Rifle Mech is now 28k DPS with 0 input from the player.

[anbujackson.9564]

4 hours ago, Tails.9372 said:

Form what they said:

It's pretty clear that the issue they want to address here is the performance gap between the skill floor and ceiling. At this point I wouldn't expect to see any major nerfs to power mech on the grounds of "is easy to play" anymore, if anything I can see them buffing up other things as time goes on for them to follow suit.

Well they shouldnt buff core stuff if it also buffs the op stuff. Just like big boomer also increase rifle mech to something between 37-38k. Thats not good.

[lorddarkflare.9186]

13 hours ago, anbujackson.9564 said:

Well they shouldnt buff core stuff if it also buffs the op stuff. Just like big boomer also increase rifle mech to something between 37-38k. Thats not good.

 

Wait what? No that is clearly not the takeaway here. I am not sure if you are serious though.

The power Mech nerf is definitely coming I think, but I don't think it will ever be severe enough to get rid of power mech as a one of the best power damage builds.

I suspect they will come for the command skills. Which I think is entirely fair.

As a rifle lover, I am perfectly fine with Power Mech getting what is coming to it, but I want to continue to play no/1-Kit builds.

The best thing I can come up with is potentially taking the rocket punch change, and applying that idea to the Mech class as a whole. First, take about 20% of the classe's power and move it to rocket punch. Then weapon skills 2 - 5 all work like kinetic battery: each one gives a charge 2 - 5 based on their position. At 5 stacks a rocket punch is initiated. You cannot overflow.

The numbers are all suspect so you would have to play with them (including rocket punch power scaling), but the goal should be that with 100% alacrity and good management a power mechanist can deal 5 - 10% MORE damage than they do now. And brainless usage should net you 10 - 20% less damage.

The idea is to introduce more consideration in how you use you mech skill as DPS without wrecking the vibe of the class or returning to piano.

Edited August 14, 2022 by lorddarkflare.9186

[Tails.9372]

6 hours ago, lorddarkflare.9186 said:

The idea is to introduce more consideration in how you use you mech skill as DPS without wrecking the vibe of the class or returning to piano.

Which is a rather pointless endeavor, the % damage increase the mech skills provide over the mech just AAing is in the single digits so, unless you need the quickness, depending on the situation you're already better off just keeping them for the BB damage and people who just spam it cause they couldn't care less will do so either way.

Edited August 14, 2022 by Tails.9372

[Fwog.9387]

I might start making a habit of booting power mechanists out of my group that cannot keep from pinballing the enemies around with knockback. That is my only problem with them. Was in dragonfall and the elemental spawn i was fighting was getting knocked all over the place left and right. They are somehow worse than longbow rangers. 

[squeegee.4320]

I like how 90% of the forum is complaining about power rifle mechanist so they nerf support and condi mechanists in the balance patch. 🤔

[Jerus.4350]

34 minutes ago, squeegee.4320 said:

I like how 90% of the forum is complaining about power rifle mechanist so they nerf support and condi mechanists in the balance patch. 🤔

They needed it.  Condi might not seem like it just looking at bench numbers, but with confusion factored in condi was over 40k on most fights, a little shaving makes sense.  And, the heal stuff, of course healmech was/is busted I’m just sad they nerfed core/scrapper while they were at it.

[Atticus.7194]

On 8/13/2022 at 7:35 AM, Treacy.4067 said:

 Balance is an ongoing process. People will continue to sound the alarm about the afk automated high dps and rightly so.  Give it time.

Tbf we have a massive overwhelming balance patch coming and 2 of the 3 most egregious specs are being balanced but conspicuously the one that is overwhelmingly (rightfully so) talked about and agreed to be overperforming is omitted from any meaningful adjustment. This coming after the class got an indirect buff and was given a way to be even more brainless and afk it's kinda... weird. In fact it's very very weird, I cannot for the life of me think that ArenaNet doesn't hear us and seems to be doing nothing or the outright opposite of what the vast majority agree needs to be done. 

