June 27 Balance Update Preview

[Myror.7521]

@prototypedragon.1406 well after next patch this build will be hella good ...... in at least PvP xd 

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PKwAEl7lJwYYNMMWJeWX+tbA-zZILlGTgIjgMLgeDBbHAA

 

[Septimus Prime.6743]

16 minutes ago, Anais.6728 said:

As a casual player who mainly focuses on open world content, I am greatly disappointed to see Signets of Suffering change. It not only kills the last remaining low intensity reaper build there was which takes the fun out of the game for people like me but also doesn't provide enough of a benefit for anyone to pick it over Awaken the Pain on higher levels of gameplay.

+100 to this.

My main necro reaper build relies on Signets of Suffering + 3 signets passives beneficial effets, especially 33% life force gain increase, which enables long shroud functionality and more powerful and fun gameplay.

So I personally am against ALL necros changes they want to introduce in this patch!

Killing Scourge functionality and necro corruption uniqueness functionality! What were you thinking!

[Merkalto.5743]

Specter changes look neat, except the implications for Alacrity Specter:

It seems like Alac Specter (which would now be PvE only) won't be able to provide Alacrity at the start of fights anymore since it would be tied to Shroud skill usage. As Alac Specter, you'd have to either start the fight will some Shroud, which can't always be the case (e.g. EoD strikes), or you'd have to enter Shroud as early as possible by spamming Siphon and wells with the Traversing Darkness trait in order to generate enough Shroud HP so you aren't knocked out of it early. For comparison, the reason quickness from Shroud works on Harbinger is because your shroud on that spec doesn't tank hits for you.

Alac Specter would still have to take and use 2-3 wells off cooldown in order to maintain proper Shroud HP so you can provide Alacrity + not worry about getting knocked out of Shroud early... so on paper it sounds like nothing about the spec has changed except that it's harder to give Alacrity at the start of encounters.

I think the changes are a good start, but don't really seem to fix the problem of "I have to spam wells off cooldown to maintain alacrity." I wonder if a little bit of Alacrity (or Protection for PvP/WvW) could be given out to the party when using Siphon would help fix the issue of not being able to give Alacrity at the start of fights?

[Gendalfs.7521]

I know that would be more work intensive, but why they dont make public forum polls for everything. 

For example: I think Scourge revive was almost cheating at boss fights 🙂, but why nerf Scourge all around?

Do you need alacrity and quickness added to classes? I dont know, probably not, but if yes, people here are very experienced to say on which skills. 

Anet make polls. I know its not perfect solution because it can go wrong also, but excuse me, your team is not big enought to know and play all classes in all game modes (only my opinion).

[soul.9651]

12 minutes ago, Gendalfs.7521 said:

I know that would be more work intensive, but why they dont make public forum polls for everything. 

Only if its in game polls that could work. If its a forum poll that would be just useless.. well unless you think 100+ players would be the whole gw2 playerbase..xd 

[Gendalfs.7521]

1 minute ago, soul.9651 said:

Only if its in game polls that could work. If its a forum poll that would be just useless.. well unless you think 100+ players would be the whole gw2 playerbase..xd 

Good point. It could be also big text on launcher with participation rewards.

[soul.9651]

1 minute ago, Gendalfs.7521 said:

Good point. It could be also big text on launcher with participation rewards.

No, but it could be something like how osrs does in game polls, well i guess launcher would work too but in game polls would feel kinda more natural 

Edited June 13, 2023 by soul.9651

[Furball.1236]

9 hours ago, GeraldBC.4927 said:

They are, they announced in the balance stream that they'll be killing the blight damage increase in pve as well, they just do it quietly by mentioning it in the stream and not here where most people see it.

I didn't notice there was a secret nerf to PvE harb as well. Sounds like a terrible idea that wasn't based on the actual gameplay performance and defies the class concept.

Is there any webpage that listed up all the sneaky changes they're making?--Those changes shouldn't exist in the first place.

 

Edit: I just checked the live stream. They actually are making a sneaky yet significant nerf to harbinger DPS specifically for PvE lol

Live stream: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1842006044?t=1h43m20s

"Septic Corruption: Reduced condition damage increase per stack from 0.5% to 0.25% in PvE only" which makes it -12.5% less condi damage increase at 25 stacks of blight

Edited June 13, 2023 by Furball.1236

[kcorion.7531]

I don't even play Necro/scourge, and I'm disappointed with what's happening to them. Call me crazy, but a necromancer should be good at resurrecting dead players, it's kind of their whole deal.

But what really has me concerned, is the changes to the Ranger/Druid. Just straight up deleting natural Swiftness is not the way to go. It's the worst thing when I can't keep up with my party just moving around in Fractals when everyone, but my druid, has a movement speed buff, especially when the mechanist, and base engineer, get something similar that isn't being affected. I also don't want to constantly burn Celestial Avatar just to keep boons up, otherwise, Druids are a support class, and this update, will kill their defining feature.

[James.3982]

Spellbreaker in WvW Feedback.
I feel like you're half a year behind in state of Spellbreaker in WvW. Most 20-40 player squads see 1-4 spellbreakers in them these days due to it not being the most effective class at any role. (Maybe the general nerf in boonstrip will balance this out and make it more popular class again?)

Winds of Disenchantment: Lowered the duration from 5 seconds to 4 seconds in WvW only.
GOOD CHANGE = Less area denial, promotes melee heavy fights. 4 Second duration already gives the desired effect and the extra second only removes the lingering area denial.

Break Enchantments: Reduced the number of boons removed from 2 to 1 in WvW only.
MAYBE TOO MUCH NERF = I feel like this goes against what you said on stream, when nerfing long range boonstrip (nullfield, scourge) in order to promote more melee gameplay and risk taking. Break Enchantments is a melee boonstrip skill and requires a push. Leave this as it is - or add few seconds to the cooldown. This should potentially balance Spellbreaker on par with Scourges in strips after the nerfs go trough.

[ShatteredStars.6548]

6 hours ago, TheRunningSquire.3621 said:

Why do traits need to be removed anyways, why can't we have a little arrow next to the traits that allows us to pick which one we want instead of removing them, of course you have a right to change them or replace them but giving us that option to pick a play style just seems right.

People who reacted, don't even understand that.

[Era.2635]

On 6/8/2023 at 11:12 PM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

Berserker

• Arc Divider: Reduced the number of strikes from 3 to 1. Reduced the casting time from 1.86 seconds to 0.8 seconds. Reduced total power coefficient from 5.1 to 2.5 in PvE and from 2.112 to 1.82 in PvP.

