps as well. Then there are sentries and towers traited to mark/reveal. I just fought a necro who had multiple fears. Made my shadow refuge useless. 

 

Deadeyes have NIGH stealth.  D/P thieves have nigh stealth.

Pure Melee Thieves have minimal stealth. We got screwed with this ridiculous patch made by people who have zero clue about playing a pure melee thief. 

 

I got in a fight with a d/p thief. He spent 90% of his time in stealth. I spent 90%  of my time visible. The 2nd time shadow refuge was ready, I used it to leave the fight. Totally ridiculous how anet buffed thief classes who do not need buffs and destroyed the one thief build that was not already over powered. Remember.. I don't spam stealth because I cannot. He can now stealth more and move more due to the initiative gain anet gave his already overpowered build.

 

 

I can play my scrapper engineer who does so much more damage, kills more, and has more maneuverability but I prefer my d/d  d/d thief. And fun note... my engineer was buffed with the new rifle auto attack. Too funny.

 

But I know through experience anet does not listen to reality. 

 

I quit once before and can do it again. No loss to me. no loss to anet. I do not spend real currency on transactions anyway. I would actually love to do it as there are things I would want to have... but anet keeps reminding me why I quit the first time so I do not.

 

I am a firm believe that stealth was overly used by certain classes and those are the exact same classes anet buffed. Now they get more initiative gain and super speed while pure melee thieves get nerfed.

 

Good Job anet. you really earned you money on this screw up.

 

 

 

EDIT "Oh Yah My Point"   Learn the classes you make changes. You literally buffed deadeye and d/p thieves while ruining the one thief build (d/d  d/d) that was unable to abuse the stealth mechanic. It is truly frustrating investing so much time into what I like to have it ruined by those who probably have never tried it in the first place.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

     Greetings, Original Poster. Honestly, I would like to ask you some questions: How about using an opponent's strength as your own advantage to counterattack? How about timing the weapon abilities  or the Steal skill  to land on an adversary  more precisely? How about turning a weak spot into a trap to deceive a foe?

     P.S.1:Shadow Refuge makes you stay in a certain area; thus, it lets your foe attack the area. It is predictable; however, you can use it as a combo field to blind your foe with some certain weapons; for example, pistol, shortbow. 

    P.S. 2: Accuracy, agility and awareness  are highly required to fight certain types of fighter.

    P.S.3 :Don't fear the so-called Reveal.Try to play more aggressively and more carefully.

    P.S. Bonus: Above all, practice makes perfect. 

    I understand what you have been encountering with. I have been there and done that.

     

Edited July 5, 2022 by Sylvia.4870

[Mincsk.6028]

20 hours ago, Sylvia.4870 said:

     Greetings, Original Poster. Honestly, I would like to ask you some questions: How about using an opponent's strength as your own advantage to counterattack? How about timing the weapon abilities  or the Steal skill  to land on an adversary  more precisely? How about turning a weak spot into a trap to deceive a foe?

     P.S.1:Shadow Refuge makes you stay in a certain area; thus, it lets your foe attack the area. It is predictable; however, you can use it as a combo field to blind your foe with some certain weapons; for example, pistol, shortbow. 

    P.S. 2: Accuracy, agility and awareness  are highly required to fight certain types of fighter.

    P.S.3 :Don't fear the so-called Reveal.Try to play more aggressively and more carefully.

    P.S. Bonus: Above all, practice makes perfect. 

    I understand what you have been encountering with. I have been there and done that.

     

Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face. Trying to time out a master stroke while engi just nades his own feet to make you die. I think this is a problem with thief, the profession asks you to play chess while other just jump you playing checkers. 

[Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497]

On 7/4/2022 at 9:43 PM, Sylvia.4870 said:

     Greetings, Original Poster. Honestly, I would like to ask you some questions: How about using an opponent's strength as your own advantage to counterattack? How about timing the weapon abilities  or the Steal skill  to land on an adversary  more precisely? How about turning a weak spot into a trap to deceive a foe?

     P.S.1:Shadow Refuge makes you stay in a certain area; thus, it lets your foe attack the area. It is predictable; however, you can use it as a combo field to blind your foe with some certain weapons; for example, pistol, shortbow. 

