Herald traits (changes/pve only) for Condition Builds - Suggestion

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

4 hours ago, lodjur.1284 said:

Nope. 

 

You legit argued there's no such thing as a playstyle that shouldn't exist. Strawman is a bit different. 

 

Nope

 

Playstyles can be adjusted and toned down. Completely axing skills and traits the way you suggest guts and removes playstyles which is what I’m very clearly against. My point of view should be quite clear at this point; I never said playstyles can’t be adjusted or toned down.   The only straw men here are your outrageous ones. And what you said IS a strawman since you said “Transfer is on the same level as a playstyle that lags people out...”That’s an extremely out there point of view.  You tried to set up ridiculous scenarios that misrepresent my point of view to try to make it look worse which is the very definition of a strawman. 

Edited May 22, 2021 by LucianTheAngelic.7054

[lodjur.1284]

4 hours ago, LucianTheAngelic.7054 said:

Nope

 

Playstyles can be adjusted and toned down. Completely axing skills and traits the way you suggest guts and removes playstyles which is what I’m very clearly against. My point of view should be quite clear at this point; I never said playstyles can’t be adjusted or toned down.   The only straw men here are your outrageous ones. And what you said IS a strawman since you said “Transfer is on the same level as a playstyle that lags people out...”That’s an extremely out there point of view.  You tried to set up ridiculous scenarios that misrepresent my point of view to try to make it look worse which is the very definition of a strawman. 

You misrepresented your own views then. 

 

You're right transfers might be an even jamkier playstyle than lagging people out. 

 

Bring back no cd Kodan combat tonic, that was my playstyle spamming that 20 times/sec was the only way I could truly enjoy WvW

 

Certain playstyles lock others out, diversity needs nuking oppressive things. Transfer Herald definitely fit all the nuking criteria, not as much anymore but it still enables gimmicky janky stuff.

[Katary.7096]

Spellbreaker is not all that useful for condition builds, the same goes for Dragonhunter. Meanwhile Reaper is a weak choice for support builds and Druid is bad for damage focused builds in general. It is perfectly fine for Herald to not offer anything meaningful to condition damage builds.

[Virdo.1540]

2 hours ago, Katary.7096 said:

Spellbreaker is not all that useful for condition builds, the same goes for Dragonhunter. Meanwhile Reaper is a weak choice for support builds and Druid is bad for damage focused builds in general. It is perfectly fine for Herald to not offer anything meaningful to condition damage builds.

But does herald offer anything good? 

Power damage? Bottom line

Healing/Support? Worse than Druid,Tempest,HFB,...

Condi damage? Bottom line (if at all)

CC is ok, but a lot of classes have access to that.

 

Herald is always forced to go into some kind of "hybrid-style".  A power herald  cant not give boons etc. So there should be more combinations for the "hybrid-only class"

[lodjur.1284]

58 minutes ago, Virdo.1540 said:

But does herald offer anything good? 

Power damage? Bottom line

Healing/Support? Worse than Druid,Tempest,HFB,...

Condi damage? Bottom line (if at all)

CC is ok, but a lot of classes have access to that.

 

Herald is always forced to go into some kind of "hybrid-style".  A power herald  cant not give boons etc. So there should be more combinations for the "hybrid-only class"

So tell me then, why do you like herald? It's extremely bland

[Virdo.1540]

2 hours ago, lodjur.1284 said:

So tell me then, why do you like herald? It's extremely bland

I like the Energy-LowCooldown playstyle. And i liked the thing that a single spec can perform many different roles (I came from another MMO, where you were bound to a single character. I liked this kinda more than having tons of different characters). Right now ,it performs bad in almost every role.

 

But yes, its kinda bland due to small build-variety and poor weapon choice

[lodjur.1284]

1 minute ago, Virdo.1540 said:

I like the Energy-LowCooldown playstyle. And i liked the thing that a single spec can perform many different roles (I came from another MMO, where you were bound to a single character. I liked this kinda more than having tons of different characters). Right now ,it performs bad in almost every role.