God, please no. 

If anything reduce the casting time by a fraction of a second or put the last tick of damage just as the animation ends to remove the need for weapon stowing. The fact that you have 3 strikes makes it possible to at least hit 1 or 2 when you're moving in a PvE environment.  It's such a satisfying ability to use and properly place.  If you really want to reduce the strikes make it at least 2, but not just 1. What's the point of it being a Primal Burst if it's the same as Arcing Slice?

You just revived Power Berserker and it's freaking great. Don't kill it again. Please.

[Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365]

Medkit nr1
If you're reducing the range atleast make the angle wider to make it more reliable in close range

[Obtena.7952]

2 hours ago, Gendalfs.7521 said:

I know that would be more work intensive, but why they dont make public forum polls for everything. 

Well, for a few reasons:

1.  game design isn't a democracy

2. Forum population is likely not statistically significant. 

3. Players are likely biased against most changes they see as not aligned to their own personal vision

Edited June 13, 2023 by Obtena.7952

[Batalix.2873]

1 hour ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Well, for a few reasons:

1.  game design isn't a democracy

2. Forum population is likely not statistically significant. 

3. Players are likely biased against most changes they see as not aligned to their own personal vision

It's not a democracy, however:

1 and 2. Democracy isn't a democracy, but ideally affording the chaffy masses a forum allows some wheat to rise to the top. I would say about 10-20 percent of the few commenters in this thread have generally constructive commentary. Which is important because:

3. A lot of the points being made clearly illustrate that the devs' "vision" is extremely flawed and underthought. Flavor and entire playstyles are being needlessly gutted; most of the boon support propositions won't even really work because they rely on building resources (Specter), or are limited to burst cooldowns (Berserker, BS, Druid) or have oddly specific limitations (Scrapper); and the EoD especs continue to wildly bounce back and forth between concepts (Untamed, Mechanist, and Specter being the worst, but honestly all of them need refining) because they were thin, half-baked DPS-brrrr recycles of prior especs and badly need stronger identities/gimmicks. If the commenters can point out so many ways these changes so obviously don't even serve the larger "vision", I would argue the balance team doesn't have a clear vision. Too many details are being overlooked, the overall picture is getting muddled, and specs will have even less distinct fantasies across the board.

I think having this discourse is important, but it might even be better to just hire some players for flat consultation fees in exchange for more brain power to tackle the issues, because the lack of oversight here is honestly staggering. And given that we only get these threads once a quarter with no indication of whether our voices are heard, the whole process does seem very one-sided.

Edited June 13, 2023 by Batalix.2873

[Burnfall.9573]

4 hours ago, kcorion.7531 said:

I don't even play Necro/scourge, and I'm disappointed with what's happening to them. Call me crazy, but a necromancer should be good at resurrecting dead players, it's kind of their whole deal.

But what really has me concerned, is the changes to the Ranger/Druid. Just straight up deleting natural Swiftness is not the way to go. It's the worst thing when I can't keep up with my party just moving around in Fractals when everyone, but my druid, has a movement speed buff, especially when the mechanist, and base engineer, get something similar that isn't being affected. I also don't want to constantly burn Celestial Avatar just to keep boons up, otherwise, Druids are a support class, and this update, will kill their defining feature.

"Necromancers , calling on the spirits of the dead, and even death itself, to overpower enemies and assist allies. In sacrificing Health and taking curses and diseases upon themselves, they can deal large amounts of damage to those foolish enough to oppose them. Dead and dying enemies become unwilling allies in their hands."

"Necromancers have the singular ability to absorb Energy from an enemy’s death, and can raise a fighting force from the corpses of their foes. Curses, which often cost the Necromancer dearly, exact an even greater toll from enemies, who find that their Enchantments and healing skills are rendered useless. Due to the sacrificial nature of their methods, Necromancers must practice patience and self-discipline to survive."

 

Once again, Necromancer Profession Identity and Lore... Does Not Resurrect Dead Party Members. It Only Create Dead Spirits From Dead Bodies.

That's It!!

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Necromancer

 

Resurrection

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Resurrection

The only Professions in Guild Wars Lore who Resurrects dead party members are; Ritualist Profession and Monk Profession

 

Necromancer Profession: Elite Specialization:

--The Ritualist Profession--

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Ritualist

 

The only way to Resurrection, is through Ritualist Profession Magic

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Lively_Was_Naomei

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Restoration

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Death_Pact_Signet

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Flesh_of_My_Flesh

so there.

 

(side note:)

This is why, throughout the years, the Communit has Vigorously suggested to Anet, to make Ritualist Profession, an Elite Specialization for the Necromancer Profession.

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/topic/115919-elite-specialization-concept-ritualist-a-necromancer-elite-specialization/

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/topic/109618-stop-teasing-us-with-ritualist/

 

Necromancer Profession + Ritualist Profession Lore's, Are The Perfect Pact For Each Other!!

 

https://i.imgur.com/naOSwQt.jpg

 

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ritualist_Outfit

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/ancient-rituals-and-valuable-supplies-in-the-gem-store/

Edited June 14, 2023 by Burnfall.9573

[Abram.7816]

On 6/9/2023 at 4:48 PM, Creativity.3816 said:

concentration expertise -50% in wvw please

BOONvBOON #boonwars

[Mystical Joe.9348]

I watched Mukluk's video and I agree with most of it. I don't play Necro much but I agree that the massive group rez should not be nerf'd. It is a signature necro move and changing that will effect a lot of the players that are new to certain strike missions. I do play mechanist and to have to try and always be within 360 of the Mech is going to suck. I do understand why you want to nerf it in PVE (there are a lot of Mech everywhere in PVE). Overall I don't think the Mech is actual over powered. It is fun and easy to play is why people use it a lot? What's wrong with that? In WvW and PvP i don't really see that many Mechs (certainly not like in PvE). The Mechanist is great option for players like me who have poor keyboard skills because of physical issues with our hands. Please don't mess that up. At the very least keep it viable for LI people in WvW and PvP. Thanks for considering this.