    P.S. 2: Accuracy, agility and awareness  are highly required to fight certain types of fighter.

    P.S.3 :Don't fear the so-called Reveal.Try to play more aggressively and more carefully.

    P.S. Bonus: Above all, practice makes perfect. 

    I understand what you have been encountering with. I have been there and done that.

     

You say that like its a simple solution. It is against someone that didn't know how to deal with a thief. Against someone with more than two brain cells to rub together, this advice is meaningless.

 

Considering that you have a heavily neutered kit, going against someone with more tools to deal with you than just reveal. And access to their entire hotbar without fear of global cooldowns getting in the way

Honestly. Im near the point of just quiting. As they feel its fine to make crippling changes and address it three or more months later.

 

Edited July 6, 2022 by Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497

[Sylvia.4870]

6 hours ago, Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 said:

You say that like its a simple solution. It is against someone that didn't know how to deal with a thief. Against someone with more than two brain cells to rub together, this advice is meaningless.

 

Considering that you have a heavily neutered kit, going against someone with more tools to deal with you than just reveal. And access to their entire hotbar without fear of global cooldowns getting in the way

Honestly. Im near the point of just quiting. As they feel its fine to make crippling changes and address it three or more months later.

 

            Meaningless? If you think that way, okay -  I respect your thought. I can't forbid someone's idea, after all. A simple solution? Since when did I say it was simple? It is not.  Imao!

Edited July 7, 2022 by Sylvia.4870

[Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497]

42 minutes ago, Sylvia.4870 said:

            Meaningless? If you think that way, okay -  I respect your thought. I can't forbid someone's idea, after all. A simple solution? Since when did I say it was simple? It is not.  Imao!

The keyword is "You say that like".

 

Reality is, every thief eventually gets to this point. The problem is, that over time your kit fell behind and theirs only improved.

 

Timing counter attacks against other players skills? Yeah. Thats how thief USED TO WORK. You had burst damage which let you punish. Thief was a single target duelest. And it used to be the best at it.

 

Now you don't have that massive burst. You don't have the init to stay in a prolonged fight. Hell, acrobatics used to be good back when cats grace refunded half of core thief's stamina while providing vigor. So core thief could actually go blow for blow with a warrior and stay on top of them. Init regen used to be faster, so you could blow up mes's phantasms to reduce their damage on you temporarily and get back to them. You can't pressure as well anymore. They have easy access to crap like stability, protection, aegis, regen, invulnerability. Spammable AOEs to zone you out, or blow you up.

 

And the same people who can't seem to figure out that the easiest way to stop a thief isn't reveal - complain causing more and more nerfs to get stacked on the profession. Cuz reveal isn't that big of an issue. Its just DO SOMETHING. Anything than just stand there waiting for the thief to be visible again.

 

The most infuriating part? I have to put more effort into this profession to take out another player than they do for me. And now if you're not a deadeye, they can eat a backstab without worry, and faceroll the keyboard to burst you dead.

 

If you're not a specter the survivability you used to have has been sliced in half and set on fire.

Edited July 7, 2022 by Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497

[Sylvia.4870]

1 hour ago, Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 said:

The keyword is "You say that like".

 

Reality is, every thief eventually gets to this point. The problem is, that over time your kit fell behind and theirs only improved.

 

Timing counter attacks against other players skills? Yeah. Thats how thief USED TO WORK. You had burst damage which let you punish. Thief was a single target duelest. And it used to be the best at it.

 

Now you don't have that massive burst. You don't have the init to stay in a prolonged fight. Hell, acrobatics used to be good back when cats grace refunded half of core thief's stamina while providing vigor. So core thief could actually go blow for blow with a warrior and stay on top of them. Init regen used to be faster, so you could blow up mes's phantasms to reduce their damage on you temporarily and get back to them. You can't pressure as well anymore. They have easy access to crap like stability, protection, aegis, regen, invulnerability. Spammable AOEs to zone you out, or blow you up.

 

And the same people who can't seem to figure out that the easiest way to stop a thief isn't reveal - complain causing more and more nerfs to get stacked on the profession. Cuz reveal isn't that big of an issue. Its just DO SOMETHING. Anything than just stand there waiting for the thief to be visible again.