That's not herald. Herald is more cooldown focused than any other revenant spec

 

That's just revenant.

 

What's stopping you from swapping between core/herald/renegade depending on the situation?

1 minute ago, Virdo.1540 said:

But yes, its kinda bland due to small build-variety and poor weapon choice

Then why are you artificially limiting yourself to just Herald?

[Virdo.1540]

35 minutes ago, lodjur.1284 said:

That's not herald. Herald is more cooldown focused than any other revenant spec

Only for the facet actives, but they have a pretty low cooldown aswell (in pve at least)

& i do sometimes switch between core and herald. 

 

Very seldomly i also switch to Alacrigade (imagine how hard it is to find a raid&fractal cm slot as herald or core rev).

But i kinda absolutely hate the renegade espec.  Placing pets, having AOEs only, expensive skills... its just not fun for me.

 

[lodjur.1284]

35 minutes ago, Virdo.1540 said:

Only for the facet actives, but they have a pretty low cooldown aswell (in pve at least)

& i do sometimes switch between core and herald. 

 

Very seldomly i also switch to Alacrigade (imagine how hard it is to find a raid&fractal cm slot as herald or core rev).

But i kinda absolutely hate the renegade espec.  Placing pets, having AOEs only, expensive skills... its just not fun for me.

 

Mallyx+Shiro is a very good DPS build in PvE for condi renegade and I would assume it's the highest dps combination for both core and herald.

[SeTect.5918]

9 minutes ago, lodjur.1284 said:

Mallyx+Shiro is a very good DPS build in PvE for condi renegade and I would assume it's the highest dps combination for both core and herald.

With Shiro active as Herald u have literally no boons if u use mallyx+shiro. Renegade still has a trait that gives protection when using renegade skill. DragonxMallyx offers more ccs, conditions and sustain then ShiroxMallyx.

U asked why to limit to just Herald. I for example dont like the summonings of Renegade when u r using kallaxmallyx and i kinda force myself to use kalla as condi because of the bleed, ccs and life siphon.

Herald is a nice melee based spec that also does burn as a skill on dragon.
why a Herald shouldnt be allowed to use more condition dmg since its a dragon?

Also Renegade is more asked as boon support then Herald because of the alac that Herald cant give. Also the boons that Herald gives can other classes give with a other boons included and more healing.
The only thing herald is good at is a mix of Power dps and sustain which is not what Herald was designed for.

Also why shouldnt Herald get a bit more condition damage in pve to open an option as condi dps with some small boons in fractals? This is absolutely not a big thing.
Giving Herald like 10% more condi dmg in pve only hurts who?

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

14 hours ago, lodjur.1284 said:

You misrepresented your own views then

No, you made assumptions and inserted words into my mouth I never said

 

14 hours ago, lodjur.1284 said:

You're right transfers might be an even jamkier playstyle than lagging people out.

Yikes is all I'm going to say to that.  This is why I have a hard time taking this opinion seriously

Edited May 22, 2021 by LucianTheAngelic.7054

[Za Shaloc.3908]

@lodjur.1284 I think at this point you are being overly hyperbolic with your stance. Seems like you have a personal problem with Herald as a whole. I'm like you in that I prefer the core legends (have spent like 75% of my time on core Rev since Ancient Echo), but Mallyx F2 on Herald wasn't/isn't jankier than "lagging people out.." Like, what?

 

It was strongest in group settings in WvW, where your "holding" of conditions could easily be unintentionally cleansed by allies, or on the other side, immediately cleansed by enemies since there is such an overabundance of cleanses in the game. Don't get me wrong, the skill was very broken in the right scenario, but gamebreaking like you seem to be implying? Nah. TN Demon should have been changed a long time ago to 360 radius, blockable, evadable, and should have also been given a more distinct animation. . They changed Shiro (minus the unblockability) way back when, but at that point condi Herald wasn't meta in PvP so of course it wasn't adjusted.