[Obtena.7952]

53 minutes ago, Batalix.2873 said:

It's not a democracy, however:

1 and 2. Democracy isn't a democracy, but ideally affording the chaffy masses a forum allows some wheat to rise to the top. I would say about 10-20 percent of the few commenters in this thread have generally constructive commentary. Which is important because:

2. A lot of the points being made clearly illustrate that the devs' "vision" is extremely flawed and underthought. Flavor and entire playstyles are being needlessly gutted; most of the boon support propositions won't even really work because they rely on building resources (Specter), or are limited to burst cooldowns (Berserker, BS, Druid) or have oddly specific limitations (Scrapper); and the EoD especs continue to wildly bounce back and forth between concepts (Untamed, Mechanist, and Specter being the worst, but honestly all of them) because they were thin, half-baked DPS-brrrr recycles of prior especs and badly need stronger identities/gimmicks. If the commenters can point out so many ways these changes so obviously don't even serve the larger "vision", I would argue the balance team doesn't have a clear vision. Too many details are being overlooked, the overall picture is getting muddled, and specs will have even less distinct fantasies across the board.

I think having this discourse is important, but it might even be better to just hire some players for flat consultation fees in exchange for more brain power to tackle the issues, because the lack of oversight here is honestly staggering. And given that we only get these threads once a quarter with no indication of whether our voices are heard, the whole process does seem very one-sided.

Sure ... but I was responding specifically about polls on the forum and why they are low value to Anet for gauging player sentiment. I'm all for forum discourse. 

 

 

Edited June 13, 2023 by Obtena.7952

[Batalix.2873]

On 6/13/2023 at 4:21 PM, Obtena.7952 said:

The Devs control the vision of class theme, design and balance. Sure the discourse with players is important but the problem is that 99% of that discourse simply assumes the devs aren't capable of doing their job. That's an immediate non-starter. The bottomline is that Anet have adopted a role-based scheme, so that's how they are going to move forward with class developments. 

I also think it's weird you assume that the 'solution' to this is to just hire players to consult because we know from the past Anet DID consult with players, that Anet devs do actually play the game (or have people on staff that they could talk to that certainly do play it) or that even some of the current devs actually started and have some notoriety as players. 

In otherwords, the solution you assume is needed ... it's already in place. These change are being put in front of the eyes of players. There are reasons for these changes to happen, even if people disagree with them and the majority of people on the forums simply aren't even willing to consider why before they dispute them. 

 

 

This still feels like a blanket appeal to authority, though, while ignoring the many specific criticisms leveled at this patch.

Just because devs are paid to work at ANet or even used to be players does not mean they are doing a good job at designing or balancing the game.

And, at least in my case, this is not starting from some presumption of incompetency. I actually was stoked at some of the changes in this patch before really delving into the details. It is only after looking at the specifics, and contextualizing them against the past couple years of development, that I come to the conclusion that the devs may not actually be doing a very good job with this. I.e. it was in analyzing the evidence on hand that I came to that conclusion.

Handwaving all of this away with "that's what the devs want" just circumvents so much discourse as well as attempts to lampshade some pretty big problems with this patch and the game's overall trajectory.

Maybe you're right that the devs just want to transform this game more and more into a gatcha Vindictus two-button cookie clicker or synchronized FFXIV DDR because market research or whatever. But that would be somewhat incompatible with their prior professed aims and design goals, as well as what most of the current active playerbase wants. There are changes, and then there are paradigm shifts, and this is approaching the latter.

Edited June 16, 2023 by Batalix.2873

[Chazara.9075]

Alright so I have taken a couple days to let the changes stir and get a better set of thoughts on the full patch. As mainly a PvE/PvP player I'm just going to review the PvE changes because I don't live in WvW and those who do, their opinion matters more than less experienced players. There will be a TL:DR at the end of this for the vast majority of people who are going to skip the large post. If anyone actually reads good on ya, most of the thread is all negative as is so leave your own thoughts separately.

Quote

 

Hi everyone,

Welcome to the preview for the June 27 balance update! As always, the goal of previewing these changes is to gather your feedback before the live release. We'll be following the conversation and making further adjustments as needed.

Thanks,

Cal "cmc" Cohen

Skills and Balance Lead

 

As we mentioned in the last studio update blog, the primary goals for this update are:

• Improving the feeling of moment-to-moment gameplay for many boon support builds. We want these builds to have more flexibility in their utility skill choice and not be required to activate a particular utility type on cooldown to provide quickness or alacrity.

First thing here is this is pretty untrue of the current state the most egregious offender would be Firebrand providing its quickness on Mantras and Shouts. And I'm sure the team has some kind of plan to change this, but you are stepping in the wrong direction completely at this point and destroying the uniqueness of all classes and what their thematic originally was in order to provide homogenization that no one wants.

• Introducing alternate playstyles for some specializations.

But you didn't though. In fact you removed one or multiple playstyles from almost every single class you changed.

• Tuning up some underutilized weapons and solidifying their roles within their professions.

They won't be utilized, most weapons are set in their positions on a build because of the damage or the utility that it provides. And from what I seen you removed multiple advantages of some weapons. Banshee's Wail on Necro horn

• Removing additional skill-type-specific recharge-reduction traits and rolling the reduction into baseline skills where it makes sense to do so. The goal of these changes is to give players more flexibility in trait selection

This is actually a good change and I agree with it, this brings us a step closer to dealing with the crutch that is Quickness and Alacrity that at this point should be removed because it seems to be what the entire balance struggle is based around. Also if you're going to change it then give the global cooldown to all gamemodes Harbinger Vials

General

• To make them more reliable in endgame PvE content, all effects that benefit when the player strikes from the flank or from behind now always apply their benefits when striking defiant foes.

Thief Runes just jumped in price when people saw this and may change what Runes people run in raid builds off of Scholar because almost every single Strike/Raid boss is Defiant... This change is questionable but thiefs and rangers will love it

• Confusion damage has been adjusted as follows in PvE only:
  • Damage over time: Increased the base damage from 11 to 18.25. Increased condition damage scaling from 0.03 to 0.05.
  • Damage on skill activation: Reduced base damage from 49.5 to 16.34. Reduced condition damage scaling from 0.0975 to 0.0325.

Why? This condition is very good in the PvE setting on CERTAIN BOSSES or fights because of HOW it works. In PvP I understand that it hurts like hell and that makes sense which is why Torment was changed globally to function the opposite of what it was. This SHOULD NOT be a global change and instead either needs to be reworked or not touched at all until the team comes up with a better decision like turning it into a non damaging condition that applies a condi on skill use.

