Which class is underperforming? 5 vs 5

[Quadox.7834]

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Tayga.3192 said:

@"bluri.2653" said:Mirage > thief

Portal > thief

More like Portal > Shortbow 5

thief has portal but sind doesn't want to use it

Because its only one-way, and only one person can use it. Even with the longer duration, its

so much worse

than the Mesmer portal, it aint even funny.

1 month ago most people would have said mes portal was bad. Thief portal is good, you heard it here first.

Not really? Noone wouldve said Mesmer Portal is bad, only that Mesmer might not want to use it. Or perhaps that its not good outside of coordinated play (that much is true). But bad? Hardly. Anyway, its so limited in PvP that its really no good. I get why they limited it, but it kinda makes the skill pointless. But then again, its quite nice in WvW, sooo. But yeah, in PvP it doesnt really do enough, shuffling over one person once, with no chance of return, is just too narrow of a proposition, and usually the thief will use it themselves, and given how fast thief moves accross the map? Rather pointless.

When I said bad I meant "not worth taking" and now it is suddenly the bee's knees.

And the fact that thieves mostly (almost only) use it for themselves is exactly the problem.

[RedAvenged.5217]

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@RedAvenged.5217 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@RedAvenged.5217 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Tayga.3192 said:

@bluri.2653 said:Mirage > thief

Portal > thief

More like Portal > Shortbow 5

thief has portal but sind doesn't want to use it

Because its only one-way, and only one person can use it. Even with the longer duration, its

so much worse

than the Mesmer portal, it aint even funny.

Shadow portal rework allowed multiple ppl to use it, but it struggled for viability at first because it’s just not the most consistent thing in the world to have allies use a 1 way portal. Rn it’s pretty meh, I’d say it’s the best option iff your Da dp DrD which still is less consistent than Sa dp DrD because your game play is kind of one sided, where you just portal to decap and rotate back to team fights. Where as Sa dp has all the benefits and isn’t forced to 1 sided game play ie. Sa dp is just more consistent and doesn’t need portal whereas Da dp would and be less consistent

Only in WvW. In sPvP only one person can use it. If it let 5 people use it, different story.

Correction in wvw it allows 5 allied targets where as pvp it allows 1 meaning either you and 1 ally can use it or just 1 ally, I’m not 100% on which but I’m pretty sure it’s you and 1 ally can use it. But again not very consistent great for a single play rotation but the primary value has been in most cases decaps not team play

Nope. Its just 1 person. If you take it, everyone else is locked out. If they take it, youre locked out. If it was you and an ally, maybe itd be alright.

Buff shadow portal plz

[UNOwen.7132]

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Tayga.3192 said:

@"bluri.2653" said:Mirage > thief

Portal > thief

More like Portal > Shortbow 5

thief has portal but sind doesn't want to use it

Because its only one-way, and only one person can use it. Even with the longer duration, its

so much worse

than the Mesmer portal, it aint even funny.

1 month ago most people would have said mes portal was bad. Thief portal is good, you heard it here first.

Not really? Noone wouldve said Mesmer Portal is bad, only that Mesmer might not want to use it. Or perhaps that its not good outside of coordinated play (that much is true). But bad? Hardly. Anyway, its so limited in PvP that its really no good. I get why they limited it, but it kinda makes the skill pointless. But then again, its quite nice in WvW, sooo. But yeah, in PvP it doesnt really do enough, shuffling over one person once, with no chance of return, is just too narrow of a proposition, and usually the thief will use it themselves, and given how fast thief moves accross the map? Rather pointless.

When I said bad I meant "not worth taking" and now it is suddenly the bee's knees.

And the fact that thieves mostly (almost only) use it for themselves is exactly the problem.

I mean, "not worth taking" also comes with conditionals. Thieves portal is basically not worth taking unconditionally. And why would the thief portaling himself be a problem? They can get accross the map extremely quickly anyway, and theyre extremely useless on their own, so that narrows down the potential use cases further. Its the main reason you dont use it.

[Quadox.7834]

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Tayga.3192 said:

@"bluri.2653" said:Mirage > thief

Portal > thief

More like Portal > Shortbow 5

thief has portal but sind doesn't want to use it

Because its only one-way, and only one person can use it. Even with the longer duration, its

so much worse

than the Mesmer portal, it aint even funny.