[Katary.7096]

20 hours ago, Virdo.1540 said:

But does herald offer anything good? 

Power damage? Bottom line

Healing/Support? Worse than Druid,Tempest,HFB,...

Condi damage? Bottom line (if at all)

CC is ok, but a lot of classes have access to that.

 

Herald is always forced to go into some kind of "hybrid-style".  A power herald  cant not give boons etc. So there should be more combinations for the "hybrid-only class"

That is a valid but different topic. Herald gives you tools for power damage and support focused builds, it is a lot more reasonable to suggest buffing those aspects than demanding that Herald should receive one or two traits that make a bad condition damage build slightly less bad.

Though the developers clearly do not see it that way, since Renegade is now strictly better than Herald for power, conditions and support, so you might get what you want.

[lodjur.1284]

On 5/23/2021 at 12:10 AM, SeTect.5918 said:

With Shiro active as Herald u have literally no boons if u use mallyx+shiro. Renegade still has a trait that gives protection when using renegade skill. DragonxMallyx offers more ccs, conditions and sustain then ShiroxMallyx.

Yet it's worse in PvE.

 

I mean jalis probably offers more dps than glint too in PvE, but that's just a guess and has better breakbar damage as condi.

Quote

U asked why to limit to just Herald. I for example dont like the summonings of Renegade when u r using kallaxmallyx and i kinda force myself to use kalla as condi because of the bleed, ccs and life siphon.

Shiro+Mallyx is perfectly viable on Renegade. Better in some encounters even iirc.

Quote

 

Herald is a nice melee based spec that also does burn as a skill on dragon.
why a Herald shouldnt be allowed to use more condition dmg since its a dragon?

Also Renegade is more asked as boon support then Herald because of the alac that Herald cant give. Also the boons that Herald gives can other classes give with a other boons included and more healing.

What do you like about Herald that some other version of Rev doesn't have?

 

Cause the boons it offer are mediocre ones for PvE. Due to them being provided better by other classes. Even solo Renegade self buffs better.

Quote

The only thing herald is good at is a mix of Power dps and sustain which is not what Herald was designed for.

 

Do tell.

 

What is Herald designed for?

Quote

 

Also why shouldnt Herald get a bit more condition damage in pve to open an option as condi dps with some small boons in fractals? This is absolutely not a big thing.
Giving Herald like 10% more condi dmg in pve only hurts who?

Why shouldn't spellbreaker get more condi damage? Why shouldn't weaver get increased healing to allies? 

 

Because a specs identity is what it's good and brings to the table. 

 

Herald has consistently had no identity, the only consistent thing about is just how little it's brought to condi builds outside of 2 busted skills in competitive, one of which is a heal and the other a transfer.

 

On 5/23/2021 at 12:29 AM, LucianTheAngelic.7054 said:

No, you made assumptions and inserted words into my mouth I never said

I quoted you.

Quote

Yikes is all I'm going to say to that.  This is why I have a hard time taking this opinion seriously

How isn't transfer Herald janky?

 

22 hours ago, Za Shaloc.3908 said:

@lodjur.1284 I think at this point you are being overly hyperbolic with your stance. Seems like you have a personal problem with Herald as a whole. I'm like you in that I prefer the core legends (have spent like 75% of my time on core Rev since Ancient Echo), but Mallyx F2 on Herald wasn't/isn't jankier than "lagging people out.." Like, what?

Imo it is. 

 

It fits all the criteria for "jank"

 

Gimmicky - basically do nothing, then hit 1 key and 5 people around you explode (but with a bit of rng)

 

One trick pony - if you weren't against any condi builds it didn't do a whole lot

 

Awkward - You didn't have a lot of control over what condis you send so it would essentially devolve into just pain abso spam, using TN demon on cooldoen til you hit the 25+ damaging conditions in one go.

