Death judgement 25k single hit damage

[Delweyn.1309]

It's so cheat. We get knocked down for 1 hour 37 minutes knock down. And after death judgement hits you at 999 999 damages instant cast at cost of 0.25 energy. And after that it's even more cheated, they get invisible for 4 months and 18 days. So pls nerf.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

My point is that while DJ has counter play it’s simply unhealthy for the game. The same for scourge. Being able to spam AoE’s that cover a point in a point based game mode is bad design. There’s a lot that needs balanced in the game and DJ is one of them. At least with backstab and heart seeker you have to be in melee range and set up the backstab.

Agreed with this. It's bad design, but not insurmountable. It's not broken but it will make you frustrated with how easy it is to down from it.

That being said, you went to fight a necro while marked? You're out of your mind.

@Regon Phoenix.8215 said:Literal description of the ability: Mark a single target to generate stacks of malice over time. Malice generates faster and increases your damage against the marked target as long as you have recently struck it. Lose all malice when the mark ends or this skill is recast on a new target.Look at bold here please.

Also look at tooltip on wiki.This skill now only deals its bonus damage to your marked target.The only way you could get crit for 25k on a DJ is if you were marked AND got hit by Binding Shadow, AND ran fullzerk or close to it/whatever your zerk derivative is for your damage type of choice.So you went to fight a necro on point, had a big honking marker over your head for 15 seconds, got KDed, possibly stunbroke, got feared and then got nailed for 25k instead of looking for DE so you could dodge the shot/reflect the shot/block the shot, WHILE knowing you were full dps and that getting hit from a big attack would instadown you.

As soon as you were marked you should have known that was a 2v1. You would lose a 2v1 to any class pairing unless they were both garbage, and you should have moved/retreated.

If I'm wrong, please correct me. DE is pretty annoying yes, but Ignoring a player obviously about to kill you then coming to forums to call for nerfs is poor form. That death's on you, not the DE.

[Regon Phoenix.8215]

@Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

@Imperadordf.2687 said:DJ red-laser and projectile effects appear before the initial shot, and reveals the Deadeye before the shot gets executed aswell. So you have BIG tells coming at you and if you are still not dodging, well, the problem isn’t DJ, it’s you.

BIG TELL , is the warrior's Killshots , 1 1/4 secDeath's Judgment with quickness (Be Quick or Be Killed - trait) its 0,35 secSpotter's Shot (immobilize -cant dodge) > Three Round Burst > DJ

OP , just avoid PvP for some time :: pRather than getting burned and running for other games , just join some WvWvW , hopefully they will alocate resources in the next x-pack for PvE+WvWvW , or whatever the majority of the population is :P

Played several times as deadeye:1) Double Tap -> 10 stacks of might2) Deadeye's Mark - > Stealth, rapidly regenerate initiative3) Double Tap -> 6 stacks of might4) Double Tap -> 6 stacks of might5) Binding Shadow -> 3 sec knockdown6) Kneel -> Stealth, rapidly regenerate initiative7) Haste -> 6 sec quickness8) Devourer Venom + Basilisk Venom9) Three Round Burst -> apply venom10) Death's Judgement

Overall (against heavy armor if no attack was reflected, blocked or dodged):25 stacks of might3 sec knockdown1 and 1/2 sec stun1 (2x) sec immobilizeMinimum 11 sec stealth3 Double Taps for total 10k damage (no criticals)1 Three Round Burst for total 5k damage (no criticals)1 Death's Judgement for total 11k damage (non critical, with 4 of malice)

Killed in 1v1 situation:Guardian (probably condition guardian, but he didn't even landed a hit while i run around in stealth)ScourgeRevenant (probably bruiser, because he was using staff all the time)

Got killed in 1v1:Power mesmer

It can't be more easy to kill any non-mesmer. I thought Deadeye is OP, but it is ridiculously easy to play as and dominate nearly anyone as.It seems i got to main Deadeye now until Arena nerf it. It is way easier and way stronger than my main.

[babazhook.6805]

@Regon Phoenix.8215 said:

@babazhook.6805 said:KILLshot

Damage level 1 damage: 949 (2.25)?Damage Level 2 damage: 1,160 (2.75)?Damage Level 3 damage: 1,371 (3.25)?PiercesCombo Finisher: Physical ProjectileRange: 1,500

Deaths Judgment

Damage: 696 (1.65)?Damage bonus per stack: 20%Revealed (3s): You cannot stealthCombo Finisher: Physical ProjectileRange: 1,500

Killshot hits much harder base. In order to get DJ into killshot range , full malice stacks needed and one must kneel to make the shot. Just as Malificient 7 can be used to maximize damage on a DJ , there are traits that increase kill shot damage. (burst mastery ,Berserkers power)

As example , at 7 malice stacks the DE thief gets 21 percent bonus damage to the DJ. Berserkers Power gives that same 21 percent bonus damage to a kill shot. The base damage of a Kill shot is MUCH higher then a DJ meaning the only thing that brings DJ ahead is the bonus off the kneel. Note that while a Kill shot warrior can switch off his target and maintain the SAME high level of damage, a DJ thief will lose damage if they switch targets. Note a Killshot warrior has a shot that pierces and has an esier time making the shot unblockable.

So the FACT is yes a Killshot warrior can make a single shot and take someone out with that single shot. One does not need 25k damage to single shot another. The OP is continously moving the Goalposts. The reason DJ will hit harder then a killshot is not because DJ does more damage then KS. it due to other factors and bonuses not directly linked to Killshot (such as executioner , lead attacks, signet use on assassins and so on) which play a role in all thief attacks by design.

Done testing myself. Both with identical amulets, sigils and traits for maximum damage output.Killshot against heavy golem - critical for 6000Killshot against light golem - critical for 7400Death judgement against heavy golem - critical for 12kDeath judgement against light golem - critical for 16k

Warrior don't have stealth, warrior don't have infinite mobility, warrior can't spam Killshot. So warrior in no way, shape or form can dish out this much damage with a single ability.

I went in with a warrior damage build using zerker amulet PvP lobby. I was not focused on might stacking and had no bloodlust built.

Kill shot hit light Golem with 0 MIGHT stacks no bloodlust for 12800 critKill shot hit medium golem with 4 might stacks 11407 critkill shot hit heavy golem 4 might stacks 10907 crit

The might stacks might have been a bit higher or lower when shot made but never exceeded 6 meaning I can muster a potential 570 pwer added. No vuln on targets just straight adrenaline build with shot made.