1 month ago most people would have said mes portal was bad. Thief portal is good, you heard it here first.

Not really? Noone wouldve said Mesmer Portal is bad, only that Mesmer might not want to use it. Or perhaps that its not good outside of coordinated play (that much is true). But bad? Hardly. Anyway, its so limited in PvP that its really no good. I get why they limited it, but it kinda makes the skill pointless. But then again, its quite nice in WvW, sooo. But yeah, in PvP it doesnt really do enough, shuffling over one person once, with no chance of return, is just too narrow of a proposition, and usually the thief will use it themselves, and given how fast thief moves accross the map? Rather pointless.

When I said bad I meant "not worth taking" and now it is suddenly the bee's knees.

And the fact that thieves mostly (almost only) use it for themselves is exactly the problem.

I mean, "not worth taking" also comes with conditionals. Thieves portal is basically not worth taking unconditionally. And why would the thief portaling himself be a problem? They can get accross the map extremely quickly anyway, and theyre extremely useless on their own, so that narrows down the potential use cases further. Its the main reason you dont use it.

It is a "problem" because it doesn't get as much value from the skill for the reasons you explained yourself (thief has high mobility).

[UNOwen.7132]

@RedAvenged.5217 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@RedAvenged.5217 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@RedAvenged.5217 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Tayga.3192 said:

@bluri.2653 said:Mirage > thief

Portal > thief

More like Portal > Shortbow 5

thief has portal but sind doesn't want to use it

Because its only one-way, and only one person can use it. Even with the longer duration, its

so much worse

than the Mesmer portal, it aint even funny.

Shadow portal rework allowed multiple ppl to use it, but it struggled for viability at first because it’s just not the most consistent thing in the world to have allies use a 1 way portal. Rn it’s pretty meh, I’d say it’s the best option iff your Da dp DrD which still is less consistent than Sa dp DrD because your game play is kind of one sided, where you just portal to decap and rotate back to team fights. Where as Sa dp has all the benefits and isn’t forced to 1 sided game play ie. Sa dp is just more consistent and doesn’t need portal whereas Da dp would and be less consistent

Only in WvW. In sPvP only one person can use it. If it let 5 people use it, different story.

Correction in wvw it allows 5 allied targets where as pvp it allows 1 meaning either you and 1 ally can use it or just 1 ally, I’m not 100% on which but I’m pretty sure it’s you and 1 ally can use it. But again not very consistent great for a single play rotation but the primary value has been in most cases decaps not team play

Nope. Its just 1 person. If you take it, everyone else is locked out. If they take it, youre locked out. If it was you and an ally, maybe itd be alright.

Buff shadow portal plz

I would be hesitant with that. Giving thief a full mesmer portal would actually be dangerous, and it would lock them even further into a decap and +1 bot than they already are.

[UNOwen.7132]

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Tayga.3192 said:

@"bluri.2653" said:Mirage > thief

Portal > thief

More like Portal > Shortbow 5

thief has portal but sind doesn't want to use it

Because its only one-way, and only one person can use it. Even with the longer duration, its

so much worse

than the Mesmer portal, it aint even funny.

1 month ago most people would have said mes portal was bad. Thief portal is good, you heard it here first.

Not really? Noone wouldve said Mesmer Portal is bad, only that Mesmer might not want to use it. Or perhaps that its not good outside of coordinated play (that much is true). But bad? Hardly. Anyway, its so limited in PvP that its really no good. I get why they limited it, but it kinda makes the skill pointless. But then again, its quite nice in WvW, sooo. But yeah, in PvP it doesnt really do enough, shuffling over one person once, with no chance of return, is just too narrow of a proposition, and usually the thief will use it themselves, and given how fast thief moves accross the map? Rather pointless.

When I said bad I meant "not worth taking" and now it is suddenly the bee's knees.

And the fact that thieves mostly (almost only) use it for themselves is exactly the problem.

I mean, "not worth taking" also comes with conditionals. Thieves portal is basically not worth taking unconditionally. And why would the thief portaling himself be a problem? They can get accross the map extremely quickly anyway, and theyre extremely useless on their own, so that narrows down the potential use cases further. Its the main reason you dont use it.

It is a "problem" because it doesn't get as much value from the skill for the reasons you explained yourself (thief has high mobility).