 

Elementalist

I suck at Ele and I'll admit it and I rarely play it... But I did play catalyst and talked with weaver players. You promised Tempest DPS build changes to make it a thing, while I HAVE seen DPS Tempest builds and played one quite a while ago, this isn't viable in the current state. The Tempest line really isn't currently set up for DPS anymore and nothing was changed about it in this patch to actually give it more DPS. So where are the Tempest changes you mentioned at the mini patch? Because the changes to the weapons doesn't make Tempest more viable it effects all of Ele.

Catalyst

• Spectacular Sphere: This trait now grants quickness when deploying your jade sphere in any attunement, in addition to the boons currently granted. Quickness duration reduced from 5 seconds to 2 seconds.

So my first question is; Why revert this NOW after it was complained about multiple times when you changed it originally, and why is it 2 seconds? Jade Sphere requires energy to charge up no matter what attunement you are in so this is just a minor nerf but allows people to not be locked into air for most of their rotation. Either take the energy off Jade Sphere and just make it a cooldown or give this like 2.5s

Engineer

Mechanist's penalty for being too far from its mech is something that we've been keeping an eye on since it was added to the game. We think there's room for improvement, and in this update, we're changing the penalty from a mech stat reduction to an increased cooldown for the mech command skills. We believe that this change will make the penalty more visible and easier to understand. Scrapper is also getting an adjustment to how it applies quickness, with Kinetic Accelerators now triggering when successfully finishing a combo with a leap or blast finisher.

So the first issue here is you recognize there was an issue with the stat penalty. Now I actually think this version is a much better version than your proposed change, just increase the radius on Mechanical Genius so it's not as punishing and it won't be an issue. Or better yet look into the pet AI cuz thats borked on every class and we as a community would love that fixed. This scrapper change is interesting and from reading the thread and talking with my scrapper friends this change is on the mixed review side of things, while it basically forces a weapon type you did free up gyros, but people like the superspeed aspect and you're just gutting that for the sake of boons. I vote don't do it.

Core

• Med Blaster: Reduced range from 600 to 450. The number of boons that affect this skill has been limited to 4 in WvW and PvP. Improved the visual effect of this skill to better match its radius.

Med Blaster is already in a pretty bad shape after it was nerfed to the ground for the HAM nerf, this is really just insult to injury. Don't do this.

• Elixir CDR and Unblockable

Why are they Unblockable now?

Scrapper

• Speed of Synergy: Reduced ally superspeed from 3 seconds to 2 seconds in WvW only. Reduced personal superspeed from 7 seconds to 4 seconds in WvW only.
• Kinetic Accelerators: This trait has been reworked. Apply boons to nearby allies when you successfully combo with a blast or leap finisher. Your function gyro is now a blast finisher.

Scrap this change

Mechanist

• Mechanical Genius: This trait has been reworked. Instead of the mech incurring a stat-reduction penalty, command skills now take longer to recharge if activated while the mech is farther than a range of 360 away from the engineer.

I said this earlier, just increase the radius of the Mechanical Genius to like 600 and keep the current iteration.

• Mech Core: Barrier Engine: Base barrier and healing power coefficient from the automatic pulses are no longer split between modes and will use the PvP and WvW values for PvE as well.
• Barrier Burst: The base barrier granted by this skill has been increased from 260 to 454 in PvE only. The healing power coefficient has been increased from 0.2875 to 0.575.

This is a good change barrier on mech is pretty lackluster as it is especially with the healing output nerfs from a few patches ago

Guardian

Mainly Cooldown reduction traits (all of this is fine and is actually just a huge Guardian buff in general)

Firebrand

• Weighty Terms: This trait no longer reduces the mantra charge-recovery times. Increased pages granted from 1 to 2.
• Opening Passage: Increased the number of conditions removed from 1 to 2 in PvP only. Increased ammunition recharge from 12 seconds to 18 seconds in PvP only.
• Clarified Conclusion: Reduced the number of conditions converted to boons from 5 to 3 in PvP only.

Quote

Improving the feeling of moment-to-moment gameplay for many boon support builds. We want these builds to have more flexibility in their utility skill choice and not be required to activate a particular utility type on cooldown to provide quickness or alacrity.

Mesmer

Core

• Null Field: Reduced range from 1,200 to 900.
• Temporal Curtain: Reduced range from 900 to 600

Null Field nerf really hurts WvW but the Temporal Curtain change just brings it in line with most other pulls.

Chronomancer

• Stretched Time: This trait has been reworked. Flow of Time affects nearby allies. Grant alacrity to nearby allies when you summon a phantasm.

So you just remade Mirage?

• Seize the Moment: This trait no longer causes Tides of Time to grant quickness and instead grants quickness to nearby allies when you summon a phantasm.

So you just made Mirage Quickness?

• Well of Senility: Reduced cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds in PvE only. Increased pulse power coefficient from 0.7 to 1.5 in PvE only. Increased the number of boons removed from 2 to 3 in PvE only.
• Well of Action: Reduced cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds in PvE only. Increased pulse power coefficient from 0.7 to 1.5 in PvE only. The final pulse of this skill now grants alacrity instead of superspeed.

Memes aside Wells are awkward to use on the party as a form of giving boons if the team isn't stacked up nice and tight but on the flip side most boon applications have a very short range as it is. While I actually like this change to put the boons on Phantasm Summoning, this quite literally does feel like a cop out to just copy Mirage.

Mirage

• Mirage can no longer dodge while immobilized or under the effects of crowd control.

This is a bad change its unique to Mirage and really fits it's thematic, not only that the dodge doesn't move you in the first place so this is EXTREMELY punishing for no reason

• Mirage Cloak: This trait no longer reduces the mirage's endurance in PvP and WvW.

Good change, just make it so they don't benefit from regen and you don't need the above change for competitive modes. Or something along those lines

• Chaos Vortex: Reduced clone bleeding and torment duration from 8 seconds to 4 seconds.

Why? Mirage is mainly a confusion based condi class and you won't see it used for the bleeding and torment, if a Mesmer wanted that Virtuoso is right there.

Virtuoso

• Bladesong Distortion: Reduced distortion duration per blade from 1 second to 0.75 seconds in PvE only.
• Bladeturn Requiem: This skill no longer blocks incoming attacks.

These two are interesting because yes having two on demand block/invuln is really really good in most game modes, you can literally just turn Requiem into a Distortion and keep its current damaging effect. Just remove regular distorion and keep this with distortion's Invuln instead of a block

• Bladecall: If the original target of the skill is in range, the returning blades will now lock on to that enemy. If not, the blades will return to the player as normal.

