anet u need to make up ur mind

[felix.2386]

Yes balance patches are good, a lot of stuff need fixing,

But u can't just rework something you just reworked not long ago. Like really?

I can't recall how many times banner got reworked from the past 1 year.

This is not a test server, you can't just keep reworking the same thing over and over like that.

While still having a lot of other skills that's basically untouched in all modes in years just sit there.

It's discourging for the player base.

[Batalix.2873]

Prior to EoD, the HoT/PoF specs were largely okay, barring FB and Scourge needing some focusing and banners. I do think that increasing access to quickness and alacrity was not a bad compromise in the long run. But by and large the state of the game, pre EoD, was okay.

This is all the EoD specs' fault. Most of these patches are specifically targeting HoT/PoF especs to try to normalize the EoD specs which are inherently underdeveloped and overtuned because they were rushed.

We would not be getting repeated patches if they had mostly left the HoT/PoF specs alone and focused hard on finishing the EoD especs and bringing them up to parity. Maybe only a couple major balance patches would have been needed, and largely only targeting the EoD specs which were always the problem children.

This could have been handled so much better but some individuals at ANet are too insistent on jerking themselves over their cringily thin EoD spec fantasies. and "fixing" oddly specific and petty PvP gripes that virtually none of the players care about with sweeping paradigm shifts.

Edited June 20, 2023 by Batalix.2873

[Beddo.1907]

Some ppl are like the icecream kid from spongebob. They want something changed, only to say they don't want it changed.

[felix.2386]

3 hours ago, Beddo.1907 said:

Some ppl are like the icecream kid from spongebob. They want something changed, only to say they don't want it changed.

people want the bad version changed, doesnt mean completely change 4 times in 1 year and not just number changes.

you do realize people want skills changed because the skill is bad, not because they want change because they like change and only for the sake of change.

people just want a good version of the skill, and not have a different version of the same skill every 4 months 

Edited June 20, 2023 by felix.2386

[AlexndrTheGreat.8310]

11 hours ago, Batalix.2873 said:

 

Prior to EoD, the HoT/PoF specs were largely okay, barring FB and Scourge needing some focusing and banners. I do think that increasing access to quickness and alacrity was not a bad compromise in the long run. But by and large the state of the game, pre EoD, was okay.

This is all the EoD specs' fault. Most of these patches are specifically targeting HoT/PoF especs to try to normalize the EoD specs which are inherently underdeveloped and overtuned because they were rushed.

We would not be getting repeated patches if they had mostly left the HoT/PoF specs alone and focused hard on finishing the EoD especs and bringing them up to parity. Maybe only a couple major balance patches would have been needed, and largely only targeting the EoD specs which were always the problem children.

This could have been handled so much better but some individuals at ANet are too insistent on jerking themselves over their cringily thin EoD spec fantasies. and "fixing" oddly specific and petty PvP gripes that virtually none of the players care about with sweeping paradigm shifts.

 

I feel similar about the EoD specs being a let down compared to what we could have, or maybe even should have gotten.

I feel like some classes didn’t get an elite spec that did the role that they were really needing to get. For example, Bladesworn seems really cool and is very fitting for Cantha, but did Warrior really need a 3rd dps / brawler elite spec? Support Warrior and Heal Warrior is on the cusp of being there, what it really needed was a support focused elite to give them something truly different. Similar with Mesmer almost being there as a healer, but a clone-less Mesmer was also something players really wanted. Other specs like Untamed for example are just so pathetic in my opinion. You never actually played Untamed, you only played Fervent Force and everything else was tagged on.

Now Anet’s at a point where they are slowing down development of elite specs, from my perspective likely due to their change in GW2s business model where they’re releasing more frequent expansion, but don’t want to get caught in needing to make new elites every expansion. If we do get new ones it will be more infrequent and only for big expansions. At the same time they want to spread out more roles to classes that don’t have them and that’s a fantastic thing to do. The only issue is that they restrained themselves into only being able to use the elites that are already there. Putting quickness or alacrity on Untamed would have been fine, but for me it doesn’t feel great because the spec itself isn’t great. Quickness and alacrity has to get slapped into Warrior somewhere because an obvious support elite spec doesn’t exist.

Unfortunately just pausing future development of elite specs and also wanting to expand roles to all classes are at odds with each other. Anet has kind of developed themselves into a corner and the only way to escape it is to hold off on expanding roles entirely, or just expand it piecemeal where it makes sense (Alac Druid, Alac Scourge is fine, etc) until the other classes have specs that are initially designed with that in mind.

