DeathPanel.8362 Posted June 12 Share Posted June 12 9 minutes ago, Kiof.5710 said: Well if they are transplanting nodes and such from our home instances to our homesteads, could they do the same with lounge passes? For example, if you have Thousand Seas it could unlock a fishing pond. Or what about something similar to an Ausra portal that would take you from your home instance (and back) to any lounge you have purchased a pass for? It's a cool concept but I don't think it's feasible because too many people would complain, rightfully, that their paid expansion is dependent on gem shop lounges. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiof.5710 Posted June 12 Share Posted June 12 How would that differ from transplanting nodes from other paid expansions to our new homesteads? With real money, we paid for an expansion that gave us access to nodes that are now in our home instance that will be showing up in our new homesteads. Wouldn't that be similar to buying a lounge pass, with real money, and having a node (portal) to that lounge? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeathPanel.8362 Posted June 12 Share Posted June 12 1 minute ago, Kiof.5710 said: How would that differ from transplanting nodes from other paid expansions to our new homesteads? With real money, we paid for an expansion that gave us access to nodes that are now in our home instance that will be showing up in our new homesteads. Wouldn't that be similar to buying a lounge pass, with real money, and having a node (portal) to that lounge? The benefit over existing lounges and home instances, I assume, would be accessibility and customization. The drawback would be it's private and not openly accessible to other players, unlike current lounges. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiof.5710 Posted June 12 Share Posted June 12 What I was suggesting is rather than having all the lounge features unlocked in our home instance is for an easy way to go to any lounge we have unlocked. I have all lounge passes, but due to shared inventory space, I do not use most of them. I would visit others more often if I could easily access them. Just one magic door, button, or batpole that would give me the option to visit the actual lounge that I have purchased passes for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inculpatus cedo.9234 Posted June 12 Share Posted June 12 1 hour ago, Kiof.5710 said: unlock a fishing pond You can see a fishing hole in the screenshot for Homesteads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashantara.8731 Posted June 12 Share Posted June 12 On 6/11/2024 at 12:43 AM, DeathPanel.8362 said: Homesteads are part of the expansion and paid for too. It's effectively just a paid customizable personal lounge. I doubt that will be the case. I expect it to be nothing more than a mix of a mini-guild hall and an old-fashioned home instance. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teknomancer.4895 Posted June 12 Share Posted June 12 7 hours ago, DeathPanel.8362 said: You still haven't demonstrated how Homesteads would "take away" from lounges by having similar functionality when you already conceded lounges don't take away from each other by having similar functionality. The lounges have Gem Store access passes. The Homestead will be an included-at-launch feature for anyone who has the expansion, no additional purchase needed. If it were to have all of the same functions as the Lounges, sales of those passes would drop. That's where the take-away would happen. Yes, you're still spending money on the expansion, but if the Homestead has everything lounges do then you'd have very little incentive to buy a Lounge pass, right? If you have a couple fishing holes and a portal to other spots in the Homestead, that obsoletes Thousand Seas. If you have direct access to WvW, that obsoletes Armistice. If you have direct access to Fractals, that obsoletes Mistlock. Etc. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeathPanel.8362 Posted June 12 Share Posted June 12 21 minutes ago, Teknomancer.4895 said: The lounges have Gem Store access passes. The Homestead will be an included-at-launch feature for anyone who has the expansion, no additional purchase needed. If it were to have all of the same functions as the Lounges, sales of those passes would drop. That's where the take-away would happen. Yes, you're still spending money on the expansion, but if the Homestead has everything lounges do then you'd have very little incentive to buy a Lounge pass, right? If you have a couple fishing holes and a portal to other spots in the Homestead, that obsoletes Thousand Seas. If you have direct access to WvW, that obsoletes Armistice. If you have direct access to Fractals, that obsoletes Mistlock. Etc. I never said it had to have fish spots or other unique features of existing lounges. Just core functionalities like craft benches and basic vendors, which all existing lounges have, and clearly, they don't take away from each other having those core features. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistwraithe.3106 Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 1 hour ago, DeathPanel.8362 said: I never said it had to have fish spots or other unique features of existing lounges. Just core functionalities like craft benches and basic vendors, which all existing lounges have, and clearly, they don't take away from each other having those core features. You're missing the point. Yes, once you have one lounge pass then the other lounge passes don't offer much extra value. But the point is that you have to pay gems to get that first lounge pass and that gives Anet money. If the Homestead has the key features of a lounge pass (ie crafting benches) then you no longer have nearly as much incentive to buy that first lounge pass and Anet get less money. Of course Anet will have sold Janthir Wilds to you in that case so it's just possible that Anet decide it would be fine to let Janthir Wild Homesteads cannibalize lounge sales. But I wouldn't count on it as it would effectively negate some of their expansion income (by reducing future lounge sales) and they've made it pretty clear they need the expansion income to deliver new content at a reasonable rate. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeathPanel.8362 Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 15 minutes ago, Mistwraithe.3106 said: You're missing the point. Yes, once you have one lounge pass then the other lounge passes don't offer much extra value. But the point is that you have to pay gems to get that first lounge pass and that gives Anet money. If the Homestead has the key features of a lounge pass (ie crafting benches) then you no longer have nearly as much incentive to buy that first lounge pass and Anet get less money. Your logic doesn't follow. By that logic, a second lounge pass being released would make it so you no longer have nearly as much incentive to buy that first lounge pass. I already pointed this out but you seem to have missed the point. Whatever logic you'd use to argue Homesteads take away from lounges would apply to other lounges. Also, by this point in the game, most people who would be amenable to buying lounge passes have already bought theirs, and those who haven't aren't going to be any more incentivized to buy them. You can't "take away" from 0. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistwraithe.3106 Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 (edited) 18 minutes ago, DeathPanel.8362 said: Your logic doesn't follow. By that logic, a second lounge pass being released would make it so you no longer have nearly as much incentive to buy that first lounge pass. I already pointed this out but you seem to have missed the point. Whatever logic you'd use to argue Homesteads take away from lounges would apply to other lounges. Only if the second lounge pass was released free (which they aren't). If they all cost gems then Anet don't care which one you buy, the get money either way. This logic is pretty straightforward and it is the opposite of what you are saying. 18 minutes ago, DeathPanel.8362 said: Also, by this point in the game, most people who would be amenable to buying lounge passes have already bought theirs, and those who haven't aren't going to be any more incentivized to buy them. You can't "take away" from 0. I bought my first lounge pass in January 2024 (my account is from 2012 but I didn't play much back then, restarted in late 2022). That's 12 years after the game launched. Pretty sure you will find Anet get a steady income from lounge passes. Edited June 13 by Mistwraithe.3106 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeathPanel.8362 Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 24 minutes ago, Mistwraithe.3106 said: Only if the second lounge pass was released free (which they aren't). If they all cost gems then Anet don't care which one you buy, the get money either way. This logic is pretty straightforward and it is the opposite of what you are saying. Maybe you haven't noticed but the Homestead isn't free either. Every argument you make against Homestead taking away from lounges applies to other lounges. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flowersunshine.7385 Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 (edited) One major feature of lounge passes is that they return you to your previous location. This is a crucial feature for me. I have a character parked at the hidden garden, but it's also one of my crafters. So sometimes I need it out of the hidden garden. I will never do that with something other than a lounge pass, because the lounge pass returns me to my previous location. I do not expect homesteads to work similarly. Also, I do not expect a Mystic forge or TP at my homestead. Or thematic vendors (laurels, dungeon tokens, fractal currency, etc.). I do think crafting stations should be an option though, in some shape or other. Otherwise, why would people without homeinstance nodes ever even go to their homestead? Edited June 14 by Flowersunshine.7385 Typo. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linken.6345 Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 8 hours ago, Flowersunshine.7385 said: One major feature of lounge passes is that they return you to your previous location. This is a crucial feature for me. I have a character parked at the hidden garden, but it's also one of my craters. So sometimes I need it out of the hidden garden. I will never do that with something other than a lounge pass, because the lounge pass returns me to my previous location. Snip spvp lobby do the same thing and have since the game started. Only thing it dont do is the crafting but ye getting to a vendor, bank and trading post and back to the same place have never been a issue. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashen.2907 Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 15 hours ago, DeathPanel.8362 said: By that logic, a second lounge pass being released would make it so you no longer have nearly as much incentive to buy that first lounge pass. This is correct. The more lounge passes there are the lower the demand for any single one of them as there is limited value in having more than one. If I want a lounge pass, am absolutely going to buy one, and there is only one available then I am 100% going to buy that one. If there are two available then the chance of selecting either is only 50%. Of course there are those who are completionists who will buy more than one but the actual utility of doing so is very limited. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeathPanel.8362 Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 24 minutes ago, Ashen.2907 said: This is correct. The more lounge passes there are the lower the demand for any single one of them as there is limited value in having more than one. If I want a lounge pass, am absolutely going to buy one, and there is only one available then I am 100% going to buy that one. If there are two available then the chance of selecting either is only 50%. Of course there are those who are completionists who will buy more than one but the actual utility of doing so is very limited. ANET clearly disagrees with your assessment since they've repeatedly released new lounges. Since ANET has the actual sales metrics, I'm inclined to believe it over your unsubstantiated claims. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luthan.5236 Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 I doubt they will add everything - making the lounge passes useless. (I would still buy them if they actually added some special UI to "unlock" porting options - then it would encourage completion lol.) Safe to say that we'll get a crafting station for the new crafting profession tied to making furniture for the homestead. This will also work as bank access like in the guild hall. Then the nodes. More/other stuff: Really not sure. I'd like to at least see a trading post unlockable. And if it was only for gems (instead of buying a lounge pass with gems buying lounge functions for the homestead). Mystic forge is not that interesting for me. I have only Lily of the Elon pass from PoF deluxe and I mainly use it for free porting to the desert. Most of the other stuff I just use LA/Arborstone (still not having moved my chars to the Wizard's Tower to park before logging out the Arborstone looks just better visually). Then I have chars parked in LA (the not too actively played ones where I split my crafting professions parked near the stations). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeathPanel.8362 Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 Just now, Luthan.5236 said: I doubt they will add everything - making the lounge passes useless. (I would still buy them if they actually added some special UI to "unlock" porting options - then it would encourage completion lol.) Safe to say that we'll get a crafting station for the new crafting profession tied to making furniture for the homestead. This will also work as bank access like in the guild hall. I wouldn't be opposed to them adding everything so long as they are initially locked behind the new profession mechanics and require extensive investment in time and gold. Lounge passes wouldn't be useless, because they'd be used by players who don't want to put in the investment and time to unlock the Homestead features. At the very least, I expect crafting stations and bank access in the homestead. Without these features, or some undisclosed new ones that are of equal or more value, there will be no incentive to interact with the Homestead mechanic for most players. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flowersunshine.7385 Posted June 14 Share Posted June 14 23 hours ago, Linken.6345 said: spvp lobby do the same thing and have since the game started. Only thing it dont do is the crafting but ye getting to a vendor, bank and trading post and back to the same place have never been a issue. The main reason I move this character is for crafting. But I guess the typo made my post unclear. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashen.2907 Posted June 14 Share Posted June 14 20 hours ago, DeathPanel.8362 said: ANET clearly disagrees with your assessment since they've repeatedly released new lounges. Since ANET has the actual sales metrics, I'm inclined to believe it over your unsubstantiated claims. Continuing to release new lounges in no way invalidates what I said. I have made no unsubstantiated claims. Having multiple options on a menu increases the chance that one of them will appeal to a potential customer. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeathPanel.8362 Posted June 14 Share Posted June 14 1 hour ago, Ashen.2907 said: Continuing to release new lounges in no way invalidates what I said. I have made no unsubstantiated claims. Having multiple options on a menu increases the chance that one of them will appeal to a potential customer. You have no sales data to back up your argument regarding the appeal of multiple lounges. Therefore it's unsubstantiated. I pointed out that ANET operated contrary to your original argument and since they had the actual sales metrics, I believe their decisions over your claims. You also just agreed with my point. Homesteads having lounge features wouldn't take away from existing lounges, it would increase the chance that one of them would appeal to a customer. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teknomancer.4895 Posted June 14 Share Posted June 14 On 6/13/2024 at 1:40 AM, Flowersunshine.7385 said: One major feature of lounge passes is that they return you to your previous location. This is a crucial feature for me. I have a character parked at the hidden garden, but it's also one of my crafters. So sometimes I need it out of the hidden garden. I will never do that with something other than a lounge pass, because the lounge pass returns me to my previous location. I do not expect homesteads to work similarly. Given that at least some of the existing home instance stuff is being linked/ported in, I lean the opposite direction, because leaving the home instance does indeed put you back where you came from -- if you used the Home Portal Stone. I fully expect the homestead to be added as a destination for the stone, and will be pretty kittening salty if it isn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flowersunshine.7385 Posted June 14 Share Posted June 14 I still think lounge passes will have enough to recommend them to share at least the crafting stations with their included bankaccess with them. I think adding them as destination to the home portal stone would probably be fine - that's a gemstone item after all. It might even make the home portal stone a more attractive buy. (It would make the difference for me personally. I've never felt the need to get one so far.) Different lounges have different features, their usefulness depending entirely on your preferences. For example, I don't do wvw regularly, but if I did, I would definitely get the lounge pass that allowed me to follow chat while dealing with my inventory and crafting. But all of the lounges have at least some features that would not think would fit in a homestead, like the plethora of vendors. I would find it rather weird to have a vendor in my home, tbh. I look forward to seeing what gemstore QoL features they come up with for these homesteads. Gem prices have been steady, my gold has soared since the WV came out. I need things to spend my gems on... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeathPanel.8362 Posted June 14 Share Posted June 14 24 minutes ago, Flowersunshine.7385 said: I still think lounge passes will have enough to recommend them to share at least the crafting stations with their included bankaccess with them. I think adding them as destination to the home portal stone would probably be fine - that's a gemstone item after all. It might even make the home portal stone a more attractive buy. (It would make the difference for me personally. I've never felt the need to get one so far.) Different lounges have different features, their usefulness depending entirely on your preferences. For example, I don't do wvw regularly, but if I did, I would definitely get the lounge pass that allowed me to follow chat while dealing with my inventory and crafting. But all of the lounges have at least some features that would not think would fit in a homestead, like the plethora of vendors. I would find it rather weird to have a vendor in my home, tbh. I look forward to seeing what gemstore QoL features they come up with for these homesteads. Gem prices have been steady, my gold has soared since the WV came out. I need things to spend my gems on... For me, ideally all home instance and lounge features, including portals, should be available to the Homestead, but locked behind time and gold investment in the new undisclosed crafting profession similar to Scribing. This way, people who don't want to spend the time and investment are still incentivized to use the lounges, while those who want to interact with the mechanic are rewarded with the QOL of having a one-stop location to get their harvesting, vendoring, and banking done. Btw, there are already vendors in existing home instances in the racial home cities. The Homestead is similar to that of a manor, with servants, and other amenities. Having vendors and other NPC helpers there shouldn't be weird. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linken.6345 Posted June 14 Share Posted June 14 (edited) 8 minutes ago, DeathPanel.8362 said: For me, ideally all home instance and lounge features, including portals, should be available to the Homestead, but locked behind time and gold investment in the new undisclosed crafting profession similar to Scribing. This way, people who don't want to spend the time and investment are still incentivized to use the lounges, while those who want to interact with the mechanic are rewarded with the QOL of having a one-stop location to get their harvesting, vendoring, and banking done. Btw, there are already vendors in existing home instances in the racial home cities. The Homestead is similar to that of a manor, with servants, and other amenities. Having vendors and other NPC helpers there shouldn't be weird. A manor? are we seeing the same pictures it looks like a cottage with alittle land around it. Edit Sure Im not against you buying Thousand seas pavilion pass to get fishing hole in your homestead. Mistlock sanctuary for a fractal portal. Armistis bastion for wvw portal. Thats 3k gems to there are your gold investment already mate. Edited June 14 by Linken.6345 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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