Oh, thats what you meant. Yeah, basically. And shuffling a guy from your team around is too narrow usually. Iunno how Id fix it in PvP without making it broken or making thief even further locked into +1ing. Making it thief + 1 ally could work, but maybe thats just not worth doing.

[Quadox.7834]

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Tayga.3192 said:

@"bluri.2653" said:Mirage > thief

Portal > thief

More like Portal > Shortbow 5

thief has portal but sind doesn't want to use it

Because its only one-way, and only one person can use it. Even with the longer duration, its

so much worse

than the Mesmer portal, it aint even funny.

1 month ago most people would have said mes portal was bad. Thief portal is good, you heard it here first.

Not really? Noone wouldve said Mesmer Portal is bad, only that Mesmer might not want to use it. Or perhaps that its not good outside of coordinated play (that much is true). But bad? Hardly. Anyway, its so limited in PvP that its really no good. I get why they limited it, but it kinda makes the skill pointless. But then again, its quite nice in WvW, sooo. But yeah, in PvP it doesnt really do enough, shuffling over one person once, with no chance of return, is just too narrow of a proposition, and usually the thief will use it themselves, and given how fast thief moves accross the map? Rather pointless.

When I said bad I meant "not worth taking" and now it is suddenly the bee's knees.

And the fact that thieves mostly (almost only) use it for themselves is exactly the problem.

I mean, "not worth taking" also comes with conditionals. Thieves portal is basically not worth taking unconditionally. And why would the thief portaling himself be a problem? They can get accross the map extremely quickly anyway, and theyre extremely useless on their own, so that narrows down the potential use cases further. Its the main reason you dont use it.

It is a "problem" because it doesn't get as much value from the skill for the reasons you explained yourself (thief has high mobility).

Oh, thats what you meant. Yeah, basically. And shuffling a guy from your team around is too narrow usually. Iunno how Id fix it in PvP without making it broken or making thief even further locked into +1ing. Making it thief + 1 ally could work, but maybe thats just not worth doing.

The way to fix it is to educate thieves in how to use it properly.

[UNOwen.7132]

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Tayga.3192 said:

@"bluri.2653" said:Mirage > thief

Portal > thief

More like Portal > Shortbow 5

thief has portal but sind doesn't want to use it

Because its only one-way, and only one person can use it. Even with the longer duration, its

so much worse

than the Mesmer portal, it aint even funny.

1 month ago most people would have said mes portal was bad. Thief portal is good, you heard it here first.

Not really? Noone wouldve said Mesmer Portal is bad, only that Mesmer might not want to use it. Or perhaps that its not good outside of coordinated play (that much is true). But bad? Hardly. Anyway, its so limited in PvP that its really no good. I get why they limited it, but it kinda makes the skill pointless. But then again, its quite nice in WvW, sooo. But yeah, in PvP it doesnt really do enough, shuffling over one person once, with no chance of return, is just too narrow of a proposition, and usually the thief will use it themselves, and given how fast thief moves accross the map? Rather pointless.

When I said bad I meant "not worth taking" and now it is suddenly the bee's knees.

And the fact that thieves mostly (almost only) use it for themselves is exactly the problem.

I mean, "not worth taking" also comes with conditionals. Thieves portal is basically not worth taking unconditionally. And why would the thief portaling himself be a problem? They can get accross the map extremely quickly anyway, and theyre extremely useless on their own, so that narrows down the potential use cases further. Its the main reason you dont use it.

It is a "problem" because it doesn't get as much value from the skill for the reasons you explained yourself (thief has high mobility).

Oh, thats what you meant. Yeah, basically. And shuffling a guy from your team around is too narrow usually. Iunno how Id fix it in PvP without making it broken or making thief even further locked into +1ing. Making it thief + 1 ally could work, but maybe thats just not worth doing.

The way to fix it is to educate thieves in how to use it properly.

Even the ones that know how to use it, dont. Because its not good even when you try to play to its strengths. As I said, its simply too narrow in its use cases. Even if you want to shuffle a teammate around, its often not good to do so, and setting up when it is good is too specific and easily stopped.

[Quadox.7834]

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Tayga.3192 said:

@"bluri.2653" said:Mirage > thief

Portal > thief

More like Portal > Shortbow 5

thief has portal but sind doesn't want to use it

Because its only one-way, and only one person can use it. Even with the longer duration, its

so much worse

than the Mesmer portal, it aint even funny.