My thief I allowed to build to 12 might and did damage around your numbers (slightly higher). The thief took far longer to get to maximum malice then did my warrior to build adrenaline. The warrior was easier to test as well as he could build adrenaline on a medium and switch over to the heavy when full burst ready.

I do not think you designed your warrior to do anything close to maximum damage.

Now remember when discussing one shot kills. The WARRIOR using the same amulet has 19k health. The thief has just over 11k health.

[Imperadordf.2687]

@Regon Phoenix.8215 said:

@Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

@Imperadordf.2687 said:DJ red-laser and projectile effects appear before the initial shot, and reveals the Deadeye before the shot gets executed aswell. So you have BIG tells coming at you and if you are still not dodging, well, the problem isn’t DJ, it’s you.

BIG TELL , is the warrior's Killshots , 1 1/4 secDeath's Judgment with quickness (Be Quick or Be Killed - trait) its 0,35 secSpotter's Shot (immobilize -cant dodge) > Three Round Burst > DJ

OP , just avoid PvP for some time :: pRather than getting burned and running for other games , just join some WvWvW , hopefully they will alocate resources in the next x-pack for PvE+WvWvW , or whatever the majority of the population is :P

Played several times as deadeye:1) Double Tap -> 10 stacks of might2) Deadeye's Mark - > Stealth, rapidly regenerate initiative3) Double Tap -> 6 stacks of might4) Double Tap -> 6 stacks of might5) Binding Shadow -> 3 sec knockdown6) Kneel -> Stealth, rapidly regenerate initiative7) Haste -> 6 sec quickness8) Devourer Venom + Basilisk Venom9) Three Round Burst -> apply venom10) Death's Judgement

Overall (against heavy armor if no attack was reflected, blocked or dodged):25 stacks of might3 sec knockdown1 and 1/2 sec stun1 (2x) sec immobilizeMinimum 11 sec stealth3 Double Taps for total 10k damage (no criticals)1 Three Round Burst for total 5k damage (no criticals)1 Death's Judgement for total 11k damage (non critical, with 4 of malice)

Killed in 1v1 situation:Guardian (probably condition guardian, but he didn't even landed a hit while i run around in stealth)ScourgeRevenant (probably bruiser, because he was using staff all the time)

Got killed in 1v1:Power mesmer

It can't be more easy to kill any non-mesmer. I thought Deadeye is OP, but it is ridiculously easy to play as and dominate nearly anyone as.It seems i got to main Deadeye now until Arena nerf it. It is way easier and way stronger than my main.

Woah, you must have some kind of infinite-initiative hack.

[FyzE.3472]

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@"brannigan.9831" said:One shots should not be a part of any game. Stop defending it. Its bad gameplay and the vast majority of people hate it.Try it yourself? You will see that it is far from ONE. There is a whole ritual that needs to be performed beforehand. If you can not block/reflect/dodge/LOS it, may be you being in silver is the problem? Maybe?

So you are ok with GS Mesmer burst?

Did you read the title, my friend?

Aye. I was just curious since you were ok with DE one shots if you were ok with Mesmer “one shots”Oh, OK then. No, I am not OK with the mesmer burst just because a good mesmer can hide his burst pretty well. It's kinda hard to see coming as well in the middle of a fight. Sadly, when mesmer is about to burst you, there is no red loading circle on you screamind "you're about to get bursted!!!"

[FyzE.3472]

@Regon Phoenix.8215 said:

@Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

@Imperadordf.2687 said:DJ red-laser and projectile effects appear before the initial shot, and reveals the Deadeye before the shot gets executed aswell. So you have BIG tells coming at you and if you are still not dodging, well, the problem isn’t DJ, it’s you.

BIG TELL , is the warrior's Killshots , 1 1/4 secDeath's Judgment with quickness (Be Quick or Be Killed - trait) its 0,35 secSpotter's Shot (immobilize -cant dodge) > Three Round Burst > DJ

OP , just avoid PvP for some time :: pRather than getting burned and running for other games , just join some WvWvW , hopefully they will alocate resources in the next x-pack for PvE+WvWvW , or whatever the majority of the population is :P

Played several times as deadeye:1) Double Tap -> 10 stacks of might2) Deadeye's Mark - > Stealth, rapidly regenerate initiative3) Double Tap -> 6 stacks of might4) Double Tap -> 6 stacks of might5) Binding Shadow -> 3 sec knockdown6) Kneel -> Stealth, rapidly regenerate initiative7) Haste -> 6 sec quickness8) Devourer Venom + Basilisk Venom9) Three Round Burst -> apply venom10) Death's Judgement

Overall (against heavy armor if no attack was reflected, blocked or dodged):25 stacks of might3 sec knockdown1 and 1/2 sec stun1 (2x) sec immobilizeMinimum 11 sec stealth3 Double Taps for total 10k damage (no criticals)1 Three Round Burst for total 5k damage (no criticals)1 Death's Judgement for total 11k damage (non critical, with 4 of malice)

Killed in 1v1 situation:Guardian (probably condition guardian, but he didn't even landed a hit while i run around in stealth)ScourgeRevenant (probably bruiser, because he was using staff all the time)

Got killed in 1v1:Power mesmer

It can't be more easy to kill any non-mesmer. I thought Deadeye is OP, but it is ridiculously easy to play as and dominate nearly anyone as.It seems i got to main Deadeye now until Arena nerf it. It is way easier and way stronger than my main.

Wait until you get out of silver and people start using their reflects.

[FyzE.3472]

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@babazhook.6805 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@babazhook.6805 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@"brannigan.9831" said:One shots should not be a part of any game. Stop defending it. Its bad gameplay and the vast majority of people hate it.Try it yourself? You will see that it is far from ONE. There is a whole ritual that needs to be performed beforehand. If you can not block/reflect/dodge/LOS it, may be you being in silver is the problem? Maybe?

So you are ok with GS Mesmer burst?

Did you read the title, my friend?

Aye. I was just curious since you were ok with DE one shots if you were ok with Mesmer “one shots”

The difference is that the person at the end of a DJ has much more warning and much more time to react than is a person on the end of that mesmer spike. The DJ shot has a much longer setup time and has far more in the way of tells along with more ways to counter. I personally would have no issues with the mesmer burst if it could be blocked, reflected dodged, be made immune from, countered with LOS , countered by moving inside a group of people, blocked by blades of grass all with a sign over my head telling me that burst coming, along with a sound and a full second plus to react when it coming with a purple beam added.

