OW Bounding Dodger Staff Daredevil = fun

[TheAgedGnome.7520]

I rarely see Daredevils in OW, and I can't recall the last time I saw another one using Bounding Dodger, which seems a shame, because I find it a rather fun build. In particular, I find it infinitely more fun that the condi D/D Daredevil.

I'm using a variant of Snowcrows OW power Daredevil build, with some Marauder pieces, P/P offhand set, sigil changes, and trait variations. [build - still being tweaked] 

I find it most useful to think of the Endurance and Initiative systems as dual "energy" bars:

• While burning down my initiative with staff2 spam, endurance is refilling.
• While bounding until endurance is empty, initiative is refilling.
• So by managing these two alternating "energy" sources, its usually possible to keep up a good pace and rhythm of attack.

Never thought after 11 years that this would be the class I currently gravitate most toward.  

Edited May 6 by TheAgedGnome.7520
typo

[Palikka.8249]

I usually play condi specter in ow, just becouse its fun and good vs strong mobs. Thou staffdevil bouncing around is awesome!

[TheAgedGnome.7520]

FWIW, as I've gotten more comfortable with staff Daredevil, I've changed my build to use Deadly Arts instead of Acrobatics, and to use Assassin's Signet for better damage.  I'll also use Fist Flurry instead of Signet of Shadows when movement isn't as useful.

[agnlaa.7594]

i have a lot of thief builds (7 slots + a couple in storage) so i cant really say any is my 'main' build, but staff dd definitely gets a lot of use in ow and fractals. big metas and world bosses i switch to ritualist spectre a lot of the time, then full viper spectre or power deadeye for champions

[FrancisN.9276]

On 5/6/2024 at 9:05 AM, TheAgedGnome.7520 said:

I rarely see Daredevils in OW, and I can't recall the last time I saw another one using Bounding Dodger, which seems a shame, because I find it a rather fun build. In particular, I find it infinitely more fun that the condi D/D Daredevil.

I'm using a variant of Snowcrows OW power Daredevil build, with some Marauder pieces, P/P offhand set, sigil changes, and trait variations. [build - still being tweaked] 

I find it most useful to think of the Endurance and Initiative systems as dual "energy" bars:

• While burning down my initiative with staff2 spam, endurance is refilling.
• While bounding until endurance is empty, initiative is refilling.
• So by managing these two alternating "energy" sources, its usually possible to keep up a good pace and rhythm of attack.

Never thought after 11 years that this would be the class I currently gravitate most toward.  

I am rolling with a combination of Dragon and Marauder gear to achieve exactly 60% crit rate without infusion, which adds up to 100% after Critical Strike traitline and fury. I also use the relic that grants fury everytime I disable an opponent, which I can trigger reliably by Helmet Breaker to keep fury uptime 100%. Since this combo gives a more dodge iframe, I also choose Acrobatic to get vigor on evasion and might/condi cleanse on bouncing as well. DPS loss compared to full Berserker gear is like 15% when OW solo.

[Antycypator.9874]

On 5/6/2024 at 6:05 PM, TheAgedGnome.7520 said:

I rarely see Daredevils in OW,

You know why? Because Daredevil is an outdated spec with almost 0 boons. Even Staff Deadeye can smack harder and faster with staff than Daredevil in Open World.

[Doggie.3184]

A lot of Thieves use Staff, far more-so now since Deadeye can use it, but there aren't exactly a lot of Thieves in general. I actually see no reason at all anymore to run Daredevil over Deadeye since Staff was the most it had going for it in PvE. I used to hate Deadeye and been exclusively playing Daredevil since it's release but after the Rifle buffs/reworks, mechanic fixes and universal spec weapons I been running around most as Deadeye with Rifle and Staff.

Shortbow is also the best tagging weapon for Thief~ many you see in OW may just be arrow pew pew farming.

Deadeye got tons of boons and initiative to do whatever you want with and the new Wayfinder Relic fixes the lack of OOC movement speed without much loss. Being able to use Staff on it gives massive breakbar power making OH Pistol unnessary and giving us something to AoE with. The forced movement of Daredevil dodge also gets annoying eventually and the hitbox is still super tiny (things fixed and given to Revenant). Deadeye is just more chill and relaxing without many downsides. Even if you don't kneel you'll be outDPSing Daredevil Pistols will less effort, and you get free condi removal with Death's Retreat which is hugely useful.

I wish I could enjoy Dual Pistols more but it just has no good synergy or niche with DD imo since it wants you in close range and Black Powder + Vault stealth isn't even fixed for group play and gets overridden~ not that the Stealth Attack is any good outside of PvP anyways. Ricochet (the old bouncy bullets trait) was still superior over requiring the Deadly Aim trait for Pierce, which also doesn't support condi builds, but at least it doesn't have the pointless damage reduction anymore. I still find it difficult to give it purpose. I mean it isss an option now for single-target range damage if you want to be a Daredevil... But Deadeye renders Daredevil's existance meaningless. It needs something more unique added to it than just dodge.

Best thing about Thief Staff in OW is being able to jump across ledges with it. Only a few other classes can do that~ Engi, Necro and Warrior; but we don't have long cooldowns. IMO that is a big selling point for the entire class. 

Edited June 4 by Doggie.3184

[Bunny.9834]

Daredevil needs self-quickness and superspeed.  Also increase the radius of bound. 

[Antycypator.9874]

On 6/7/2024 at 6:17 AM, Bunny.9834 said:

Daredevil needs self-quickness and superspeed.  Also increase the radius of bound. 

There is quickness, you just can't really get super high uptime without investing half of your stats into Concentration (Haste, Thrill of the Crime, Sigil of Celerity). I used to run with these in Open World.

[Bunny.9834]

7 hours ago, Antycypator.9874 said:

There is quickness, you just can't really get super high uptime without investing half of your stats into Concentration (Haste, Thrill of the Crime, Sigil of Celerity). I used to run with these in Open World.

That's the problem, you can't upkeep quickness with thief unless you play a deadeye. Which I feel like the only spec the devs care about for thief. 

I'm not understanding why they're so afraid of giving DD 100% SELF-quickness uptime (also same for Weaver). It's a DPS spec with no boons to share. 
 

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

I found it fun at HoT release, before nerf (relatively to powercreep/other specs/new mobs) but yeah, since I've played Mirage and Vindicator, Bounding Dodger really feels clunky. Vindicator's dodge is fully controllable, 240 radius, 10sec buff ... against forced movement, 180 radius, 4sec buff. 💔Really fun to spam dodge every 4sec and miss half the random mobs.

And without even talking about the boons and initiativve from Deadeye M7 or BQBK, the recharge on deadeye's mark totally outclasses Daredevil in OW.
I don't know if daredevil needs quickness, 25 might or whatever; but just a rework of Bounding Dodger similar to Vindicator or Mirage would greatly improve attactiveness.