 

Please ArenaNet if you read this stuff at all, listen to us I know power mechanist is your golden child and you want to protect it but for the sake of the game and our sanity you need to tone it down while it requires borderline zero skill, risk or investment. It's making all the rest of us on other classes feel extremely bad about its diamond encrusted platinum plated silver spoon you insist on leaving in its mouth. This is a perfect time just pull it back, drop power mechs coefficients, reduce rocket punch, lower aim assisted rocket and increase CD's just a bit and everyone will be happier in the long run.

[Tyro.8237]

Whenever there is a problem I like to zoom out a bit and look at the overall picture.

 

Firstly, I like the rifle changes. For years this was neglected and the pistol is still being neglected and now it is at least fun to play, although if you just afk it is super boring.

 

Secondly, these super important benchmarks, the thing that is the most important thing for (well for those who seem to care), are all in the high 30k or 40k.

 

Taking this in context:

1) If you raid/fractals, etc. if a player afks, I suppose the will get kicked and with 28k will the group want them?

2) If you go open world, what does it matter what the player next to you does? You do your thing, they do their thing. If they AFK during a group content but still contribute to kill the thing, who cares?

3) If you afk in PVP or WvW you are dead anyways.

 

In essence, who really cares about this? I mean I get it, you are upset someone does nothing and gets 28k and you break your fingers with some specs and get 35k maybe. But that is all in theory because in a proper setting the AFK player either doesn't matter or gets kicked. Also, real mobs/players don't just stand there. Isn't it a waste of energy to complain about something that doesn't affect you or does not have a real practical effect?

 

If someone wants to play something easy let them. For years, we have had everyone always recommend minion Necro or Ranger for Open World cause it was super easy with a pet/minion. Now the Engineer got a pet, it tanks, its easier to play. For me personally, I prefer a more engaging play style but some like it, or want to chill, or need to have simple mechanics to be able to play.

 

You know what you are getting into when choosing to play an elementalist or a core engineer, or an untamed, or a mesmer, or a thief. Some of those builds/specs are challenging and require practice to play them well. Others are more beginner-friendly. I think it is nice to have options and different ways to play. That is why I don't understand the current drive and all the cries to always make everything the same. I want to have different classes that play differently. I want them to have different boons. I want to be able to switch around and feel I am playing something different. If all is the same, then delete 8 classes and keep 1, oh and then just one spec as well, so everyone can do, let's say 35k DPS.

 

I think the balancing should be much more focused on looking at broken traits/skills/weapons and figuring out ways to fix them to be enjoyable. Afterall, and reading their news about the 10th anniversary and steam, that was their mantra when they started GW. Fun. So, instead of always nerfing all to the ground and removing skills or reducing their effectiveness so that it becomes unplayable, rather get all to play better.

 

The most recent preview for the next balance round seems a bit of an easy fix as they are actually giving the rifle treatment to some other weapons. I hope they have another round and actually look at traits and skills to make every class and various builds enjoyable. This also calms down people. You want to feel your character is the "Commander" who just entered battle and turned the tide. You don't want to stand next to another "Commander" with 4dps while they slaughter 500 mobs in the meantime. If all enjoy, then there is less bickering and calls for nerfs.

 

 

[Obtena.7952]

18 hours ago, squeegee.4320 said:

I like how 90% of the forum is complaining about power rifle mechanist so they nerf support and condi mechanists in the balance patch. 🤔

That just shows 90% of the forum doesn't understand what's important to how Anet changes the game and how they want the game to work. 

[Treacy.4067]

2 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

That just shows 90% of the forum doesn't understand what's important to how Anet changes the game and how they want the game to work. 

Or people like you don't understand the intricacies of balance in the first place.  Look how long it took for them to address the banners issue.  This is an ongoing process and I expect them to fix it in due time.  People who voice their opinions of both praise and criticism, do so because they care about the game's health and longevity.  And many have been around mmos long enough to see the warning signs.  That's why many of us are being vocal yet patient.  This isn't going to be fixed in one patch and to think otherwise is nonsense.