A flying purple GS isn’t a tell? The same arguement you’re using for DJ being fine is the same for Mesmer being fine.The only part of Mesmer burst that can’t be blocked is the Gs bounce, shatters and jaunt are blockable.Stab counters MoDSo the argument that you should have a stun break and dodge saved literally is the same thing to counter GS burst. You can’t say one is fine but not the other.

You picked out ONE tell and ignored all of the others. I gave you a list of tells , not just the one. If DJ was JUST a purple beam you would have an argument. Note DJ against a person NOT marked is just a beam but the person not marked will not get hit for 25k. A mark is a little symbol over your head that allows you a lot of time to ready for that shot.

Same too with the ways to counter. Jaunt and the others you mentioned are not blocked by blades of grass, they can not be countered by moving into a group of friends, they can not be reflected. When a person gives a LIST of advantages as comparison, you do not pick one item out of the list and say "see they are all the same".

Seeing that blades of grass can in fact impair clones from reaching the target yeah I’d say the only difference is reflect as I’ve seen people in groups be hit by DJ’s multiple times.

But I honestly think you’re missing my point. How is DJ ok when it requires less skills to use vs GS Mesmer, fresh air ele, etc that can also “one shot” yet those need nerfed? Whether it’s OP or not(I’m not saying it is, just unhealthy) the ability to do that much damage with minimal skill input is not good for the game. They all need nerfed but so do passive defenses. I would have liked to see a lot more done in this regard with the upcoming patch but we won’t. You will still be able to spam confounding suggestions(to an extent) which is a big reason GS Mesmer burst is high. It holds the hand of bad-average players by literally doing the work for them rather than making the player work and set up the burst. DJ is no different. Mark target, kneel, build stacks, wait a bit more and boom players dead. Especially when combined with other traits and utilities.

My point is that while DJ has counter play it’s simply unhealthy for the game. The same for scourge. Being able to spam AoE’s that cover a point in a point based game mode is bad design. There’s a lot that needs balanced in the game and DJ is one of them. At least with backstab and heart seeker you have to be in melee range and set up the backstab.

If the builds you mentioned (FA Ele, GS Mesmer etc) will have the same tell as DJ, I'm OK with any oneshots. Seriously. Look at DH, now that people have learned how to counter them, there are not considered OP at all! Now imagine a world when people learn how to reflect/dodge/block/LOS? Unreal, right?

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@babazhook.6805 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@babazhook.6805 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@"brannigan.9831" said:One shots should not be a part of any game. Stop defending it. Its bad gameplay and the vast majority of people hate it.Try it yourself? You will see that it is far from ONE. There is a whole ritual that needs to be performed beforehand. If you can not block/reflect/dodge/LOS it, may be you being in silver is the problem? Maybe?

So you are ok with GS Mesmer burst?

Did you read the title, my friend?

Aye. I was just curious since you were ok with DE one shots if you were ok with Mesmer “one shots”

The difference is that the person at the end of a DJ has much more warning and much more time to react than is a person on the end of that mesmer spike. The DJ shot has a much longer setup time and has far more in the way of tells along with more ways to counter. I personally would have no issues with the mesmer burst if it could be blocked, reflected dodged, be made immune from, countered with LOS , countered by moving inside a group of people, blocked by blades of grass all with a sign over my head telling me that burst coming, along with a sound and a full second plus to react when it coming with a purple beam added.

A flying purple GS isn’t a tell? The same arguement you’re using for DJ being fine is the same for Mesmer being fine.The only part of Mesmer burst that can’t be blocked is the Gs bounce, shatters and jaunt are blockable.Stab counters MoDSo the argument that you should have a stun break and dodge saved literally is the same thing to counter GS burst. You can’t say one is fine but not the other.

You picked out ONE tell and ignored all of the others. I gave you a list of tells , not just the one. If DJ was JUST a purple beam you would have an argument. Note DJ against a person NOT marked is just a beam but the person not marked will not get hit for 25k. A mark is a little symbol over your head that allows you a lot of time to ready for that shot.

Same too with the ways to counter. Jaunt and the others you mentioned are not blocked by blades of grass, they can not be countered by moving into a group of friends, they can not be reflected. When a person gives a LIST of advantages as comparison, you do not pick one item out of the list and say "see they are all the same".

Seeing that blades of grass can in fact impair clones from reaching the target yeah I’d say the only difference is reflect as I’ve seen people in groups be hit by DJ’s multiple times.

But I honestly think you’re missing my point. How is DJ ok when it requires less skills to use vs GS Mesmer, fresh air ele, etc that can also “one shot” yet those need nerfed? Whether it’s OP or not(I’m not saying it is, just unhealthy) the ability to do that much damage with minimal skill input is not good for the game. They all need nerfed but so do passive defenses. I would have liked to see a lot more done in this regard with the upcoming patch but we won’t. You will still be able to spam confounding suggestions(to an extent) which is a big reason GS Mesmer burst is high. It holds the hand of bad-average players by literally doing the work for them rather than making the player work and set up the burst. DJ is no different. Mark target, kneel, build stacks, wait a bit more and boom players dead. Especially when combined with other traits and utilities.

My point is that while DJ has counter play it’s simply unhealthy for the game. The same for scourge. Being able to spam AoE’s that cover a point in a point based game mode is bad design. There’s a lot that needs balanced in the game and DJ is one of them. At least with backstab and heart seeker you have to be in melee range and set up the backstab.

If the builds you mentioned (FA Ele, GS Mesmer etc) will have the same tell as DJ, I'm OK with any oneshots. Seriously. Look at DH, now that people have learned how to counter them, there are not considered OP at all! Now imagine a world when people learn how to reflect/dodge/block/LOS? Unreal, right?

What do you think happened to Dragonhunters ? :

a) Nerf to the selfhealing

• Traps no longer does daze (some trait)
• Spear of Justice (F1 pull) increased the cast time from 0.25 sec to 0,75

or

b) PPL started using reflects ?

Any ranged character when faced reflects , he can see his projectile go to the target and have even more time to react when his projectiles comes back

[FyzE.3472]

@Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@babazhook.6805 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@babazhook.6805 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@"brannigan.9831" said:One shots should not be a part of any game. Stop defending it. Its bad gameplay and the vast majority of people hate it.Try it yourself? You will see that it is far from ONE. There is a whole ritual that needs to be performed beforehand. If you can not block/reflect/dodge/LOS it, may be you being in silver is the problem? Maybe?

