Discussion on Combat and Boons.

[joneirikb.7506]

Just an idea to how to execute my earlier suggestion:

Change/use the existing passive class buffs like "Strength In Numbers" from guardian, or "Spotter" from Ranger etc. Make it a class feature, so you always have it. Make this either 5 or 10 players (depending upon how you want it). Have this ability pulse the class primary boon to anyone affected. Say that Guardians "Strength In Numbers" pulsed Stability to anyone affected. This means Any guardian would automatically pulse Stability to 1-2 parties.

Again, divide the main/primary boons around 1 per class. Leave a couple of them (like Might and Swiftness) in a common pool that anyone can apply.

Optional further, have most of the traitlines have a minor trait, that adds something to this ability. Examples: Might, Swiftness, Stat (Toughness for guardian), possibly other unique abilities depending on class. Specifically not the other classes primary boons. And might also be worth sticking these on the non primary damage dealing trait lines (?).

 

* Change all other access to boons to short durations, and leave these as the main long duration ones.
* Since 2 of the same class ability won't stack, it puts an upper limit to the amount of boons you can get/refresh.
* If putting it at 10 target limit, there's not much point in not getting 1 of each class in a group/squad.
* They can balance them around how often they pulse, number of stacks, and duration per boon.
* And the actual class abilities themselves can't be removed/corrupted, so they'll be there to re-apply.
* Would need a complete overhaul of boon remove/corrupt as well, to match up.

[Aeolus.3615]

On 8/4/2021 at 9:00 PM, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

I'm not even sure its boons really...

 

Just remove the gear that adds to the issue like trailblazer, marauder, etc.  As full disclosure I have builds that use both of those as well, and only use them because that's how you play WvW.  It's not great design at all because it just leads to way too much survivability for no downside cost.  

 

If you had to run glassy to utilize protection or something then it would feel better to fight against.  I guess boon spam is still an issue but spreading out removal to more classes could alleviate that.  

 

Stats negation by removing isnt a good thing IMO, the problem isnt even related to stats IMO, but how boon spreads easilly and gets 0/1 converted al the time.

Trail stats are strong but theres also something called balance and quoficients on the overperferming traits/skill that can be changed, so again not stats fault but a class design/balance/initial iteration issue.

 

 

Most boon balls consist in every one cast/spam to each other w/o most time dont need know when skill must be used, they just need to keep up boon up stacking cause they.. stack and alot... and its easilly done, party members dont need even to stay close to each other as well cause the boon ball will effect every one in a way or another.

 

Stacking both aoe in deffense and offense is way to easy(really way to easy), we always had bit to much aoe in game as constant pressure that went into a normalized and almost as a only way to play(meta WvW classes are very aoe spammable rather than strong effects on slithly increased CD when they are needed most of the time),  its the only thing that matters overall whatever game content is AOE and if recharges faster the better that class will be meta for sure, wich is also the problem of boon/condi wars, if its aoe it works, if  has a higher CD concept players will discard that class or skills.

Also the effect of player cast shout, meditation, facet, mantra, whatever it will hend in a boon or condi, that overstacked and if is easilly to reaplty it will overperform for sure, its just the boon casted with a diferent flavour.

 

Note:

Perma quickness groups its a huge mistake while i believe anet is in extremelly favour of this perma stacking groups.

Some boons should not stack, most of them actualy...

 

joneirikb.7506

Gw1 kinda works like that way, shouts and Echos can be overlaped but if i recall will end the last one if its stronger, shouts have their own effect, enchantmens are basiccly boons that will stack in duration, some even work like Herald facets at the price of energy but even the facets end in boon for the stacking horde.

 

 

 

Edited August 7, 2021 by Aeolus.3615

[Caedmon.6798]

On 8/4/2021 at 10:00 PM, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

I'm not even sure its boons really...

 

Just remove the gear that adds to the issue like trailblazer, marauder, etc.  As full disclosure I have builds that use both of those as well, and only use them because that's how you play WvW.  It's not great design at all because it just leads to way too much survivability for no downside cost.  

 

If you had to run glassy to utilize protection or something then it would feel better to fight against.  I guess boon spam is still an issue but spreading out removal to more classes could alleviate that.  

Yeah its not just boons,its forever heals,forever cleanses,projectile destroy and projectile ignore. The boons really aint the issue which can be stripped easily anyway.

Edited August 8, 2021 by Caedmon.6798

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

One thing I see people suggesting alot is to lower boon durations even further.

 

*Don't do this. This is the entire problem with the game and what lead us here.*

 

The original game was designed around very long boon durations with equally high cooldowns on the skills which, when we finally got boon corruption, meant you could strategically strip that boon and it wouldn't be available again for 40-60sec or more. However, as time went on, we got shorter and shorter boons but we also got lower and lower cooldown skills, then we got Alacrity on top of it, and as a result, boons get shot out of players like a machinegun.

 

This is the opposite direction we should be going. If you want to stop boonballs, if you want to stop boon sharing spam, return to high durations, high cooldowns so when you use tactics like strips in combat /they actually work./

 

Look at to games from the pre-WoW era (around 1997-1999) to see what I mean.

 

And tbh we need to stop with all the low cooldown skills in general. More powerful skills on much higher cooldowns, and most importantly, actual consequences to having your skills interrupted would make for a more balanced game instead of the faceroll skill spam we have now, especially in WvW.

 

Most of the balance problems in this game was because the devs got carried away with the action game design during the "everything is a MOBA" era, which has largely become a meme at this point.

 

Slow things down a bit, focus less on thrills and more on tactics and everything will improve.

Edited August 8, 2021 by Hannelore.8153

[kamikharzeeh.8016]

the only reason that people cry about boons is because of the general very low skill levels these days. when i go scrouge, i always hope they have as many boons as possible, so i can get high stripscore on arcDps 😛

 

any balanced composition with chronomancers and spellbreakers next to 1 scourge per party has absurdly huge strip potential.

 

then in groups, several scourges have barely any strips bc they don't play the class correctly. easy issue. then again crying about the 30 man smaller squad that wipes your blobs, just bc their classes do their job. boons rarely stopped any good groups from farming bad groups, regardless of size

 

zero need of making them more exclusive than they are. all the weird nerfs just damaged the combat enough by now. good players adapt or leave the game. bad players stay bad, as long as they refuse to learn the combat system simply.