Edited June 20, 2023 by AlexndrTheGreat.8310

[Batalix.2873]

2 minutes ago, AlexndrTheGreat.8310 said:

I feel similar about the EoD specs being a let down compared to what we could have, or maybe even should have gotten.

I feel like some classes didn’t get an elite spec that did the role that they were really needing to get. For example, Bladesworn seems really cool and is very fitting for Cantha, but did Warrior really need a 3rd dps / brawler elite spec? Support Warrior and Heal Warrior is on the cusp of being there, what it really needed was a support focused elite to give them something truly different. Similar with Mesmer almost being there as a healer, but a clone-less Mesmer was also something players really wanted. Other specs like Untamed for example are just so pathetic in my opinion. You never actually played Untamed, you only played Fervent Force and everything else was tagged on.

Now Anet’s at a point where they are slowing down development of elite specs, from my perspective likely due to their change in GW2s business model where they’re releasing more frequent expansion, but don’t want to get caught in needing to make new elites every expansion. If we do get new ones it will be more infrequent and only for big expansions. At the same time they want to spread out more roles to classes that don’t have them and that’s a fantastic thing to do. The only issue is that they restrained themselves into only being able to use the elites that are already there. Putting quickness or alacrity on Untamed would have been fine, but for me it doesn’t feel great because the spec itself isn’t great. Quickness and alacrity has to get slapped into Warrior somewhere because an obvious support elite spec doesn’t exist.

And the thing is that now that they are committed to assigning alac/quickness between the especs we currently have, that just makes it less likely they will be releasing more especs at all. And if that is the case, if the EoD specs are all we will will be getting, why aren't they finished? Why do they feel like sad shadows of the HoT/PoF design philosophy? And why, if the devs are not devoting resources to new especs, aren't the devs taking that extra time and resources to bring the EoD especs more into line with the HoT/PoF especs? Give them actual identities, niches, roles, conceits, unique weaponstyles? It is truly baffling.

I will say one thing about Fervent Force. At least it gave Untamed some kind of cripple-hunter bunny-thumper identity. I would have preferred it mostly be kept and moved to a minor trait that just inherently became part of Untamed (albeit with some considered nerfing), instead of removing it and Untamed going back to having no identity at all.

[BadLuck.8456]

I mean, banners were always a bad design. A buff but you drop it in an area and then need to pick it up and run it by hand to the next area? Maybe would have been okay with one elite banner but not all 4. They only saw play when they were a unique dps buff you couldn't get anywhere else and you could just drop them in the middle of the boss area and not worry about it and even then I think they took away picking it up and dropped the CD considerably to try to cram SOME QoL into them. Then unique buffs needed to go, but when you took banner buffs away from warrior it showed off exactly how bad a state warrior was in. As a band aid they added quickness to banners so that banner warriors still provided something that was needed in a group to justify their terrible dps and then they set to work buffing warrior to get it to be a solid dps pick. Now that you can play any warrior spec without being a determent to your team they are ripping the band aid off and brining warrior in line with their idea that every class should be able to provide alac or quickness with a spec and not with the base class.

They could have let banners rot after removing the unique buffs but then warriors would have been excluded from most end game instanced content until EoD and bladesworn.

After this, banners will join the junk pile of other useless utility skills waiting to be fully reworked so that they have a purpose.

[felix.2386]

now all banners will just be irrelevant other than the one that give quickness base line in pve btw.

[JTGuevara.9018]

20 hours ago, felix.2386 said:

Yes balance patches are good, a lot of stuff need fixing,

But u can't just rework something you just reworked not long ago. Like really?

I can't recall how many times banner got reworked from the past 1 year.

This is not a test server, you can't just keep reworking the same thing over and over like that.

While still having a lot of other skills that's basically untouched in all modes in years just sit there.

It's discourging for the player base.

Well then! Wait until you see how many times banners got reworked in their entire history!

(Source: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Banner_of_Strength )

(leans back)...Ahhh...just give me my likes, already...

 

[ventress.4879]

2 hours ago, JTGuevara.9018 said:

Well then! Wait until you see how many times banners got reworked in their entire history!

(Source: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Banner_of_Strength )

(leans back)...Ahhh...just give me my likes, already...

 

The problem was they were always mandatory buffs for benchmarks so if you where playing a Warrior and didn't want to use banners you would be kicked since it would drastically lower the group DPS. 

[MikSki.9481]

I can understand not being happy with how they change banners, but I don't understand why anyone would scold them for actually trying to make a change and make it better. It's really hard to get it right on first attempt, and they are open to feedback from the playerbase, just let them do their thing. With frequent patches like we have now, and their size, you honestly can't say they're neglecting other skills and stuff (maybe thief is a bit shy on patch notes).

Edited June 21, 2023 by MikSki.9481