So you are ok with GS Mesmer burst?

Did you read the title, my friend?

Aye. I was just curious since you were ok with DE one shots if you were ok with Mesmer “one shots”

The difference is that the person at the end of a DJ has much more warning and much more time to react than is a person on the end of that mesmer spike. The DJ shot has a much longer setup time and has far more in the way of tells along with more ways to counter. I personally would have no issues with the mesmer burst if it could be blocked, reflected dodged, be made immune from, countered with LOS , countered by moving inside a group of people, blocked by blades of grass all with a sign over my head telling me that burst coming, along with a sound and a full second plus to react when it coming with a purple beam added.

A flying purple GS isn’t a tell? The same arguement you’re using for DJ being fine is the same for Mesmer being fine.The only part of Mesmer burst that can’t be blocked is the Gs bounce, shatters and jaunt are blockable.Stab counters MoDSo the argument that you should have a stun break and dodge saved literally is the same thing to counter GS burst. You can’t say one is fine but not the other.

You picked out ONE tell and ignored all of the others. I gave you a list of tells , not just the one. If DJ was JUST a purple beam you would have an argument. Note DJ against a person NOT marked is just a beam but the person not marked will not get hit for 25k. A mark is a little symbol over your head that allows you a lot of time to ready for that shot.

Same too with the ways to counter. Jaunt and the others you mentioned are not blocked by blades of grass, they can not be countered by moving into a group of friends, they can not be reflected. When a person gives a LIST of advantages as comparison, you do not pick one item out of the list and say "see they are all the same".

Seeing that blades of grass can in fact impair clones from reaching the target yeah I’d say the only difference is reflect as I’ve seen people in groups be hit by DJ’s multiple times.

But I honestly think you’re missing my point. How is DJ ok when it requires less skills to use vs GS Mesmer, fresh air ele, etc that can also “one shot” yet those need nerfed? Whether it’s OP or not(I’m not saying it is, just unhealthy) the ability to do that much damage with minimal skill input is not good for the game. They all need nerfed but so do passive defenses. I would have liked to see a lot more done in this regard with the upcoming patch but we won’t. You will still be able to spam confounding suggestions(to an extent) which is a big reason GS Mesmer burst is high. It holds the hand of bad-average players by literally doing the work for them rather than making the player work and set up the burst. DJ is no different. Mark target, kneel, build stacks, wait a bit more and boom players dead. Especially when combined with other traits and utilities.

My point is that while DJ has counter play it’s simply unhealthy for the game. The same for scourge. Being able to spam AoE’s that cover a point in a point based game mode is bad design. There’s a lot that needs balanced in the game and DJ is one of them. At least with backstab and heart seeker you have to be in melee range and set up the backstab.

If the builds you mentioned (FA Ele, GS Mesmer etc) will have the same tell as DJ, I'm OK with any oneshots. Seriously. Look at DH, now that people have learned how to counter them, there are not considered OP at all! Now imagine a world when people learn how to reflect/dodge/block/LOS? Unreal, right?

What do you think happened to Dragonhunters ? :

a) Nerf to the selfhealing

• Traps no longer does daze (some trait)
• Spear of Justice (F1 pull) increased the cast time from 0.25 sec to 0,75

or

b) PPL started using reflects ?

Any ranged character when faced reflects , he can see his projectile go to the target and have even more time to react when his projectiles comes back

Wow! A person with a brain! I totally agree with you.About your question: I actually think it's both? I mean, there were a TON of nerfs BUT also people finally know what to do vs DHs.

[Jace al Thor.6745]

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@babazhook.6805 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@babazhook.6805 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@"brannigan.9831" said:One shots should not be a part of any game. Stop defending it. Its bad gameplay and the vast majority of people hate it.Try it yourself? You will see that it is far from ONE. There is a whole ritual that needs to be performed beforehand. If you can not block/reflect/dodge/LOS it, may be you being in silver is the problem? Maybe?

So you are ok with GS Mesmer burst?

Did you read the title, my friend?

Aye. I was just curious since you were ok with DE one shots if you were ok with Mesmer “one shots”

The difference is that the person at the end of a DJ has much more warning and much more time to react than is a person on the end of that mesmer spike. The DJ shot has a much longer setup time and has far more in the way of tells along with more ways to counter. I personally would have no issues with the mesmer burst if it could be blocked, reflected dodged, be made immune from, countered with LOS , countered by moving inside a group of people, blocked by blades of grass all with a sign over my head telling me that burst coming, along with a sound and a full second plus to react when it coming with a purple beam added.

A flying purple GS isn’t a tell? The same arguement you’re using for DJ being fine is the same for Mesmer being fine.The only part of Mesmer burst that can’t be blocked is the Gs bounce, shatters and jaunt are blockable.Stab counters MoDSo the argument that you should have a stun break and dodge saved literally is the same thing to counter GS burst. You can’t say one is fine but not the other.

You picked out ONE tell and ignored all of the others. I gave you a list of tells , not just the one. If DJ was JUST a purple beam you would have an argument. Note DJ against a person NOT marked is just a beam but the person not marked will not get hit for 25k. A mark is a little symbol over your head that allows you a lot of time to ready for that shot.

Same too with the ways to counter. Jaunt and the others you mentioned are not blocked by blades of grass, they can not be countered by moving into a group of friends, they can not be reflected. When a person gives a LIST of advantages as comparison, you do not pick one item out of the list and say "see they are all the same".

Seeing that blades of grass can in fact impair clones from reaching the target yeah I’d say the only difference is reflect as I’ve seen people in groups be hit by DJ’s multiple times.

But I honestly think you’re missing my point. How is DJ ok when it requires less skills to use vs GS Mesmer, fresh air ele, etc that can also “one shot” yet those need nerfed? Whether it’s OP or not(I’m not saying it is, just unhealthy) the ability to do that much damage with minimal skill input is not good for the game. They all need nerfed but so do passive defenses. I would have liked to see a lot more done in this regard with the upcoming patch but we won’t. You will still be able to spam confounding suggestions(to an extent) which is a big reason GS Mesmer burst is high. It holds the hand of bad-average players by literally doing the work for them rather than making the player work and set up the burst. DJ is no different. Mark target, kneel, build stacks, wait a bit more and boom players dead. Especially when combined with other traits and utilities.