 

Buggy beyond belief - TN Demon js still unevadeable. It also isn't even a real transfer. After testing it you'll notice you don't even need a target within 600 range of you to clear condis (and gain might) and that the condis transferred aren't necessarily the same ones you remove from yourself

 

Poor experience to fight against - There was no real back and forth against Herald, you essentially took no damage then got enough stacks of whatever conditions you inflict to almost 1 shot you while it spammed CC then if you managed to survive the burst, back to 0 pressure. It didn't fight by wearing you down or punishing anything, just purely by attempting a cheesy burst and hiding behind multiple invulns til it got "lucky" (I mean it's not luck if you try 10 times but I am sure you get what I mean). Staff+Resistance+Infuse Light made actually punishing these players almost impossible.

 

This isn't even an issue with it being overpowered this is just a poor design issue, it being overpowered just made it common. 

 

I personally would have preferred a build that lowers the fps of all enemies by 50% or w/e and I would have hated that lol.

Quote

It was strongest in group settings in WvW, where your "holding" of conditions could easily be unintentionally cleansed by allies, or on the other side, immediately cleansed by enemies since there is such an overabundance of cleanses in the game. Don't get me wrong, the skill was very broken in the right scenario, but gamebreaking like you seem to be implying? Nah. TN Demon should have been changed a long time ago to 360 radius, blockable, evadable, and should have also been given a more distinct animation. . They changed Shiro (minus the unblockability) way back when, but at that point condi Herald wasn't meta in PvP so of course it wasn't adjusted.

I mean the meta for smallscale even numbered fights was essentially run a condi Herald based comp or a comp specifically to counter it, if you cared about 3v3-5v5, those were your options, nothing else was viable. The patch did alleviate it quite a bit tho. But imo that's gamebreaking.

[SeTect.5918]

11 hours ago, lodjur.1284 said:

Yet it's worse in PvE.

 

I mean jalis probably offers more dps than glint too in PvE, but that's just a guess and has better breakbar damage as condi.

Shiro+Mallyx is perfectly viable on Renegade. Better in some encounters even iirc.

What do you like about Herald that some other version of Rev doesn't have?

 

Cause the boons it offer are mediocre ones for PvE. Due to them being provided better by other classes. Even solo Renegade self buffs better.

Do tell.

 

What is Herald designed for?

Why shouldn't spellbreaker get more condi damage? Why shouldn't weaver get increased healing to allies? 

 

Because a specs identity is what it's good and brings to the table. 

 

Herald has consistently had no identity, the only consistent thing about is just how little it's brought to condi builds outside of 2 busted skills in competitive, one of which is a heal and the other a transfer.

 

I quoted you.

How isn't transfer Herald janky?

 

Imo it is. 

 

It fits all the criteria for "jank"

 

Gimmicky - basically do nothing, then hit 1 key and 5 people around you explode (but with a bit of rng)

 

One trick pony - if you weren't against any condi builds it didn't do a whole lot

 

Awkward - You didn't have a lot of control over what condis you send so it would essentially devolve into just pain abso spam, using TN demon on cooldoen til you hit the 25+ damaging conditions in one go.

 

Buggy beyond belief - TN Demon js still unevadeable. It also isn't even a real transfer. After testing it you'll notice you don't even need a target within 600 range of you to clear condis (and gain might) and that the condis transferred aren't necessarily the same ones you remove from yourself

 

Poor experience to fight against - There was no real back and forth against Herald, you essentially took no damage then got enough stacks of whatever conditions you inflict to almost 1 shot you while it spammed CC then if you managed to survive the burst, back to 0 pressure. It didn't fight by wearing you down or punishing anything, just purely by attempting a cheesy burst and hiding behind multiple invulns til it got "lucky" (I mean it's not luck if you try 10 times but I am sure you get what I mean). Staff+Resistance+Infuse Light made actually punishing these players almost impossible.