[Obtena.7952]

3 hours ago, Treacy.4067 said:

Or people like you don't understand the intricacies of balance in the first place. 

The part I like about this is that Anet did EXACTLY what I  said they would and would not do ... despite the claim you make here. Nerfs to the mech builds getting stacked, no nerfs to builds that enable low capable players. This isn't about me understanding the intricacies of balance, it's about understanding how Anet wants the game to work. 

Maybe I don't know whatever you are talking about; it appears I don't really need to ... I did knew better than anyone who believed Anet was going to nerf Power Rifle mech this patch. The direction of this game has never been so clear. Anet is literally telling us why they are making these changes. There is no point to denying that direction with the claim that Anet is violating 'balancing rules' to justify the changes you want. 

Edited August 17, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Treacy.4067]

1 hour ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Maybe I don't know whatever you are talking about; it appears I don't really need to ... 

It's apparent that you don't and you don't feel you need to because you're trying to ignore the problem by sticking your fingers in your ears and yelling na-na-na.  I don't even think you know what you're arguing anymore.

 

1 hour ago, Obtena.7952 said:

 I did knew better than anyone who believed Anet was going to nerf Power Rifle mech. The direction of this game has never been so clear. Anet is literally telling us why they are making these changes. There is no point to denying that direction with the claim that Anet is violating 'balancing rules' to justify the changes you want. 

Seriously what are you on about?  You agreed that mechs take up all the spots, and that their dps has been unbalanced since that one patch.  Now you're trying to switch positions again.  You do realise that people can still see your original comments even after you edit them right?   Anet will fix it, again just give it time.

[Obtena.7952]

1 minute ago, Treacy.4067 said:

Seriously what are you on about?  You agreed that mechs take up all the spots, and that their dps has been unbalanced since that one patch. 

I didn't agree to any of these things. Mechs don't take up ALL the spots and I never said their DPS was unbalanced. 

Edited August 17, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Treacy.4067]

Just now, Obtena.7952 said:

I didn't agree to any of these things. Mechs don't take up ALL the spots and I never said their DPS was unbalanced. 

Go back through the thread.  You've edited every single one of your posts but I usually quote the original or relevant bits.  I even thanked you at one point but then you went and stealth edited that post to say something completely different.  You don't debate in good faith.

[Obtena.7952]

7 minutes ago, Treacy.4067 said:

Go back through the thread. 

I don't need to ... I never said the things you are accusing me of saying. I don't agree that mechanists take up all spots (cause they don't) and I don't say their DPS is unbalanced. 

Edited August 17, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Treacy.4067]

2 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

I don't need to ... I never said the things you are accusing me of saying. 

We were talking about the dps being out of whack and I said it was a balance issue, then you said it was an encounter issue.  I then said: "The encounters didn't all of a sudden break.  It's a problem with the recent changes in the balance patches."  and you said: "That's true. That doesn't mean they weren't trivial in the first place though."  And I thanked you for finally agreeing lol.  You did the same for the problems with afk mech.  I can quote that too if you're too lazy to go back and read what you wrote.

 

 

[Obtena.7952]

7 minutes ago, Treacy.4067 said:

We were talking about the dps being out of whack and I said it was a balance issue, then you said it was an encounter issue.  I then said: "The encounters didn't all of a sudden break.  It's a problem with the recent changes in the balance patches."  and you said: "That's true. That doesn't mean they weren't trivial in the first place though."  And I thanked you for finally agreeing lol.  You did the same for the problems with afk mech.  I can quote that too if you're too lazy to go back and read what you wrote.

 

 

Quote all you like. No where in there did I say was the DPS a balance issue or mechanists were taking up all the spots. 

Edited August 17, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Treacy.4067]

Just now, Obtena.7952 said:

Quote all you like. No where in there did I say was the DPS a balance issue. 