My point is that while DJ has counter play it’s simply unhealthy for the game. The same for scourge. Being able to spam AoE’s that cover a point in a point based game mode is bad design. There’s a lot that needs balanced in the game and DJ is one of them. At least with backstab and heart seeker you have to be in melee range and set up the backstab.

If the builds you mentioned (FA Ele, GS Mesmer etc) will have the same tell as DJ, I'm OK with any oneshots. Seriously. Look at DH, now that people have learned how to counter them, there are not considered OP at all! Now imagine a world when people learn how to reflect/dodge/block/LOS? Unreal, right?

And you’re over looking something. The builds I listed do have tells but fresh air is 900 range while Gs mes and d/p thief are both melee. Deadeye is 1500 range and stealthed until dj is triggered. The d/p has zero tells but runs the inherent risk of being melee while squishy. GS Mesmer has plenty of tells but the synergy between confounding suggestions, mental anguish and MoD is what gives people problems. The icd increase may help but won’t fix the problem. CS needs reworked into something different imo. Fresh air is the only build comparable to DE of the ones I listed but it’s getting nerfed fairly hard in the upcoming patch.All these builds can be dodged, LoS’ed, blocked, etc with the exception of GS2 as it’s unblockable. This difference is, and this is what you’re not understanding, is that they do not do the kind of damage DE can do at 1500 range while being stealthed. There’s no inherent risk to do that damage because you’re currently off point and the only way to reach you quickly is to use teleports IF you have them. A scourge will not be able to reac a DE before they can reset. There needs to be a risk involved and currently there isn’t any so either the damage needs reduced or the stealth removed to introduce risk to using it.

[FyzE.3472]

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@babazhook.6805 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@babazhook.6805 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@"brannigan.9831" said:One shots should not be a part of any game. Stop defending it. Its bad gameplay and the vast majority of people hate it.Try it yourself? You will see that it is far from ONE. There is a whole ritual that needs to be performed beforehand. If you can not block/reflect/dodge/LOS it, may be you being in silver is the problem? Maybe?

So you are ok with GS Mesmer burst?

Did you read the title, my friend?

Aye. I was just curious since you were ok with DE one shots if you were ok with Mesmer “one shots”

The difference is that the person at the end of a DJ has much more warning and much more time to react than is a person on the end of that mesmer spike. The DJ shot has a much longer setup time and has far more in the way of tells along with more ways to counter. I personally would have no issues with the mesmer burst if it could be blocked, reflected dodged, be made immune from, countered with LOS , countered by moving inside a group of people, blocked by blades of grass all with a sign over my head telling me that burst coming, along with a sound and a full second plus to react when it coming with a purple beam added.

A flying purple GS isn’t a tell? The same arguement you’re using for DJ being fine is the same for Mesmer being fine.The only part of Mesmer burst that can’t be blocked is the Gs bounce, shatters and jaunt are blockable.Stab counters MoDSo the argument that you should have a stun break and dodge saved literally is the same thing to counter GS burst. You can’t say one is fine but not the other.

You picked out ONE tell and ignored all of the others. I gave you a list of tells , not just the one. If DJ was JUST a purple beam you would have an argument. Note DJ against a person NOT marked is just a beam but the person not marked will not get hit for 25k. A mark is a little symbol over your head that allows you a lot of time to ready for that shot.

Same too with the ways to counter. Jaunt and the others you mentioned are not blocked by blades of grass, they can not be countered by moving into a group of friends, they can not be reflected. When a person gives a LIST of advantages as comparison, you do not pick one item out of the list and say "see they are all the same".

Seeing that blades of grass can in fact impair clones from reaching the target yeah I’d say the only difference is reflect as I’ve seen people in groups be hit by DJ’s multiple times.

But I honestly think you’re missing my point. How is DJ ok when it requires less skills to use vs GS Mesmer, fresh air ele, etc that can also “one shot” yet those need nerfed? Whether it’s OP or not(I’m not saying it is, just unhealthy) the ability to do that much damage with minimal skill input is not good for the game. They all need nerfed but so do passive defenses. I would have liked to see a lot more done in this regard with the upcoming patch but we won’t. You will still be able to spam confounding suggestions(to an extent) which is a big reason GS Mesmer burst is high. It holds the hand of bad-average players by literally doing the work for them rather than making the player work and set up the burst. DJ is no different. Mark target, kneel, build stacks, wait a bit more and boom players dead. Especially when combined with other traits and utilities.

My point is that while DJ has counter play it’s simply unhealthy for the game. The same for scourge. Being able to spam AoE’s that cover a point in a point based game mode is bad design. There’s a lot that needs balanced in the game and DJ is one of them. At least with backstab and heart seeker you have to be in melee range and set up the backstab.

If the builds you mentioned (FA Ele, GS Mesmer etc) will have the same tell as DJ, I'm OK with any oneshots. Seriously. Look at DH, now that people have learned how to counter them, there are not considered OP at all! Now imagine a world when people learn how to reflect/dodge/block/LOS? Unreal, right?

And you’re over looking something. The builds I listed do have tells but fresh air is 900 range while Gs mes and d/p thief are both melee. Deadeye is 1500 range and stealthed until dj is triggered. The d/p has zero tells but runs the inherent risk of being melee while squishy. GS Mesmer has plenty of tells but the synergy between confounding suggestions, mental anguish and MoD is what gives people problems. The icd increase may help but won’t fix the problem. CS needs reworked into something different imo. Fresh air is the only build comparable to DE of the ones I listed but it’s getting nerfed fairly hard in the upcoming patch.All these builds can be dodged, LoS’ed, blocked, etc with the exception of GS2 as it’s unblockable. This difference is, and this is what you’re not understanding, is that they do not do the kind of damage DE can do at 1500 range while being stealthed. There’s no inherent risk to do that damage because you’re currently off point and the only way to reach you quickly is to use teleports IF you have them. A scourge will not be able to reac a DE before they can reset. There needs to be a risk involved and currently there isn’t any so either the damage needs reduced or the stealth removed to introduce risk to using it.

I would agree with you completely (seriously, good points) if I saw at least the same ammount os DE running around as scourges. Them being a few actually is saying that maybe the build is not all that OP as people think it is. If not, try it in plat. Just to be clear, I'm not playing DE. I've tried it a few times, got camped by a dp DD all the time, decided not to play it. It's just isn't worth it. And now when I play, I have no trouble killing a DE in my games. Oh and just an example, but if you play a warrior and successfully bullcharge -> 100b with quickness sigil it's a dead enemy. If he, again, does not have a stunbreak. This takes ALOT less time, preparatin and has a lot more chance to actually work than a DE "oneshotting" you. Just my 2 cents.