 

This isn't even an issue with it being overpowered this is just a poor design issue, it being overpowered just made it common. 

 

I personally would have preferred a build that lowers the fps of all enemies by 50% or w/e and I would have hated that lol.

I mean the meta for smallscale even numbered fights was essentially run a condi Herald based comp or a comp specifically to counter it, if you cared about 3v3-5v5, those were your options, nothing else was viable. The patch did alleviate it quite a bit tho. But imo that's gamebreaking.

Spellbreaker has no condi skill on its spec and weaver no healing, except the weapon skills.

Herald has...2 traits that increase the healing or even heal allies. But Herald as healer is totally trash.

Also Herald has a skill that does 3 stacks of burning and 1 skill that give coolness while there is a skill that gives torment whenever u inflict coolness.

Spellbreaker should not have more condi and weaver not more healing because they have 0 traits or skills to increase that, but Herald has.

 

And you argue about WvW while we say that herald should get a buff in PvE.

 

You asked me what herald was designed for if not for sustain+Power damage.

Its easy to answer because renegade has better sustain, range weapon and more damage. Also herald was meant as boon support and healer. But the boons and healing outputs r sad.

 

You asked why i even play herald then. Herald has a lot of condi transfers and thats just the style i like to play, also in pve. I like it that whenever an enemy inflicts a condi on me, it can increase my dmg.

Also i have found a great combo of cc and condis with the herald elite skill and mace+axe weapons. I just like it. 

If i would like to have allmighty whatever i would just swap to Guardian, but thats not my playstyle. 

Every elite spec has a different flavour and thats why people play them, but that doesnt mean that they neednt a buff.

 

And if you want true nature demon to be evadable, then condi herald has just 1 skill that transfers conditions and u even have just a radius of like 300. Not no mention condi Herald has no condi range weapon Option.

While i fk classes like necro, warriors or sth, i have not even a close chance against thieves or (good) rangers that use range weapons, they just have to keep distance and also my tormenting rune cant heal me bc i cant hit someone. So i have no heal and i cant do dmg. 

 

Some classes counter other classes. Get over it and stop talk about Herald doesnt deserve a buff in PvE bc u have problems with it in WvW.

Also you seem to just dislike True Nature - Demon because you played a condition class and fought a Herald that played tactical and used it to move back 2 conditions to u (3 with special trait).
If u fight Condi Herald and the Herald uses that skill, just clean away that conditions fast. Its possible because True Nature has a special sound and also has a special animation.
Also Herald is not the only class with condition transfers. Scourge has a signet that moves more then 2 conditions to the enemy (i m not sure but i think its 5). At least I am sure that it is more then 2.

Also Herald got nerfed on may 11 patch a lot.
Due to the torment change u deal more damage to not moving enemies now what is a general damage decrease in WvW.
Also Herald lost all its Resistance because its basically useless now.

I didnt even want to seem too offensive but it really seems like you just have a personal problem with Herald because you fought someone in WvW.
Like i have a personal problem with condi thieves because i always lose against them because i just cant reach them because the pop out, do 10 bleed stacks within 1 second, go in stealth, pop out on the other side, do it again and i cant reach them, i always lose my patience with them and i think the extreme buff was not needed in WvW even if it was in PvE.
But thats just like that because my build is just not made to long range fights.



But anyway we r talking about PvE while you r talking about True Nature demon being too op in WvW, even if i dont think so.
But it doesnt matter anyway because we dont want a WvW buff, and we dont want more conditions transfer.
We want more conditions damage as Herald in PvE because it has already existing Condition Skills and due to also the melee ranged Herald utility and Elite skill, it is perfect for the fully melee based Mace+Axe combo, even if the damage is too low. Thats why we want a buff in PvE.

Edited May 24, 2021 by SeTect.5918

[lodjur.1284]

1 hour ago, SeTect.5918 said:

Spellbreaker has no condi skill on its spec and weaver no healing, except the weapon skills.