Super good change, I don't think anyone would argue against it

• Unstable Bladestorm: This skill is now a ground-targeted spell instead of a projectile. The spell strikes enemies in range in addition to firing projectiles at nearby enemies.

this is another mixed bag, while having it ground targeted gets rid of that slow moving tornado, the projectiles are what is the odd part about this. Why not just change it so the projectiles home in on a nearby target withing range? so instead of spawning 4 static ones each enemy gets hit by a homing projectile?

Necromancer

Scourge has always been intended to be a viable support option, but the lack of quickness or alacrity has held it back in endgame content outside of specific cases. That won't be an issue anymore, as we've adjusted Desert Empowerment to be that source of alacrity. With scourge support likely becoming more viable in general use, we felt that its reviving power was just a bit too high and have made some adjustments to bring it more in line. We'll be keeping a very close eye on alacrity scourge's performance and will follow up as needed.

Now I have already said my piece on this before and all the changes to gut HealScourge and core necro just to make a 'viable build' that isn't viable as a dps or a healer with these proposed changes is actually pretty disgusting and I really think the balance team should be ashamed of themselves. Here is a link to my original post about Necro with a bit more indepth at certain aspects and even suggestions for change.

Core

• Well of Blood: This skill now applies regeneration with every pulse.

Sure nice little buff

• Ritual of Life: Reduced revive percentage from 7% to 2% in PvE only.

Without getting into a rant; Necro having higher revive potential is NOT A BAD THING, its good for teaching new players content even if it is a carry in some cases but its more important to help teach the community to finish the content rather than punish them for not dodging a mechanic or two.

Remove this change...

• Quickening Thirst: This trait has been reworked. Gain life force when you strike an enemy with a dagger skill.
• Life Siphon: This skill is no longer channeled and will instead perform a single attack. Enemies struck by the initial attack will be dealt damage over time, and the user will be healed when damage is dealt.
• Life from Death: This trait no longer revives allies and now increases outgoing healing.

Necro is not a /healer/ in its current state and this doesn't scale with barriers the way it is worded so justifying it as a change specifically for new Alac Scourge is a lie.

• Banshee's Wail: This trait no longer increases outgoing healing.

This triat isn't used often just put the effect on the Warhorn and call it good then you don't need to keep buffing outgoing healing elsewhere. Makes warhorn usable on SOMETHING again.

• Transfusion: This trait now only teleports downed allies when initially activated. Reduced the revival pulse from 2% to 1% when used with the scourge elite specialization in PvE only.

I love the reduced usage on Scourge specifically. Don't do this the multiple pulses makes this skill precastable and it doesn't proc on the same target multiple times anyways so what exactly is this change aimed at? As an example, Boneskinner's puddles mechanics can appear while someone is getting revived or someone can go down while Gnarish Pillar is active and pulsing so they get sucked into the hands making this actually have a skill ceiling already.

• Unholy Feast: This skill now removes boons instead of converting them into conditions.
• Spiteful Spirit: This trait now removes boons instead of converting them into conditions.
• Enfeebling Blood: This skill no longer converts boons into conditions.
• Lesser Enfeeble: This skill no longer converts boons into conditions.
• Signets of Suffering: This trait has been reworked and causes signet skills to remove boons from affected foes.

Boon corruption and remove is a core staple of the class itself and these changes are downright wrong ESPECIALLY for WvW where boonball is a big threat and you are actively taking out boon removal/corruption. If you are trying to change the meta you are just firmly cementing the WvW zergs.

• Signet of Vampirism: Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 24 seconds.
• Plague Signet: Reduced cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds in PvE and from 45 seconds to 35 seconds in PvP and WvW. Reduced the number of conditions transferred from 5 to 4 in PvP and WvW.

People use this?

Scourge

• Desert Empowerment: This trait has been moved to the grandmaster tier, replacing Feed from Corruption. The barrier from this trait will now only apply around the shade and will affect 5 targets. This trait now also grants alacrity to allies when you grant them barrier.

Just make Sand Savant do this, its already 5 target max and literally is directed at the changes you want.

• Sandstorm Shroud: This skill now pulses barrier to allies near the scourge before it detonates.

I actually agree with this change, pretty much the only one of the Scourge list

• Abrasive Grit: This trait no longer causes Sand Flare to grant barrier to allies. In addition to its previous effects, this trait now grants might when you apply barrier.

Like I said in my initial post, Might isn't an issue in most groups so this is somewhat overkill

• Sand Flare: This skill now grants a reduced amount of barrier to nearby allies.

I understand you don't want 10man scourge groups anymore but if you want an actual HEALING Scourge don't change this. It has a long cast time for minimal barrier and while it would proc the alacrity it's just not worth its cast time. Also see the top of the post about you wanting to remove utility skills from applying Quickness/Alacrity

• Sadistic Searing: This trait no longer reduces the cooldown of punishment skills. Increased burning duration from 2 seconds to 4 seconds in PvP and WvW
• Trail of Anguish: Reduced cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds in PvE and from 50 seconds to 40 seconds in PvP and WvW.
• Ghastly Breach: Reduced cooldown from 75 seconds to 60 seconds in PvE and from 90 seconds to 72 seconds in PvP and WvW. Reduced duration from 4 to 3 seconds in WvW only.
• Desiccate: This skill now also grants fury to nearby allies. Increased might from 5 stacks for 8 seconds to 8 stacks for 9 seconds. Reduced cooldown from 20 seconds to 16 seconds.

See my previous post about these

• Serpent Siphon: This skill has been reworked. It will now send a serpent to a target area that will detonate upon arrival. Allies in the area will gain barrier, regeneration, and aegis. Enemies will be poisoned and one of their boons will be converted into torment. Reduced cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds.

Finally Necro is getting an Aegis on demand excluding elite elixir on Harb because that isn't exactly on demand but this is still a pretty bad skill given the utility that Scourge is going to /have/ to bring to be supportive. Signet of Undeath is required leaving only 2 other slots and most likely its going to be filled with Blood is Power and a well.

Harbinger

• Vile Vials: This trait no longer reduces the cooldown of elixir skills. Increased vulnerability stacks from 5 to 7.

Cool so the trait is useless now

• Elixir of Promise: Reduced cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW.
• Elixir of Anguish: Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 25 seconds in PvP and WvW.
• Elixir of Bliss: Reduced cooldown from 40 seconds to 32 seconds in PvP and WvW.
• Elixir of Ignorance: Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 24 seconds.
• Elixir of Risk: Reduced cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW.
• Elixir of Ambition: Reduced cooldown from 90 seconds to 72 seconds in PvP and WvW.