[Jace al Thor.6745]

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@babazhook.6805 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@babazhook.6805 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@"brannigan.9831" said:One shots should not be a part of any game. Stop defending it. Its bad gameplay and the vast majority of people hate it.Try it yourself? You will see that it is far from ONE. There is a whole ritual that needs to be performed beforehand. If you can not block/reflect/dodge/LOS it, may be you being in silver is the problem? Maybe?

So you are ok with GS Mesmer burst?

Did you read the title, my friend?

Aye. I was just curious since you were ok with DE one shots if you were ok with Mesmer “one shots”

The difference is that the person at the end of a DJ has much more warning and much more time to react than is a person on the end of that mesmer spike. The DJ shot has a much longer setup time and has far more in the way of tells along with more ways to counter. I personally would have no issues with the mesmer burst if it could be blocked, reflected dodged, be made immune from, countered with LOS , countered by moving inside a group of people, blocked by blades of grass all with a sign over my head telling me that burst coming, along with a sound and a full second plus to react when it coming with a purple beam added.

A flying purple GS isn’t a tell? The same arguement you’re using for DJ being fine is the same for Mesmer being fine.The only part of Mesmer burst that can’t be blocked is the Gs bounce, shatters and jaunt are blockable.Stab counters MoDSo the argument that you should have a stun break and dodge saved literally is the same thing to counter GS burst. You can’t say one is fine but not the other.

You picked out ONE tell and ignored all of the others. I gave you a list of tells , not just the one. If DJ was JUST a purple beam you would have an argument. Note DJ against a person NOT marked is just a beam but the person not marked will not get hit for 25k. A mark is a little symbol over your head that allows you a lot of time to ready for that shot.

Same too with the ways to counter. Jaunt and the others you mentioned are not blocked by blades of grass, they can not be countered by moving into a group of friends, they can not be reflected. When a person gives a LIST of advantages as comparison, you do not pick one item out of the list and say "see they are all the same".

Seeing that blades of grass can in fact impair clones from reaching the target yeah I’d say the only difference is reflect as I’ve seen people in groups be hit by DJ’s multiple times.

But I honestly think you’re missing my point. How is DJ ok when it requires less skills to use vs GS Mesmer, fresh air ele, etc that can also “one shot” yet those need nerfed? Whether it’s OP or not(I’m not saying it is, just unhealthy) the ability to do that much damage with minimal skill input is not good for the game. They all need nerfed but so do passive defenses. I would have liked to see a lot more done in this regard with the upcoming patch but we won’t. You will still be able to spam confounding suggestions(to an extent) which is a big reason GS Mesmer burst is high. It holds the hand of bad-average players by literally doing the work for them rather than making the player work and set up the burst. DJ is no different. Mark target, kneel, build stacks, wait a bit more and boom players dead. Especially when combined with other traits and utilities.

My point is that while DJ has counter play it’s simply unhealthy for the game. The same for scourge. Being able to spam AoE’s that cover a point in a point based game mode is bad design. There’s a lot that needs balanced in the game and DJ is one of them. At least with backstab and heart seeker you have to be in melee range and set up the backstab.

If the builds you mentioned (FA Ele, GS Mesmer etc) will have the same tell as DJ, I'm OK with any oneshots. Seriously. Look at DH, now that people have learned how to counter them, there are not considered OP at all! Now imagine a world when people learn how to reflect/dodge/block/LOS? Unreal, right?

And you’re over looking something. The builds I listed do have tells but fresh air is 900 range while Gs mes and d/p thief are both melee. Deadeye is 1500 range and stealthed until dj is triggered. The d/p has zero tells but runs the inherent risk of being melee while squishy. GS Mesmer has plenty of tells but the synergy between confounding suggestions, mental anguish and MoD is what gives people problems. The icd increase may help but won’t fix the problem. CS needs reworked into something different imo. Fresh air is the only build comparable to DE of the ones I listed but it’s getting nerfed fairly hard in the upcoming patch.All these builds can be dodged, LoS’ed, blocked, etc with the exception of GS2 as it’s unblockable. This difference is, and this is what you’re not understanding, is that they do not do the kind of damage DE can do at 1500 range while being stealthed. There’s no inherent risk to do that damage because you’re currently off point and the only way to reach you quickly is to use teleports IF you have them. A scourge will not be able to reac a DE before they can reset. There needs to be a risk involved and currently there isn’t any so either the damage needs reduced or the stealth removed to introduce risk to using it.

I would agree with you completely (seriously, good points) if I saw at least the same ammount os DE running around as scourges. Them being a few actually is saying that maybe the build is not all that OP as people think it is. If not, try it in plat. Just to be clear, I'm not playing DE. I've tried it a few times, got camped by a dp DD all the time, decided not to play it. It's just isn't worth it. And now when I play, I have no trouble killing a DE in my games. Oh and just an example, but if you play a warrior and successfully bullcharge -> 100b with quickness sigil it's a dead enemy. If he, again, does not have a stunbreak. This takes ALOT less time, preparatin and has a lot more chance to actually work than a DE "oneshotting" you. Just my 2 cents.

And I understand what you’re saying. But then you look at the skill floor for scourge and it’s so brain dead I don’t think there’s another class outside Druid that’s so... infuriatingly simple to play but contributes as much as they can to a match.I personally don’t have an issue going up against them. Actually it’s the opposite as when I see one it generally dies shortly after. But I know a lot of people do struggle against it. I made it to plat using zerker Gs shatter(no CS or mental anguish as I disagree with how easy it makes setting up burst) so I’ve seen how ineffective DE is there. But on the same token plat players generally also know how to avoid GS bursts. So I’m not saying DE is OP, but that it’s needs a couple small nerfs but that’s no different than any class. Without drastic changes to the spec or the introduction of new game modes I don’t DE being meta over d/p and Sw/d.It’s like Scourge. It’s not strong as most make it out to be by itself. But when paired with a support class it’s ability to cover a point in a conquest game mode is a big issue. There’s no reason any class should be able to dominate a point with AoE’s and when you have more than one it’s extremely annoying to play against.