 

The most infuriating part? I have to put more effort into this profession to take out another player than they do for me. And now if you're not a deadeye, they can eat a backstab without worry, and faceroll the keyboard to burst you dead.

 

If you're not a specter the survivability you used to have has been sliced in half and set on fire.

             I wholeheartedly agree with you. All of what you say and elaborate here. Cat's grace - you mean Feline Grace. Initiative regeneration is slower than it used to be. Due to the reduced damage, one has to struggle more than ever to inflict damage on an enemy significantly. 

                 Those poeple who barely stop complaining about the Thief profession and cry out for nerfs on it - I wish they were in the position the Thief players currently stay at,  learned it more for erasing their hatred, misunderstanding or at least tried to fight it with what they possess  as best as they could till the end; be that as it may, they will never change(sigh).

                

       

Edited July 7, 2022 by Sylvia.4870

[Jitters.9401]

On 7/4/2022 at 8:43 PM, Sylvia.4870 said:

     Greetings, Original Poster. Honestly, I would like to ask you some questions: How about using an opponent's strength as your own advantage to counterattack? How about timing the weapon abilities  or the Steal skill  to land on an adversary  more precisely? How about turning a weak spot into a trap to deceive a foe?

     P.S.1:Shadow Refuge makes you stay in a certain area; thus, it lets your foe attack the area. It is predictable; however, you can use it as a combo field to blind your foe with some certain weapons; for example, pistol, shortbow. 

    P.S. 2: Accuracy, agility and awareness  are highly required to fight certain types of fighter.

    P.S.3 :Don't fear the so-called Reveal.Try to play more aggressively and more carefully.

    P.S. Bonus: Above all, practice makes perfect. 

    I understand what you have been encountering with. I have been there and done that.

     

First. Let me thank you for making suggestions. 

 

My best was me killing 4 people with my thief? 5 with my engineer. Thief is more fun and more my playstyle. 

 

This will sound narcissistic but it is true. I am literally one of the best I have ever seen on WvW. I like being the only person who plays like I do (or did now that I got f'd) so I've never shared. 

 

Those builds that seem too good to be true.... I can kill almost everyone of them. The one incredibly rare thing I may not be able to take down cannot take me down either.  That deadeye build that everyone hates on because it kills multiple people... I kill those.

 

I play condition.  I built myself to survive all those ridiculous rerevealsi use. I know when to play aggressive or defensive. 

 

I don't need a lot of stealth but to take away the most important ones (on steal on heal) was just ludicrous. 

 

I can play the deadeye that everyone hates but it isn't fun for me. I get bored of my engineer quickly. My condi thief is the only thing that kept me going.

 

For me now... I only see myself quitting.  I have a busy life anyway and waiting to see if they fix their stupidity is a waste of time.

 

And yeah. No loss to anyone in game. No loss to anet. I'm good with that. I only really know one person anyway.

 

But good luck to the thieves out there. 

 

 

[DeceiverX.8361]

On 7/4/2022 at 10:43 PM, Sylvia.4870 said:

     Greetings, Original Poster. Honestly, I would like to ask you some questions: How about using an opponent's strength as your own advantage to counterattack? How about timing the weapon abilities  or the Steal skill  to land on an adversary  more precisely? How about turning a weak spot into a trap to deceive a foe?

     P.S.1:Shadow Refuge makes you stay in a certain area; thus, it lets your foe attack the area. It is predictable; however, you can use it as a combo field to blind your foe with some certain weapons; for example, pistol, shortbow. 

    P.S. 2: Accuracy, agility and awareness  are highly required to fight certain types of fighter.

    P.S.3 :Don't fear the so-called Reveal.Try to play more aggressively and more carefully.

    P.S. Bonus: Above all, practice makes perfect. 

    I understand what you have been encountering with. I have been there and done that.

     

 

...SR is a Dark field bro.

I agree with the SA changes, and even I'm gonna call out your post as BS lol.

[Sylvia.4870]

6 hours ago, DeceiverX.8361 said:

 

...SR is a Dark field bro.

I agree with the SA changes, and even I'm gonna call out your post as BS lol.

😄     Speak for yourself. Go on. Grant him some good ideas if you are so intelligent and insult anyone else's  advises. Your comment right here doesn't help either. You have already wasted time. 😄

     P.S. Talk about the Shadow Arts Traitline - I don't care anymore.