1 month ago most people would have said mes portal was bad. Thief portal is good, you heard it here first.

Not really? Noone wouldve said Mesmer Portal is bad, only that Mesmer might not want to use it. Or perhaps that its not good outside of coordinated play (that much is true). But bad? Hardly. Anyway, its so limited in PvP that its really no good. I get why they limited it, but it kinda makes the skill pointless. But then again, its quite nice in WvW, sooo. But yeah, in PvP it doesnt really do enough, shuffling over one person once, with no chance of return, is just too narrow of a proposition, and usually the thief will use it themselves, and given how fast thief moves accross the map? Rather pointless.

When I said bad I meant "not worth taking" and now it is suddenly the bee's knees.

And the fact that thieves mostly (almost only) use it for themselves is exactly the problem.

I mean, "not worth taking" also comes with conditionals. Thieves portal is basically not worth taking unconditionally. And why would the thief portaling himself be a problem? They can get accross the map extremely quickly anyway, and theyre extremely useless on their own, so that narrows down the potential use cases further. Its the main reason you dont use it.

It is a "problem" because it doesn't get as much value from the skill for the reasons you explained yourself (thief has high mobility).

Oh, thats what you meant. Yeah, basically. And shuffling a guy from your team around is too narrow usually. Iunno how Id fix it in PvP without making it broken or making thief even further locked into +1ing. Making it thief + 1 ally could work, but maybe thats just not worth doing.

The way to fix it is to educate thieves in how to use it properly.

Even the ones that know how to use it, dont. Because its not good even when you try to play to its strengths. As I said, its simply too narrow in its use cases. Even if you want to shuffle a teammate around, its often not good to do so, and setting up when it is good is too specific and easily stopped.

Not rly true, sind doesn't use it but others do.

[UNOwen.7132]

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Tayga.3192 said:

@"bluri.2653" said:Mirage > thief

Portal > thief

More like Portal > Shortbow 5

thief has portal but sind doesn't want to use it

Because its only one-way, and only one person can use it. Even with the longer duration, its

so much worse

than the Mesmer portal, it aint even funny.

1 month ago most people would have said mes portal was bad. Thief portal is good, you heard it here first.

Not really? Noone wouldve said Mesmer Portal is bad, only that Mesmer might not want to use it. Or perhaps that its not good outside of coordinated play (that much is true). But bad? Hardly. Anyway, its so limited in PvP that its really no good. I get why they limited it, but it kinda makes the skill pointless. But then again, its quite nice in WvW, sooo. But yeah, in PvP it doesnt really do enough, shuffling over one person once, with no chance of return, is just too narrow of a proposition, and usually the thief will use it themselves, and given how fast thief moves accross the map? Rather pointless.

When I said bad I meant "not worth taking" and now it is suddenly the bee's knees.

And the fact that thieves mostly (almost only) use it for themselves is exactly the problem.

I mean, "not worth taking" also comes with conditionals. Thieves portal is basically not worth taking unconditionally. And why would the thief portaling himself be a problem? They can get accross the map extremely quickly anyway, and theyre extremely useless on their own, so that narrows down the potential use cases further. Its the main reason you dont use it.

It is a "problem" because it doesn't get as much value from the skill for the reasons you explained yourself (thief has high mobility).

Oh, thats what you meant. Yeah, basically. And shuffling a guy from your team around is too narrow usually. Iunno how Id fix it in PvP without making it broken or making thief even further locked into +1ing. Making it thief + 1 ally could work, but maybe thats just not worth doing.

The way to fix it is to educate thieves in how to use it properly.

Even the ones that know how to use it, dont. Because its not good even when you try to play to its strengths. As I said, its simply too narrow in its use cases. Even if you want to shuffle a teammate around, its often not good to do so, and setting up when it is good is too specific and easily stopped.

Not rly true, sind doesn't use it but others do.

Ive only seen it used when trying to match the Portal of a Mesmer. Which yeah, that works I guess.

[Revolution.5409]

The most useless class in coordinated 5vs5 is Ranger.You can +1 but you don't have thief mobility, Mesmer's utilities or Rev's teleports.You can fight on side points but Necro, Prot holo and some build variations of Rev are stronger.You have a class mechanic that makes it impossible for you to fight more than one player at a time.Druid will not be comparable to FB even in 100 years.