Except you did, that's how quotes work. You agreed with me when I said the balance and dps problems happened since the last patch.  Maybe read the things you reply to before commenting to avoid maybe saying something you didn't mean in the first place.  If you want to go back on it fine, but you said those things.

[Obtena.7952]

3 minutes ago, Treacy.4067 said:

You agreed with me when I said the balance and dps problems happened since the last patch.  

OK .. that's not me agreeing the power rifle DPS is unbalanced. That's just you taking things out of context or misunderstanding. I don't know how you do that ... I've been very clear what my position is in this thread. 

 

Edited August 17, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Gotejjeken.1267]

Not reading all 13 pages of this, but just funny to me that mech can do godlike damage but ranger pets get the nerf bat literally every corner.  Iboga's nerf they found from patch notes literal FOUR years ago....😂.

I get they needed to sell an expansion, but equality is definitely not a thing.

EDIT: Also, as a PSA, debating a certain poster will get this thread to over 100 pages with nothing to show for it.

Edited August 17, 2022 by Gotejjeken.1267

[Treacy.4067]

1 minute ago, Obtena.7952 said:

OK .. that's not me agreeing the power rifle DPS is unbalanced. That's just you taking things out of context or misunderstanding. I don't know how you do that ... I've been very clear what my position is in this thread. 

You've not been clear, you've changed your position several times.  First it was about accessibility, then about afk, then encounters, etc, etc.  Also, just because you change your original posts AFTER the fact, does not mean someone is taking you out of context.  I always quote the original thing said to me, I don't go back to see what changes were made after I make my own point. I only caught you doing that well into the discussion.  Bad form.

[Obtena.7952]

3 minutes ago, Treacy.4067 said:

You've not been clear, you've changed your position several times.  First it was about accessibility, then about afk, then encounters, etc, etc.  

Sure we talked about all those things because they are related, but my point hasn't changed. The DPS on LI rifle build isn't a problem, no matter how few buttons are pressed to get it. If the patch is any indication, Anet doesn't think so either. 

Edited August 17, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Treacy.4067]

Just now, Obtena.7952 said:

Sure we talked about all those things because they are related, but my point hasn't changed. The DPS on LI rifle build isn't a problem. If the patch is any indication, Anet doesn't think so either. 

At the very least stop changing what you write, stand behind what you say for crying out loud.  Anyway, The DPS on afk NI rifle build is an issue of meme proportions and I expect it will be addressed on October 4th if not sooner.

[Voyant.1327]

Its starting to have a hilarious counter reaction, people are leaving groups if Mechanists join. I've seen "No Mechs" in LFGs....

Literally becoming known as a troll class, which sucks for people who main Engi.... And second Steam gets wind of it, here come 20,000 Mechs mark my words lol. 

[lorddarkflare.9186]

On 8/16/2022 at 9:25 PM, Atticus.7194 said:

This is a perfect time just pull it back, drop power mechs coefficients, reduce rocket punch, lower aim assisted rocket and increase CD's just a bit and everyone will be happier in the long run.

 

I was with you at first, but can we stop suggesting nerfs to core Engineer to fix specs?

Also, they will never nerf power mech so much that it is not easy DPS. The issue with Mech is not the power, but the low level of interaction.

You either nerf it so that it is useless in the DPS slot or you make it more complex to play. Any in-between will continue to draw complaints as people think it is not fair that mech can AFK 24K DPS or whatever the post-nerf value is.

This is a class design issue.

  

52 minutes ago, Voyant.1327 said:

Its starting to have a hilarious counter reaction, people are leaving groups if Mechanists join. I've seen "No Mechs" in LFGs....

Literally becoming known as a troll class, which sucks for people who main Engi.... And second Steam gets wind of it, here come 20,000 Mechs mark my words lol. 

 

Is this in Raids? Been using it in t4 fractals for a few months now and I have never seen this.

Edited August 18, 2022 by lorddarkflare.9186