Why not in PvE also? Oh right you don't want people to bring just elixirs on Harb

• Septic Corruption: Reduced condition damage increase per stack from 0.5% to 0.25% in PvE only.

Oh yes I did see this on the stream. This is a HORRIBLE change, it's sneaky you guys slipped it into the stream but we all saw it. Look the Shroud blight gain buff was great and I can honestly say it did make a difference BUT after playing it for a week I can honestly say that it really didn't change much in the rotation and only effected how much blight you had when leaving shroud. Given Harbinger wants to basically LIVE IN SHROUD to get its damage this is a HUGE HUGE nerf literally -12.5% damage to conditions (roughly 5k+ dps) and this is on top of you removing it from being 1% per stack in the beta which at the time didn't have a way to /dump/ the blight while in shroud like it does now. Yeah just don't do this because then you have literally only condi reaper as Necro's condition damage dealer. This is actually a bigger effect than most people realize.

Ranger

Spirits won't be granting alacrity moving forward, and we've taken this opportunity to do a larger pass on the skill type. Spirits will now trigger a smaller effect when summoned, slam the ground for a more powerful effect, and finally grant boons for a shorter period of time. Druid was the natural place to slot in an alacrity build, while we decided to give untamed access to quickness. Nature magic is also getting a larger set of changes with to solidify it as a support trait line. Rounding out the ranger changes are some improvements to sword and introducing a condition damage build for druid.

I don't play ranger a lot but I do play Druid and I like the idea of removing alacrity off of spirits, I really do but uh why are you doing this specifically especially after you /just/ reworked spirits.

Druid

• Grace of the Land: This trait now grants alacrity instead of might.

So there is a rather serious issue with this one. Druid wants to be in Celestial Avatar for big burst healing, as might generation in the current meta isn't actually an issue but you bring this anyways just because the others aren't exactly worth taking if you are supportive Druid. Druid DOES NOT want to be constantly going in and out of Celestial Avatar as often as possible just to provide said boon. Overall this is a highly questionable change.

• Rejuvenating Tides: This skill now grants might to nearby allies in addition to its previous effects
• Natural Convergence: This trait now grants might to nearby allies every pulse.

Well I found the might

• Blood Moon: This trait replaces Primal Echoes. Daze nearby foes when you become a celestial avatar. Bleed foes you immobilize or disable.
• Natural Balance: This trait replaces Natural Stride. Deal increased damage and take reduced damage for a period of time after entering or exiting Celestial Avatar.
• Eclipse: This trait replaces Ancient Seeds. Your celestial avatar abilities inflict conditions on enemies.

So my question is; is this how you want a Condi Druid? Are you killing the healing aspect of Druid to make Condi Alac Druid? I dunno about that one chief, but I think its a neat idea to expand Druid even if Tempest didn't get the same treatment.

• Glyph of Alignment: Increased bleeding duration from 8 seconds to 10 seconds in PvE only.
• Glyph of Equality: The non-celestial version of this skill now applies stability in PvE only.

Stars already does this

• Natural Mender: Increased astral force generation from 5 to 8 in PvE only.

Good change honestly does allow CA to come back faster but its basically mandatory now

• Cosmic Ray: Increased radius from 120 to 240.
• Lingering Light: This trait no longer grants increased outgoing healing after exiting Celestial Avatar, and it instead reduces the recharge of Celestial Avatar every time another player is healed by a celestial avatar skill.

Now I'm going to say right now, the way this is worded is very confusing. Because Celestial Avatar requires full charge to go into but its abilities don't effect if you aren't actually in CA. So are you reducing the cooldowns of the abilities while you are in Celestial Avatar or are you trying to increase generation of Astral Force to get back /into/ CA

Untamed

• Let Loose: This trait replaces Fervent Force. Grant boons to nearby allies when you use an unleashed ambush skill. Recharge your unleashed ambush skill when you swap weapons.

If this is how you are applying quickness you just made the class a bit harder to play and rely more on cooldown reduction

Revenant

Herald's quickness application is being moved to Elevated Compassion and tied to maintaining upkeep skills. In its place, Draconic Echo will now cause facet passive effects to grant additional bonuses to the herald. Vindicator is also getting some adjustments in WvW to bring it more in line with other support builds.

Core

• Banish Enchantment: This skill now has a 5-second cooldown in WvW only.
• Aggressive Agility: This trait no longer removes immobilization, and it instead grants resistance.
• Demonic Defiance: This trait will now also remove a damaging condition when it triggers.
• Forced Engagement: Reduced number of targets from 5 to 1. Increased range from 600 to 900.

Okay, but why? This is a taunt and at 900 range it's somewhat useless given almost every Revenant is a melee focus so this feels more like a slap from a wet noodle to anyone it hits rather than an actual FORCED ENGAGEMENT

• Battle Scars: Increased base healing from 58 to 68 in PvP only.

Herald

• Elevated Compassion: This trait now grants boons to nearby allies while six or more points of upkeep are in use, in addition to its current effect.
• Draconic Echo: This trait no longer grants boons when using a consume skill and instead causes facet passives to grant an additional bonus to the herald.

Alright I have a bone to pick here. I enjoy all the current Herald builds in PvE and this change is /interesting/ to say the very least. But let me explain some of the knock on effects of doing this given the justification is you don't want utility spamming for boons. Glint as a Legend is literally a boon bot, all the facets provide boons by default while they are active and the bonus effect from reactivating the facet only effects the Herald which are not being touched as far as I have seen from the preview and the stream.

HOWEVER, Elevated Compassion is currently not used because Draconic Echo has the quickness on it changing the quickness over in order to make it pulse on upkeep use doesn't actually fix the problem of facet smashing and instead creates a new more unique problem. Now Heralds will have to at the very least choose which facet they want to keep active and pulsing to upkeep quickness but that means LESS boons are being applied to the group overall as you are forced to CHOOSE which boons you want to apply and pop the rest of your facets anyways for their damage or buff.

HealQuickHerald is affected by this the most as as a healer it's meant to be providing boons as well as healing however with a constant drain on your energy you have to choose whether to actively heal your team with abilities or hope that the passive pulsing heal will see you through because you will be forced to swap between legends constantly and most of the time if you are forced to actively drain if you use too much energy then you burn through your legend too fast which means boons are no longer applied. See the AlacRenegade build where you have to time all your abilities perfect otherwise you On top of that the other Legends just /don't/ apply supportive boons and are really used for their utility.