Herald has...2 traits that increase the healing or even heal allies. But Herald as healer is totally trash.

Also Herald has a skill that does 3 stacks of burning and 1 skill that give coolness while there is a skill that gives torment whenever u inflict coolness.

Spellbreaker should not have more condi and weaver not more healing because they have 0 traits or skills to increase that, but Herald has.

 

And you argue about WvW while we say that herald should get a buff in PvE.

 

You asked me what herald was designed for if not for sustain+Power damage.

Its easy to answer because renegade has better sustain, range weapon and more damage. Also herald was meant as boon support and healer. But the boons and healing outputs r sad.

 

You asked why i even play herald then. Herald has a lot of condi transfers and thats just the style i like to play, also in pve. I like it that whenever an enemy inflicts a condi on me, it can increase my dmg.

Also i have found a great combo of cc and condis with the herald elite skill and mace+axe weapons. I just like it. 

If i would like to have allmighty whatever i would just swap to Guardian, but thats not my playstyle. 

Every elite spec has a different flavour and thats why people play them, but that doesnt mean that they neednt a buff.

 

And if you want true nature demon to be evadable, then condi herald has just 1 skill that transfers conditions and u even have just a radius of like 300. Not no mention condi Herald has no condi range weapon Option.

While i fk classes like necro, warriors or sth, i have not even a close chance against thieves or (good) rangers that use range weapons, they just have to keep distance and also my tormenting rune cant heal me bc i cant hit someone. So i have no heal and i cant do dmg. 

 

Some classes counter other classes. Get over it and stop talk about Herald doesnt deserve a buff in PvE bc u have problems with it in WvW.

Also you seem to just dislike True Nature - Demon because you played a condition class and fought a Herald that played tactical and used it to move back 2 conditions to u (3 with special trait).
If u fight Condi Herald and the Herald uses that skill, just clean away that conditions fast. Its possible because True Nature has a special sound and also has a special animation.
Also Herald is not the only class with condition transfers. Scourge has a signet that moves more then 2 conditions to the enemy (i m not sure but i think its 5). At least I am sure that it is more then 2.

Also Herald got nerfed on may 11 patch a lot.
Due to the torment change u deal more damage to not moving enemies now what is a general damage decrease in WvW.
Also Herald lost all its Resistance because its basically useless now.

I didnt even want to seem too offensive but it really seems like you just have a personal problem with Herald because you fought someone in WvW.
Like i have a personal problem with condi thieves because i always lose against them because i just cant reach them because the pop out, do 10 bleed stacks within 1 second, go in stealth, pop out on the other side, do it again and i cant reach them, i always lose my patience with them and i think the extreme buff was not needed in WvW even if it was in PvE.
But thats just like that because my build is just not made to long range fights.



But anyway we r talking about PvE while you r talking about True Nature demon being too op in WvW, even if i dont think so.
But it doesnt matter anyway because we dont want a WvW buff, and we dont want more conditions transfer.
We want more conditions damage as Herald in PvE because it has already existing Condition Skills and due to also the melee ranged Herald utility and Elite skill, it is perfect for the fully melee based Mace+Axe combo, even if the damage is too low. Thats why we want a buff in PvE.

You ask for changes that would 100% be carried over. 

 

I provided an alternative (make elemental blast ridiculous).

 

Also SPB got the copy condis. Adding about the same amount to condi as Herald.

 

If you want power herald to be good in PvE suggest raising those skills/traits. Not functional changes that would have to carried to buff something which never was part of it's identity. 

 

Some classes are made for certain types of builds, others aren't, you can force certain things, but expecting it to be balanced around it is silly. 

 

Transferring in PvE is extremely rarely relevant. 

 

Yet in PvE dragon is the 5th (?) Highest dps legend out of 6

 

Mallyx>Kalla>Shiro>Jalis>Glint>Ventari . Haven't tested but I'd be surprised by any other result for condi dps. With Renegade>Core>Herald

[SeTect.5918]

1 hour ago, lodjur.1284 said:

You ask for changes that would 100% be carried over. 