  

Edited July 8, 2022 by Sylvia.4870

[Yasai.3549]

In general, I think they should have just removed 1 dodge from Deadeye and leave Core traitlines alone. 
I'm sick of Anet nerfing Core traitlines because an Espec is overperforming. 

They've done this to Engi, Rev, Guard, Ele and now Thief. 
When will they stop molesting Core traitlines and start nerfing the actual problems which stem from Especs? 

But it's not fair to say Melee Thief is dead. S/D is still alive, and DD Staff is always a strong build. You're just not gonna be able to get away with P/D Condi garbage anymore or abuse DE as hard. 

Edited July 8, 2022 by Yasai.3549

[itspomf.9523]

On 7/6/2022 at 9:02 PM, Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 said:

The keyword is "You say that like".

 

Reality is, every thief eventually gets to this point. The problem is, that over time your kit fell behind and theirs only improved.

 

Timing counter attacks against other players skills? Yeah. Thats how thief USED TO WORK. You had burst damage which let you punish. Thief was a single target duelest. And it used to be the best at it.

 

Now you don't have that massive burst. You don't have the init to stay in a prolonged fight. Hell, acrobatics used to be good back when cats grace refunded half of core thief's stamina while providing vigor. So core thief could actually go blow for blow with a warrior and stay on top of them. Init regen used to be faster, so you could blow up mes's phantasms to reduce their damage on you temporarily and get back to them. You can't pressure as well anymore. They have easy access to crap like stability, protection, aegis, regen, invulnerability. Spammable AOEs to zone you out, or blow you up.

 

And the same people who can't seem to figure out that the easiest way to stop a thief isn't reveal - complain causing more and more nerfs to get stacked on the profession. Cuz reveal isn't that big of an issue. Its just DO SOMETHING. Anything than just stand there waiting for the thief to be visible again.

 

The most infuriating part? I have to put more effort into this profession to take out another player than they do for me. And now if you're not a deadeye, they can eat a backstab without worry, and faceroll the keyboard to burst you dead.

 

If you're not a specter the survivability you used to have has been sliced in half and set on fire.

 

Just wanted to say you nailed it with this post.  Originally, we had the line "They're deadly in one-on-one combat using their agility, acrobatic fighting style, and the ability to steal to overcome their enemies" in the class page, to no longer making any mention of that whatsoever.  I remember being able to pull off truly absurd 16k backstabs back in the day, but now struggle to break even half that, on entirely the same gear. 

 

We've lost so many traits and had so many skills deteriorating with each nerf patch, that despite having mained thief since before release, I honestly feel like I have to work twice as hard as every other one of my characters.  Heck, my core necromancer (Blood/Death focused, with Cleric + Soldier's gear) can happily tank most anything thanks to the massive healing from everything, recover 50-70% HP off a single skill (6.7s recharge, no less!), and get up to 45,000 effective HP.  At the same time!  I even used him to face-tank Hablion and Pyroxis for fun in Boss Blitz, just because he could.  Yet meanwhile, with Invigorating Precision nerfed into oblivion, I haven't even had the will to see just how quickly the average expansion veteran can mop the floor with me, as that trait (on a Critical Strikes build with Berserker + Assassin's gear) was literally what kept me alive.

 

And the trade-off?  I had to press the attack.  Constantly.  That was the point -- if I wasn't hitting something, I wasn't healing, so even if I wasn't a filthy PvE casual, the counterplay is immense (daze, stun, confusion, knockback, knockdown, float, petrify, fear, even just being out of range ...) and I've never understood why they felt the need to absolutely gut one of our only sources of sustain.

 

You know, aside from pressuring people to buy End of Dragons and play Specter, or something deplorable like that.

 

I don't really have anything to say in closing, just that I'm tired, I'm a decade older than when I started this game, and I no longer have the energy to keep trying to workshop "new" builds to do the same old thing with each big "shakeup" of design philosophy.  I'm still salty about losing 4,500 HP when attributes got pulled off traits (and Practiced Tolerance was modified to give Ferocity) with the Specializations update.

[Downstate.4697]

The problem isnt stealth; d/d just sucks lmao