Spear wasn't competently designed for Elementalist.

[TheAgedGnome.7520]

On 6/27/2024 at 7:22 PM, TIM.3064 said:

The new gimmick with the spear is that it's a slow ranged focused weapon where you can place an "etching" which is an element specific field you drop on your feet that has a similar radius to meteor shower, tied to skill 5

When you place this field down, you get an element specific buff, and casting up to three spells within this field will replace your 5 skill with a finisher that ends the aoe.

So in principle the gameplay loop is you stand withing a 10 meter circle, use three abilities and then use the unlocked skill 5 as a finisher attack that ends the etch.

In my view, this etching gimmick is not a rotation, it is bureaucracy masquerading as a rotation:

1. Enter your cubicle and do step 1 of task.
2. Fill out and submit 3 TPS reports before lunchtime while not leaving your cubicle, even for a bathroom break.
3. Hope you don't get laid off from Initech.

I appreciate the effort toward the class fantasy aspect for ele, but the implementation doesn't work. A suggestion:

• Etching provides a 6 (or 8?)-second duration buff
  • The buff amount starts high and decrements in strength every 2 seconds. Leaving the etching area removes the buff. E.g.:
    • Fire etching provides immediate increased strike damage, with the added amount (or percentage) decreasing every 2 sec.
    • Water etching provides immediate high regeneration for 2 sec, then decreasing regen every 2 sec.
    • Air etching provides immediate increased ferocity (and superspeed?), with the added amount (or percentage) decreasing every 2 sec.
    • Earth etching provides immediate increased damage reduction, with the added amount (or percentage) decreasing every 2 sec.

These particular buffs are just examples off the top of my head, there could be better ones.

The main point is that this changes etching in these positive ways:

• The etchings provide immediate benefit/feedback/dopamine.
• The decreasing benefits over time reduce the negative impact of being forced to leave the etching area due to enemies, mechanics, etc.
• There are tactical advantages to knowing when to cast the etching to both maximize benefit and reduce risk of incomplete etching use.
  • I.e., it is not "cast etching off of CD".  
• The arbitrary "use 3 skills" APM gimmick is eliminated.
  •  NOTE: There could still be a way to interact with skill use and etching area: if the base duration in the etching area buffs was, say 4 sec, but using spear skills while inside the etching area extended the duration up to 8(?) sec. As long as its not made so onerous that it is just an APM-fest, which ruins spear for less-skilled players.

 

 

 

 

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

That's a bit sad to read the purpose of the next weapon, coming after PoF, weaver and Weaponmaster, is to avoid the purpose of weaver ?
Obviously lots of weapons  don't shine with all specs; but design a new one and just "kitten off" weaver's mechanic and one important dps trait with useless filler skills ... well yeah, ... that's sad.

It's not even like the Spear and its gimmick were viable. *Nor Weaver already overperforming.

Edited July 10 by Zhaid Zhem.6508

[draxynnic.3719]

12 hours ago, Zhaid Zhem.6508 said:

That's a bit sad to read the purpose of the next weapon, coming after PoF, weaver and Weaponmaster, is to avoid the purpose of weaver ?
Obviously lots of weapons  don't shine with all specs; but design a new one and just "kitten off" weaver's mechanic and one important dps trait with useless filler skills ... well yeah, ... that's sad.

It's not even like the Spear and its gimmick were viable. *Nor Weaver already overperforming.

Especially since spear won't work well with other elite specs either due to the other elite specs having mechanics that push you into close range. 

[Markus.6415]

On 7/10/2024 at 3:49 PM, TheAgedGnome.7520 said:

In my view, this etching gimmick is not a rotation, it is bureaucracy masquerading as a rotation:

1. Enter your cubicle and do step 1 of task.
2. Fill out and submit 3 TPS reports before lunchtime while not leaving your cubicle, even for a bathroom break.
3. Hope you don't get laid off from Initech.

I appreciate the effort toward the class fantasy aspect for ele, but the implementation doesn't work. A suggestion:

• Etching provides a 6 (or 8?)-second duration buff
  • The buff amount starts high and decrements in strength every 2 seconds. Leaving the etching area removes the buff. E.g.:
    • Fire etching provides immediate increased strike damage, with the added amount (or percentage) decreasing every 2 sec.
    • Water etching provides immediate high regeneration for 2 sec, then decreasing regen every 2 sec.
    • Air etching provides immediate increased ferocity (and superspeed?), with the added amount (or percentage) decreasing every 2 sec.
    • Earth etching provides immediate increased damage reduction, with the added amount (or percentage) decreasing every 2 sec.

These particular buffs are just examples off the top of my head, there could be better ones.