 

I provided an alternative (make elemental blast ridiculous).

 

Also SPB got the copy condis. Adding about the same amount to condi as Herald.

 

If you want power herald to be good in PvE suggest raising those skills/traits. Not functional changes that would have to carried to buff something which never was part of it's identity. 

 

Some classes are made for certain types of builds, others aren't, you can force certain things, but expecting it to be balanced around it is silly. 

 

Transferring in PvE is extremely rarely relevant. 

 

Yet in PvE dragon is the 5th (?) Highest dps legend out of 6

 

Mallyx>Kalla>Shiro>Jalis>Glint>Ventari . Haven't tested but I'd be surprised by any other result for condi dps. With Renegade>Core>Herald

Glint>jalis and as condi maybe also glint>shiro

 

But however it was never part of the identity? Here is a fun fact:

Condi herald with spear does tons of burn, fire combo fields and whatever in underwater, the good thing of spear is that u can see exactly which conditions each legend does. 

Example: 

-shiro, vulnerable (oh okay its power dps)

-demon, torment (oh okay its condi dps)

-jalis, weakness (oh okay so i get less dmg)

-glint, burn (oh okay its condi dps, but wait it does no dmg)

 

Glint should do more conditions to fit the theme as dragon, not only in underwater.

 

If glint was meant to be full power dps and not for condi then why would it do burn stacks and not sth like slowness to make the enemy hit u slower what means more sustain.

 

So: glint should get more condi dmg

[lodjur.1284]

2 hours ago, SeTect.5918 said:

Glint>jalis and as condi maybe also glint>shiro

Alright, you show me a benchmark of that and I'll believe you. 

Quote

But however it was never part of the identity? Here is a fun fact:

Condi herald with spear does tons of burn, fire combo fields and whatever in underwater, the good thing of spear is that u can see exactly which conditions each legend does. 

Example: 

-shiro, vulnerable (oh okay its power dps)

-demon, torment (oh okay its condi dps)

-jalis, weakness (oh okay so i get less dmg)

-glint, burn (oh okay its condi dps, but wait it does no dmg)

 

Glint should do more conditions to fit the theme as dragon, not only in underwater.

 

If glint was meant to be full power dps and not for condi then why would it do burn stacks and not sth like slowness to make the enemy hit u slower what means more sustain.

 

So: glint should get more condi dmg

Ah yes, trident what we should base it off. A weapon added as a second thought to a part of the game the devs pretend don't exist. 

 

Spear is ofc not based on the legend. 

 

The fact that you got this wrong even as you were using it to make a point should show just how far down the list it is. 

Edited May 24, 2021 by lodjur.1284

[SeTect.5918]

7 minutes ago, lodjur.1284 said:

Alright, you show me a benchmark of that and I'll believe you. 

Ah yes, trident what we should base it off. A weapon added as a second thought to a part of the game the devs pretend don't exist. 

 

Spear is ofc not based on the legend. 

 

The fact that you got this wrong even as you were using it to make a point should show just how far down the list it is. 

My bad yes it is trident.

 

And lol i cant even show you a normal condi herald benchmark bc i dont find one. 

 

I just called out the wrong weapon name but that has nothing to do with the thing i wrote.

[SeTect.5918]

11 minutes ago, lodjur.1284 said:

Alright, you show me a benchmark of that and I'll believe you. 

Ah yes, trident what we should base it off. A weapon added as a second thought to a part of the game the devs pretend don't exist. 

 

Spear is ofc not based on the legend. 

 

The fact that you got this wrong even as you were using it to make a point should show just how far down the list it is. 

And if Glint has so low damage why are you so afraid of giving condi herald more damage in PvE????

The true reason and not the: Herald is not meant to be condi bla bla.