QuickHerald is affected in a more interesting way as now you don't HAVE to supply other boons and can literally just be a quickness bot for existing like harbinger in shroud while doing damage. And depending on how often and how much this pulses you may never have to bring any Concentration.

DPSHerald may actually bring Draconic Echo now because there is more active damage on the facets thanks to the new bonus passives this trait will apply and I hate to say it but they will still facet spam for the damage and now get rewarded for it.

Overall I think this doesn't actually accomplish what you guys THINK it needs to accomplish, just don't change this or come at a solution from another angle.

Vindicator

I dont play it in WvW. Let them tell you about these changes

Thief

In addition to moving alacrity off of wells, we wanted to improve specter's ability to play a support role in larger group situations. Ally-targeted scepter skills will now grant their effects in an area around the target, and Shadestep has been reworked to allow Shadow Shroud skills to affect multiple allies around the tethered target. We're also introducing a quickness build for deadeye. Fire for Effect will cause every stolen skill to become Steal Time, which now grants quickness in an area. We've also bumped up daredevil's staff damage while reducing the damage of the more powerful stolen skills to make the build more consistent.

I had to rewatch the stream and look over the notes about 5 times. Did you guys really just REMOVE Alac on Specter altogether or...?

Core

• Improvisation: This trait now reduces the cooldowns of all utility skills by a certain percentage when you steal, instead of recharging a random skill.

Thief usually has a pretty dead set rotation and this doesn't make it faster because of how Initiative works. Not only that you bring this just for the Double Stolen skill....

• Endless Stamina: This trait has been reworked and renamed Fluid Strikes. It now grants the thief a damage bonus for a period of time after using a movement skill or completing a shadowstep.

This seems almost required to be taken now in almost all Thief builds?

• Pain Response: This trait has been reworked. It now removes a damaging condition from the thief when completing a dodge roll.
• Guarded Initiation: This trait has been reworked. It now grants the thief resistance when using a movement skill, with a 5-second internal cooldown.

These seem to be Competitive changes

• Swindler's Equilibrium: This trait now recharges Steal by 1 second per trigger, with a 1-second cooldown.
• Assassin's Reward: Increased base healing per initiative spent from 102 to 151.

This is nice I guess?

Daredevil

• Bound: Increased power coefficient from 1.75 to 3.5 in PvE only.
• Staff Strike: Increased power coefficient from 0.75 to 1.0 in PvE only.
• Staff Bash: Increased power coefficient from 0.8 to 1.2 in PvE only.

The staff change actually encourages the user to interrupt their auto chain before the third hit to gain more DPS, either add damage to the third auto or don't change this

• Brawler's Tenacity: This skill no longer reduces the cooldown of physical skills.
• Channeled Vigor: Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 24 seconds in PvP and WvW.
• Bandit's Defense: Reduced cooldown from 20 seconds to 16 seconds in PvE and from 30 seconds to 24 seconds in PvP and WvW.
• Fist Flurry: Reduced cooldown from 20 seconds to 16 seconds.
• Impairing Daggers: Reduced cooldown from 18 seconds to 15 seconds.
• Impact Strike: Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 25 seconds.

In line with the rest of the cooldown reduction traits, nothing to say

• Detonate Plasma: This skill now deals damage to nearby enemies and no longer grants quickness.
• Throw Magnetic Bomb: Reduced power coefficient from 1.5 to 0.7.
• Throw Unstable Reagent: Increased power coefficient from 1.5 to 2.0.
• Throw Cursed Artifact: Reduced power coefficient from 0.5 to 0.4. Reduced bleeding, torment, and confusion stacks from 5 to 3.
• Time in a Bottle: Reduced duration from 5 seconds to 3 seconds.

Now I KNOW this is targeted at boonThief specifically but that is a relatively niche build in the current meta because of how stolen skills are distributed in the first place. Like with the Confusion change this makes little sense as the mechanic is baked into the fight and you're really just punishing people for correctly identifying mechanics. Either change the distribution of Stolen skills (becuase there literally is NONE in EoD fights right now) or don't change this and think of something better to do with stolen skills as they either need a rework or need to be spread out far more.

Deadeye

• Stolen Skills: Stolen skills now grant their beneficial effects in a radius around the caster. Reduced casting time by approximately 25%.
• Steal Time: Increased quickness duration from 3 seconds to 5 seconds in PvE only.
• Steal Resistance: Increased resistance duration from 3 seconds to 5 seconds in PvE only.

I know many a Deadeye player myself included who are really eager to try out this build. Deadeye is highly reliant on this boon right now and if it can supply it fully by itself its going to be madness

• Malicious Intent: Increased malice gain from 1 to 2 in PvE only.

Huge, love this

• Fire for Effect: This trait no longer requires a target to grant boons to allies. Additionally, equipping this trait guarantees that the stolen skill will be Steal Time, regardless of the target's profession.

This quickness change I actually really like, but it's always going to be paired with Inspiration just for the two uses and most likely Mercy as well to refresh Deadeye Mark.

• Shadow Flare: Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 20 seconds in PvE only. This skill now only damages once when used instead of pulsing.
• Shadow Swap: This skill now causes an additional strike to occur at your original location when used.

Honestly this is a good change, it makes the skill less punishing and actually more universally usable, if you messed up a stealth while this was active you actually lost more damage than the skill would ever gain you in the fight total.

• One in the Chamber: This trait now also increases the damage of stolen skills, in addition to its previous effects.

Odd buff but alright. Seems like a real backhand to Daredevil players as well.

• Binding Shadow: Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 20 seconds in PvE and from 30 seconds to 25 seconds in PvP and WvW. This skill now immobilizes marked targets instead of knocking them down

Why? There is a ton of other knockdowns baked into the good Competitive classes right now, this is a really questionable change.

Specter

• Ally-targeted scepter skills now also grant a lesser effect to additional allies in a radius around the target.
• Second Opinion: This trait now grants condition damage instead of healing power when equipped and while wielding a scepter.
• Shallow Grave: This trait has been reworked. It now causes Siphon to transfer conditions to a targeted enemy or remove conditions from the specter and their targeted ally.
• Traversing Dusk: This trait no longer grants alacrity to allies when using a well skill.
• Shadestep: This trait has been reworked. It now spreads the beneficial effects of your shadow shroud skills to allies around your tethered target, and it additionally grants boons to yourself and those allies when you use a shadow shroud skill.