[FyzE.3472]

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@babazhook.6805 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@babazhook.6805 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@"brannigan.9831" said:One shots should not be a part of any game. Stop defending it. Its bad gameplay and the vast majority of people hate it.Try it yourself? You will see that it is far from ONE. There is a whole ritual that needs to be performed beforehand. If you can not block/reflect/dodge/LOS it, may be you being in silver is the problem? Maybe?

So you are ok with GS Mesmer burst?

Did you read the title, my friend?

Aye. I was just curious since you were ok with DE one shots if you were ok with Mesmer “one shots”

The difference is that the person at the end of a DJ has much more warning and much more time to react than is a person on the end of that mesmer spike. The DJ shot has a much longer setup time and has far more in the way of tells along with more ways to counter. I personally would have no issues with the mesmer burst if it could be blocked, reflected dodged, be made immune from, countered with LOS , countered by moving inside a group of people, blocked by blades of grass all with a sign over my head telling me that burst coming, along with a sound and a full second plus to react when it coming with a purple beam added.

A flying purple GS isn’t a tell? The same arguement you’re using for DJ being fine is the same for Mesmer being fine.The only part of Mesmer burst that can’t be blocked is the Gs bounce, shatters and jaunt are blockable.Stab counters MoDSo the argument that you should have a stun break and dodge saved literally is the same thing to counter GS burst. You can’t say one is fine but not the other.

You picked out ONE tell and ignored all of the others. I gave you a list of tells , not just the one. If DJ was JUST a purple beam you would have an argument. Note DJ against a person NOT marked is just a beam but the person not marked will not get hit for 25k. A mark is a little symbol over your head that allows you a lot of time to ready for that shot.

Same too with the ways to counter. Jaunt and the others you mentioned are not blocked by blades of grass, they can not be countered by moving into a group of friends, they can not be reflected. When a person gives a LIST of advantages as comparison, you do not pick one item out of the list and say "see they are all the same".

Seeing that blades of grass can in fact impair clones from reaching the target yeah I’d say the only difference is reflect as I’ve seen people in groups be hit by DJ’s multiple times.

But I honestly think you’re missing my point. How is DJ ok when it requires less skills to use vs GS Mesmer, fresh air ele, etc that can also “one shot” yet those need nerfed? Whether it’s OP or not(I’m not saying it is, just unhealthy) the ability to do that much damage with minimal skill input is not good for the game. They all need nerfed but so do passive defenses. I would have liked to see a lot more done in this regard with the upcoming patch but we won’t. You will still be able to spam confounding suggestions(to an extent) which is a big reason GS Mesmer burst is high. It holds the hand of bad-average players by literally doing the work for them rather than making the player work and set up the burst. DJ is no different. Mark target, kneel, build stacks, wait a bit more and boom players dead. Especially when combined with other traits and utilities.

My point is that while DJ has counter play it’s simply unhealthy for the game. The same for scourge. Being able to spam AoE’s that cover a point in a point based game mode is bad design. There’s a lot that needs balanced in the game and DJ is one of them. At least with backstab and heart seeker you have to be in melee range and set up the backstab.

If the builds you mentioned (FA Ele, GS Mesmer etc) will have the same tell as DJ, I'm OK with any oneshots. Seriously. Look at DH, now that people have learned how to counter them, there are not considered OP at all! Now imagine a world when people learn how to reflect/dodge/block/LOS? Unreal, right?

And you’re over looking something. The builds I listed do have tells but fresh air is 900 range while Gs mes and d/p thief are both melee. Deadeye is 1500 range and stealthed until dj is triggered. The d/p has zero tells but runs the inherent risk of being melee while squishy. GS Mesmer has plenty of tells but the synergy between confounding suggestions, mental anguish and MoD is what gives people problems. The icd increase may help but won’t fix the problem. CS needs reworked into something different imo. Fresh air is the only build comparable to DE of the ones I listed but it’s getting nerfed fairly hard in the upcoming patch.All these builds can be dodged, LoS’ed, blocked, etc with the exception of GS2 as it’s unblockable. This difference is, and this is what you’re not understanding, is that they do not do the kind of damage DE can do at 1500 range while being stealthed. There’s no inherent risk to do that damage because you’re currently off point and the only way to reach you quickly is to use teleports IF you have them. A scourge will not be able to reac a DE before they can reset. There needs to be a risk involved and currently there isn’t any so either the damage needs reduced or the stealth removed to introduce risk to using it.

I would agree with you completely (seriously, good points) if I saw at least the same ammount os DE running around as scourges. Them being a few actually is saying that maybe the build is not all that OP as people think it is. If not, try it in plat. Just to be clear, I'm not playing DE. I've tried it a few times, got camped by a dp DD all the time, decided not to play it. It's just isn't worth it. And now when I play, I have no trouble killing a DE in my games. Oh and just an example, but if you play a warrior and successfully bullcharge -> 100b with quickness sigil it's a dead enemy. If he, again, does not have a stunbreak. This takes ALOT less time, preparatin and has a lot more chance to actually work than a DE "oneshotting" you. Just my 2 cents.

And I understand what you’re saying. But then you look at the skill floor for scourge and it’s so brain dead I don’t think there’s another class outside Druid that’s so... infuriatingly simple to play but contributes as much as they can to a match.I personally don’t have an issue going up against them. Actually it’s the opposite as when I see one it generally dies shortly after. But I know a lot of people do struggle against it. I made it to plat using zerker Gs shatter(no CS or mental anguish as I disagree with how easy it makes setting up burst) so I’ve seen how ineffective DE is there. But on the same token plat players generally also know how to avoid GS bursts. So I’m not saying DE is OP, but that it’s needs a couple small nerfs but that’s no different than any class. Without drastic changes to the spec or the introduction of new game modes I don’t DE being meta over d/p and Sw/d.It’s like Scourge. It’s not strong as most make it out to be by itself. But when paired with a support class it’s ability to cover a point in a conquest game mode is a big issue. There’s no reason any class should be able to dominate a point with AoE’s and when you have more than one it’s extremely annoying to play against.

100% agreed.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

@Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

What do you think happened to Dragonhunters ? :

a) Nerf to the selfhealing

• Traps no longer does daze (some trait)
• Spear of Justice (F1 pull) increased the cast time from 0.25 sec to 0,75

or

b) PPL started using reflects ?

Any ranged character when faced reflects , he can see his projectile go to the target and have even more time to react when his projectiles comes back

This is funny because you can't reflect or block spear of justice anyway, which was what actually got you into the traps. At one point I think you couldn't even evade it.So... Apples to Apples pls?