 

(It is and should)

[lodjur.1284]

9 hours ago, SeTect.5918 said:

And if Glint has so low damage why are you so afraid of giving condi herald more damage in PvE????

The true reason and not the: Herald is not meant to be condi bla bla.

 

(It is and should)

Cause all changes are functional that would carry over.

 

Also really Herald badly lacks identity but the one clear thing about it's (on land) identity is that it's horrible as condi dps and always has been

9 hours ago, SeTect.5918 said:

My bad yes it is trident.

 

And lol i cant even show you a normal condi herald benchmark bc i dont find one. 

 

I just called out the wrong weapon name but that has nothing to do with the thing i wrote.

 

Well it's hardly difficult to test how much dps difference is between them just doing the standard rotation for mallyx+shiro subbing in impossible odds with bunch of herald upkeeps+elemental blast for glint and hammers for jalis

 

Even if you don’t reach close to perfect numbers that part should be easy enough to see

Edited May 25, 2021 by lodjur.1284

[SeTect.5918]

8 hours ago, lodjur.1284 said:

Cause all changes are functional that would carry over.

 

Also really Herald badly lacks identity but the one clear thing about it's (on land) identity is that it's horrible as condi dps and always has been

 

Well it's hardly difficult to test how much dps difference is between them just doing the standard rotation for mallyx+shiro subbing in impossible odds with bunch of herald upkeeps+elemental blast for glint and hammers for jalis

 

Even if you don’t reach close to perfect numbers that part should be easy enough to see

Yea exact Herald lacks in condi dps thats why it should get buffed. 

But you dont want it to get buffed? But why? Tell me some good reasons.

There neednt even be the changes that i suggested. If they would see my post and think about buffing Condi Herald because of that, they would not even use all of them. They r just suggestions to give a slight view how it could be.

I dont want it to have 40k dps in fractals like... firebrand or whatever.

I just want it to have like a 10-20% damage increase that would increase my...for example 20k dps at molten boss to 22-24k.

There could also be a way to give the herald skills some burn (3 sec) or torment (6 sec) or bleed stacks (10 sec) in PvE. They could decrease them in WvW how they did with axe skill 5 -> 1 second.

As i said i just want to give Suggestions and not a class that get a patch that deals 10k more dps after.

 

 

However i wanna stop this discussion here because it ends into nothing i think. Its better for both of us. 

[lodjur.1284]

40 minutes ago, SeTect.5918 said:

Yea exact Herald lacks in condi dps thats why it should get buffed. 

But you dont want it to get buffed? But why? Tell me some good reasons.

There neednt even be the changes that i suggested. If they would see my post and think about buffing Condi Herald because of that, they would not even use all of them. They r just suggestions to give a slight view how it could be.

I dont want it to have 40k dps in fractals like... firebrand or whatever.

I just want it to have like a 10-20% damage increase that would increase my...for example 20k dps at molten boss to 22-24k.

There could also be a way to give the herald skills some burn (3 sec) or torment (6 sec) or bleed stacks (10 sec) in PvE. They could decrease them in WvW how they did with axe skill 5 -> 1 second.

As i said i just want to give Suggestions and not a class that get a patch that deals 10k more dps after.

 

 

However i wanna stop this discussion here because it ends into nothing i think. Its better for both of us. 

1 sec is too much

 

But raising burning of Elemental blast to a ton of stacks would be an option,  anet just doesn't seem to want to

[Virdo.1540]

Maybe we should start asking to nerf herald in pve. 

Anet always does the opposite of what this Forum-Section & Community says.

 

I mean its already dead.... it cant get any worse.

Edited May 25, 2021 by Virdo.1540

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

9 hours ago, Virdo.1540 said:

Maybe we should start asking to nerf herald in pve. 

Anet always does the opposite of what this Forum-Section & Community says.

 

I mean its already dead.... it cant get any worse.

I'm down for this.  Please nerf Herald Anet!