The main point is that this changes etching in these positive ways:

• The etchings provide immediate benefit/feedback/dopamine.
• The decreasing benefits over time reduce the negative impact of being forced to leave the etching area due to enemies, mechanics, etc.
• There are tactical advantages to knowing when to cast the etching to both maximize benefit and reduce risk of incomplete etching use.
  • I.e., it is not "cast etching off of CD".  
• The arbitrary "use 3 skills" APM gimmick is eliminated.
  •  NOTE: There could still be a way to interact with skill use and etching area: if the base duration in the etching area buffs was, say 4 sec, but using spear skills while inside the etching area extended the duration up to 8(?) sec. As long as its not made so onerous that it is just an APM-fest, which ruins spear for less-skilled players.

 

 

 

 

This is like hammer orbs all over again. Slapping a boring passive buff on the same skillslot of every single attunement compared to the massive etching final attacks... is sad.

[Mini Crinny.6190]

On 7/9/2024 at 5:06 PM, Mascarun.7910 said:

Perhaps Anet just hates weaver because it forces them to design 6 more weaponskills whenever they add a new weapon to elementalist, on top of the 12 (one-handed mainhand) to 20 (two-handed) weaponskills they already have to create. Perhaps Anet should just rework weaver if they hate it so much, or add an F5, like catalyst has, which counts as a damaging dual attack and is the same regardless of the actual weapon. 

I wouldn't say hate, they just don't want to spend time making the dual attacks unique, time is money so they need to be efficient xP

Edited July 15 by Mini Crinny.6190

[mirage.8046]

Dual attacks have been a letdown since weaponmaster training. All the fun can still be had with the core weapons and main-hand sword at least. 

However, why should spear's dual attacks instantly recharge an attunement when Unravel already exists? Additionally, Unravel should've been Weaver's F5 from the start instead of a utility stance.

Tempest and Catalyst rely on so many auras for sustain, DPS, and have melee-centric mechanics, so spear won't be useful IMO. The combo fields on your etches don't mean anything unless you are leaping into your fire field or dark field; for sharing fire, dark, light, frost, and chaos auras, there's only one leap finisher to trigger powerful aura Where's the synergy? 

[draxynnic.3719]

9 hours ago, mirage.8046 said:

However, why should spear's dual attacks instantly recharge an attunement when Unravel already exists? Additionally, Unravel should've been Weaver's F5 from the start instead of a utility stance.

I think the logic is that spear is more dependent on the back end of the bar than other weaponsets, so they wanted to make sure that you could always switch to start a new etching quickly. Of course, they could have made a weaver spear that is designed to be less dependent on the 4 and 5 skills because the dual skills are also good on their own, but that would have required making graphics for five more spear attacks (the air/earth bubble looks to be graphically complex enough that I'm not going to point the proverbial finger on it).

[Twilightmage.8309]

On 7/21/2024 at 1:54 AM, draxynnic.3719 said:

I think the logic is that spear is more dependent on the back end of the bar than other weaponsets, so they wanted to make sure that you could always switch to start a new etching quickly. Of course, they could have made a weaver spear that is designed to be less dependent on the 4 and 5 skills because the dual skills are also good on their own, but that would have required making graphics for five more spear attacks (the air/earth bubble looks to be graphically complex enough that I'm not going to point the proverbial finger on it).

imagine making a class that is known for having a ton of abilities, giving it an elite spec that gives it even more abilities, then complaining its too much work to do that work for a new weapon. Oh wait it happened twice now with hammer and now spear.

You made the class this way a-net, we weren't the ones who told you to give ele 4x the buttons. If you don't want to do the effort every time something new comes out, rework the elite spec.

[Instant Fatality.7213]

Hey, the spear animations look insanely cool on Elementalist!  Only problem..  it seems the damage to staff far surpasses it for some reason...  Any way we can get some juice added to the new spear to make the damage match how cool the animations look?  Thank you! :D

[Zephyrus.9680]

Spear feels slow and clunky while staff is slow but fluid (don't know how to describe the difference). Also the etching gimmick is just boring and robotic. Cool animations don't make up for the boring repetitive mechanics of the weapon. On staff every attunement is unique. On spear it's all the same. IMO hammer, pistol and spear were all disappointments for ele. 

[Rocker.2906]

IMO many things in the weapon don't sinergize well even with itself. Skill 3 in fire and air guarantees a big hit on next skill, but I have to use 3 skills quickly to charge the etching so it denies any strategy I could have for how to use the buff. 

The Etching creates a combo field under my feet, but my combo finishers are supposed to be aimed at the enemy?  

The big finishers on skill5 are all aimed, meaning they could miss sometimes. Imagine how awful it feels to stand almost still and spammimg skills for charging, only for it to miss...

Honestly don't know how to make the weapon better. Maybe the etching could be just a passive buff when you change attunements, getting rid of the big circle, and skill5 would just fire the thing?