@Regon Phoenix.8215 said:

It can't be more easy to kill any non-mesmer. I thought Deadeye is OP, but it is ridiculously easy to play as and dominate nearly anyone as.It seems i got to main Deadeye now until Arena nerf it. It is way easier and way stronger than my main.

Go for it! Just be sure you are willing to stick to it to prove how OP it is, even when people start counting to 15 and reflecting your shots, or you encounter a thief that can evade DJ and port to you immediately.

What's your main, btw? I'm curious.

[babazhook.6805]

@Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

@Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

What do you think happened to Dragonhunters ? :

a) Nerf to the selfhealing

• Traps no longer does daze (some trait)
• Spear of Justice (F1 pull) increased the cast time from 0.25 sec to 0,75

or

b) PPL started using reflects ?

Any ranged character when faced reflects , he can see his projectile go to the target and have even more time to react when his projectiles comes back

This is funny because you can't reflect or block spear of justice.

And it also reveals the target for 6 seconds when it strikes .

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

@Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

@Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

What do you think happened to Dragonhunters ? :

a) Nerf to the selfhealing

• Traps no longer does daze (some trait)
• Spear of Justice (F1 pull) increased the cast time from 0.25 sec to 0,75

or

b) PPL started using reflects ?

Any ranged character when faced reflects , he can see his projectile go to the target and have even more time to react when his projectiles comes back

This is funny because you can't reflect or block spear of justice anyway, which was what actually got you into the traps. At one point I think you couldn't even evade it.So... Apples to Apples pls?

The human reaction of humans is 0,23 sec or somethingIf you cant react to that you are a slowpoke (thief general answer to everything - since 2013)But when DJ with quickness does the same , ppl start using different glasses :P

@Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

@Regon Phoenix.8215 said:

It can't be more easy to kill any non-mesmer. I thought Deadeye is OP, but it is ridiculously easy to play as and dominate nearly anyone as.It seems i got to main Deadeye now until Arena nerf it. It is way easier and way stronger than my main.

Go for it! Just be sure you are willing to stick to it to prove how OP it is, even when people start counting to 15 and reflecting your shots, or you encounter a thief that can evade DJ and port to you immediately.

What's your main, btw? I'm curious.

True , in order to catch a thief , you must be a thief .....or w8 for the company to give their mobility , like they did with Mirage :PThe company choose the powercreep or the community ?: P

When i can get Daredevils huge-dodge-backwards -distance with my core enginner ?I hate Warriors in my face :(

[DeceiverX.8361]

The only major issues with DE being stupid is the cheese that can be pulled to hide the laser as shown in the thief section of the boards recently, and how it kind of breaks SA.

The spec is absolutely stupidly-designed and this is the result of the concept of a stealth-sniper and why it's bad for the game.

Overpowered? Not really. Anti-fun to play against? Absolutely.

[Imperadordf.2687]

@DeceiverX.8361 said:Overpowered? Not really. Anti-fun to play against? Absolutely.

YESSOMUCHYES

[BlackBeard.2873]

Seriously, just play a game that actually has good pvp mechanics!! This game is garbage!

I mean, 1-shot sniping in a game with tab-targeting....lol. You don't even have to aim or anything else! Power creep and an unreasonably slow balance cycle have killed this game's pvp.

[Delweyn.1309]

I think forum will be more serious when the rank will be displayed near the players names.

[sephiroth.4217]

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@Jace al Thor.6745 said:

@FyzE.3472 said:

@"brannigan.9831" said:One shots should not be a part of any game. Stop defending it. Its bad gameplay and the vast majority of people hate it.Try it yourself? You will see that it is far from ONE. There is a whole ritual that needs to be performed beforehand. If you can not block/reflect/dodge/LOS it, may be you being in silver is the problem? Maybe?

So you are ok with GS Mesmer burst?

Did you read the title, my friend?

Aye. I was just curious since you were ok with DE one shots if you were ok with Mesmer “one shots”

Mesmer isn't one shot.... It's a combination of skills used in succession to land at the same time, a combo if you will.

Do I have a problem with classes being able to pull off combo's due to co-ordination, skills and timing? No, absolutely not.

The best part is, no matter what change you make to these "1 shot" skills, there will be another combo ready to take it's place that will again produce a "1 shot" effect that will again, use 4-5 skills in succession.

[brannigan.9831]

As people have pointed out this has nothing to do with whether the build in question is overall op or not. Its about allowing bad game mechanics. One shot type mechanics are bad. They are not fun and most players do not enjoy them. I have no problem dealing with dead eyes in general but I'll still get sandbagged by them occassionally in larger fights and no its not fun to explode in a second or two. Overall weakness of a class does not justify unfun game mechanics.

[Legatus.3608]

@brannigan.9831 said:As people have pointed out this has nothing to do with whether the build in question is overall op or not. Its about allowing bad game mechanics. One shot type mechanics are bad. They are not fun and most players do not enjoy them. I have no problem dealing with dead eyes in general but I'll still get sandbagged by them occassionally in larger fights and no its not fun to explode in a second or two. Overall weakness of a class does not justify unfun game mechanics.

So you know DJ isn't OP since it's by far the easiest attack in the game to prepare for and avoid, but you want it nerfed anyways? Why? Since when is making people actually DO SOMETHING to survive a bad mechanic for the game? Literally just DO anything... dodge, block, LOS, cc, interrupt, immunity, even stealth might work if you can see the guy waiting for you. You COULD even try throwing a reveal at the area you think the guy might be hiding since it's typically the same spots every game. Or how about reflect? How about simply standing behind minions/clones/pets? The game couldn't POSSIBLY warn you any more than it does for DJ, if you're being hit for 25k it means you've been marked for A REALLY LONG TIME.

Despite that, I still might agree to a nerf to DJ if it comes paired with buffs to something else, but you don't see anybody asking for that do you? No, because nobody wants to fight a viable spec, everyone wants to nerf a spec that isn't even good because it requires them to press buttons on their keyboard to beat a terrible build. We shouldn't have to press one of our 16 (minimum) buttons to survive even against trash tier builds, we should just have every build in the game be so bad you just stand there afk and survive anyways.

SMH.

[Kageseigi.2150]

Regon Phoenix

Wow, this guy again? Please ignore. He's been complaining about the Thief for years on the old forums.

I'm afraid a Thief touched him in a bad way when he was just a newbie.Hashtag: MeToo