I have one big question because most other players have torn this apart pretty well. Anet what the actual kitten is your plan with this spec?

Warrior

With quickness being removed from banners, we wanted to introduce both a quickness and an alacrity build to warrior elite specializations and have done so for berserker and bladesworn, respectively. We'll be keeping an eye on how these builds perform relative to their counterparts and will make follow-up adjustments as needed. We've also tuned up rifle and off-hand dagger to make them more effective options.

There is a bit to unpack here. You killed banners AGAIN! Congrats thats two shots to the back of the head. Just rework them, Teapot had a pretty good idea talk to him about it. Berserker; .... Why...? Bladesworn; WHY?

Core

• Banners are dead and they reduced cooldowns. Also ShoutHealWarrior is dead, thanks Anet

Berserker

• Flaming Flurry: Reduced the number of hits from 8 to 6. Reduced casting time. Increased power coefficient from 0.25 to 0.33. Increased burning duration from 2 seconds to 5 seconds.

This is technically a nerf as there is now less bolts from combo fields, but we'll see how it plays out

• Arc Divider: Reduced the number of strikes from 3 to 1. Reduced the casting time from 1.86 seconds to 0.8 seconds. Reduced total power coefficient from 5.1 to 2.5 in PvE and from 2.112 to 1.82 in PvP.

This one is already super controversial and others have been nagging on it, I agree with them, don't do this (yes we know you hate weapon stowing just remove the aftercast and get over it)

• Blood Reaction: Increased the base precision-to-ferocity conversion to 10%. This trait now converts 10% of power to condition damage. These bonuses are still doubled in berserk mode.
• Bloody Roar: Reduced the increased damage provided from 25 to 20% in PvE only.

Yeah this makes sense go for it

• Heat the Soul: This trait has been reworked. This trait will now grant boons to nearby allies when you strike an enemy with a burst skill.

Another controversial change. This forcibly puts MORE utility on Berserker's bar in order to keep them in Berserk for as long as possible so they can adequately provide the boon. Not only does this go against your statement from the start of the post AGAIN its a bad change in general and I agree with the community this is actually the worst way you could have done this for the sake of pulling quickness out of core warrior.

Spellbreaker

• Winds of Disenchantment: Lowered the duration from 5 seconds to 4 seconds in WvW only.
• Break Enchantments: Increased the number of boons removed from 2 to 4 in PvE only. Reduced the number of boons removed from 2 to 1 in WvW only.

WvW needs more boon removal, not less, bad change.

• Wastrel's Ruin: This skill now removes boons when striking an enemy.
• Bladestorm: This skill now grants barrier when striking an enemy.

Why?

Bladesworn

• Daring Dragon: This trait has been reworked. Dragon Slash has a lower maximum charge level and consumes more flow per charge, but its damage per charge has been increased. Grant alacrity to nearby allies when you use Dragon Slash.

I don't play Bladesworn so the other people's sentiment is worth more than mine, but this is a really odd change. Don't do it.

And that concludes the patch notes plus my little breakdown/personal thoughts.

TL:DR

Anet, I want to make this clear that I do love the game but this patch is really controversial. You as a team are saying one thing yet doing the complete opposite to the goal you have set in mind. And at this point the way you are actively removing class identity across the board is very obvious and the community is not a fan of it. the few and far between people that like this patch most likely only play one or two classes and builds, and while not everyone plays every single class there are enough "Mains" that someone can tell you what went wrong very quickly with your changes. I know this sounds like an impossibility but either OPEN MORE lines of contact to the community on each class, or get a full team of 9 people who ACTUALLY PLAY THE GAME AND A CLASS that understand the class they are working on and put them in charge of helping to balance.

While I get that the team is focused on mixing things up and changing the playstyle of the game at this point you're actively making things worse. There is VERY FEW good changes in this entire list and is honestly rather depressing to see that you as a balance team wish to pull the game in a more unhealthy direction for the players.

STOP gutting classes to shoehorn in support boons, keep to the class themaitic and build off of it instead of tearing apart current builds. You VERY CLEARLY stated you want more diversity but this is not how you do it. Look at the traits and weapons that ARE NOT BEING USED as often and make changes to them to give suggested options and viability to them.

I really think as a design team you need to rethink your design philosphy because the community seems to disagree with how you are leading things and if you wish for the game to survive you really should be listening. Most other games have people leaving giving a good influx of new players here which is very healthy and I love to hear more and more people are trying out Guild Wars, but at this point I grow more and more hesitant to encourage people to try Endgame content or Competitive content as the lack of understanding of certain fundamental problems with each seems to go right over the team's heads.

 

As in the wise words of 3kliksphillip - "Anet... Please fix"

[Obtena.7952]

1 minute ago, Batalix.2873 said:

This still feels like a blanket appeal to authority, though, while ignoring the many specific criticisms leveled at this patch.

Just because devs are paid to work at ANet or even used to be players does not mean they are doing a good job at designing or balancing the game.

And, at least in my case, this is not starting from some presumption of incompetency. I actually was stoked at some of the changes in this patch before really delving into the details. It is only after looking at the specifics, and contextualizing them against the past couple years of development, that I come to the conclusion that the devs may not actually be doing a very good job with this. I.e. it was in analyzing the evidence on hand that I came to that conclusion.

Handwaving all of this away with "that's what the devs want" just circumvents so much discourse as well as attempts to lampshade some pretty big problems with this patch and the game's overall trajectory.

So I owe you an apology because I misunderstood some of your intend and re-edited my post. I don't disagree with discourse on the forum. I was responding specificialy to the idea that Devs use the forum poll system to gauge player sentiment. Generally, it's just not that valuable a tool to get information from people. 

Edited June 13, 2023 by Obtena.7952

[Strauss.1384]

There were over 200 confused reactions to the original post with the patch notes and now it's down to 54. Can someone explain?

[Obtena.7952]

1 minute ago, Strauss.1384 said:

There were over 200 confused reactions to the original post with the patch notes and now it's down to 54. Can someone explain?

maybe 146+ people became enlightened somehow. 

Edited June 13, 2023 by Obtena.7952

[Batalix.2873]

24 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Sure ... but I was responding specifically about polls on the forum and why they are low value to Anet for gauging player sentiment. I'm all for forum discourse. 

 

 

Thank you for the clarification.

The polls are pretty useless, I do agree on that front. Any feedback that a consumer can complete in a few seconds is not likely to be well thought out, no matter how big or small the polling numbers.

Edited June 13, 2023 by Batalix.2873